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Election Day in St. George North

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Today the electorate of St. George North will vote for a member of parliament to fill the vacancy created by the ‘retirement’ of Gline Clarke. The blogmaster’s assessment is that it will be a straight contest between Floyd Reifer (DLP) and Toni Moore (BLP). Of the so-called third parties Grenville Phillips should retain third option in the number count. We can debate if Barbadians are ready for a third party or is this a case of the quality of the options presented. The blogmaster respectfully suggest the latter.

The result of the election will answer a few questions for political pundits.

  • Has the Democratic Labour Party (DLP) regain its standing as the credible alternative in the eyes of voters?
  • Despite managing the affairs of state in the most challenging period post independence, will the Barbados Labour Party (BLP) be able to convince the SGN electorate that it is the most competent to govern at this time?
  • Will Grenville Phillips increase his penetration of support in the constituency to forge the way for third parties in the future?
  • How large will the protest vote be which has been fomenting in a climate of austerity for the last 3 years?
  • Has the last 90 days of campaigning confirm the urgent need for electoral reform in Barbados?

So far by-election activities has been largely peaceful in keeping with Bajan tradition. Let us continue to make the country proud by delivering an uneventful event. The blogmaster’s vote will be cast for David Walrond, the agriculturist and community practitioner.

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895 responses to “Election Day in St. George North”

  1. Mariposa Avatar
    Mariposa

    Donna F off or in other words ( take a COVIDflight )
    Who de hell is u to tell me how and what method of words i used to be critical of govt and policies
    FYI past govt has been gone for two and half years
    Present govt promised moon and stars as solutions
    Also if u had any knowledge about the environment u wouldnt even be spousing nonsense about the sewer system and a govt solution which can affect the natural habitat of animal and plant life that lives in the ocean
    Look dont bother me with yuh political nonsense
    Really not interested in nothing u have to say
    Better yet get lost

  2. Enuff Avatar
    Enuff

    Hal – And you were and are wrong. Stop misleading the blog to save face.

    From in your own country, some examples of compulsory acquisition include:
    (1) wide scale acquisition of land and rights to enable delivery of the project e.g. the London Borough of Islington (Ashburton Grove and Lough Road, Islington) Compulsory
    Purchase Order 2002, which delivered the land for the Emirates Stadium for Arsenal FC and related development; and the Liverpool City Council (Paradise Street Development Area, Liverpool) Compulsory Purchase Order 2003 which enabled the building of the Liverpool One Shopping Centre. Is Arsenal FC a private or public company?

    “The £1bn Liverpool One development, the biggest retail-led private development in Europe, should be a cause for celebration: it will transform the retail heart of the city. The huge 42.5-acre site was acquired from the city council by Grosvenor, the company owned by the Duke of Westminster, the third wealthiest man in the UK. The leasehold was handed to Grosvenor for a 250-year period and hailed as an opportunity for Liverpool to draw shoppers back into the city after they had been lured away by out-of-town malls. There will be a John Lewis store, a Debenhams, a Harvey Nichols and a Hilton hotel.”

  3. TheOGazerts Avatar
    TheOGazerts

    Nina Simone. That is great music…
    https://youtu.be/9ckv6-yhnIY

  4. TheOGazerts Avatar
    TheOGazerts

    Dub and wura
    That is what real music sound like 🙂

  5. David Avatar
    David

    To whom it may concern. ‘ Barbados has been experiencing very heavy rains in recent weeks. The unfortunate death this weekend resulted because of this with gullies overflowing bridges/roads. Some of you who live overseas need to take a breath.

  6. Donna Avatar
    Donna

    Who the hell am I, Mariposa? I am the one who will call you the fraud that you are! You and your miserable buddy from England. Your government was the worst that we ever had. During their tenure I waded through sewage, walked around numerous piles of garbage and held my nose in many places.

    All the while your PM AND YOU, MARIPOSA SAID EVERYTHING WAS ALRIGHT. THE DRAINS WERE IN A WORSE STATE THAN THEY ARE IN NOW.

    It is people like you who allow this nonsense to continue with political games.

    You say you are elderly? Yuh mean yuh gon dead so?????

  7. David Avatar
    David

    @Miller

    Who will be attracted to live in the City?

  8. Donna Avatar
    Donna

    The Ovetseas Bajan Condition

    Tell them anything and they speak of remittances forgetting that Bajans too send money to where they live.

    Ask Cuhdear Bajan. Ask my brother who will soon be joining the list of people I see EVERY BLASTED DAY IN THE WESTERN UNION LINES.

  9. Donna Avatar
    Donna

    And another thing – some of you behave as though Bajans don’t travel and see the conditions out there where you live.

    Why even Pakistanis travel! Last time I checked Imran Khan was on MSNBC mimicking the motions his limosine made as it travelled the roads in some parts of the USA and why the hell the richest country in the world would not fix its roads.

    Steupse!

  10. WURA-War-on-U Avatar
    WURA-War-on-U

    “That is what real music sound like,”

    depending on the mood.

  11. Mariposa Avatar
    Mariposa

    Look this govt first order of business after default was to give tax breaks and waivers and all kinds of goodies to big business also hire million dollar consultants and expand the cabinet
    Even the cruise industry became benefactors because of COVID and govt giving them free access to Carlisle Bay without them having to pay regulatory fees
    The tourist industry receive millions in aid to help revive the dying industry
    So far the economy has received nothing from all these freebies and giveaways
    I remember when govt raise hell about Sandals concession
    Be that as it may now taking a look at present circumstances and the unfortunate death of the young man
    How is it that none of the blp yardfowls and operatives cannot see that the millions of dollars which govt has so far spent which indeed has returned nothing of value to the economy would not have been better spent putting our local people to work in rebuilding our infrastructure cleaning our gullies and doing whatever is necessary for the protection of the people
    This govt keeps putting cart before horse and the ignorance of it all lies in the failure of the people to tell govt the truth.

  12. Mariposa Avatar
    Mariposa

    Yesterday unfortunate death demonstrates what Hal means when he says it will all end in tears
    This govt choice of making unilateral decisions has the makings of tragedy attached to their policies
    Absent of a strong and vibrant opposition to keep govt in check more of these unfortunate circumstances would occur

    https://www.facebook.com/246784233190/posts/10158109952313191/?sfnsn=mo

  13. Hal Austin Avatar
    Hal Austin

    @ Mariposa

    You are coming over loud and clear about the real issues. Leave the person abuse to those who cannot debate with you. You mention the flooding, and some talk about floods in other countries; you mention the use of Carlisle Bay as a sanctuary, and other talk about the man on the moon.
    What will be interesting is the level of rubbish and oil dumped in the bay by these ships? Ignore the whataboutisms and stick to your arguments.
    They attack you personally because they have no arguments against you, not even those who profess to be top graduates from top universities.
    You are winning.

  14. David Avatar
    David

    Verla: So what?
    DLP leader reacts to defection of two ex-candidates to BLP
    by COLVILLE MOUNSEY PRESIDENT of the Democratic Labour Party (DLP) Verla De Peiza says the defection of Rodney Grant and George Connolly to the ruling Barbados Labour Party (BLP) is of little consequence to her party.
    On Saturday, Prime Minister Mia Amor Mottley disclosed that Grant had returned to the fold of the BLP while Connolly, a technology specialist, was throwing in his lot with the Bees for the first time. In 2018, under the DLP banner, Grant contested the St Michael South East seat, while Connolly ran in St James Central.
    De Peiza told the DAILY NATION that since losing in the 2018 poll, the party had not heard from either man, therefore the DLP’s future plans did not include them.
    “It really is not significant for us because both of them joined the party in 2018 to run and neither one of them has been active in the party since the last election, so we have not lost anything. It would be up to the country to judge whether they are opportunist or not; that is not for us as a party to do.
    “Regardless, this move has neither added to nor subtracted from the Democratic Labour Party. I cannot tell when the last time was that I laid eyes on either one of them, so both literally and figuratively I do not see them,” she said, noting that the Prime Minister’s revelation did not come as a surprise to her.
    “Nothing surprises me in politics and the fact that neither one has been seen since 2018, took away any shock value from that announcement. The party had no plans surrounding them, none whatsoever. It was an unremarkable revelation,” De Peiza added.
    Grant told yesterday’s SUNDAY SUN he believed the country needed him.
    “The Prime Minister asked me to come and serve. I think there is a value I can bring at the level of the communities and at the level of Barbados in terms of helping to build out the social capital and the potential of our people. I think that is important now more than ever.”
    Connolly also said he had been in talks with Mottley for months on issues related to technology, tech space and tech strategy. He added that he had no interaction with the DLP leadership since the last election and quit the Dems more than a month ago. He deemed the party a “disorganised organisation” with no vision. Political scientist Peter Wickham said neither candidate was a political heavyweight, and to describe the development as a major blow to the DLP would be an “overstatement”.
    “Neither of these men, especially George, could be considered a political heavyweight because George was unknown to politics before he came in in 2018, while Grant was somewhat known but could by no means be considered a heavyweight.
    “So, I would not say that it is a major blow to the Democratic Labour Party. It does suggest that they are struggling, but this is something that we already know and really don’t need the departure of two members to confirm that,” Wickham said.
    The regional pollster said he found it interesting that Mottley chose not to make this an issue in the recent St George North byelection, which would have substantiated the case that the DLP was bleeding support.
    “It is clear that the Prime Minister had ammunition and she chose not to use it. The feeling was that she threw the kitchen sink at the by-election, but the reality is that she had stuff that she was holding back, especially in light of the fact that the DLP was making a lot of noise about [former BLP minister Anthony] Wood’s appearance on their platform,” he added.

  15. TheOGazerts Avatar
    TheOGazerts

    The problem is not how poor we are, but how poor we remain….
    Have a great day
    https://youtu.be/KXEtNknolKY

  16. Mariposa Avatar
    Mariposa

    Need i say more

    https://www.facebook.com/groups/nineth.nine/permalink/416296936421150/

    It has end in tears

  17. Donna Avatar
    Donna

    So says the man who claimed that telling somebody that if they are so miserable they should just curl up and die would be a threat in any proper jurisdiction.

    Winning what???!!!! She and her buddies just got their tails cut in St. George North. And we know that her ONLY reason for being on the blog is to promote the interests of the Deceased Labour Party.

    It is clear that being around intellectuals has done you no good. You talk more like you spent your life in Barbados with us idiots.

    You are one mixed up dude who needs psychiatric help.

  18. Mariposa Avatar
    Mariposa

    No news here except that Mia did not received the high expectations of voter turn out from SGN along with Floyd managing to have some Bees cross over to Dees camp a 10percent to be exact
    Now Mia clutches 2 Dees in hopes that Grant and Connelly would be an attraction to take votes away from the dees come next election
    What Mia ought to be worrying about is the slow and dying death of the economy which has placed a stranglehold and it’s knees in the necks and pocket books of every bajan household
    Not all barbadians live in SGN

  19. David Avatar
    David

    Two years out from a general election, maybe less and the DLP is in shambles. Hard ears yuh wont hear, own way …

  20. Donna Avatar
    Donna

    Well… the rain is falling again as it has been for days. The forecast suggests it will go on for about a week more. A
    couple of weeks ago we had rain for about eight days straight. I came to the realisation then that I couldn’t live in England again. I have become a child of the sun. Life without sun for too long can dampen the spirits.

    I have NEVER experienced such a long streak of heavy rains in Barbados before.

    And by the way – if the drains are clogged I would bet my last dollar that the politicians did not clog them. This is one thing you cannot blame them for. The SSA has cleared dumping sites only to have them refilled the next day. Gullies are no different.

    There is plenty of remedial work to be done with our infrastructure as it relates to drainage and some planning mistakes have been made and stubbornly not addressed. That is true.

    But many Bajans do not help their own cause.

  21. Mariposa Avatar
    Mariposa

    Sea Dream Cruise nightmare and barbados portocols

    https://www.cruiselawnews.com/2020/11/articles/disease/seadream-cruise-guests-flown-from-barbados-to-airports-around-the-world/

  22. Crusoe Avatar
    Crusoe

    MariposaNovember 16, 2020 6:30 AM This govt choice of making unilateral decisions has the makings of tragedy attached to their policies
    Absent of a strong and vibrant opposition to keep govt in check more of these unfortunate circumstances would occur

    So the BLP could stop the massive amount of water that fell? Wait bruddah. You telling me that Mia is GOD?

    Now, whuh yuh telling me? Gaw deng.

    The BLP is in the process of rebuilding the shambles that the DLP left. What did the DLP leave in the area of water and sewage?

    We all saw the videos of the unkempt, unmaintained, South Coast treatment plant that the DLP left in disrepair, that took the BLP about six weeks to fix.

    We all can see the big maguffy lease tuh what Wata Aufority building in de Pine. Big able new building but no money spent on drainage nor reservoirs.

    The BLP has already built a new reservoir up by the top of the Pine and is now building more. It has spent nuff on new drainages.

    Yet, you can come on here and talk chalk? Stuuuuupppppppppsssssssseeeeeeeee.

    Look, is Independence, guh long and eat a conkie and drink some rum, instead of wasting we time, nuh.

  23. Donna Avatar
    Donna

    Still it’s out to the garden where I am currently battling the bugs who would feast on my leaves, a few ants and a little fungus. Neem extract keeps getting washed off.

    Such is life. Always a battle to fight. No different ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD. NOT CANADA. NOT AMERICA. NOT ENGLAND.

    We Bajans don’t just have tv and google. We stay-at-home Bajans do not always stay at home.

    The google is just easy proof.

  24. Crusoe Avatar
    Crusoe

    DonnaNovember 16, 2020 7:17 AM Life without sun for too long can dampen the spirits.

    Dah is why de extracurriculars activities does be important, when it raining. When it raining, enjoy de mood and groove. Call de boss an tell he ‘yuh callin in sick’.

  25. Pachamama Avatar
    Pachamama

    David

    Tell us something about this Verla Depeiza to help us reach a higher level of understanding.

    We always are left with an impression that she is puerile. That there is a wide gap between the demands of her position and what she delivers. Could we be misjudging her? Judging her too harshly?

  26. Donna Avatar
    Donna

    Now back to the topic. In my opinion, once Floyd Reifer allowed his platform to be taken over by the 2018 rejects, his race was over.

    Never mind Ezra Alleyne who in stuck in the past. It had nothing to do with whether or not he could speak. Bajans are no longer in love with speakers. He is generally recognised as a good guy who often exceeds expectations. But if he surrounds himself with the old corrupt guard, chances are he will be tainted. The only advice they can give is bad advice. One must keep away from bad company.

    Verla Depeiza seems incapable of keeping them at bay. Therefore the DLP is doomed for the foreseeable future.

  27. TheOGazerts Avatar
    TheOGazerts

    “But many Bajans do not help their own cause.”

    Old fashion solution…
    I have not been home in ages. I remember how there was the mobile cinema which traveled from village to village.
    Has it been abandoned?
    Have we become too modern with our large screen tvs and WiFi.
    Perhaps we can keep the mobile cinema but change the programming.
    Have topics on dumping, placing garbage in waste baskets, interacting with tourists and each other, agriculture, keeping the beaches clean ……
    Pushing back some responsibility to the citizens
    Educating citizens see
    Would it work or have we pass this stage?

    A creative team, a projectionist, a driver… At least six jobs created.

  28. David Avatar
    David

    @Pacha

    Verla is a competent leader. She does not have the respect of elders or the majority of rank and file members. No disrespect to her but she can be compared to when Mascoll was a compromised pick until …

  29. Crusoe Avatar
    Crusoe

    DonnaNovember 16, 2020 7:43 AM That is so true. No one wants that lot of jokers. The DLP needs a renewal.

    Best advice? Go and ask Mr.Barrow son to lead a new resurgence of the party. Ditch the 2018 old guard totally from membership.

    November 16, 2020 7:30 AM

    You are right. Verla is singularly unimpressive.

  30. Miller Avatar
    Miller

    @ David November 15, 2020 10:27 PM
    “Who will be attracted to live in the City?”
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    The same ‘brand’ of people earmarked for the ‘sick’ Treasury building to be turned into penthouses looking over the Careenage.

    How about PLT’s “digital nomads” kidnapped by the current administration and released as a Red initiative?

  31. Pachamama Avatar
    Pachamama

    David

    As a marker. Give us evidence, an example, of such competencies, skills or capabilities.

  32. David Avatar
    David

    @Pacha

    The blogmaster is bias from that time she accused BU of engaging in treasonous behaviour because we leaked CAHILL documents.

  33. Pachamama Avatar
    Pachamama

    David

    We remember well when OSA and David Thopmson had to dealt with people changing alliances.

    At least thet were able to say something that showed an understanding of the personal and political forces which make these actions necessary, as perceived by some.

    Certainly, it cannot help the DLP to have a mind not dissimilar to that of AC at its head. To be so combative, intransigent, arrogant even, will not stem the flow.

  34. Pachamama Avatar
    Pachamama

    David

    She had you in danger of being a Bajan Julian Assange. Lol

    Means you did the right thing.

  35. Mariposa Avatar
    Mariposa

    Crusoe Nov 16 7.22am@ Mariposa

    So the BLP could stop the massive amount of water that fell? Wait bruddah. You telling me that Mia is GOD?

    Xxxxxxxcxc

    That respond is so silly not worthy of a response
    No wonder govt tek wunna for idiots
    Here i am speaking about priorities vs political agendas and this early morning paling cock Crusoe interjects the most asinine response to floods
    Jesus tek the wheel so called intelligent barbadians are sinking to a low low level of ignorance

  36. Donna Avatar
    Donna

    Barbadians are well aware of the harm they by illegal dumping. It is taught even in nursery schools. I have still a Barbadian colouring book from my son’s time there. It is taught all through school and highlighted in all media.

    Some Bajans just expect others to clean up their mess. I leave an open can outside for people to drop their small bits of trash. Some put it in. Some throw and miss and some don’t even try.

    These people, I suspect, are in the minority but manage to cause a disproportionate amount of damage.

  37. Donna Avatar
    Donna

    By the way, isn’t Hal Austin going to comment on Mariposa’s oscenities????

    Nope! Not a word! He only compliments her “winning argument”.

    Pretend prig! Bloody hypocrite!

  38. David Avatar
    David

    @Pacha

    Verla knows that her days are numbered.

  39. Crusoe Avatar
    Crusoe

    MariposaNovember 16, 2020 8:30 AM

    So where is your response on the absymal condition of the sewage plants when the BLP took over and had to fix everything? Or the waste on a building when the reservoirs that the BLP is now fixing and rebuilding?

    No, you are the joker and ‘paling cock’. Your government wasted so much money, including on a dead golf course that it did not own.

    How about that?

    Barrow must be rolling in the grave at you bunch of jokers.

    Bunch of sellouts.

  40. WURA-War-on-U Avatar
    WURA-War-on-U

    “How about PLT’s “digital nomads” kidnapped by the current administration and released as a Red initiative?”

    they have to run around tiefing ideas, and promoting white trash, how stupid a PM looks promoting a book of lies from Cow the Tief…whic title should read….Everything I Stole from Black Bajans Over the Last 40 Years.. dispicable, repulsive looking old fraud…but wait, he might not name it that, because according to the LIAR Cummins, yall don’t exist and have no human rights…

  41. Crusoe Avatar
    Crusoe

    DavidNovember 16, 2020 8:07 AM @Pacha The blogmaster is bias from that time she accused BIU as engaging in treasonous behaviour because we leaked CAHILL documents.

    David, how I could forget Cahill, the most atrocious nefarious thing that ever crossed Barbados. That someone high claimed that he did not know of, but his signature was there, big and bold?

    Mariposa, yuh hypocrite!

  42. Donna Avatar
    Donna

    Crusoe,

    Mariposa and Hal are fooling no-one. They seem to forget that BU keeps an archive.

  43. Crusoe Avatar
    Crusoe

    Best advice? Go and ask Mr.Barrow son to lead a new resurgence of the party. Ditch the 2018 old guard totally from membership.

    Pretty sure that is the part of my comment that riled Mariposa of the Prior Realm.

    Truth hurts, nuh?

    You old 2018 guard should go jump in the Careenage for what yuh did to Barbados.

  44. WURA-War-on-U Avatar
    WURA-War-on-U

    “Go and ask Mr.Barrow son to lead a new resurgence of the party”

    why would you want to do that, if you care about removing the disgusting nepotism, cronyism, yardfowlism, selloutism, tiefingism, corruption etc, especially since his name called a couple years ago over malfeasance at the airport….

    .yall need to remove all vestiges from that go nowhere era. for the masses…names like Barrow Adams Mottley (unless she uses the time left to make the appropriates changes) etc should be nowhere near the haunted house going forward…..and please, no more Grenvilles.

    Caswell is smart to stay away from the triangle of failures.

  45. TheOGazerts Avatar
    TheOGazerts

    My last comment for the day.
    @wura
    I am certain the comment was meant to rule Mariposa, but it made me cringe a little.

    It conveys the impression that some think the solutions must come from a select few. We need to abandon ideas of pedigree and ‘high color’

  46. Mariposa Avatar
    Mariposa

    Boy even David joins the lying Brigade
    When did Mariposa accuse BU of treacherous behaviour when the issue of Cahill was a hot topic on BU

    Anyhow in accordance with good policies and governance
    People still await the actual cost of the garbage trucks and buses
    Am political agendas cannot be considered good governance
    Also how much money it is costing govt to warehouse visitors along with medical treatment already received over the past six months
    Also how much money has been spent to blow up the NIS building and Ram warehouse to plant an Invisible Hilton
    Questions and no answers to govt policies which havent shown a return in govt investment
    As for the sewer system still waiting for a viable solution as was promised by this govt
    Pumping sh..it in the ocean is not a solution
    Heard Bostic said that visitors on the cruise ship that have the COVID would not be counted in barbados total

  47. Hal Austin Avatar
    Hal Austin

    @ Mariposa

    Keep on discussing the policy issues. Note there is no answer to what you are saying, apart from juvenile abuse. Mia is not God, at least the last two years have shown that.
    It is more basic than that. Every major company and well managed nation has a disaster plan. It is called a what if; what if we had an earthquake? What if there was a major fire at the hospital? What if? What if?
    You hope for the best but plan for the worst. Big companies have fire drills etc, when the alarm goes off and staff have to react as if it was the real thing. Nations have to plan for terrorists attacks, etc.
    Nations have also to plan for the once in a hundred, or once in two hundred year events. Our last major flood was in 1949, so, it is reasonable to say on the balance of probabilities, that we are/were due another.
    The 1961 Barrow government carried out a lot of work on the Constitution river which, I have said, I thought was impressive at the time, but on reflection was a total disaster. I liked the 1961 Barrow government for reasons I have stated many times.
    We know, since the Sandiford government, that we have had problems with our drains and sewers, a direct result of our prosperity and the increased use of indoor latrines or water toilets as we call them.
    There is no excuse in 2020 for these problems, especially when the people employed to clear the ditches were the first to be sacked by the Mottley government.
    They cannot blame Stuart, an act of God, fewer mongooses, or people eating too much fried chicken. Mottley is now in charge and the ball is in her court.
    One of the advantages of not having proper public discussions about policy is that voters, such as those in St George North, can miss a trick and vote for their own oppression.
    It creates a field day for the foul-mouthed, brain dead and simply vulgar to pontificate. Your arguments are sound, including those about infrastructural developments.
    Here is another trick. Do not reply to all of them. Some just need meaning in their lives and get satisfaction by barking on BU. Here are not here to share education.

  48. David Avatar
    David

    You are so illiterate you failed to comprehend the comment was directed at Pacha.

  49. Hal Austin Avatar
    Hal Austin

    MariposaNovember 16, 2020 6:30 AM This govt choice of making unilateral decisions has the makings of tragedy attached to their policies
    Absent of a strong and vibrant opposition to keep govt in check more of these unfortunate circumstances would occur

    So the BLP could stop the massive amount of water that fell? Wait bruddah. You telling me that Mia is GOD?….(Quote)

    ???????

  50. WURA-War-on-U Avatar
    WURA-War-on-U

    “I am certain the comment was meant to rule Mariposa, but it made me cringe a little.”

    Actually, mentally it’s very unhealthy, i doubt most know, but these haunted house negros, once elected, are merely placeholders for dead slave masters under the westminister program, fulfilling their evil Wills and Edicts, look whom they promote, elevate and enrich at the expense of the black majority, and have been doing so since the 1940s,…nothing has changed since then, it’s gotten more visible and toxic since these black faces refuse to acknowledge that black people have human rights that are to be RECOGNIZED, OBSERVED…and RECORDED PUBLICLY by the sellouts in the parliament whose salary the people pay.

    personally, i cringe everytime they pay tribute to these dead house negros who did not make any changes to uplift the people from social and financial bondage…while everyone love nothing more than to invoke the names of these long gone politicians…who did not even know they were still viewed as slaves themselves….

The blogmaster invites you to join the discussion.

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