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The Bible And The Qur'an, Brothers Kept Apart

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brotherskeptapartFellow blogger Weighed in the Balance has undertaken the ambitious and highly risky task of writing a book which as he terms it “is a comparative analysis of the Bible and the Qur’an, and it assumes that both books are correct.  If God is the principal author of each book, as Christians and Muslims claim, then a comparative analysis should reveal harmony between the principal teachings of both.  This is what I have found.  Hence, Christians and Muslims have been kept apart by their religious leaders who have taught their adherents that God has rejected the other group.” The topic matter was thought to be so contentious that he originally penned his book using a pseudonym.

Phillip’s book is titled Brothers Kept Apart and can be purchased on Amazon.com at a reasonable price. Some members of the BU family have already demonstrated that they are students of the religions. Brother Phillips advises that the book represents 30 years of research and 7 years of critical review and he stands ready to defend his thesis.

It is no secret that the BU household has demonstrated a keen interest in the religions or what some people disparagingly refer to as dogmas. It is a fascinating subject and one which is shrouded in mystery, allegories, parables, fables and some theology  Religion has been used through the ages to edify and destroy man’s existence. Of interest to all through the ages has been the cooption of  religion to pit Islam versus Christianity, East versus West by geo-political motivated groups.

For a synopsis of the book the BU family is welcomed to visit Phillips’s blog. We look forward to a fascinating discussion and take the opportunity to wish him every success.

What he has attempted demonstrates courage of conviction, a characteristic in scarce supply.

.

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1,124 responses to “The Bible And The Qur'an, Brothers Kept Apart”

  1. Not Saved Avatar
    Not Saved

    Georgie,

    I certainly do give you a credit of understanding a little science.

    With this understanding you can respect your fellow scientists who you must admit some of which know a little more ev0-biology that you or I.

    So rather than rehash the silly canards of the creationist movement, be honest and recognise that you cannot name a single university biology department in any major university anywhere in the world that does not accept the basic premise of common descent and natural selection being one of the key underlying processes driving change.

    And these departments are full of believers of every persuasion and unbelievers too. This would make Zoe’s claim of bias look rather stupid.

    And by the way, natural selection of giraffe necks is also thought to involve “necking”, a form of fighting between males, thereby explaining the observed difference in height between males and females. But I digress and I am not an expert on giraffe evolution so I suggest you speak to leading zoologist on the matter rather than take anything I say as authority.

    Georgie if you disbelieve evolution, as you say you are entitled to your view, but rather than use your reputation as a scientist to cite more canards please cite the relevant published journals from recognised peer reviewed journals which support your contention.

    You know this is how science is done !

  2. ROK Avatar
    ROK

    @BT

    This piece below from GP is why your farm analogy is perfect:

    ” Georgie Porgie // May 1, 2009 at 4:08 pm

    Now BAFBFP, as I said before, note that in the form of a parable BT in his last post has, in my view gone in to the very deep truths of John 1o which I will post below- As you read,
    give special consideration to words like SHEEP VOICE ONE SHEPHERD DOOR SHHEPFOLD”
    ……………………………………………

    We are being farmed or herded! We are sheep and God is the Shepherd.

  3. Georgie Porgie Avatar
    Georgie Porgie

    Not Saved
    Re “the relevant published journals from recognised peer reviewed journals ”

    You know as I do that a lot of published articles in so called recognised peer reviewed journals is cows wallop, because in many universities men must publish our lose tenure.

    You know also that so called scientists dont present truths that will discount thier views of evolution. I have seen it more than once on tv programs.

    I dont think that you can discount the circulation in the giraffe’s neck. In my view on the basis of the physiology that I was taught, it is too unique to have evolved!

    I think that we ought to be able to see sense in things that our opponents say with out declaring them stupid,or trying to discredit them as often happens here.

  4. BAFBFP Avatar
    BAFBFP

    Man ROK
    You dissect this plan to a point where I feel that as an Atheist I should keep my mout’ shut..! Ha hA. If the atheists over and away were set up in opposition to the Roman Catholics or even just Christian dogma well I’m good with that. But what I think you might be saying is that if you are found to be a member of this new institution you might have to prepare yourself for a life of being kept under surveillance and having your home strip searched. The members will be pigeon holed whether they like it or not. I don’t think the cats have to snap at this one.

    GP

    I am glad for the Bushman and yourself. You are comfortable being high level sheep, or should I say, egotistical high level sheep and that is fine. BTW Bushman the speed of light is in fact constant only under certain conditions – I trap yah Hah, and this we know to be true FOR THE TIME BEING.

    Doc I will say this to you, if I ever experience hearing the voice of the shepherd of which you speak I would be lucky to be close to your facility because I am damned sure that this mini giraffe-heart of mine would not survive the experience. I am not making light of anything that you said, I am just not designed or cut out like you I suppose.

  5. Not Saved Avatar
    Not Saved

    And when scientists publish “cows wallop”, fellow scientists revel in tearing it down

    (yes men must publish, but reviewers need not accept)

  6. Georgie Porgie Avatar
    Georgie Porgie

    Psalm 100:3 states
    Know that the LORD, He is God; It is He who has made us, and not we ourselves; We are His people and the sheep of His pasture.

    We all know or have heard Psalm 23
    We all went to secondary school and did something called English Language, and were taught about metaphors, didnt we?

  7. Not Saved Avatar
    Not Saved

    BT/BAFBFP,

    Light, behaving as a wave, has a speed which depends on the medium in which it is traveling.

    So light travels at different speeds in space, in the air, through glass and in water.

    I suspect you are getting confused with a concept known as lightspeed invariance. (part of special and general relativity)

    Maybe MME can explain better than I

  8. Georgie Porgie Avatar
    Georgie Porgie

    I agree with what you said Not saved, but you know what I mean. We cant depend on these peer review stuff that you like to talk about man. We too have brains man! I know that you dont accept everything you read…….cause you contending with me.LOL and all the time! Is a good thinh I know what I believe, and what I dont believe.

    I dont accept everything the so called scientists say either. There is much that can not be explained on both sides of the issue, or else we would not be dabating.

  9. Not Saved Avatar
    Not Saved

    Back on topic.

    Muslims say jesus was not crucified:

    4:157 That they said (in boast), “We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Apostle of God”; but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow for of a surety they killed him not.
    4:158 Nay, God raised him up unto Himself; and God is Exalted in Power, Wise.
    4:159 And there is none of the People of the Book but must believe in him before his death; and on the Day of Judgment He will be a witness against them.

    Grenville, what say you?

  10. Georgie Porgie Avatar
    Georgie Porgie

    BAFBFP
    I don’t know if the Bushman is a high level sheep, but I am just a simple sheep trying to follow the voice of the Shepherd, as revealed in his Word.

    I can assure you that hearing the voice of the Shepherd wont make you crazy. By the way, I am not one of those folk who you will meet that will tell you the Lord tell me this to tell you etc. Perhaps I don’t hear as well as they. So you can see I am just a plain simple sheep.

  11. Not Saved Avatar
    Not Saved

    Georgie writes :

    “I dont accept everything the so called scientists say either. ”

    —-

    Neither do other scientists.

    The core of the method is to challenge and demonstrate; and the by product is the knowledge we do ultimately acquire.

    But simply choosing what you accept from scientific enquiry based on whether it conflicts with ancient bronze age writings (rather than the science itself) is your prerogative but it is a approach that I cannot accept.

  12. Georgie Porgie Avatar
    Georgie Porgie

    NS

    Could you tell us what you think about the issues that were raised with respect to the physiology of the necks of giraffes and the asses of beetles, as you call it.

  13. Not Saved Avatar
    Not Saved

    Neither observation are inconsistent with the theory of evolution.

    Neither are inconsistent with common descent

    Neither are inconsistent with common descent with modification partially driven by natural selection.

  14. Not Saved Avatar
    Not Saved

    For the beetle I will defer to a well known source, complete with references

    http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/bombardier.html

    It is notable that creationist Gish, so loved and quoted by Zoe is completely discredited by the article.

  15. ROK Avatar
    ROK

    @GP

    “You know as I do that a lot of published articles in so called recognised peer reviewed journals is cows wallop…”

    You were singing a different tune when we were talking about vaccinations.

  16. Not Saved Avatar
    Not Saved

    Let me quote talk origins:

    “Evolution only contradicts a man-made God that operates under man-made constraints.”

    ——-

    So my main point is rather than discredit almost universally accepted scientific understanding (rather disrespecting your fellow scientists I think) on the basis of your own self imposed theological constraints (taking a literal interpretation of bronze age authors), a more rational approach would be to adjust your understanding of the theology.

    There is no more debate in the scientific world about the basic claims of evolutionary theory than there is debate about a flat earth.

    Comment MME ?

  17. ROK Avatar
    ROK

    BAFBPF

    “if you are found to be a member of this new institution you might have to prepare yourself for a life of being kept under surveillance and having your home strip searched…”

    Man you got the wrong impression. You know that strip-search and surveillance could never bother me. I mean that I would have problems being a member because my thing is about truth not about being anti-christian because we are all human and my fight is not against my people but against the entrapment.

    I would therefore be hardpressed to go against people (like how the Christians behave with their brimstone and fire and like the Israelis killing Palestinians). I would not be any better than the christian who wage hol(e)y wars.

  18. Not Saved Avatar
    Not Saved

    I am not an atheist because of evolutionary theory.

    I am an atheist because I dont accept the positive claims of christian theology (or any other theology for that matter)

    I dont understand why some christians fear this one aspect of science (more than any other). It usually leads them to look less credible than otherwise.

    Evo Theory is (to borrow from Newton) one drop of knowledge in the ocean of truth.

    It fills a tiny (but important) gap in our understanding of the world but my approach to the remaining gaps remains the same, I cannot fill it with what is to me nothing more than superstition.

  19. Rohan Avatar
    Rohan

    There are some great minds on this blog.

    On both sides of the fence.

    No question.

    How some of those minds could believe in talking bushes, talking snakes, a 6,000 year old earth, man walking the earth with dinosaurs, and a whole set of other patently ridiculous concepts can only be explained by systematic brainwashing from an early age.

    Brainwashing that leads you to believe everything you read in a book that is full of obvious errors and inconsistencies.

    Brainwashing does 3 things to Xtians:
    1) Make them believe ridiculous claims

    2) Make them look the other way when they are presented with text in the bible that shows obvious inconsistencies, errors, and things that we KNOW to be wrong.

    3) Makes then find excuses for immoral acts including murder, rape, and slavery.

  20. Rohan Avatar
    Rohan

    And the Christians on this board have clearly exhibited all three behaviors with zeal.

    Funny thing, the brainwashing has set so deep that black christians would find a way to defend God when he endorsed slavery.

    Black people, a people that have suffered the ravages of slavery, and continue to do so. Yet Christians are so blinded, they would even seek to find a way to explain or justify God instructing his people to take slaves, and instruct them on how to beat them!!

    That would be like trying to convince jews that the Holocaust was okay cause God said it was.

    Am I the only one that sees this????

  21. Not Saved Avatar
    Not Saved

    Rohan,

    I agree.

    The lack of any unequivocal condemnation of slavery in the bible is very strong evidence of human authorship.

    More to the point, jesus, the jewish apocalyptic prophet was a great moral teacher for his time, but he to failed to condemn slavery, in my opinion demonstrating his very human condition.

  22. BAFBFP Avatar
    BAFBFP

    ROK

    Pity, we are the same side but we have different agendas. I am following this NS link of Bettles’ asses and I’ll get back to you bro.

  23. Georgie Porgie Avatar
    Georgie Porgie

    Not Saved

    You will of course disagree with me.

    I fail to see how the lack of any unequivocal condemnation of slavery in the bible is very strong evidence of human authorship. I fail to see how also why the fact that Jesus failed to condemn slavery as you say, demonstrates his very human condition. You did of course say, in your opinion.

    The purpose of the Bible is clearly not to discuss slavery as you see it. It does, however, trace God’s desire to redeem men from the slave market of sin, and explains how Jesus did so.

    In John 8, Jesus’ opponents declared that they were not then in bondage to anyone nor had never been in bondage. This was at a time when they were subjugated by the Romans, and despite the fact that they had been in bondage in Egypt, had been afflicted throughout the period of the judges, and some of the kings and had been deported by the Assyrians and Babylonians. Jesus’ response was if the Son shall set you free, you shall be free indeed.

    The question to me is one of focus. You guys like the incidentals, believers focus on the essentials of what the Word teaches. I don’t think we are stupid because we don’t harp on slavery.

    Everyone is enslaved by something. Certainly mankind is enslaved by sin, whether it is the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes or the pride of life.

  24. BAFBFP Avatar
    BAFBFP

    Frankley MME,

    I have the greatest respect for individuals who have been on this Earth longer than I have and still chose to think and comment on fundamental issues that affect us all. GP has never tried to force his opinion down my throat, but has only defended his position time and time again with quote after quote. The Bushman who has never been wrong since 1976 will continue not being wrong. But MME I must take exception to this:“the intellectual road to Divine discovery always runs through atheism territory… keep questioning and you will eventually find your way through the fog” If I in fact do find a way through the fog it would only be because I chose to take a short cut.

    You must look at tbat link provided by NS on beetles’ asses.

    Life is short.

    ROK

    The Christian lobby in Barbados needs a counter.

  25. Georgie Porgie Avatar
    Georgie Porgie

    BAFBFP
    MME’s position that :“the intellectual road to Divine discovery always runs through atheism territory… keep questioning and you will eventually find your way through the fog” is not an unreasonable one when you consider that there are many reports of folk who were once avowed atheists who eventually were converted after having their questions answered following contact with the Word of God.

    It is true that for some atheists that when the seed of the Word is sown by the Sower that it falls on stony ground (or bed rock) and does not take root……….

    By your remark “The Christian lobby in Barbados needs a counter” are you saying that NS and Rohan are no mach for Zoe, BT & MME? LOL

  26. ROK Avatar
    ROK

    @GP

    “I fail to see how also why the fact that Jesus failed to condemn slavery as you say, demonstrates his very human condition…”

    Jesus supported slavery in your bible when he said, give unto Caesar what is Caesar’s and unto God what is God’s.

    Clearly that is what we are speaking of. It was a set up. Let the white man keep on doing what he likes and let the sheep follow God so that the white man gets what he wants, because those things are secular.

    Meanwhile the white man plundering and living large off we and we suffering and dying hoping for riches in the after life. What a conspiracy. Of course Imperialism in Barbados is represented by the white man but it is the imperialists that the bible helps out. The white man in Barbados is a contributor tho the imperialists and he gets the money from we.

  27. Micro Mock Engineer Avatar
    Micro Mock Engineer

    OK BAFBFP… I am going to check out the beetles’ asses now and will get back to you 🙂

    @Not Saved… you want my comment on evolutionary theory? LOL… you know my view on that one already… you trying to set up a fight between me an GP? You is Don King or wha? 🙂

  28. Not Saved Avatar
    Not Saved

    Georgie,

    Once again, you show you are an excellent scholar of christian apologetics

    (and I trust you know I am making a compliment to you)

  29. Rohan Avatar
    Rohan

    GP wrote:
    Everyone is enslaved by something. Certainly mankind is enslaved by sin, whether it is the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes or the pride of life.
    ***
    Yup, here is the justification I just said black descendants of slaves come up with.

    And it’s more than a lack of condemnation of slavery. God INSTRUCTED his people to enslave other people, and to keep women that were captured in war if they were virgins.

    Again, Your God instructed his people to Rape and enslave the people around them.

    Are you for or against that?

    Twist words, slick talk, and justify all you want, but this simple truth remains:

    If you are for the rape and enslavement of your fellow human beings you yourself share in that immorality.

    So black people, are you for or against rape and slavery?

  30. victor Avatar
    victor

    Does anybody know which was the first country in human history to make sIavery iIIegaI?

  31. ROK Avatar
    ROK

    BAFBFP

    “The Christian lobby in Barbados needs a counter…”

    I know you don’t mean a secretariat… However, I agree with you, but I am always mindful of how women’s issues got caught up in the feminists struggle. Actually the feminists movement swallowed up women’s issue to the point that women’s issues are still not clarified; even now.

    This is a case where genuine women’s issues got caught up in men bashing and women trying to push over men, etc. That overshadowed any work we could have done towards healing family relations. It turned out in an all out war and who got hurt and still getting hurt? The children.

    We fight a white women’s war for them by endorsing their solutions to their imperialists husbands and put it on our poor men. There is no balanced approach to gender issues. When you hear gender you know they mean women.

    That is why I would caution about falling into a European oriented atheist agenda if we are to save our people from the grasp of the imperialists. We have to define our path and clearly state what we set out to achieve.

    This is where common sense prevails and rather than an attack on people, use educational techniques to get the message of empowerment across. This would bring people to the realisation that they are under slavery and help them find a path out.

    We should approach this not as anti Christian but anti-religion, designed to raise awareness of one’s self, environment and history.

    Take it from me, trying to persuade a Christian away from their faith is like taking them to a bottomless pit, lowering them in and threatening to release. Can you think of anything more terrifying? Well then you have the picture.

  32. Rohan Avatar
    Rohan

    Victor no, I don’t know. Looks like Portugal was the first European country though.

    But can I put you down for being against rape and slavery?
    Thanks

  33. Georgie Porgie Avatar
    Georgie Porgie

    Not Saved
    Thanks for your compliment, but my response was the way I see it.
    In a Bible reading (a Bible study in which several men participate) on the relevant books, the issues that you and Rohan raise would be discussed within its context, but the overall focus of that book, or the BOOK as a whole is stressed. The issues Rohan keep on harping on are definitely none of the major themes or sub themes of the Bible. They may be so very important to him, but Bible scholars and theologians don’t rant and rave about these things, nor do I.

    Rohan
    You say that I twist words and use slick talk to justify God, while you simultaneously and deliberately quote the texts out of their context thereby making them into a pretext. I do not have to defend anything that God said or did. He can, and will defend him self at the great white throne judgement.

    Can you cite the texts where God instructed some one to rape women. I do not rape or enslave anyone.

    Is God instructing black men to rape black women today? Is God instructing black men to enslave other black men today?

  34. Micro Mock Engineer Avatar
    Micro Mock Engineer

    BAFBFP… just finished reading that article on talkorigins. Two observations:

    “The theory says that surviving organisms have developed strategies that succeed; those which acquired failing strategies aren’t around any more.”

    – belief in the Divine is a strategy that succeeds.

    The author begins his concluding remarks with this statement “Do bombardier beetles look designed? Yes; they look like they were designed by evolution.”

    – LOL… that’s like saying “do houses look like they were designed? Yes; they look like they were designed by AutoCad.”

    Lets not confuse design tools with Designers.

  35. Rohan Avatar
    Rohan

    GP wrote:
    You say that I twist words and use slick talk to justify God, while you simultaneously and deliberately quote the texts out of their context.
    ****
    Here is another sweet christian technique. When faced with damning text from the bible, they raise the objection that the quote is taken out of context.

    So GP, In what context does an order to enslave someone work?

    In what context does the endorsement of “keeping virgin women for yourself” work? Is’nt that enslavement and rape?

    Here are your texts that you ask for:

    ******
    Obviously these women were repeatedly raped. These sick bastards killed and raped an entire town and then wanted more virgins, so they hid beside the road to kidnap and rape some more. How can anyone see this as anything but evil?

    1) Murder, rape, and pillage at Jabesh-gilead (Judges 21:10-24 NLT).

    So they sent twelve thousand warriors to Jabesh-gilead with orders to kill everyone there, including women and children. “This is what you are to do,” they said. “Completely destroy all the males and every woman who is not a virgin.” Among the residents of Jabesh-gilead they found four hundred young virgins who had never slept with a man, and they brought them to the camp at Shiloh in the land of Canaan.

    The Israelite assembly sent a peace delegation to the little remnant of Benjamin who were living at the rock of Rimmon. Then the men of Benjamin returned to their homes, and the four hundred women of Jabesh-gilead who were spared were given to them as wives. But there were not enough women for all of them. The people felt sorry for Benjamin because the LORD had left this gap in the tribes of Israel. So the Israelite leaders asked, “How can we find wives for the few who remain, since all the women of the tribe of Benjamin are dead? There must be heirs for the survivors so that an entire tribe of Israel will not be lost forever. But we cannot give them our own daughters in marriage because we have sworn with a solemn oath that anyone who does this will fall under God’s curse.”

    Then they thought of the annual festival of the LORD held in Shiloh, between Lebonah and Bethel, along the east side of the road that goes from Bethel to Shechem. They told the men of Benjamin who still needed wives, “Go and hide in the vineyards. When the women of Shiloh come out for their dances, rush out from the vineyards, and each of you can take one of them home to be your wife! And when their fathers and brothers come to us in protest, we will tell them, ‘Please be understanding. Let them have your daughters, for we didn’t find enough wives for them when we destroyed Jabesh-gilead. And you are not guilty of breaking the vow since you did not give your daughters in marriage to them.’” So the men of Benjamin did as they were told. They kidnapped the women who took part in the celebration and carried them off to the land of their own inheritance. Then they rebuilt their towns and lived in them. So the assembly of Israel departed by tribes and families, and they returned to their own homes.

  36. Rohan Avatar
    Rohan

    Murder, rape and pillage of the Midianites (Numbers 31:7-18 NLT)

    They attacked Midian just as the LORD had commanded Moses, and they killed all the men.

    Moses, Eleazar the priest, and all the leaders of the people went to meet them outside the camp. But Moses was furious with all the military commanders who had returned from the battle. “Why have you let all the women live?” he demanded. “These are the very ones who followed Balaam’s advice and caused the people of Israel to rebel against the LORD at Mount Peor. They are the ones who caused the plague to strike the LORD’s people. Now kill all the boys and all the women who have slept with a man. Only the young girls who are virgins may live; YOU MAY KEEP THEM FOR YOURSELVES.

    Clearly Moses and God approves of rape of virgins.

  37. Rohan Avatar
    Rohan

    More Murder Rape and Pillage (Deuteronomy 20:10-14)

    As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will SERVE YOU IN FORCED LABOR. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may KEEP FOR YOURSELF ALL THE WOMEN, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you.

    What kind of God approves of murder, rape, and slavery?

  38. Rohan Avatar
    Rohan

    IS that enough GP? Or do you want more rape, pillage, and murder?

    Want me post where God says that if you beat a slave and he doesn’t die the same day it’s okay?

    If you beat your slave and he manages to live one day, even if he dies the next day, it’s okay cause it’s your property!

    Let me know if you need more?

  39. Rohan Avatar
    Rohan

    Laws of Rape (Deuteronomy 22:28-29 NLT)

    If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.

    What kind of lunatic would make a rape victim marry her attacker? Answer: God.

  40. Rohan Avatar
    Rohan

    Rape of Female Captives (Deuteronomy 21:10-14 NAB)

    “When you go out to war against your enemies and the LORD, your God, delivers them into your hand, so that you take captives, if you see a comely woman among the captives and become so enamored of her that you wish to have her as wife, you may take her home to your house. But before she may live there, she must shave her head and pare her nails and lay aside her captive’s garb. After she has mourned her father and mother for a full month, you may have relations with her, and you shall be her husband and she shall be your wife. However, if later on you lose your liking for her, you shall give her her freedom, if she wishes it; but you shall not sell her or enslave her, since she was married to you under compulsion.”

    Once again God approves of forcible rape.

  41. Rohan Avatar
    Rohan

    This is the sick, SICK creature you worship.

    Sex Slaves (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)

    When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl’s owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter. If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife. If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)

  42. Sir Bentwood Dick Avatar
    Sir Bentwood Dick

    ROK, ”You can explain nothing by believing”

    Ah, but you are trying to ‘explain’,according to some formula or comfortable notation that makes you happy, which in itself is a limitation by parameters.

    With some things, the explanation is the event itself!

    As I said, it seems that we are on different planes completely and I have no problem with that.

    But, do not call it BE, because your ‘expalanations’ are unverifiable also, they simply cannot be verifiable in totality, it is impossible.

    NO ONE can have any ‘claim’ to know what the truth is, neither ‘Christians who support a biblical history and lifestyle as per their understanding’ nor ‘scientists’ who oppose such views.

    Neither has any greater claim on ‘truth’ than the other.

    I have noted the hilarious defense of science recently, that scientists themselves know that their ‘theories’ may be tested and disagreed to.

    This is hilarious because most in the past have put their theories forward as ‘gospel’, until disproved, which is in itself a lie, disguised with explanations under current knowledge.

    I say, that none of you, no one out there, can tell anyone else what is truth, or not.

    Full stop.

    If you disagree, then no problem.

  43. Straight talk Avatar
    Straight talk

    Respect SIR,

    I was at one time identifying you as Lowdown, but after your last two comments I think you deserve the accolade of Big Up.

  44. Georgie Porgie Avatar
    Georgie Porgie

    Rohan

    I think the best person for you to take up your peeve in these matters is with God himself. You will get to see him at the great white throne judgement.

    I have never had any problem with these passages. And these same things happen today all over the world without God telling folk to do them.

  45. Rohan Avatar
    Rohan

    Georgie Porgie wrote:
    I have never had any problem with these passages. And these same things happen today all over the world without God telling folk to do them.

    *******
    Thanks for proving my premise in this one callous statement. You, sir are a despicable human being.

  46. ROK Avatar
    ROK

    @Sir Bentwood Dick

    “Ah, but you are trying to ‘explain’,according to some formula or comfortable notation that makes you happy, which in itself is a limitation by parameters.”

    Come on Sir Bentwood, you were so comfortable doing it yourself that you don’t recognise the difference. What mote are you trying to point out? Is there a beam in your eye?

    You are picking up on the formula itself without realising that I was simply using the formula as an analogy to explain “application and use” of knowledge. In that example if you know two, you can calculate the third factor. I was referring to the creative use of knowledge, not that the formula is a universal approach to gaining knowledge.

    There are several ways to gain knowledge. One way of rejecting knowledge though is having a deep and strong belief that is contrary to or in conflict with the truth, so that the truth becomes unrecognisable.

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    Not Saved

    “This is hilarious because most in the past have put their theories forward as ‘gospel’, until disproved”

    —-

    Nice straw man, hope you had fun with it

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    MME,

    On the contrary, I was hoping you would ‘comfort’ GP on how one could be a believer and accept evolutionary theory.

  49. ROK Avatar
    ROK

    Rohan,

    You have to understand that GP does not think there is anything wrong no matter what you say. He will tell you that you can’t fly in the face of God and that you can’t know god’s will; a cop-out.

    so if you say anything against the Israelis killing the Palestinians, they will support the Israelis. He, Carlos and one Dictionary defended the Israelis to the bone, talking about prophecies that have to be fulfilled.

    That is how dangerous christianity is. It will allow the destruction of people under the guise of doing god’s work. So if GP et al found themselves in Palestine today they would feel committed to taking up arms against defenseless people in order to be a proud part of the prophesy.

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    Georgie writes:

    “The issues Rohan keep on harping on are definitely none of the major themes or sub themes of the Bible.”

    —–

    I understand what you mean.

    I too would agree they are not a major theme and that is not the point I would make about them.

    It is the absence of condemnation of practices acceptable in the 1st century that points strongly to 1st century authorship rather than divine authorship.

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