Caribbean Scholars Renew Reparations Call

 

Submitted by Don Rojas

Scholars from the Caribbean recently renewed their call for reparations in recompense for hundreds of years of native genocide and enslavement in the region. The calls were made during a recent virtual symposium to honour the life and work of St. Lucian Nobel Laureate Sir William Arthur Lewis…

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163 comments

  • It may be better to FIX the racial and financial disparities which still exists in Black majority islands first, what’s the use of reparations being paid when these very ugly and human rights violating practices still exist.

    These structures need to be torn down which is another battle since those who the taxpayers pay a monthly salary to and who insist on calling themselves leaders of the people even refuse to remove a racist statue that is a symbol of hatred and slavery perpetrated for centuries against Black people, they are projecting that it is offensive to remove such a disrespectful image away from the eyes of the descendants of the practitioner’s victims although the hateful statue shouild have been removed 22 years ago….and can’t or refuse to see that it’s presence is more offensive to the descendants of the slave trade, there is no moving forward until all of those continuing crimes against the African descended have been dismantled, torn down, eradicated out of the lives of the majority population…or there will just continue to be an already embedded generational practice of violating Black rights..as has obtained for over the last 50 years post independence and a real threat exists that they will never benefit from the reparations they are entitled to especially if it’s paid in the form of paper money..and passed on to leaders who do not care about their own people’s human rights.

    These charters should have been consistently and rigorously adherred to once ratified over the decades and the majority population granted full access to these rights as the indigenous, but black leaders decided that it was not important for their own people to be free or happy or wealthy with.their own land and money. Minorities should not have been enjoying these rights for decades, while the majority who fund the island remain oppressed, robbed and abused and are still barred by Black leaders from enjoying their full rights, with all types of wicked excuses thrown in about why they should’nt.

    I do believe that first, pressure from the Caricom region should be brought to bear on Black leaders who are neglectful and scorn respecting their own people’s human rights.

    ▼Article V.
    Full effect and observance of human rights
    Indigenous peoples and individuals have the right to the full
    enjoyment of all human rights and fundamental freedoms,
    as recognized in the Charter of the United Nations, the
    Charter of the Organization of American States, and
    international human rights law.

    Well I am yet to see any of the two governments whose colonial practices have been so destructive to the majority Black population.. observing or practicing any of these fundamental and international human rights as outlined in this documemt or in the UNs 30 Articles of Human Rights ratified since 1948 on their people.

    Both governments in their arrogance and absolute backwardness, pretend that these documents dont exist, the people were never made aware of them until recently and that can be attributed to social media; ministers continue to act as though these charters that they are all signatory to and love to be seen signing does not apply to the majority population who elected them; that they only apply to minorities who they make sure have access to and enjoy these fundamental rights along with enriching themselves at the expense of the same majority, these people whom they prefer to have a relationship with for corrupt reasons while cutting out generationally the very people these international laws were created and meant to PROTECT completely out of the equation.

    Some charters that once adherred to would help to alleviate poverty and oppression, they outright refuse to ratify so that the people remain helpless and vulnerable..

    They boldfacedly allow the practice of racism and apartheid to be practiced on the majority population in direct violation of international law and then insultingly and disrespectfully call themselves leaders and got the absolute nerve to return to the same victimized population begging for votes every election cycle

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  • The average man in the street will never be given any of that money.

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  • At this stage given how the society has evolved is it practical to think that reparations if a reality can be dispensed at the person level? There is a need to stop the pettiness.

    >

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  • The term “PISSING UP A ROPE” comes to mind and is likely to as successful. Author uses the term SCHOLARS extremely loosely, maybe this is the result of FREE EDUCATION. Just read that 40% of PAKISTANI AIRLINE PILOTS have FAKE credentials, maybe someone should check the credentials of these “SCHOLARS”.

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  • Everyone is aware that UK etc who plan to pay reparations cannot very well do it willy nilly and recklessly while knowing how corrupt and criminal many Caribbean leaders are, knowing that there has been human rights violations committed by Black leaders against the African descended majority for over 50 years in some islands; knowing that many of them are thieves just waiting to rob the vulnerable again; and knowing that the despicable Comissiong has some really evil plans to include the indian population WHOSE ANCESTORS WERE NEVER SLAVES IN THE CARIBBEAN…in any reparations pay out.

    It’s obvious that they are all already plotting to steal from the majority population to once again enrich minorities at the expense of our enslaved ancestors once again.

    This cannot be allowed to happen.

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  • Who can see a maneuvering to grab any money that is paid for reparation. The so-called Caribbean scholars (a contradiction in terms) are calling for the reparations to be handed over. What they really mean is handed over to them.
    Professor Hillary Beckles is in the fray, but for the time being he thinks the money should go to the UWI, as long as he is head. And the badly run governments and their incompetent politicians are asking for the money because their exchequers are empty. None of this is done ethically in the long-term interest of the people.
    The nations that are paying reparations should establish a reparations investment fund, totally independent of every Caribbean nation, where all the money will go and be invested in the interested of all the nations (paid on a pro rata basis of the number of slaves at abolition).

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  • Ding! John Boy’s Slave Registry spam all over BU can come into use after all in the Reparations Case in this Dispensation
    Give I Fe I Name

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  • @ Harold Austin Esq (Final Times Editor in the Shitty City of Iniquity, London Town, Home of the Slave Trade)
    cc BU Posse
    FYI, I did already mention that you can get the ball rolling to set up a UK based Investment Trust Fund administered by BlackRock to be Official Receivers of the Slave Reparations Monies that companies like Lloyds of London, Natwest, Aviva and many more are offering, but you didn’t hear me though.

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  • “Ding! John Boy’s Slave Registry spam all over BU can come into use after all in the Reparations Case in this Dispensation
    Give I Fe I Name”
    That provided me with a good laugh.

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  • Thanks for your OPINION.

    The Caricom reparations committee represents who again?

    >

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  • This seems like an astro turf group of which Beckles is puppet master.

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  • At least the ambassador to the UN knows which way the wind is blowing, now if she could just get Mia to dust off that 4 year old 68 page Charter on human rights that were maliciously denied the majority population by the crooks of parliament for decades…then we will be making some headway…i will be helping them read that Charter bit by bit and so will the majority population…..and so will citizens of the other Caribbean islands, our cousins..

    the tone is changing but don’t try to shift the blame, players in the developing world do a different type of strangling of small economies than do wicked tiefing lawyers and ministers who collude with minorities to rob the majority Black population….different type of strangling, not in the same class…that is no excuse to rob ya own people blind and leave them in generational poverty…..the bigger countries did not do that..

    yall are the ones allowed a bunch of half assed racists in Barbados both local and foreign to practice racism against YOUR people, and ya did that for over 50 years, so don’t try to shift the blame for that on bigger countries either, just dismantle the evil of both racism and apartheid in the lives of the people, those tiefing racists on the island are YOUR monkeys and YOUR circus….

    ….what unique position what, you would have to spend years on the ground in NYC to understand what really obtains re racism, can’t do so from some multi-floor office in the UN building…apparently ya were not observing ya evil dirty racists in Barbados and what they did to your own people for decades practicing their repulsive small island racism….or ya won’t need to use big countries as any example..

    https://barbadostoday.bb/2020/06/26/thompson-calls-for-nelsons-removal-cites-inequality/

    “Barbados’ Ambassador to the United Nations Elizabeth Thompson has placed her full support behind the removal of the controversial statue of Lord Nelson from Heroes Square and the participation of Barbadians in global Black Lives Matter movements.

    However, from the unique position in which she sits, the New York City-based diplomat has sounded the alarm over racism of a different kind, manifested in the economic inequalities faced by majority black and developing nations who are being “strangled” by players in the developed world.”

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  • Pacha…the narrative is changing, don’t blink though…

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  • But the talking heads got nerve though, they economically strangled their OWN PEOPLE for TWO GENERATIONS….but none of that registers in their minds….so the island is strangled economically by larger countries, then the half assed black leaders did their own strangling of THE PEOPLE too….and as if that was not enuff…they invited a bunch of descended rejects of the wannabe white variety into the legislature, into the supreme court and added a goddamn cartel to the equation..for DECADES…TO STRANGLE THEIR OWN PEOPLE TOO….so check how the Black population got the air, their rights, their legacies, their futures, their opportunities, their own money squeezed out of them and by how many TIEFING lowlifes and for how long..

    ..the narrative is changing BUT WITH A TWIST…

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  • Miller…ya did not even tell me…

    “The Archbishop of Canterbury has said that statues and memorials in churches and cathedrals will “have to come down” over links with slavery, dividing clergy and historians.

    In a move that experts said recalled the “iconoclasm of Reformation” in the 16th century, many dioceses are conducting audits to document who is memorialised in the Church of England’s 16,000 churches and 42 cathedrals after leaders backed the “alteration or removal of monuments” in some cases.

    Britain is examining its links with the slave trade after Black Lives Matter protests. There are several examples on church land of memorials to those who either participated in or profited from it or who were known to have murdered or tortured slaves under their control.”

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  • A large number of slaves were ‘owned’ in Barbados by so-called coloured people, the descendants of whom are still living in Barbados, many of them with top jobs and expensive homes.
    In removing Nelson’s statue, are we then going to look at these ‘coloured’ people, many of them landless? There is no evidence that those ‘coloured’ slave owners treated their slaves any differently than the white owners.

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  • Well lookee here…Barbados’ deceitful governments have not only colluded to DENY the majority population ALL their HUMAN RIGHTS for 50 years, but they REFUSED to acknowledge that the African descended also have COLLECTIVE RIGHTS TO THEIR OWN LAN, that was systematically stolen using the land registry, the supreme court and robbing 3 generations of their lands and rights..

    ▼Article VI.
    Collective rights
    Indigenous peoples have collective rights that are
    indispensable for their existence, well-being, and integral
    development as peoples. In that regard, States recognize
    and respect the right of indigenous peoples to their
    collective action; to their juridical, social, political, and
    economic systems or institutions; to their own cultures; to
    profess and practice their spiritual beliefs; to use their own
    tongues and languages; and to their lands, territories and
    resources. States shall promote, with the full and effective
    participation of indigenous peoples, the harmonious
    coexistence of the rights and systems of different
    population groups and cultures.

    Land that both governments and the gaggle of lawyers in the Bar Association and in the Supreme Court have been stealing for themselves and colluding with the evil, no good minorities both local and foreign to steal from the people from 1964, robbing generations of Bajans their futures, their right to wealth and progress, robbing their beneficiaries and sinking them into generational poverty, none of you have had any problem with those crimes against the people…and all that stolen land should be RETURNED.

    Right here is the evidence in Article V1 shows that you knew that you were committing crimes against the people, but was never deterred, that is why you hid this book of human rights, you thought the people would never find out, but here it is, can’t hide it anymore..

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  • Pacha….so those Caribbean “scholars” now DROOLING ALL OVER THEMSELVES OVER REPARATIONS being paid and put into their outstreched hands…….better use all those scholarly SKILLS TO FIX this matter of black governments robbing their own people of everything…. FIRST..

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  • The nations that are paying reparations should establish a reparations investment fund, totally independent of every Caribbean nation, where all the money will go and be invested in the interested of all the nations (paid on a pro rata basis of the number of slaves at abolition).

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    That is assuming there are nations in existence that have a few billions knocking about to pay.

    There is one characteristic all nations on earth have in common ….. National Debt.

    Barbados had 80,000 out of the 800,000 slaves freed in 1833/4.

    America had 450,000 slaves at the end of the civil war.

    America should get about 5 times what Barbados gets from the nations who pay whichever they may be!!

    Which nations pay America?

    Since Barbados etc were colonies of England should England be paid reparations for the slaves it owned and apply the funds among its former colonies?

    Which nations pay England?

    Pie in the sky from Caribbean scholars who are intellectually bankrupt like their various nations are financially bankrupt.

    Just some musings from a Barbados scholar who knows a thing or three.

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  • Jesus! What is that..
    It is so ignorant it made me laugh.
    You are doing irreparable harm to the high school scholars of Barbados.

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  • Was unable to get a full sleep last night,
    Binged on Netflix
    Cannot tell you what I watched.
    Was a sleep and wake session.
    But it looks like a beautiful day where I am.
    Hope it is beautiful day wherever you are.
    Have a great day Barbadians.

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  • Me, I slept like a baby!!

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  • The nations that are paying reparations should establish a reparations investment fund, totally independent of every Caribbean nation, where all the money will go and be invested in the interested of all the nations (paid on a pro rata “of the number of slaves at abolition).”

    first of all…the nations that control these establishments….ARE THE DESCENDANTS OF SLAVE MASTERS…their bloodlines STILL LIVE ON…so why the hell would YOU…a descendant of YOUR brutally ENSLAVED ANCESTORS…….still trust them with YOUR reparations…

    if you think their ancestors were evil, well let me tell ya..no better yet, find a black person with those same bloodlines running through their veins and let them tell you…am off limits..

    HAVE YOU LEARNED NOTHING…after 400 years..

    can the African descended …DO NOTHING FOR THEMSELVES

    fcuk is wrong with yalll

    do you need 4000 more years of enslavement, go right ahead…….this time it will never end….

    i know it was 555 made this insane suggestion, i was just too busy yesterday to bother…

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  • Apologies to Harold. He did hear me. My mission is completed signing off. God Speed.

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  • I guess some would know that not all of us would have all of this information, plus it feels to me like they are trying to glamorize an ugly part of their history of their own making, for the last 150…or 180 years..

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  • “first of all…the nations that control these establishments….ARE THE DESCENDANTS OF SLAVE MASTERS…their bloodlines STILL LIVE ON…so why the hell would YOU…a descendant of YOUR brutally ENSLAVED ANCESTORS…….still trust them with YOUR reparations…”

    My thoughts were as follows:

    Say for arguments sake £100bn was received for reparations monies
    1. Money placed in trust fund and could be invested in bonds and shares in black centric businesses etc to generate more funds
    2. Businesses can invest in investment trust for ethical black based investing and shares trades in Markets
    3. Pension funds, 401(k), Unit Trusts, Institutional Funds, Individuals etc could also buy shares in Black Trust in investment market
    4. Ex-Slaves descendants would be eligible for free shares in Investment Trust with Special Dividends
    (requiring proof on application)

    Shares in Slave Trade Business were the original shares ever traded in markets which raised Capital for all other related businesses such as shipping, insurance, investment banking, factories, import, export, railways, schools etc.

    Same principle would be used to redress the racial exploitation and could be used for development of black communities worldwide including Africa (where smaller investments go further e.g. you can build a school for £1000 although it costs more to maintain)

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  • If this action is not taken the Companies paying reparations will chose how they reinvest the monies, which will most likely be UK based only.

    There is a compensation fund for the victims of Jeffrey Epstein’s sexual abuse from his estate funds and assets that has been approved for distribution to eligible people. A slave victim fund could be administered same way.

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  • “If this action is not taken the Companies paying reparations will chose how they reinvest the monies, which will most likely be UK based only.”

    which they have no right to do, the African descended in the Caribbean are not their children. If those descended of slaves based in UK still want to be dependent on a racist white system still designed to destroy them, it’s fine, their choice, but they do not get to decide for those living in the Caribbean who don’t want to remain dependant for any wealth and progress created and designed by UK, look how well it has worked out for the African descended so , so UK does not get to decide how the money is invested, that is the choice of the Caribbean people, the UK is the criminal, remember…you don’t accept what you are entitled to through human rights laws and then tell your oppresser and abuser, here, invest the money for me and then give me what you feel like, crazy shit.

    “1. Money placed in trust fund and could be invested in bonds and shares in black centric businesses etc to generate more funds
    2. Businesses can invest in investment trust for ethical black based investing and shares trades in Markets
    3. Pension funds, 401(k), Unit Trusts, Institutional Funds, Individuals etc could also buy shares in Black Trust in investment market.”

    Descendants of slaves can create their own markets, create their own investments, black trusts, black pension funds 401k…no need for any white interfence, we have more than our fair share of successful business people who are at genius level of developing anything successfully.

    If African children are born with the spirit of UBUNTU, what the hell is wrong with big hard back black leaders and adults in Barbados and the Caribbean…the ones pretending to have African roots but not African origins…never heard such shit before..

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  • Let me repeat for clarity because i think it got lost somewhere in the mix…

    you don’t accept what you are entitled to through human rights laws and then tell your oppresser, abuser AND ENSLAVER, here, invest the money for me and then give me what you feel like, crazy shit.

    this is the 21st century…invest in Africa, at least you would be investing in the land of your ancestors……and not in the land of your ENSLAVERS…

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  • “If those descended of slaves based in UK still want to be dependent on a racist white system still designed to destroy them, it’s fine, their choice”

    Africans with European Names are Slave descendants whether based in Caribbean, South America, USA (Americas) or emigrated to UK 70 years ago. The biggest legacy of Slave Trade, Colonialism, Global Capitalism is wealth inequality across African diaspora and Third World. White Supremacy racism affected all areas of life.

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  • “you don’t accept what you are entitled to through human rights laws and then tell your oppresser, abuser AND ENSLAVER, here, invest the money for me and then give me what you feel like, crazy shit.

    this is the 21st century…invest in Africa, at least you would be investing in the land of your ancestors……and not in the land of your ENSLAVERS…”

    The fund and all decisions will need to be administered by black people for black interests and representatives of Caricom could / should be part of the board involved in the processes.

    Ideally UK and USA could be involved in a combined worldwide reparations trust as their histories are one and same with regards to slavery and racism in USA slave trade was in fact originally brought over and run by Brits. USA is biggest market and has 14% slave descendants. There are many rich blacks investing in USA and Africa already such as Oprah, Hollywood, Musicians and many have obtained dual citizenship to live in Africa.

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  • “USA is biggest market and has 14% slave descendants. There are many rich blacks investing in USA and Africa already such as Oprah, Hollywood, Musicians and many have obtained dual citizenship to live in Africa.”

    right…they already made their own plans regarding reparations for eheir people in US and their US investments are decades old….they certainly don’t need the UK or US systems controling any reparations money that may be generated, they know how to control their own money or they would never have made it to millionaire and billionaire status….so why should Caribbean people not want to do the same, keep their money in their own community… The African descended in the US will never fall for that dependency on others syndrome to be successful and neither should the African descended in the Caribbean…

    Again…the African descended in the UK are free to do whatever…no one is judging, but other people already made grown up decisions to benefit THE AFRICAN DESCENDED ONLY.

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  • “White Supremacy racism affected all areas of life.”

    so am sure that you can appreciate how much more that same white supremacy will STILL continue to affect all areas of the African descended lives indefinitely should they be crazy enuff to put their reparations payments BACK INTO the hands of the same white supremacist, i know you are way too intelligent to believe that once reparations are paid, the white supremacist will suddenly and automatically become nonracist and non exploitative..

    but i know some yardfowls in Barbados who would be happy to do that dumb shit as well as some sell out negros in the parliament…would jump at the opportunity….to really fcuk things up for their people…

    …check out repulsive Comissiong ready to jump on the indian bandwagon and apply for slave reparations on their behalf when their ancestors were never slaves, they turned up in the Caribbean AFTER slavery was abolished, but i want him to try that shite and get his ass arrested for fraud…idiot that he is…

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  • Indians were imported to Caribbean, Kenya, Uganda, Fiji, Sri Lanka and many other places to do admin work in plantations.
    India was the Crown Jewell of the Empire and Diamonds and Jewels were taken from them just like Africa and their Silver and Gold.
    They are kept on longer chains than blacks with maybe some more freedoms but are still held down.

    Anyway the idea is out there in the online universe as one solution for consideration. Barbados is also an offshore financial centre that could administer a Global Trust Fund, USA could do it too. There is corruption everywhere and a Black Investment Trust would need to be squeaky clean to gain trust from worldwide community so the big global corps would invest billions in the cause.

    White money would probably expect to be given an opening into the future black markets. Black consumers could divert their spending into Companies that invested in the Trust. Nike earns a lot of black money and needs to give something back to the black community.
    Money put into Black communities could also benefit people of other colour that live in same communities.

    I just needed to say my piece so it was heard.

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  • Hal AustinJune 27, 2020 4:02 AM

    A large number of slaves were ‘owned’ in Barbados by so-called coloured people, the descendants of whom are still living in Barbados, many of them with top jobs and expensive homes.
    In removing Nelson’s statue, are we then going to look at these ‘coloured’ people, many of them landless? There is no evidence that those ‘coloured’ slave owners treated their slaves any differently than the white owners.

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    We know white slave owners were Quakers/Christians and they treated their slaves well.

    A coloured slave owner would most probably be a descendant of a white slave owner.

    Take for example Samuel Jackman Prescod, (1806-1871).

    “Prescod was born as the son of a free woman of colour, Lidia Smith, and a wealthy white father, William Prescod. He was given his forenames for Samuel Jackman, a local white planter.”

    The 1834 return of a Lydia Smith details 6 slaves.

    38 year old Joe she manumitted.

    He was black.

    Two coloured children, Mary Eliza 5 years 11 months and Robert, 8 years 11 months she sold to R.G. Prescod and M.S. Prescod respectively.

    She retained 3 slaves, Eve 62, Sarah 31 and Nathaniel, 16 years 2 months.

    All three were black.

    Sarah was probably the mother of the two coloured children Lydia Smith sold.

    William Hinds Prescod owned several Plantations.

    He appears to have made returns in 1817 for over 1,143 slaves.

    He owned several plantations and was probably attorney for several others.

    Samuel Jackman Prescod does not seem to have made any returns for slaves.

    Had slavery persisted, he would have stood to inherit slaves from both his mother and father.

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  • “They are kept on longer chains than blacks with maybe some more freedoms but are still held down.”

    that has absolutely NOTHING to do with the descendants of enslaved Africans, again, the Caribbean indian population were brought to the Caribbean as indentured servants not as chattel slaves, and it was after slavery was abolished, some were in the fields but NOT at the end of a whip nor lynchings…so that falls under none of my business., i see their descendants on FB cussing everybody and being nasty and racist to black people, so let them contact UK on their own for reparations for servitude or whatever rocks their boat, they got their mouths to cuss so they should know how to read and write..the only thing many of them seem to be more than happy to embrace is the practice of racism against black people like a religion…

    Comissiong could give them his share..

    “I just needed to say my piece so it was heard.”

    no one’s judging but there must be security for the African descended so they are not sold into slavery again by their own and others, while also being robbed again by their own and others, i don’t hear you giving any guarantees that it won’t happen….

    am yet to hear all the talking heads and anxious players who can’t wait to get their hands on reparations talking about that security, they are not even talking about dismantling the same racism, apartheid and thefts against the people on the island…but expect people to take them seriously about being fair to the people who are entitled to any reparations distribution….

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  • Just saw a sign asking “WHY IS ENDING RACISM A DEBATE” ya would think they would just end it, dismantle the stinking thing, this scourge that just keeps going on and on in the lives of the African descended and all they do is talk and talk in the bigger countries..

    …….those leaders in Barbados are not even bringing the topic to the table, not that anyone wants to hear them since they have for decades enabled and condoned the practice, the evil practitioners and THIEVES are hiding because it’s not a conversation they can engage in since they are the RACISTS….and it will never go away on its own.

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  • “i don’t hear you giving any guarantees that it won’t happen”

    your criticisms are valid points that have to be considered into the plans

    reparations for India and Colonialism are well outside the remit of slave reparations

    I am an ideas man that does project planning and provide the design solution for others to do the work for

    If you want a successful project delivered for setting up a reparations trust you will have to pay me

    Harold at the FT could run the idea past his bosses at work or contacts in industry. Times News (racist right wing media) are suddenly trying to get a handle on black culture and are regularly reporting on reparations monies coming and statues of racists being taken down, they would love to sponsor something like this for some credibility and advertising, so the idea could be sold to the devils who need direction to save and redeem their souls. Those types would take the idea and do it themselves for all the winnings / management fees etc.

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  • Samuel Jackman Prescod, born August 6 1806 was baptised on 17 December 1816 when he was 10.

    His mother is recorded as Mary Lydia Smith, free mulatto.

    At the same time his siblings were also baptised.

    Their names were Maria Louisa born on September 22 1810 and Wellington born on November 21 1812.

    Wellington was chosen probably because of the Duke of Wellington who was successfully fighting Napoleon in the Peninsular war and the victor of Waterloo at the time of the birth of Mary Lydia’s 3 children.

    Maria Louisa may have been chosen because of Maria Luisa of Parma (1782-1824), daughter of Charles IV, King of Spain.

    Samuel Jackman Prescod married and produced 4 children so in all likelihood his descendants will be around today.

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  • Stop the Press
    LIAT to be liquidated
    “From all indication, LIAT will be liquidated,” Prime Minister Gaston Browne has just announced

    https://barbadostoday.bb/2020/06/27/from-all-indication-liat-will-be-liquidated-pm-browne/

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  • What was Owen Authurs brief the blogmaster keeps asking?

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  • But some progress is being made, the pracitce of cursing buildings and schools with the names of dead racists and enslavers is being dismantled bit by bit and that process started some years ago….many of the biggest names involved in that blight are being removed.

    racists should never be given their freedom anywhere, they should be shunned and banned.

    https://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/ny-woodrow-wilson-prnceton-20200627-a24upmuejngyjaiabaurqekcx4-story.html#nt=oft-Single%20Chain~Recommender~new-left-chain~lower-headline-stack~~6~yes-art~automated~curatedpage

    “One Ivy League school is trimming some overgrown racist vines.

    Princeton University will remove the name of former U.S. president Woodrow Wilson from one of its buildings due to his “racist thinking and policies.”

    “On my recommendation, the board voted to change the names of both the School of Public and International Affairs and Wilson College,” university president Christopher Eisgruber announced on Friday. “The trustees concluded that Woodrow Wilson’s racist thinking and policies make him an inappropriate namesake for a school or college whose scholars, students and alumni must stand firmly against racism in all its forms.”

    Wilson was a staunch proponent of segregation and imposed it on several federal agencies that were not racially divided at the time. He also barred African-American students from attending the school during his eight-year reign as university president from 1902 to 1910, noted The Associated Press.”

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  • Pay attention when hardline senators in Mississippi of all places are starting to bend.

    “The Mississippi Senate has joined the House in a historic vote that is expected to bring down the Mississippi flag with its Confederate battle emblem.

    The Senate voted 36 -14, followed by loud cheers, to suspend rules late Saturday afternoon so a bill can be considered to remove the flag. The two-thirds majority vote to suspend the rules by both chambers all but assures that Mississippi will finally take down a flag that has divided the state.”

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  • @ Quaker John

    I notice you now refer to Quaker/Christians. Nice. But there are sect s within the Quaker movement. Which one do you belong to? More importantly, when the campaign about the removal of Nelson’s statue and reparations gain momentum, we must also think of unintended consequences.
    As I have said above, what about the descendants of the ‘coloured’ people who owned slaves? In the US and UK, the movement has gone beyond slave owners and segregationists’ statues, down the the naming of streets and buildings. But will it end there?
    Have a look at this:
    Princeton University says it is to remove the name of former US President Woodrow Wilson from a building on its campus because of his racist beliefs and policies.

    The move follows a wave of protests across the US sparked by the death of African-American man George Floyd.

    Wilson was US president from 1913 to 1921 and helped to establish the League of Nations, a forerunner of the UN.

    However, he supported segregation and imposed it on several federal agencies.

    He also barred black students from Princeton while serving as university president and spoke approvingly of the Ku Klux Klan….(Quote)

    Like

  • Hal AustinJune 28, 2020 4:11 AM

    @ Quaker John

    I notice you now refer to Quaker/Christians. Nice. But there are sect s within the Quaker movement

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    I’ve always said Christianity ended slavery and that Quakers were the tool God used to effect its demise.

    I know you don’t google so here is one answer to the question “Are Quakers Christian?” as per google.

    Like

  • Are there Sects within the Quaker movement? Were prominent Quakers, especially in the US, slave owners? Yes or no?

    Like

  • @Sargeant

    If the report about LIAT is true, it will be very interesting. When will we see the current financial report? What are the assets and liabilities? Who made the decision to ‘liquidate’ the airline? What about the Barbados 49 per cent share, is that now down the shute? Who is the insolvency practitioner?
    Most of all, there will be a huge gap in the market, who is going to fill it? Finally, will there be an official report n the rise and fall of LIAT, naming names?

    Like

  • Hal AustinJune 28, 2020 4:33 AM

    Are there Sects within the Quaker movement?

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    You can goolgle, unfortunately you don’t, and look at the history of Quakerism and you will realise there have been various “schisms” and what exists today is nothing like what started.

    There are always books.

    If you want to call the different groups sects whatever that means to you, no sweat.

    If that’s a question about which you obsess, then go for it, I’ve never thought about it.

    I think God has a task set for each of us and guides us through the choices we make when confronted with the vagaries of life.

    Sometimes we listen and do, sometimes we listen and don’t and sometimes we don’t listen.

    There is only one certainty for each of us, death.

    God doesn’t do taxes … or sects.

    Like

  • @ David

    Gaston Browne was previously insisting Prime Ministers of LIAT’s shareholder governments and other regional leaders should continue subsidising the airline, under the guise of facilitating regional travel, when in reality, he wanted to maintain jobs for Antiguans.

    Now, he has finally come around to accepting what was suggested by former Tourism Minister, Richard Sealy……… close LIAT and establish a new airline……. and SLU’s PM Allen Chastanet who has been consistent in saying LIAT should be restructured.

    But. I hope you realize although Browne is now calling for LIAT’s liquidation, he wants any new airline formed to be also named LIAT and its headquarters in Antigua.

    Like

  • The Prime Minister made the point that LIAT does not have sufficient assets to satisfy the requirements or claims of most of its creditors, including the airline’s employees.

    “LIAT only owns three planes and those planes are charged to the Caribbean Development Bank, so clearly they have a superior claim and after they would have covered their claim there will be hardly any assets available to liquidate severance and other liabilities to staff and other creditors, so there has to be a negotiated position,” Browne said….(Quote)

    Wow. So, it was operating while insolvent? Is that legal? How incompetent. In any other jurisdiction there will be an investigation in to the collapse. Once again, who was in charge?

    Like

  • Hal AustinJune 28, 2020 4:33 AM

    Were prominent Quakers, especially in the US, slave owners?

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    No.

    Some were, some weren’t..

    George Fox didn’t own slaves, nor Margaret Fell, as far as I know,

    George Fox did get to America in 1671, Margaret Fell didn’t as far as I can tell.

    William Penn owned and traded in slaves.

    He first appears in America 10 years later.

    Nothing illegal or immoral at the time.

    When you google William Penn Slavery here is the first thing you get, if you were actually to google.

    “Slavery was documented in this area as early as 1639. William Penn and the colonists who settled Pennsylvania tolerated slavery, but the English Quakers and later German immigrants were among the first to speak out against it.”

    “The 1688 Germantown Quaker Petition Against Slavery was the first protest against African-American slavery made by a religious body in the English colonies. Francis Daniel Pastorius authored the petition; he and three other Quakers living in Germantown, Pennsylvania (now part of Philadelphia) signed it on behalf of the Germantown Meeting of the Religious Society of Friends. Clearly a highly controversial document, Friends forwarded it up the hierarchical chain of their administrative structure–monthly, quarterly, and yearly meetings–without either approving or rejecting it. The petition effectively disappeared for 150 years into Philadelphia Yearly Meeting’s capacious archives; but upon rediscovery in 1844 by Philadelphia antiquarian Nathan Kite, latter-day abolitionists published it in 1844 in The Friend, (Vol. XVII, No. 16.) in support of their antislavery agitation.”

    You will find if you google the State of Pennsylvania and slavery that “Pennsylvania’s Act for the Gradual Abolition of Slavery was the most conservative of the laws emancipating slaves that were passed in northern states between 1780 and 1804. The law freed few slaves immediately.”

    The economy of the North was not based on slavery.

    Many Barbadian Quakers emigrated to Pennsylvania when the option presented itself in 1681.

    Many Germans also emigrated there because Quakers who founded it did so on the basis of freedom of religion.

    That’s how the Mennonites, Amish etc. ended up there.

    Moravians also flocked there to escape the persecutions in Europe.

    I am curious about the origins of the Moravians in Barbados as my gut tells me the Quaker planters with links to Pennsylvania were the catalysts.

    Like

  • @ Quaker John

    Again you are being duplicitous. On the one hand you are saying ‘no’ to prominent Quakers being slave owners, then you go on to say some were some were not. You go on to mention William Penn. You cannot get any more prominent than having an entire US state named after you.
    You say there was nothing illegal or immoral. Illegal, yes. But immoral? Are you sure?

    Like

  • Options for Quakers from Barbados to get to America presented themselves prior to 1681 and the opening up of Pennsylvania.

    John Yeamans himself a Quaker first led a group of Barbadian Quakers there in 1665.

    If you were to google you would find “In the deteriorating economic conditions of the 1660s and 1670s many Barbadian planters sought better opportunities.[1] In 1663 a number of planters in Barbados made arrangements with the proprietors of Carolina for establishing a colony at Cape Fear. The proprietors, by the exercise of their influence at court, secured a baronetcy for Yeamans, conferred on him 12 January 1665, and on 11 January 1665 they appointed him governor of their colony, with a jurisdiction extending from Cape Fear to San Mateo.[2].”

    Did Yeamans own slaves?

    Yes.

    Like

  • @ Quaker John

    You have a brilliant modus operandi. You have a statement you want to make and no matter what the question is, you say what you want to. You ought t be a politician.

    Like

  • I assumed you were asking if all prominent Quakers in America slave owners.

    The answer is of course no.

    Some were and some were not.

    I started with George Fox, the most prominent of all who was in America for a while.

    He was here too so same as in Barbados.

    Putting George Fox aside for the moment, if you look at the Census c.1680, you will find that there were major land owners, prominent Quakers, who owned no as in ZERO slaves.

    One such name that springs to mind was William Sharpe who owned Mount Wilton.

    What he may have done was rent land to Quaker/Christian planters who owned slaves but there are no slaves registered against his name.

    Hal, the problem is your ignorance of history!!

    You cannot put people in a box and act surprised and with righteous indignation when one size doesn’t fit all.

    SOME PROMINENT QUAKERS OWNED SLAVES AND SOME DIDN’T.

    ARE YOU COMFORTABLE WITH THAT?

    Like

  • I have to admit though that I used George Fox as an example to mess with you!!

    Seems to have worked.

    Like

  • @Artax

    Is it any surprise insularity prevent us from harnessing the advantage of being a regional body? The location of an airline should be informed by due diligence performed by professionals.

    Like

  • @ Quaker John

    Mess with me? Do you mean fabricating a story? As I have said on numerous occasions on BU, do not assume what I mean. I ask the questions I want answered. The problem is not what I am comfortable with, but the historical truth.
    As I said, you answer the questions you want to answer, regardless to if they were asked. Two things about that. My experience and training and, as to my ignorance of history, well spotted. I am so ignorant that it surprises me when I write my name. I did not go to Harrison College, nor did I get a Barbados Scholarship.

    Like

  • After chattel slavery was abolished in 1834 by UK and 1865 in US with the 13th Amendment, people were still enslaved with debt bondage indentured slavery and blacks were still discriminated against and treated as inferior sub-humans up to civil rights act of 1964 and beyond up to present time.

    Europeans followed this up with scramble to colonise Africa 1884-1914 taking resources and valuable minerals and mistreating abusing indigenous and implemented apartheid segregated states in South Africa up to 1994 and Rhodesia up to 1979.

    Reparation for Colonialism of Africa should be included Reparations for Atlantic Slave Trade remit in my opinion.

    The Colonialism and Slavery was implemented by Royal Families and Heads of State who made untold wealth passed down through generations from exploitation of black race and Governments and Crowns are liable for hefty remedial recompense to make good on their damage inflicted.

    Like

  • Like

  • Majority in BU think tank would be stakeholders in any reparations process / project, producing white papers in feasibility studies and planning. But Slave Reparations issues are bigger scope than the whole of Barbados. Like MLK they may not reach to see the changes they seek in their life but can provide useful service to humanity and equality.

    Like

  • @ David

    I agree “The location of an airline should be informed by due diligence performed by professionals,” and not determined by the ‘whims and fancies’ of selfish Gaston Browne, who seems to believe Antiguans have some special entitlement to benefit from LIAT or any other airline that replaces it.

    As it relates to your comment about ‘insularity,’ the United States Cricket Hall of Fame has recommended former CWI president Dave Cameron for the post of chairman of the International Cricket Council (ICC). Since Cameron will require the support of two full members of the ICC, he intends to seek endorsement from CWI.

    I’m wondering if Cameron will be supported by CWI……. or chairman of the CARICOM subcommittee on cricket, Ralph Gonsalves. Recall Gonsalves was consistently critical of Cameron, while openly ‘canvassing’ for Vincentian, Dr. Kishore Shallow to be elected as vice-president, in last year’s CWI presidential elections.

    He was quoted as having said “Skerritt and Shallow were ‘modern Caribbean personalities steeped within our Caribbean civilisation,’ and possessed the ideas to take West Indies cricket forward.”

    It’s highly unlikely he would now believe Cameron possesses ideas to take world cricket forward.

    It will be very interesting ‘to see how this plays out.’

    Like

  • @Artax

    Interesting supporting point about Cameron and the possibility of him being recommended to head ICC. Do not anticipate the power elite of cricket will permit it. What it does is to expose the fragility of the regional movement. The UWI, CDB, LIAT, CXC and CWI probably represent the pillars of the regional project. Are we happy with how the entities are being managed with the goal of bringing the region together?

    Like

  • Hal AustinJune 28, 2020 6:08 AM

    @ Quaker John

    Mess with me? Do you mean fabricating a story? As I have said on numerous occasions on BU, do not assume what I mean. I ask the questions I want answered. The problem is not what I am comfortable with, but the historical truth.
    As I said, you answer the questions you want to answer, regardless to if they were asked. Two things about that. My experience and training and, as to my ignorance of history, well spotted. I am so ignorant that it surprises me when I write my name. I did not go to Harrison College, nor did I get a Barbados Scholarship.

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    There you go fabricating a response to me.

    Historical Fact – George Fox was the most prominent Quaker in America ….. or Barbados.

    Historical Fact – George Fox owned no slaves.

    Therefore the answer to the question “Were prominent Quakers, especially in the US, slave owners?” is NO, DEFINITELY NOT.

    But some did.

    Because a Quaker was prominent did not guarantee slave ownership.

    I gave the example of William Sharpe in Barbados.

    You phrased your question to get the answer it deserved!!

    Even if you had gone to HC and won 10 Barbados scholarships, the question got its deserved answer.

    Like

  • ‘Therefore the answer to the question “Were prominent Quakers, especially in the US, slave owners?” is NO, DEFINITELY NOT.
    But some did.”

    Question: “Were prominent Quakers, especially in the US, slave owners?”
    Answer:
    “No.
    Some were, some weren’t..”

    It seem as if you are tying yourself in needless knots. Why not say “Yes. some did”

    Like

  • I like an element of precision.

    I realised from my experience with lawyers (>30 years) that a question can be answered correctly but convey an element of imprecision and mislead.

    Just me.

    Meanwhile here is an example of the top general in George Washington’s Army who was a prominent Quaker.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nathanael_Greene

    Clearly all Quakers were not pacifists!!

    Incidentally, he acquired slaves when he moved to the south after the War of Independence.

    It was lawful there.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nathanael_Greene

    “After resigning his commission, Greene returned to Newport. Facing a large amount of debt, he relocated to the South to focus on the plantations he had been awarded during the war, and he made his home at the Mulberry Grove Plantation outside of Savannah. Though he had spoken against slavery earlier in his life, Greene purchased slaves to work his plantations.[79] In 1784, Greene declined appointment to a commission tasked with negotiating treaties with Native Americans, but he agreed to attend the first meeting of the Society of the Cincinnati.[80]”

    Had he lived in Pennsylvania at the time he would have found the law prohibited the ownership of slaves.

    http://pacivilwar150.com/Understand/SlaveryandFreedom.html

    Had he lived in Rhode Island where he was born he would have found “In 1652, Rhode Island passed the first abolition law in the Thirteen Colonies banning slavery, but the law was not enforced by the end of the 17th century.”

    Like

  • Why not say “Yes. some did”

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Grasshopper

    Because I know the poem IF!!

    If you can keep your head when all about you
    Are losing theirs and blaming it on you,
    If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
    But make allowance for their doubting too;
    If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
    Or being lied about, don’t deal in lies,
    Or being hated, don’t give way to hating,
    And yet don’t look too good, nor talk too wise:

    If you can dream—and not make dreams your master;
    If you can think—and not make thoughts your aim;
    If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
    And treat those two impostors just the same;
    If you can bear to hear the truth you’ve spoken
    Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
    Or watch the things you gave your life to, broken,
    And stoop and build ’em up with worn-out tools:

    If you can make one heap of all your winnings
    And risk it on one turn of pitch-and-toss,
    And lose, and start again at your beginnings
    And never breathe a word about your loss;
    If you can force your heart and nerve and sinew
    To serve your turn long after they are gone,
    And so hold on when there is nothing in you
    Except the Will which says to them: ‘Hold on!’

    If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,
    Or walk with Kings—nor lose the common touch,
    If neither foes nor loving friends can hurt you,
    If all men count with you, but none too much;
    If you can fill the unforgiving minute
    With sixty seconds’ worth of distance run,
    Yours is the Earth and everything that’s in it,
    And—which is more—you’ll be a Man, my son!

    Liked by 1 person

  • There are alot of fools and knaves on BU!!

    Liked by 1 person

  • (1) I suspect being the scholar you are, you memorized it. If only you understood it.
    (2 And there are knaves who think the rest are fools.

    Quaker and slaves
    “Sometimes you can learn things from the way a person denies something. The choice of lies can be almost as helpful as the truth. ” Laurell K. Hamilton

    Liked by 1 person

  • @ Quaker John

    It is obvious that John Fox is not Quakers (plural. I am sure they taught you well at Kolij). Answer the question I ask and not what you want me to ask.
    Now it appears as if you are clearly a devious character, if only on Quaker history, I will attribute that characteristic to other forms of your behaviour. In a blog packed with anonymous characters it is important to be honest. See how easy it is to destroy a reputation?
    By the way, at my stage in life I would not want to go to Harrison College or get a Barbados Scholarship. I have seen what both experiences have done to people on BU and in public life in Barbados.

    Liked by 1 person

  • @ John June 27, 2020 9:39 PM
    “Wellington was chosen probably because of the Duke of Wellington who was successfully fighting Napoleon in the Peninsular war and the victor of Waterloo at the time of the birth of Mary Lydia’s 3 children.”
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Here we go again regaling other people’s ‘white’ heroes.

    So Wellington (instead of Nelson) is now the new saviour of Barbados from French conquest?

    So where is the ‘erection’ in honour of this great English man who defeated the great Frenchman called Napoleon?

    The question to you is who was the greater warrior in the eyes of the Christian Barbadians?

    The pro-slavery Nelson or the greatest military general Britain ever produced and who actually defeated the French and saved ‘white’ Barbadians from eating frogs?

    So here is a compendium of names who can assign to your in vitro grandson(s):
    Lord King Louis Nelson Wellington Napoleon Duke of Knoxville!

    Like

  • Do you, do you remember those days of slavery?
    It wasn’t black man alone, who died through bravery
    ‘Though some a dem threw dem self over board
    Because dis ya slaveship overload
    It wasn’t black man alone, that really really suffer as slaves
    But we suffer the hardest way until today
    Some a dem commit suicide
    And through disease we caught some a dem died
    De whole world a cry, dem a cry, dem a cry, dem a cry
    Do you, do you remember those days of slavery?
    through crooked rocks, dangerous ocean
    In ya dis ya civilisation
    Me said-a do you, do you really remember
    When it was the day of slavery?
    Chiney man, Indian, white man died through bravery
    But as black man we suffer as slave
    The hardest way until today
    But a-so dey say, but a-so, but a-so dey say

    Like

  • Vincent Codrington

    Wow !! What an education? I would not miss this for the ?world? .

    Like

  • I learnt two great new words today.

    Cataphatic and apophatic.

    I’ll do some study to fathom their applicability to the recent QA session.

    Like

  • Hal

    You are too predictable!!

    Liked by 1 person

  • @Quaker John

    Thanks. Consistency. I have always been complimented on my interrogative techniques. I call it drilling down on lies. You are lucky you did not have to face me professionally, you would be torn apart. I love nothing more than people with passive/aggressive attitudes.
    You like it, but you are not very good at it. Unlike those who get hysterical with you, proving you are a fabricator is like taking candy from a baby.
    Even now in retirement some of my old tabloid colleagues still get in touch. They remember the good old days.

    Like

  • David/Artax
    I’m confused, isn’t there consensus that Cameron wasn’t good at his job as head of WI Cricket? If that’s the case why should he be supported by a regional body to head ICC?

    Like

  • @Sargeant

    It is more about his ability to command the support of a couple member territories. Nothing to do with performance.

    Like

  • Like

  • Learn your history..

    Like

  • This is what a real leader of a Black majority country looks like, this what real progress looks like, in less than 20 years the servants of the people knew they were being paid to do a job and they did it because the President knew he was elected the leader for the people and they did not need to question his actions because they were confident he was working on THEIR BEHALF…..the cities are absolutely beautiful..

    “Ô CamerounLike Page
    June 10 at 7:04 PM ·
    In 19 years, this is what Paul Kagame has done with Rwanda 🇷🇼

    DURBAN 1st cleaner capital in Africa.
    5th countries in the world in terms of promoting renewable energy
    1st most competitive African country in the report of “World Competitiveness Index” (CGI) in front of Nigeria and South Africa.
    18th world country, 2th countries in sub-Saharan Africa and 1st East African countries the easiest to do business in front of Côte d ‘ Ivoire and Senegal follow each other at the 139th and 140th in the world ranking (Doing Business).
    3th East African countries with average income per head of 595 euros (JA)
    3th World country where you get the most easily obtained credit (loan). (Guetting weekly)
    1st African countries to have the largest mall in Africa (Convention Center) in Kigali. (JA)
    the country of Africa where public health insurance is 98 %. (JA)
    Africa country with literacy rates raised to 70 %. (JA)
    a country connected with a 4 G network covering more than 95 % of the population (JA)
    1st African country to remove a Volkswagen (European) vehicle from its assembly plant (European)
    one of the few countries with 98 % school attendance

    The list is still long…”

    Like

  • JohnJune 27, 2020 9:39 PM

    Samuel Jackman Prescod, born August 6 1806 was baptised on 17 December 1816 when he was 10.

    His mother is recorded as Mary Lydia Smith, free mulatto.

    At the same time his siblings were also baptised.

    Their names were Maria Louisa born on September 22 1810 and Wellington born on November 21 1812.

    Wellington was chosen probably because of the Duke of Wellington who was successfully fighting Napoleon in the Peninsular war and the victor of Waterloo at the time of the birth of Mary Lydia’s 3 children.

    Maria Louisa may have been chosen because of Maria Luisa of Parma (1782-1824), daughter of Charles IV, King of Spain.

    Samuel Jackman Prescod married and produced 4 children so in all likelihood his descendants will be around today.

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    What does the baptismal record show?

    Lydia Smith preferred not to baptise her children.

    It took 10 years for Samuel Jackman Prescod to be presented to the Anglican Church for membership through baptism.

    Once she made the decision all of her children were baptised into the Anglican Church.

    I venture to say that Lydia Smith was not a member of the Anglican Church in 1806.

    I could not find a baptismal record for her.

    So to what church did she belong?

    Quaker!!!

    The Reformed Church if you like.

    There is a painting of Samuel Jackman Prescod sitting among participants at the first Anti Slavery Conference held in London in 1840.

    Many of the participants were Quakers.

    If SJP wasn’t a Quaker he sure had Quaker pedigree and connections as would be explicable if Lydia Smith was a Quaker.

    “The World Anti-Slavery Convention met for the first time at Exeter Hall in London, on 12–23 June 1840.[2] It was organized by the British and Foreign Anti-Slavery Society, largely on the initiative of the English Quaker Joseph Sturge.”

    “The Society for the Abolition of the Slave Trade was principally a Quaker society founded in the eighteenth century by Thomas Clarkson. ”

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Anti-Slavery_Convention#Victuallers

    Like

  • Hal

    I put a beautiful puzzle in front of you and predictably you missed it.

    In plain sight for heavens sakes.

    You don’t seem to understand what baptism is.

    If you did you would immediately have pursued a line of questioning that would have led you to an explanation of the anomaly.

    … that 10 year delay in the baptism of infants.

    Look at the prominent Quakers of the day on display at the first anti-slavery conference at Exeter Hall in England where SJP went to attend.

    Do you know where it is?

    Do you realise what happened there almost exactly 180 years ago to the day?

    I was told and taught from childhood that Quakers ended slavery.

    Here it is in living colour.

    Somehow you and many others missed a vital part of our history.

    So, SJP has taught us some absolutely beautiful history lessons.

    We can move on to Sarah Ann Gill next and explore her life as a slave owner and supporter of slavery.

    Like

  • So Hal

    Lets return to prominent Quakers in the US and whether they owned slaves.

    At the 1840 anti slavery convention SJP would have met several of them, like Lucretia Mott.

    Various alliances were made.

    “Prior to living in Seneca Falls, Stanton had become an admirer and friend of Lucretia Mott, the Quaker minister, feminist, and abolitionist whom she had met at the World Anti-Slavery Convention in London, England in the spring of 1840 while on her honeymoon. The two women became allies when the male delegates attending the convention voted that women should be denied participation in the proceedings, even if they, like Mott, had been nominated to serve as official delegates of their respective abolitionist societies. After considerable debate, the women were required to sit in a roped-off section hidden from the view of the men in attendance. They were soon joined by the prominent abolitionist, William Lloyd Garrison, who arrived after the vote had been taken and, in protest of the outcome, refused his seat, electing instead to sit with the women.[41]

    Mott’s example and the decision to prohibit women from participating in the convention strengthened Stanton’s commitment to women’s rights. By 1848, her early life experiences, together with the experience in London and her initially debilitating experience as a housewife in Seneca Falls, galvanized Stanton. She later wrote:

    The general discontent I felt with woman’s portion as wife, housekeeper, physician, and spiritual guide, the chaotic conditions into which everything fell without her constant supervision, and the wearied, anxious look of the majority of women, impressed me with a strong feeling that some active measures should be taken to remedy the wrongs of society in general, and of women in particular. My experience at the World Anti-slavery Convention, all I had read of the legal status of women, and the oppression I saw everywhere, together swept across my soul, intensified now by many personal experiences. It seemed as if all the elements had conspired to impel me to some onward step. I could not see what to do or where to begin—my only thought was a public meeting for protest and discussion.[42]”

    So who was Lucretia Mott?

    Go Google

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucretia_Mott

    Did she own slaves, I think not.

    Like

  • So Hal

    I am going to set you a task so you too can learn how to learn.

    See if there is a link between Lucretia Mott and this Quaker company whose products we all enjoy to this day.

    1842: Samuel R. Mott starts making and selling cider and vinegar in Bouckville, New York.
    1900: The Mott Company merges with the W.B. Duffy Cider Company, creating Duffy-Mott.
    1914: Duffy-Mott is incorporated in New York.
    1929: Duffy-Mott acquires the Standard Apple Products Company.
    1933: Duffy-Mott begins producing prune juice.
    1938: Duffy-Mott introduces Mott’s Apple Juice.
    1958: Duffy-Mott completes its initial public offering of stock.
    1982: Cadbury Schweppes acquires Duffy-Mott.
    1987: The Mr. & Mrs. T brand is acquired.
    1999: The Hawaiian Punch brand is acquired.
    2001: ReaLime and ReaLemon are acquired.
    2002: During the previous four years, annual sales for Mott’s double.

    Like

  • For all the lowlife lawyers who knew these Articles of Human Rights existed and malicously hoped to hide them from Black populations for another 50 years, read and weep, by the time am done, every African descended person on the earth will be able to recite them verbatim and so will their children and grandchildren.

    The African descended in the Caribbean, in the Diaspora and on the African Continent have the right as the ORIGINAL and indigenous peoples of the earth all have the international and universal right to be indigenous, no country or governments/states have any right to reduce them to brainwashed, mentally damaged, empty colonial shells or slaves. And no taxpayer paid but exceedingly corrupt judicial system and their treacherous taxpayer paid employees have any right to deny us our legal human rights.

    ▼Article VIII.
    Right to belong to indigenous peoples
    Indigenous individuals and communities have the right to
    belong to one or more indigenous peoples, in accordance
    with the identity, traditions, customs, and systems of
    belonging of each people. No discrimination of any kind
    may arise from the exercise of such a right.

    ▼Article IX.
    Juridical personality
    States shall recognize fully the juridical personality of
    indigenous peoples, respecting indigenous forms of
    organization and promoting the full exercise of the rights
    recognized in this Declaration.

    Like

  • @ Quaker John

    Although I promise myself to ignore you with your intellectual masturbation, your constant lying and misrepresentation gets me so angry. Who is talking about prominent Quakers in the US? That idea came from your corrupt mind. I was talking about prominent Quakers ie on planet Earth.
    I realise it is an addiction with you, catapulting Quakerism to the centre of historical morality. It is a myth. It is just that I do not want to see you mislead the blog as many people on BU just accept what they read. This time I will not respond no matter what.

    Like

  • World is moving forwards
    John is moving backwards
    after 300 years of slavery in America
    there was 100 years of segregation
    and then 50 years of white supremacy racism legacy
    Police in USA treat Blacks like Israel treats Palestinians today
    Slaves from West Africa were Muslims not Christians
    The original man is the Afroasiatic man
    The original people in Israel were Black
    Jews were Black and Brown
    Jesus was not white

    Like

  • Europeans started discovering and settling in America from 1500 with Spanish and Christopher Columbus and John Hawkins 1562.
    Jamestown in Virginia was the first English settlement in Americas in 1607.
    Quakers originated in England in 17th Century but were persecuted when they believed presence of God exists in every person.
    Quakers prohibited their Slavery in 1776 when GB lost Civil War of Independence.

    Like

  • Hal AustinJune 28, 2020 4:33 AM

    Were prominent Quakers, especially in the US, slave owners?

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    That was your question to me.

    So let’s see, what other prominent Quakers can I think of especially in the US?

    Daniel Boone was a Quaker..

    “Like Penn, Squire Boone belonged to the Society of Friends, or Quakers, a group whose members faced persecution in England for their beliefs. In 1720, Squire married fellow Quaker Sarah Morgan and Daniel, the sixth of the couple’s 11 children, was born in 1734 in present-day Berks County, Pennsylvania.”

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Boone

    “Boone was initially prosperous, owning seven slaves by 1787 (a relatively large number for Kentucky at the time),[38] but began to have financial troubles while living in Limestone.”

    So if you were to compare his slave ownership with that of Lydia Smith in Barbados you would conclude there was not much difference.

    There is every likelihood that Lydia Smith, mother of SJP was a prominent Quaker, just like Daniel Boone and that both owned a similar number of slaves.

    Like

  • Hal AustinJune 29, 2020 4:00 AM

    @ Quaker John

    Who is talking about prominent Quakers in the US?

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Why you of course.

    Like

  • Yeah and for the jackasses who don’t know, Israel is part of Africa…

    Like

  • WURA-War-on-UJune 29, 2020 9:31 AM

    Yeah and for the jackasses who don’t know, Israel is part of Africa…

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Here I was always thinking it was a part of Asia Minor.

    Like

  • What Black John don’t know is that the last Black Queen of Hawaii was robbed of her crown by quakers…they stole that Hawain business and everything else they could get their hands in US, they were just ya garden variety common class thieves…;;jsut as they were common class enslavers who still continued to commit crimes against the African descended in Barbados and the Caribbean up until the 1970s.

    you are welcome.

    Like

  • Hal

    You are out of your league and don’t even realise it.

    You don’t even seem to understand such a basic concept as Baptism.

    But then alot didn’t and don’t.

    You don’t appreciate the importance of the Reformation nor what it was.

    I admit I was once naive/ignorant like you but I made an effort to understand.

    While I learnt about it with Captain Hutt the era was the 1960’s when things religious were frowned on and removed from the school curricula.

    Go and read GP’s Sweet Sunday Sermon about what the Church is.

    You will grasp why the Reformation occurred and what exactly the Reformation was targeted at Reforming.

    Quakers are the last group of dissenters/no-conformists coming out of the Reformation generally considered to have occurred between 1517 and 1648.

    Like

  • ya may be better off not thinking, especially when those maps were drawn up by racist, enslaving colonialists…there is no such thing as the middle east, it’s just another colonial construct, a delusion and fantasy…a myth.

    Like

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