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Barrie (right) Drewitt-Barlow wants to be able to marry his civil-partner Tony (left) in a church
Barrie (right) Drewitt-Barlow wants to be able to marry his civil-partner Tony (left) in a church

BU continues to monitor the battle by same-sex couples to be married in the Church.  A recent report out of the UK indicates the first legal challenge to the Church of England’s (C&E) ban on same-sex marriage was filed on 2 August 2013. When the issue of same-sex marriage is distilled the real issues which global societies must accept is that marriage is a matter for the state. And inherent in a marital arrangement are considerations like spousal privileges, tax concessions, issues to do with estates etc. On this basis should the Church be allowed to discriminate and possibly lose its license (issued by the state) to perform marriage?

Traditionally Christian societies, Barbados included, have adopted and institutionalize marriage as a religious ceremony. However if we are to be dispassionate about this issue, the question which Barbadians and other countries will soon have to answer is: How do we safe-guard the rights of same-sex couples under the law? Even if we were to deny same-sex couples the opportunity to equal privilege to be married in the traditional form, how does the law render unto Caesar the rights that are Caesar? In the current scenario we can have same-sex couples who have co-habitated for years but are left unsupported in law with regard to the rights to property accumulated during the union.

We have two issues playing here in the context of Barbados 1) the right to marry in the traditional way and not be discriminated against and 2) the right to access laws which safeguard the rights of same-sex couples. A scan of the international news communicate that both these issues have been and are being addressed. Even if we agree that the C&E or Churches generally should not be compelled by the Court to marry same-sex couples because it is an issue for governments. what about the law? In any event the question of whether the Church is above the law and can visibly discriminate will remain on the radar i today’s litigious world. Unfortunately for Barbados and other conservative societies, this is a matter which will not go away.

In previous BU blogs we hitched the issue of the refusal of the C&E to ordain women priests at the highest level.  Using simple analysis here is a case for discrimination as well. And the lawyers will admit there is precedent for the C&E’s position against female priests to be challenged.

In the case of Barbados BOTH Ministers Stephen Lashley and Adriel Brathwaite have been vocal about defending the traditional position of marriage. We have to conclude that this is the position of the government of Barbados. In fact BU senses that it is being fashioned as a political campaign angle to be used against a Mottley Barbados Labour Party (BLP) in 2018. Mottley has long been associated with the Gay movement.

The difficulty which Barbados and other countries who defend the traditional have is that Canada’s laws allow gay marriage and the UK will likely follow given the first challenge mentioned. Given our ‘closeness’ to the USA we have been following the battle play out in the US and there is an inevitability to it. Barbados is a tourism destination, and like many countries are bound to follow positions under accepted international arrangements. BU family members listened to Jeff Cumberbatch expound on this matter a few months ago. Why the hell have we signed international accords if there was never the intention to implement relevant local law to comply?

If we are a tourism and offshore destination at some point Barbados will have to accord citizens from countries who live and work here and who enjoy certain rights in their home countries the same. If we don’t the media backlash will be painful given the planks upon which our economic base rests. We can chose to be emotional about it or face a growing reality.


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209 responses to “The Right to be Gay”


  1. David wrote “The difficulty which Barbados and other countries who defend the traditional have is that Canada’s laws allow gay marriage.

    Canada now has openly gay leaders. The Premier of Ontario is openly gay.

    Prior to her coming out at age 37 she was married to her husband Phil Cowperthwaite with whom she had three children. She now lives with her partner Jane Rounthwaite.
    Wynne is a member of the United Church of Canada

    How is Barbados going to deal with this. Send a diplomatic note to Canada saying Gays are not welcome?

    I feel that the same acceptance accorded to common law union between a man and a woman should be accorded same sex couples.

    Same sex couples Marriage blessed in a church seems to be against what is written in the Bible from what I understand.

    The important lesson in all this is that gays are human beings just like us that are heterosexual and should not be discriminated against.


  2. @Hants

    Thanks for that comment, so what happens if the Premier decides to visit Barbados for a vacation with her partner and behave as she would in Canada?


  3. David anyone living in Canada can tell you that Gay rights are protected and we have have learned to accept them in all spheres of life.


  4. wait bozie GP is that U man u full of lyrics make some of these crop ova entertainers look like silly school boys,,,, LOL…if u keep that up fuh sure u going wear the crown next year no bull about that. .


  5. David

    How does the Canadian PM behave with her lover in Canada?

    Hants

    On the Putin law – actually I don’t feel strongly about banning the promotion of gay choices to minors anymore than I would be in respect of banning the promotion of heterosexual possibilities to minors – contingent upon precisely what was being banned. I am less happy about banning gay rallies – but then you might (as some do here) see this as an incitement to be gay as distinct from demonstrating that gay people are just people like everyone else though with their own orientation which should not be feared but should be respected.

    And yes – you are right. HOW can Church or State possibly condone ‘living in sin’ by heterosexual partners by protection of the property and familial rights of the partners, albeit with a qualifying (five year) period, and yet turn it’s back on the possibility of recognizing gay partnerships in the name of ‘God’s Law’?

  6. Georgie Porgie Avatar

    ac | August 4, 2013 at 7:59 PM |
    wait bozie GP is that U man u full of lyrics make some of these crop ova entertainers look like silly school boys,,,, LOL…if u keep that up fuh sure u going wear the crown next year no bull about that.
    NOT AT ALL JUST A BIT OF SARCASM


  7. Caswell

    Sweet heart… You holin’ the fort now sweet chile …!? … I wants tah see dat fort … as man …! … Wooo weee Cas … 🙂


  8. the difficulty Barbados has and one that is staring the leadership in the face is a tourism driven economy with a 10% world population who is gay and one that has plenty spending power and political influence. needles to say that the homosexual world is making strident and fast inroads and many of these carribbean islands going to have to come to term with those realities .wont be long before one our two of those carribbean islands open their arms allowing “privategay Weddings on their beaches,,,,,,just a matter of time soon come


  9. Pure unadulterated sadness from a set of human beings…hmmmm.


  10. Rosemary you don’ wanna see Caserll’s fort too … Bush Tea got Caswell hol’ing it … Hope it got some size … Woo Wee Cas …:)


  11. I wonder if my journey in all this is of any interest to those silent ones who read but don’t contribute – quite understandably because it can be a very hazardous exercise.

    The traditional opposition to female priests has been mentioned. Instinctively I share that opposition. That apart, I have heard many arguments over the years against the ordination of women in particular from priests. Thing is – rationally I have never found them convincing. And so despite my unease about ordination I am not opposed and certainly not, since the door has been opened, to the ordination of female bishops.

    With gay marriage I had the same inner response. The word ‘marriage’ entailed heterosexual relationship. But the more I thought about it, it seemed to me to rest on certain false assumptions

    . One is the idea that God ‘ordained’ heterosexual marriage and thereby fixed that idea in concrete. Now since the ordination of marriage in a Biblical sense begins with Genesis and since Genesis was written no earlier than 1000 years BC and had God pottering around in a garden with a wicked snake which he had created, the question obviously arises why God wasn’t chatting to humankind before then – in the billions of years since the creation of the universe. In other words, it does appear that the creation story -and there are two of them – can be no more than a myth. I ignore the number of Abraham’s wives and those of Solomon mentioned by someone above. So the ‘hetersosexual marriage’ as ‘God’s law’ simply does not work.

    As an extension of the Bible argument, there is the argument that marriage is a religiously sacred construct. But then if we look at how marriage has been conceived down the centuries we see that originally it was rooted in the shift of property interests so that there was nothing sacred about it at all – and, of course, it still is in some cultures. So that argument doesn’t work either.

    Then there’s the argument that marriage is about procreation. But then that doesn’t work (a) because many couples marry though for one reason or another there is no prospect of children, and (b) because procreation is not contingent upon marriage.

    The offshoot of that is the idea of the nuclear family in which the members sail through life without a hitch and are ever playing happy families to the greater good of everyone concerned. But then the concept of the nuclear family has, in large measure, broken down and not least because of divorce on demand. So this doesn’t really work.

    Finally, there’s the idea that ‘marriage’ has just one meaning – which was my original position. But that ignores the point that concept words don’t just have one meaning. Think of the word ‘love’, or ‘possession’, or, in the law, the development of the word ‘recklessness’. In other words, concept words are defeasible, are open-ended, not atomic. This doesn’t mean that words can mean anything we like ,but rather that the issue is the way that words are put to use – and that depends on the ‘game’ we are playing. In both Church and State we are witnessing a shift in the use of the word ‘marriage’ and, as it seems to me, that shift, as a practical matter, cannot now be reversed. Like the idea of female priests, the questioning and rejection of traditional ideas is inexorable.

    To put this in a positive way, it seems to me that the root idea of marriage is relationship – a relationship which is rooted in love while it lasts; one of a number of possible relationships but still critical in terms of what marriage as we traditionally understand it – even as a matter of wishful thinking – entails. It follows that gay people in a loving relationship are as much fitted to consummate their love in marriage as any other.

  12. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ ac | August 4, 2013 at 8:10 PM |

    Can you imagine a scene where the big fast food chains in North America having a policy of not serving homosexuals or blacks? Many of those fast food outlets would soon be out of business by discriminating against a significant minority of the consuming public who really like to spend money.
    Can just imagine many Bajans with the much rumoured “don’t bend down in St. James” proclivities visiting that country and being subject to such discrimination.

    Bajans have to make a bit more of an enlightened stride forward and widen their perspective leaving that witch hunt homo bashing bull crap to backward thinking hypocritical places like Islamic fundamentalist countries and batty bashing Jamaica hiding in the macho closet like BT and CF.


  13. but seriously though miller a lot of the homophobes who taking this issue for a lark going find themselves at the receiving end of the laughing stick when the homosexuals boycott these islands. right now Russia is in the crossfire of the gays as Russia prepares to host the Olympics ,the homosexual planning all kinds of boycotts for them . Biog business like coca cola or whoever plan on selling or advertising their products in the Russia Olympics have been giving notice that they products internationally would be boycotted,
    the UK market listen to them they understand and watched their influence and make no mistake other countries going to have to follow the lead of England with or without same sex marriage, because money like they say makes the mare fly.

  14. Caswell Franklyn Avatar
    Caswell Franklyn

    I was brought up to believe that bulling was wrong and I have always accepted that. Even though I have no difficulty with men doing it to each other, I have a fundamental abhorrence to putting my member up anybody’s backside, male or female. I do not relish the thought of cleaning faeces from my penis. If there are those who want to do that so be it but stop trying to force acceptance on the rest of us.


  15. Anybody … ANYBODY (In particular David and Amused)… who had any reason to doubt that Ross is class, sheer fu#king class … now is your chance to apologize to him and those who new it all along …!


  16. Knew … My God what a slip that actually makes sense at some level HA HA HA


  17. Caswell

    With respect I understand your sentiment, I do. As right as it may appear to be, it is most definitely wrong, and it takes a big man to acknowledge this. You I believe, can be so described. I most certainly am not wrong on this score.


  18. Very few persons have ANYTHING but pity for gays….and it is just the same kind of pity that is had for anyone with ED or any other sexual disfunction that prevents them for enjoying the unmatchable glory of some good old “he-she” percolation…
    Only a few misguided souls seek to oppress them, ridicule them or even notice them…at least not any more than they used to ‘notice’ King Dyall…with an embarrassed snigger here and there…

    What Ross and company seems to want is a global cheering section.
    These people seem to pine attention, acceptance, and reassurance.
    This suggests to Bushie that THEY THEMSELVES know that they are doing shiite, even if by luck of birth) and as a cover, they crave our collective endorsements of their lifestyles….

    Who in their right minds can say that this country hinders bullers and wickers in ANY way?
    When did anyone lay a charge against anyone for homosexuality?
    Are they not known homos in high places in Barbados?
    Are they not CLEARLY all over the very churches?
    Can’t they live together to their heart’s content?
    Can’t they have civil ceremonies to their heart’s content?
    Can’t they have their very own church if they so desire?

    YES TO ALL OF THESE …and yet they want MORE…

    They want us to love their life style

    They want us to lower our marriages vows to include their deviance (next Baffy will want man/sheep marriages accepted in church as soon as he finds a good ewe…)

    They want Bushie to accept shiite…..a known impossibility. Give them an inch and Ross calling for a foot… LOL
    Looka…
    …get thee behind Amused, Ross (…cause if you find yourself behind Bushie you will get hurt… 🙂 )


  19. Nope Bush Tea …

    All that they want is for the likes of you to man up .. simple and straight.


  20. i’m not gay. i have a few gay friends. males and females. my view on this is simple. as long as you know you bounds with me we can be the best of friends. step outside that and we have a problem. the same i apply to religion.

    i’m not going to judge anyone because i’m not God and i can’t do his job. people need to respect people gay our not. but in the end, to each his own and i can’t blame you for that at all.


  21. All that they want is for the likes of you to man up .. simple and straight.
    *********
    What the hell does that mean Baffy? … Man up? And who is ‘they’?
    …skippa, you like you ain’t recover from foreday morning yet yuh… 🙂

    @ David (not BU)
    Agreed in principle.

  22. Caswell Franklyn Avatar
    Caswell Franklyn

    Well said Bushie. These guys want us to accept that playing up in faecal matter as normal. Maybe they could find employment at the sewage plant and be in heaven.

  23. Caswell Franklyn Avatar
    Caswell Franklyn

    BAFBFP

    It is not simple and straight: these guys are bent. LOL!


  24. No you Jack asses .. The one thing about human kind is that it has traditionally been driven by the opinions of MEN .. real men, those that actually accept that the only constant that there is, is change. What the f#ck has gone wrong with the two that I actually do respect (among others) ..?

  25. Caswell Franklyn Avatar
    Caswell Franklyn

    BAFBFP

    If you only knew how many changes I have made in my life, you would be astounded. For instance, I was a soldier and had training that was superior to most, I could not imagine life as anything else. Now, I don’t even like guns when that was one of my areas of specialty. Once I lived for politics, now I keep as far from partisan politics as I can get. I have made significant changes in my opinions over the years, but I find it very difficult to allow anyone to force acceptance, of what some of you call gay sex, on me. I believe it is repulsive. I also believe eating dog meat to be repulsive but I don’t hate Chinese people. Likewise, I don’t hate gay people.


  26. You do not hate Gays … Cas that sounds Christian. They Love people of all colours shapes and sizes … But Christians have ALWAYS had a problem with the ‘respect’ thing. You accepted things over years and have met with disappointment … The natural progression would be to grow up man .. seriously. You are now accepting a status quo that says that being attracted to your own gender is wrong .. worse, forbidden. The stereo typing has mislead you in the past, stay focused. You are allowing yourself to be caught up in the same campaign again. As man, move on (even if it means leaving the old bat behind …)

  27. Caswell Franklyn Avatar
    Caswell Franklyn

    Baffy

    You remind me of an encounter I had in Ottawa two weeks ago. I was walking the street in a group of other Barbadians and we came upon a couple of people standing by a traffic light with posters of mutilated aborted foetus. One asked how do you like my pictures. No one responded but he insisted are you pro life or pro choice. Some of the group answered indicating their preference. I remained silent but the man would have none of it, he kept insisting that I answer. Eventually, I said, “I am pro mind my own business” and that fool let me have it. You remind me of that fool. The difference between him and you is that I respond to you.

    When it comes to gay and lesbian activity, I am also pro mind my own business. I have no problem with them doing their own thing as long as they don’t try to force me to accept or even indulge in their abhorrent behaviour.


  28. I am a good person Cas … a good Barbadian with sufficient knowledge to recognize the difference between forcing and requesting of those who should know better. With respect, cut me some slack


  29. Neither the church nor the state have any business up in people’s liv wids

    We really need to simplify marriage, get it back to its biblical roots, where we often read “and he took her to wife” no priest/pastor/magistrate mentioned.

    In any event as my church (Anglican) teaches people marry one another. The priest does NOT marry them. He or she blesses their already existing marital union.

    If a couple chooses they can go to their church for a blessing (that is if they are religious people.)

    And the state can make provision for couples to show up to register their union. The couple can show up, bring two sober witnesses and sign the paper.

    This nonsense of priests/pastors/ magistrates pretending to marry people really needs to stop.

    If couples want to have a big or small party before or after signing the paper, that is up to them.

    This way both the church and the state would save themselves a whole lot of grief.


  30. Kadooment today … Bad leaves at 12:00 Till after


  31. @KGB at 1:04 p.m. “Paul said (ephesians5;31-32) a man leave his father and mother,and shall be joined unto his wife and they two shall be one flesh.

    Dear KGB this passage means that a man leaves his parents and has sex with his wife,ie. he inserts his penis into his vagina, they do the requisite percolations ( if liked) and before long the woman becomes pregnant, and some 9 months later, the ONE FLESH, that is the child is born. This is no great mystery. This is biology 101, the birds and the bees and cats and dogs, and mosquitoes also do it.

    The child of a union between a man and a woman is the indisputable, undivisable ONE FLESH.

    A man and a woman cannot otherwise become ONE FLESH. Ask any divorced couple if they are one flesh?

    People like to make mysteries out of things that are not at al mysterious.

    But then again, Paul, bless him, never had any woman, so I would not give him the Biology 101 certificate.


  32. Furthermore an RC priest can refuse me a marriage ceremony because I am not RC. And a Muslim minister, or a Hindu one or a 7th Adventist one or a Jehovah’s witness one can also refuse me a marriage ceremony as I am not a member of their churches. So they have every right to refuse me.

    And indeed they should refuse me.


  33. @David. I have been deliberately not having anything to say on this one, but as Bushie has constantly called my name, it would have been impolite of me not to respond.

    @ac. You really are on a roll. Excellent. Go, girl, go!

    @Baffy, Miller. Naughty boys. Accusing Bushie and Casewell of hiding in the cupboard (or is that “closet”). But frankly their overriding preoccupation with that particular sex act, I am told by a psychiatrist, would seem to suggest that you might be right. As for Dr GP, I understand he lives in Canada. While I certainly defend his right to air his views fully, unfortunately Canadian legislation does not offer such protection in connection with such a thing as homosexuality and, were he not anonymous, he might find his license at risk – if he has not retired. And that is a fact of law, not life.

    @Bushie. “Who in their right minds can say that this country hinders bullers and wickers in ANY way? When did anyone lay a charge against anyone for homosexuality?” First of all, the charge would have to be for “buggery” not for the mere fact of being homosexual. Secondly, as I see it, the problem lies, not in the fact that no one has laid a charge for buggery in Barbados, but in the potential that someone COULD lay such a charge, based on the laws. Recently, we have seen an exposee (so far undefended) into wiretapping, e-mail tapping, secret recordings and all aspects of surveillance, carried out by a certain law enforcement officer (or upon his orders). Unless the buggery laws are repealed, coupled with such surveillance they can provide the potential for either charges to be laid – OR for blackmail. Now, I fully realise that asking you to consider this most reasonable proposition logically is, in this case, a complete and total waste of my time, but hope springs eternal that you may actually allow your usual good sense to prevail, instead of the total bovine excrement you have been spouting on this issue.

    @Casewell. Isn’t a close family member of your lord and master gay and has a predilection for dressing in ladies clothes? As I recall from years gone by, wasn’t this family member also in a bit of trouble for beating up their partners? Or have they now retreated into your closet to play with your dolls?


  34. @Caswell “I have a fundamental abhorrence to putting my member up anybody’s backside, male or female. I do not relish the thought of cleaning faeces from my penis”

    But Caswell, nobody has asked you to put your penis up their backside. And if you have been asked such a question you can simply say no. Your penis is yours and you can keep it safely in your pants 24/7. Nobody is forcing you to do anything.

    However if you should ever get faeces on your penis you would be well advised to wash it carefully, the same way you would wash your hands carefully if you got faces on them.


  35. I have a problem with Bullers
    Why is Bulling necessary
    Why are we discussing Bulling

    JUST ASKING


  36. Actually there is a gay church the Metropolitan Community Church whose website is here:

    http://mccchurch.org/

    Actually I am surprised that somebody has not opened a branch of the MCC in Barbados as yet, seeing as how we Bajans like churches (especially North American Churches) real, real bad.


  37. bulling is nasty and dirty
    shit is nasty and dirty
    dogs love shit tastes sweet to dogs
    bullers are dowgs–they want poisining


  38. Simple Simon

    About a gay church in Bim…….I have wondered the same. I raised the possibility once but was told that it would be fire bombed.

    I understand that the gaychristianbajan ‘organisation’ at one time visited churches and made no bones telling who they were. I don’t think that was particularly helpful to their cause. BUT I do think that unless gay people as a group become ‘loud’ in some not too shocking way there can be little ‘progress’ for them here….which is why Bush Tea, freshly up and re-pampered, is wrong to talk about Civil Partnership as a ‘given’ in some way or other. Maybe a priest here should openly offer gay partnership blessings even at the Animal Flower Cave.

    Caswell

    See, for what it’s worth, now that’s two people who say they respect you, the second being beloved BAF. Do remember that no-one says you must do it or have other than minus reactions to it but rather that since upwards of 10% of the world’s adult population are gay etc that you might at least respect those who are and who cause you no harm other than through your affronted feelings. The whole point of BAF’s remarks, as I understand him, is that YOU are big enough and bold enough to do this as, indeed, you acknowledge yourself in terms of your life to date.

    Just Asking

    LOL – I would still publish them. Street poetry knows no subtlety.

    BAF

    A postcard from wherever beyond I am.


  39. Bush Tea | August 4, 2013 at 11:47 PM

    Who in their right minds can say that this country hinders bullers and wickers in ANY way?
    When did anyone lay a charge against anyone for homosexuality?
    Are they not known homos in high places in Barbados?
    Are they not CLEARLY all over the very churches?
    Can’t they live together to their heart’s content?
    Can’t they have civil ceremonies to their heart’s content?
    Can’t they have their very own church if they so desire?
    YES TO ALL OF THESE …and yet they want MORE…

    why bushie when are you going to realize that BARBADOS is not the world .your sense of reasoning is muffled. you’re thinking lacks sound good judgement and common sense.
    The above comments is so telling in that you can only focus on this tiny island It is also noteworthy how you jotted down four or five statements which are just accommodations and should be acceptable and sufficient for the homosexual to live by. Homosexuals should be treated as equals and not have to be subjected to rules and laws that only give them enough space and freedom for others to accommodate them.
    |no wonder no one takes you seriously on BUP not even Caswell for sure you would take everyone back to medieval times , Your way or the highway.


  40. @ ac
    HUSH

    @ Ross
    Why is blessing by “the church” so important to gays? Almost all churches CONDEMN the practice…with predictable references to Sodom and Gamorah…..and to abominations…

    LOL ….some kind of inferiority complex? Why are they craving acceptance and blessings from the very sector that most oppose their lifestyles?

    @ Amused
    It was better when you were quiet….but you wait til SWMBO gone to sleep and rambling on with this weak defence…

    Now you are saying that the problem is NOT society’s behavior to homosexuality but the POSSIBILITY of Dottin’s spy equipment being used to catch gays committing sodomy…..?
    …wait boss, you think this is the Trevon Martin Jury? WEAK CASE!!

    Bushie told you already that the Sodomy laws are well conceived to reduce the spread of diseases through exposure to excreta. What is wrong with laws that seek to discourage persons playing around in shit…?

    ….and you can leave out the closet talk…Bushie ain’t ’bout nothing so – nor is the bushman intimidated by any such suggestions.
    Bushie has no malice whatsoever against gays. NONE!!
    HOWEVER…
    The condition of homosexuality is a DEVIATION from the natural, accepted, and ordained norm.
    From a societal management perspective, It is a condition that should be RESEARCHED so that its CAUSES can be documented and that serious efforts can be made to ensure that its incidence is REDUCED in the future.

    This movement of your group to ACCEPT this condition as normal is ill-conceived and short sighted. If we had taken this approach with polio most people in the world would have been deformed by now…

    COMMON SENSE suggest that while we love, respect, and accommodate those who are gay, we understand that sound management of our society REQUIRES that we take sensible steps to reduce the number of future victims.
    It is IDIOTIC to attempt to solve the problem by redefining these persons as “normal”.
    If that idiocy worked, we could just define the criminally minded as “normal” and our crime problem would ‘go away’ …. Right?
    ..we could define our politicians as normal and not bother about trying to improve the system….

    Give it up fellows
    Homosexuals are people..(even if not ‘normal’)..who deserve respect
    But homosexuality is an affliction that should CONCERN any society to the extent that serious efforts are made to REDUCE it.


  41. @Bushie. What makes you think SWMBO was asleep and not looking over my shoulder and agreeing with me? She was, you know. I seem to recall that I told you that SWMBO’s best friend is a gay man and second best friend was said man’s partner. You then uttered some tasteless remark denigrating SWMBO’s fidelity to me. Remember that? I do! I never had the same level of respect for you since, particularly as you don’t seem to have the same capacity as many others here on BU who willingly admit fault when you are wrong or needlessly offensive. But hey, this is Barbados where wrong and strong is a feature of unevolved persons of a certain age. Also, you seem to be very good these days at telling people to hush. Baffy, ac, me….the list goes on. I wanted it noted that I had said everything I had to say on this issue and did not intend to comment at all, but it was YOU that persisted in constantly calling my name. From that I reasonably assumed that you wished to hear from me – AGAIN!!!! For a moment I thought that you wished to hear from me so that you could reevaluate my views (the views of the majority) and thus stop making a blasted fool of yourself and join the 21st Century. Apparently I was wrong, so I leave you to the not so tender mercies of Baffy and ac and the Mighty Miller……they have no need whatever of my assistance.

    @Baffy, Miller, ac – over to you. Respectfully, I would not waste my time going up against Casewell – leave that to the family of his Lord and Master. Pimp-like, he will do as he is told.


  42. Let me tell you guys something. Once I happened to surprisingly see two men in the act of bulling. It was a nasty, shitty, greasy, smelly, abominable sight in a van one night. It was putrid and even if one wanted to prefer charges certainly touching those two men was out of the question. Caswell is right bulling is stinking. Do it amongst your likes and leave out the general society. General Stuart says not bout hey. That is final. Anyone who wishes to change that will feel the wrath of we the voters. So bring it on politicians. We are ready to send any such persons to the INS for early pension. It will be fire and brimstone at the polls come 2018. IT is time we ask politicians to declare their stance on this issue. P M Stuart has thrown down the gauntlet.


  43. LOL @ Amused
    …all of that about Bushie and nothing about your argument in support of sodomy…?
    If you felt offended by Bushie’s remark about SWMBO and her gay friends no such offense was intended, however if you looking to send Bushie on a guilt trip don’t waste your deposit…. Tough shit!
    Any day that mrs Bush come to Bushie with any such story the bushman will become highly suspicious …..that’s all.

    LOL…you are so misguided that you actually think that your views are those of the majority… LOL Ha Ha ….. Even your boy Peter W would advise you better on that one…
    You views are those of a growing number who, thinking themselves to be wise, lead themselves (and weak-minded others like ac) into the depths of darkness and deprivation.

    But right is right and wrong is wrong….and wunna CAN’T change that….


  44. PW indicated that he has done some research in Barbados and other island in the region regarding public views on these matters. What were the conclusions again?


  45. let me think a minute here.hum the funking bible says what????????
    Leviticus 20:13 (New King James Version)
    Leviticus 20:13
    New King James Version (NKJV)
    13 If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood shall be upon them.

    i guess that might mean no in gods mind.
    in the middle east if you are found doing this you are killed publicly.
    no bulling st James.

  46. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @Lighthouse | August 5, 2013 at 8:16 AM |

    Seems that your graphically vivid description of that dirty stinking shitty act that took place in a van at night could only come from someone upfront and centre from the rear.

    Are you sure you weren’t one of the consenting participants in that sordid act?

    BTW, don’t expect your Boss man to be openly opposed to such behaviour. He would be ‘challenged’ with a clear conscience.
    Go to an obeah man and contact JCT through a séance and you would see from your lighthouse the entire picture of ‘who is who’ hiding in the closet.

    Now go back to peeping behind men bulling in vans at night.
    So that was you the peeping tom that wanted to join in to form a threesome with BT and CF?

  47. Caswell Franklyn Avatar
    Caswell Franklyn

    Amused

    So I take it that when you referred to me as a pimp that you were not being needlessly offensive.


  48. @David, ac, Baffy, Miller et al (even Bushie). Since I have been drawn into this argument by Bushie, I have taken the trouble to read the Daily Mail report on the case in England and it appears to me thus:

    • A male gay couple of enviable reputation and Christian charity are desirous of marrying in accordance with law.
    • This couple has several children (whether adopted or not is irrelevant).
    • These children and the couple themselves are members of the CofE and worship there on a regular basis. The couple are communicants of the CofE and welcomed by the CofE as such.
    • The CofE is refusing to conduct a marriage ceremony for them.

    Given the prevailing laws in the EU and, by extension, the UK, it is equivocal whether or not such an application could succeed. After all, there are other bodies and persons licensed to carry out the marriage and to insist that it be conducted in and by the CofE might well be deemed unreasonable. I personally would consider such a demand to be unreasonable if that was all there was to it.

    However, these applicants are members of the CofE and regular communicants of the CofE. In these circumstances, their claim of discrimination against the CofE will almost certainly be upheld by the courts.

    It is clear that the CofE and the RC are gearing up towards acceptance of a tide that they cannot fight against and the recent statements from both the Pope and the Archbishop of Canterbury make this clear, as do the statements of Desmond Tutu. I m aware that the Archbishop of York (a Nigerian) takes an opposing view, but frankly he has neither the local (within York or the UK) nor international status and stature of Desmond Tutu – in fact, few have and certainly not in Africa. Meanwhile, the Pope’s remarks were made on a trip to South America, which should also be seen as being indicative.

    How does this impact Barbados? Only time will tell. I am now reliably informed that the average gay couple planning their holidays tend to be put off by Barbados’ laws, irrespective of the fact that there have been no incidents. I liken it to a country that has a policy of discrimination against black people, even if it is not practiced? Would you visit such a country? I would not for fear that it MIGHT BE practiced. For the rest, I defer to Jeff Cumberbatch’s excellent comments.

    @Bushie. I have never suggested for one moment that the majority of the Bajan population agrees with me. How could I? I am unaware of any poll having been taken and the results thereof. Also, why would I wish to lay a guilt trip on you? I leave those tactics to the weak. Your expressions of regret are noted with thanks.


  49. @ Miller
    Man wunna fellows ain’t got no shame at all…
    When ever Bushie turn up the heat by a few notches wunna run off like likkle children or come back with this nonsense bout Bushie in the closet with Caswell and now lighthouse….Steupssss

    Listen big man, if Bushie was “that way”, the bushman would stand up like a MAN and admit it; would shack up with a soft sweet looking thing like RR; and would ACCEPT his fate…..just as a polio victim would…and adjust his life accordingly.

    Bushie would NOT seek the endorsement of you or anyone else. Bushie would NOT envy normal marriages, and the bushman would CERTAINLY not expect the world to CHANGE ITS RULES to suit my fetish…..

    If wunna fellows can’t stand Bushie’s heat, stay to hell out of BU’s kitchen…
    (Ahmmmm ….David (BU) that DON’T apply to you hear skippa… 🙂 )

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