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brotherskeptapartFellow blogger Weighed in the Balance has undertaken the ambitious and highly risky task of writing a book which as he terms it โ€œis a comparative analysis of the Bible and the Qur’an, and it assumes that both books are correct.ย  If God is the principal author of each book, as Christians and Muslims claim, then a comparative analysis should reveal harmony between the principal teachings of both.ย  This is what I have found.ย  Hence, Christians and Muslims have been kept apart by their religious leaders who have taught their adherents that God has rejected the other group.โ€ The topic matter was thought to be so contentious that he originally penned his book using a pseudonym.

Phillipโ€™s book is titled Brothers Kept Apart and can be purchased on Amazon.com at a reasonable price. Some members of the BU family have already demonstrated that they are students of the religions. Brother Phillips advises that the book represents 30 years of research and 7 years of critical review and he stands ready to defend his thesis.

It is no secret that the BU household has demonstrated a keen interest in the religions or what some people disparagingly refer to as dogmas. It is a fascinating subject and one which is shrouded in mystery, allegories, parables, fables and some theologyย  Religion has been used through the ages to edify and destroy manโ€™s existence. Of interest to all through the ages has been the cooption ofย  religion to pit Islam versus Christianity, East versus West by geo-political motivated groups.

For a synopsis of the book the BU family is welcomed to visit Phillips’s blog. We look forward to a fascinating discussion and take the opportunity to wish him every success.

What he has attempted demonstrates courage of conviction, a characteristic in scarce supply.

.


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1,124 responses to “The Bible And The Qur'an, Brothers Kept Apart”


  1. Oh there is harmony alright;

    do as we say or burn…

    kill the unbeliever…..

    yes that is harmony alright


  2. Interesting,

    the solution to people believing in different fables and fairy tales is for everyone to believe in the same fable and fairy tale.

    These religions cant even agree on their own version let alone someone else’s fable….

    Good luck with this.

    I have another solution.

    How about we all stop believing in silly fables and fairy tales…?

    Just a suggestion.


  3. We have launched a new feature rolled out by WordPress today. We have activated the ‘comments-by-email’ feature. Commenters can now post a comment to BU from inside their mailbox. To get comments in your mailbox you need to activate the “notify” option (tick the box under comment) when making a comment.


  4. Hi Not Saved:

    The study found harmony between the principal teachings of the Bible and the Qur’an, but conflict between Christian and Islamic religious traditions.

    Regarding not believing in fairy tales, I agree with you. How do we determine whether a claim is a fairy tale? We subject it to rigorous scrutiny. We should never be afraid to critically examine claims of truth, for truth should be able to withstand rigorous scrutiny.

    Regards,
    Grenville


  5. huh?

    Right now I am going through my Hindu phase, excluding the caste theory of course. There is something to seeing God in a rat, an elephant, cow, snake, etc. My favourite is Hanuman, the monkey God. Why? In the temples he is painted black like me.

    Whenever I am invited to a puja at the temple, I say a pray to Hanuman.


  6. “Hence, Christians and Muslims have been kept apart by their religious leaders who have taught their adherents that God has rejected the other group.โ€ Yet the assumption is that both books are correct, but for whom? And since these two religious figure heads heard directly from “God” their opposing ideology should be thoroughly examined. Maybe they are hearing from two different “Gods.”

    Around 639 CE Ancient Egyptians leaders invited General El As to come to Egypt to help them drive out the Romans and since then Islam has never left. Those who rejected Islam were abused, tortured, enslaved and lost their lands. This is the same crap that was and is still being meted out under the Europeans.

    Christianity, Muslim and Judaism are the Trinity that has reduced a once Mighty People to the state of beggars and laughing stock of the world today. These are the tools that decimated Blacks and we need to step away from this enslavement. There is no brotherhood in these idelogies for Black People. They have all conspired against us. The Black Man preceded these ideologies. They have all stolen from Ancient Egypt.The head of these religious ideologies are the POPE.


  7. Grenville,

    I agree.

    How do religions (particularly islam) react to “scrutiny”?

    Not well, I think most would agree.

  8. livinginbarbados Avatar
    livinginbarbados

    @David,

    I have found that the notify option only worked before with Internet Explorer, not other browsers such as Firefox or Safari.

    Credit to the author for doing this daunting task, though it is not new.


  9. Hi Hopi:

    You wrote: โ€œThose who rejected Islam were abused, tortured, enslaved and lost their lands. This is the same crap that was and is still being meted out under the Europeans.โ€

    I am not an apologist for the many crimes that were, and continue to be carried out, under the banner of Islam. Muslims who support such acts justify them by referring to explicit passages in the Qurโ€™an, which they have simply misinterpreted. As already explained, of all the books in the world that have ever been written, the Qurโ€™an is perhaps the easiest of them all to misinterpret. I trust that the study can bring some clarity to its interpretation.

    Hi Not Saved:

    Muslims do not react well to scrutiny. However, they may be convinced by what is in the Qurโ€™an. Since I have assumed that the Qurโ€™an is correct, then we have a starting point for our discussions. A discussion on the authenticity of the Qurโ€™an is simply an academic exercise that will result in nothing but conflict.

    Hi Living in Barbados:

    I would be interested in reviewing any similar research. When I started, one had to wait for years until the Vatican library, or other such source would give permission to review such historical documents. It is only recently that much of the relevant historical documents have been more accessible.

    Regards,
    Grenville


  10. @Not Saved

    “the solution to people believing in different fables and fairy tales is for everyone to believe in the same fable and fairy tale.”

    That was the purpose of the Council of Nicea.


  11. @ Grenville
    “We should never be afraid to critically examine claims of truth, for truth should be able to withstand rigorous scrutiny.”

    All roads that lead to the truth are solidly build. However, megaton trucks heavily laden with baggage avoid them because these roads never lead in their destination. The drivers would prefer to get stuck in a back road to their destination which they never get to.


  12. @Grenville……I have not studied the Qur’an nor the Bible. But if these writings were directly from God’s Mouth to the Prophets’ Ears for the guidance of the people, why is it that they (or as you say the Qur’an) can be so easily misinterpreted. Was this the original intention of “God” to have the people all confused?


  13. Grenville

    “Since I have assumed that the Qurโ€™an is correct, then we have a starting point for our discussions.”

    I sincerely hope that you don’t turn out to be another GP.

    You see, this is my exact point. You begin by believe a story which has no relationship to the historical record and then turn around and assume it to be true.

    How in the name of the Creator can you do that? I posit that you can’t believe and then assume it to be true and this is the basis of the friction between Christians and non-christians and now, Muslims and non-muslims.

    Belief and truth are at the opposite ends of the spectrum. Where truth and belief meets we can have knowledge, but where belief does not meet truth, you have lies and at best, a probability.

    But I will take you further, the potency of the probability is in the evidence. Where there is no evidence my friend, the probability tends from zero to infinity.

    I am not putting aside the miracle, but what you have is a chronicle of events that were so miraculous that nobody in the entire world paid attention when they were happening?

    Furthermore sir, how do you account for the clear comparison between the Ancient accounts of the Sumerians and the Egyptians that existed long before any of the two of your religions?

    A dearly departed friend once told me. Religion is here because someday there will be no more religion. It will be wiped out and we will have only men of knowledge and wisdom living in harmony. Utopia!

    Scream and come again, Sir.


  14. David,

    I am not seeing a link to e-mail and if I hit the reply button that donotreply address is in the ‘to’ box?


  15. Bullocks


  16. Hi me:

    It takes no intellectual effort whatsoever to simply dismiss 30 years of research.


  17. Hi Hopi:

    Please read โ€˜The Audacity of Hopeโ€™ article again. I explained that the authorized version of the Qurโ€™an was compiled non-chronologically 24 years after Mohammedโ€™s death. The unverified assumptions that resulted are also described.

    Regards,
    Grenville


  18. Belief and truth are at the opposite ends of the spectrum.
    ***

    Truer words have never been spoken. Who needs belief when we have understanding backed by verifiable, testable evidence? We no longer have to believe that the SUN is a God, we now know it’s one of billions of stars.

    Anything that is presented without evidence should be dismissed the way we dismiss Santa Claus, the tooth fairy, Zeus, Odin, Shiva, and the thousands of Gods man has made up. Yes, that includes your particular God, whoever he/she may be.


  19. Hi ROK:

    1. Since the Nicaea documents are available for all to see, we can determine whether the process and the outcome had any integrity.

    2. The evidence in the historical record supports the major information in the Qurโ€™an. What historical source documents are you reading?

    3. The comparisons with the Sumerian and Egyptian documents is another discussion, which I would be happy to have on another discussion thread.

    4. Perhaps you are correct about the absence of religion. You are actually describing heaven, when there will be no more religion, just a relationship with God.

    Regards,
    Grenville


  20. Where is heaven? Grenville, you are hilarious. There is no more evidence for the God of the bible, versus the God of the Qu’aran, versus the Gods of Greek mythology, versus the Gods of Indian religions, versus the God-dragon that lives in my basement.

    God, didn’t create all these other Gods. So who created them? Man. And if man is in the business of creating Gods, then what makes you think he didn’t create yours too?


  21. Grenville,

    Which bible?

    Which manuscript?

    which canon?

    which version of christianity?

    the hundreds that developed after rome or the hundreds that existed before the roman church?


  22. @Grenville…… What is the verification that Mohammed received revelation from an angel?

    Since these teachings have kept them apart, caused so much bloodshed, shouldn’t they just get rid of both of them?

    And where does the Torah/Talmud fit in here? Did “God” speak to George Bushes both Sr & Jr and told them to go and kill over 1mil Iraqis. Did “God” speak to Sharon & Olmert and all the other blood-soaked zionists and told them to go and kill the Palestinians? Did “God” speak with the christian invaders and tell them to go kill the Africans? Is God speaking to Obama now telling him to drop drones in Pakistan and kill the innocent, to continue the blood-letting in Iraq and Afghanistan? Would this be the same God that spoke to the angel that spoke to the prophet Mohammed?


  23. Hopi,

    I would suggest that the God that spoke to the two in the Bush and Sharon is also the God of Mohammed and the Bible.

    This God has a MO of divide and rule. I am yet to get to the bottom of why? I would also suggest that it is the same God of all the religions on earth. It’s a monopoly that fetches a different price according to the gullibility of the particular people.


  24. Grenville

    You say: “2. The evidence in the historical record supports the major information in the Qurโ€™an.”

    Then you say: “3. The comparisons with the Sumerian and Egyptian documents is another discussion, which I would be happy to have on another discussion thread.”

    It is I that then must ask you, what are you considering to be the historical records?


  25. Hmmm…

    The link “Brothers Kept Apart” in the opening Blog (read: “http://bajan.wordpress.com/Walter Phillips”) results in a 404 server error (read: “Page not found”).

    @BU.David: What says you?


  26. @ Grenville, you seem to be an intelligent man, who appears to approach your research with proper principles of objective, cogent, coherent, logical methods, leading to rational conclusions; which is the only way to approach such a discussion a this.

    Well, my friend, if you are not aware of the likes of Rok and Hopi, Not Saved et al, you are in for a whole (hole) lot of incoherent, incongrous, inconsequent, incommunicado, from these experts, who know everything, about nothing!

    I am, however, lookingfoward to your analysis of these two very diametrically opposed documents, the Quran, and the Bible, both claiming to be divinely inspired.

    Grenville, as you know, ‘Two competing ‘truth’ claims cannot be both right at the same time and place; they can both be wrong, but they cannot both be right.” (The Law of Non-contradiction in Logic).

    Secondly, “A proposition is true, (valid) when reality is the way it is represented to be.” ( The Law of Identity in Logic).

    Thirdly, “If A is true, then -A is a falsity” (Law of Excluded Middle in Logic)

    The structure of justification, when defending any propositional truth claim, rest solely on ‘Coherence’ which is our criterion for Truth!

    These sound principles of logic, have universal application to all men, every where, ALL of the time, for there are not bound by any culture, class, nor creed; and, they do not change; truth, especially Divine truth, is absolute, unchangeable, as mankind does not invent truth; for truth is discovered, when it is seeked after with an objective mind.

    As Simon Greenleaf, a father of the theory of evidence, in his famous 1874 work, “Testimony of the Evangelists…rule of municiple law, wrote:

    “A proposition of fact is proved when its truth is established by competent and satisfactory evidence.”

    Carry on my friend!


  27. Hi Rohan:

    I will happily discuss the existence of God, and how that God is the only Creator, and the God worshipped by Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. However, let us do that on another thread.

    Hi Not Saved:

    Any recognized Bible will do. I have already explained that Islamic and Christian traditions are incompatible. Therefore, there is no need to provide a Christian denomination.

    Hi Hopi:

    Again, you are entering into โ€˜religious traditionโ€™. Harmony was found between the principal teachings in the Bible and the Qurโ€™an. Regarding verifying that an angel spoke with Mohammed, I explained that I was starting with the assumption that both books were correct.

    Hi ROK:

    The historical record I am referring to are authenticated historical documents from the time of Jesus to the time of Mohammed. You are well aware that the Sumerian and Egyptian documents predate these for thousands of years.

    Regards,
    Grenville


  28. Zoe,

    Where do you get off with your patronising rhetoric? You who don’t understand the difference between an assumption and the truth or belief and truth?

    You who demonstrates your warp sense of logic and really know nothing about the dynamics of logic.

    Look you now come with mote in your eyes to see how much more mote you could spread. How could a claim be a truth? They have to be two competing claims because two competing truths are all truth; like darkness and light.

    Furthermore, you cannot discover truth, it is always there and you may happen upon it; talk about logic?

    Really, what is reality except what you make it to be? Each and every man according to his thoughts. Can you see that you are a slave? Your reality is that you are a free man. My reality is that you are a slave with few options for success and which very few of my colour have achieved.

    @ Zoe
    “โ€œIf A is true, then -A is a falsityโ€ (Law of Excluded Middle in Logic)”.

    My Lord! What logic! They actually fooled you with that one; huh! Like “changing the goal post” rule! Anything to help you stay on top. They set you up good. You can’t even think for yourself. You swallow everything hook, line and sinker.

    Your quote: โ€œA proposition of fact is proved when its truth is established by competent and satisfactory evidence.โ€

    What is competent and satisfactory to you is certainly not competent and satisfactory. There is no universal application here. That statement is about subjectivity and emotionalism; nothing objective, and it is grounded in belief, not fact; so where is the logic? An academic exercise?


  29. Hi Zoe:

    Excellent post. Please follow this logic.

    A: Christians claim that the words of the God of Abraham are recorded in the Bible.

    B: Muslims claim that the God of Abraham is the author of the Qurโ€™an.

    If both A and B are true, then there should be harmony between the principal teachings of the Bible and the Qurโ€™an.

    If there is not harmony between the principal teachings of A and B, then a common Author s unlikely.

    If there is harmony, then it is possible that these brothers can be reconciled.

    If there is disharmony, then the chances of reconciliation are unlikely.

    I have found that there is harmony. Hence, they can either both be right or both wrong. That is the topic of another thread.

    Regards,
    Grenville


  30. @Grenville
    “The historical record I am referring to are authenticated historical documents from the time of Jesus to the time of Mohammed.”

    You are telling me that you have a historic record outside of the holy books that authenticates the bible stories?

    Man I would love to see that.


  31. Grenville

    “Muslims claim that the God of Abraham is the author of the Qurโ€™an.”

    I have to admit that your logic does seem to out-shine Zoe. This is interesting. Need to take a ringside seat on this one…. ah listening.


  32. Nemesia Grenville…

    However, let me please observe, as an independent and free thinker, that no formalized religion is required for one to be comfortable where one finds oneself…

    I, personally, mostly resonate with the believes of the Buddhist and the Hindu. They, in my humble opinion, most seriously consider the obvious reality of the empirical quantum uncertainty…

    Seriously….


  33. You people who cant think for yourselves, who have been brainwashed as children and remain that way, will spend the rest of your lives living on a flat earth.

    Better be careful driving your car, that you go over the rim and get lost in space….

    Who is this “God” you talk about? Is this ‘God’ the Christians adore, the same one the Muslims fall on their knees for? That the Jews ‘pray’ to? That the Hindus worship? And the Buddhists?

    Go to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_religions_and_spiritual_traditions and check the several hundres religions of the world… is this ‘God’ the same God at the head of these religions?

    If not, then – how many are there?

    Maybe they are Brothers ??? (we know they couldn’t be sisters…..)

    Well, you people have believed more crazy ideas… shall I provide a list for you?


  34. @CENTIPEDE…

    I abhor parasites…

    Buddhists pray to no god(s).

    Buddhists kneel to, and only for, the Universe….


  35. @ROK……I swear that, that “God” is the “God” of DEATH. Do you see how that ” christian zealot” Zoe has already stepped in here with his ardent opposition….. “I am, however, looking foward to your analysis of these two very diametrically opposed documents, the Quran, and the Bible, both claiming to be divinely inspired.” You see how he doesn’t even believe that his bible has been divinely inspired, yet he tried so hard to defend it. He said that they CLAIMED to be. Ain’t that something?

    @GRENVILLE

    “I have found that there is harmony. Hence, they can either both be right or both wrong. That is the topic of another thread.” There’s no need for another thread because this is all relative. The harmonization lies in the fact that these religions were birthed in invasion, slaughter & bloodshed and eventual damnation if you don’t concede.


  36. Hopi,

    That is good spotting. I taking it a bit further than you though. I would tell them that if they are birthed by the same god, then they both have to be compatible and there has to be convergence.

    However, it is like humanity for everybody to have their own kingdom, so much so that even when the two are birthed from the same womb, they would want to divide it into two wombs and keep them divided in order to exercise power and authority.

    Each religious denomination is like a Lucifer; cast out, but allowed to live.


  37. Thanks for that Christopher Halsall – however there are several ‘varieties’ of Buddhism.


  38. Hi ROK:

    Regarding extra-Biblical sources to verify the Biblical events, let me recommend โ€œThe Bible in the British Museumโ€ published by The British Museum Press. Let me further recommend that you visit this museum and the British Library when next you are in the UK and examine the evidence for your self. In the interim, you can read the book, Brothers Kept Apart, where I have quoted and referenced various relevant authenticated historical documents.

    Hi Christopher:

    I believe that you are correct in stating that no formalized religion is necessary for the individual. However, in order to pass on the beliefs to the next generation, history has shown that a religious tradition is quite effective.

    I have not studied the Hindu Vedas, or Buddhaโ€™s writings sufficiently to comment on them. However, the Jews, Christians, and Muslims claim that there is only One God, who is the only Creator. They also claim that we can cultivate a personal relationship with this Creator. I am still waiting for someone to provide a rational reason for rejecting such an offer.

    Hi Centipede:

    Apparently you have chosen to spurn the offer to cultivate a relationship with your Creator. Do you have a rational reason for doing so?

    Hi Hopi:

    You are mistaken. You need to critically review the source of your information.

    Regards,
    Grenville


  39. Grenville,

    You wrote:

    “They [religions] also claim that we can cultivate a personal relationship with this Creator. I am still waiting for someone to provide a rational reason for rejecting such an offer.”

    To reject the offer you must accept the claim the offer exists.

    Why accept the claim?

    Can you cite an example of “authenticated historical documents” which support the main claims of the christian religion?

    At least give us an example because I am still at a loss as to exactly what you mean.


  40. @CENTIPEDE: “…however there are several โ€˜varietiesโ€™ of Buddhism.

    True.

    However, please name one which worships a particular God.


  41. @Grenville: “However, in order to pass on the beliefs to the next generation, history has shown that a religious tradition is quite effective.

    Unfortunately, religious tradition is also quite effective for many other purposes….


  42. Hi Not Saved:

    The options that are clearly open to all of us is to either accept the offer to cultivate a relationship with our Creator, or to reject it. Those who have not accepted the offer are essentially rejecting it until death robs them of the opportunity. You must be honest with yourself. While you ponder and analyze the authenticity of the offer, are you essentially trying to justify your reasons for rejecting it?

    You asked for an example of a historical document. How about the highly respected Roman historian, Tacitus, who wrote:

    “But not all the relief that could come from man, not all the bounties that the prince could bestow, nor all the atonements which could be presented to the gods, availed to relieve Nero from the infamy of being believed to have ordered the conflagration, the fire of Rome. Hence to suppress the rumor, he falsely charged with the guilt, and punished Christians, who were hated for their enormities.”

    “Christus, the founder of the name, was put to death by Pontius Pilate, procurator of Judea in the reign of Tiberius:” (Tacitus, Annals 15.44)

    Please read Brothers Kept Apart for the remainder.

    Regards,
    Grenville


  43. Grenville
    “You asked for an example of a historical document. How about the highly respected Roman historian, Tacitus, who wrote…”

    Man you guys trip up yourselves before you start. Why don’t you come with something that is not in dispute?

    The dates are out of sync. The word Christus is in dispute because the scribe wrote something else which was changed to Christians; the physical evidence reveals the change.

    Persecution under NERO did not happen in the time of Christ and if there was a man called Pontius Pilate under Nero, he certainly was after Christ.

    Furthermore, the issue with Nero and the religious fanatics was the burning of the City. It never happened in the Bible. That was not the stated reason for the crucifixion.

    Please give me something that is not in dispute. One thing!


  44. Grenville,

    I wish I had a dollar every time a christian quoted tacitus.

    what next ? josephus? pliny?

    Tacitus is writing in 115CE about 85 years after Jesus.

    The existence of christians in the period is not in doubt and his death at the hands of pilate is a claim from the gospels. This is not a contemporaneous account.

    Lets look at Greek and Roman contemporaneous sources (around 30CE till the end of the century) and see what they say about Jesus.

    What do they say? Nothing !

    He is never discussed or even maligned or talked about in any way in any surviving pagan source of the period.

    His name is never mentioned in any secular roman/greek document, not even once.

    We have a LOT of greek and roman sources from the period; religious scholars, historians, philosophers, poets, scientists. We even have thousands of letters from the period.

    In no first century greek or roman secular source of any kind is jesus mentioned.

    If we look at certain claims in the bible they also fall short for example the alleged census requiring joseph home. There is no record.

    Looking at Jewish sources there is only one, Josephus around 90CE. josephus was a considered a traitor and his work was copied by christian scribes, his most famous reference to jesus ( one of two brief paragraphs in 20 volumes) was likely inserted and this is common ground among scholars of the period.

    If you search all secular greek and roman references to jesus for 100 years after his death, all you find is tacitus and pliny the younger.

    Thats it.

    The authenticity of the tacitus reference is even in doubt since he refers to pilate as a procurator and not a prefect and tacitus would be aware the significant historical difference.

    The gospels (for which all of or knowledge of jesus comes) are not contemporaneous accounts, they are not written by eyewitnesses, they are not written by the apostles (or companions), the names were attributed to the anonymous gospels in the 2nd century.

    So again I ask, where are the “authenticated historical documents” to which you refer?


  45. Here is the quote from tacitus, which you seem to have rather edited :

    “Consequently, to get rid of the report, Nero fastened the guilt and inflicted the most exquisite tortures on a class hated for their abominations, called Christians [or Chrestians; see below] by the populace. Christus, from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius at the hands of one of our procurators, Pontius Pilatus, and a most mischievous superstition, thus checked for the moment, again broke out not only in Judaea, the first source of the evil, but even in Rome, where all things hideous and shameful from every part of the world find their centre and become popular. Accordingly, an arrest was first made of all who pleaded guilty; then, upon their information, an immense multitude was convicted, not so much of the crime of firing the city, as of hatred against mankind. Mockery of every sort was added to their deaths. Covered with the skins of beasts, they were torn by dogs and perished, or were nailed to crosses, or were doomed to the flames and burnt, to serve as a nightly illumination, when daylight had expired.”


  46. Grenville,

    You wrote :

    “The options that are clearly open to all of us is to either accept the offer to cultivate a relationship with our Creator, or to reject it. Those who have not accepted the offer are essentially rejecting it until death robs them of the opportunity.”

    Clearly open? to whom?

    10 million children under 5 will die in the next year, the vast majority due to preventable disease.

    is the offer open to them?

    Most will have been under nourished leading to increased risk of the disease that kills them. They lead short miserable disease ridden lives.

    You continued …….

    “You must be honest with yourself. While you ponder and analyze the authenticity of the offer, are you essentially trying to justify your reasons for rejecting it?”

    It did not take long for the patronising christian to raise his head.


  47. You presume a creator, presume “an offer to cultivate a relationship” and then admonish people because “reject it”

    Typical christian arrogance.


  48. religion brings societies down… blah blah blah

  49. Micro Mock Engineer Avatar
    Micro Mock Engineer

    Qurโ€™an (Shakir Translation) Sura 112 –
    “Say: He, Allah, is One. Allah is He on Whom all depend. He begets not, nor is He begotten. And none is like Him.”

    Bible (American Standard Version) John 3:16 –
    “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have eternal life.”

    โ€ฆ and never the twain shall meet.


  50. Dear ROC:

    ROC, you have managed to dismiss the most respected Roman historian. I only provided that evidence after directing you to all of the physical and documented evidence in the British Museum. Have you rejected all of that evidence as well? I suppose that if an Angel of God appeared to you, that you would try to rationalize the experience as a result of something you ingested.

    Jesus gave an example of a rich man who lived comfortably on the earth, while a poor man sat at his gate in misery. In time they both died, and the rich man, being in torment, requested Abraham to send the poor man to comfort him. Abraham explained that such was impossible.

    The rich man then requested that the poor man be sent back to warn his brothers lest they meet the same fate. Abraham explained that there was sufficient evidence in the scriptures. The rich man, knowing his brothers, explained that they would not believe such evidence, but would believe if one came back from the dead. Abraham confirmed that if they will not accept the evidence already provided, then they would not believe one that was sent back from the dead.

    The point of Jesusโ€™ example is to show that for some people, no amount of evidence is sufficient.

    Regards,
    Grenville

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