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Are The Storm Clouds Gathering?

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Submitted by Ping Pong (as a comment)
Hon Ronald Jones, Minister of Education

Two recent news items have caused me to ponder on the future of young Barbadians. The first is the Minister of Education’s musing that future scholarship winners may not be bonded to return and work in Barbados on completion of their studies. Is this tacit acknowledgement that Barbados may not be reasonably able to employ these graduates? The second item of news is the reported level of indebtedness of Barbados to UWI. Apparently, jobs as well as student admissions are threatened.

While we enjoy the charade that is the Alexandra inquiry and pontificate on the definition of education etc, is it unreasonable to worry that the future development and employment prospects of our young people is growing dim? It appears that as the CSME experiment has been shelved (or was still born) I must ask what other plans are there to expand the opportunities of our many well certified graduates?

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  1. David Avatar
    David

    @Ping Pong

    A concern worthy of prominence.

    What has puzzled BU is when Professor Howard made the point early in the debate that we need to look at a cost effective strategy targeting tertiary education and he was crucified. Yes the UWI can determine content of syllabus BUT can we afford for them to expand head count to the beat of their own drum? They have double enrollment in quick order.

  2. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ David:
    The recent news about the financial difficulties at the tertiary education level is just the tip of the iceberg heading our way.
    The miller’s earlier warnings about a new fee payment regime at the UWI in the coming were never taken on board.
    By September 2013 there will a fee structure at UWI for Bajans in which students will be required to pay at least 50% of their tuition costs. So parents, be prepared for this inevitability even if it means you will not be able to buy the next SUV or go on the next cruise in Europe or America.

  3. David Avatar
    David

    @miller

    As DJ said this morning, nothing was ever free. We have a nation of people who believe they are entitled to everything even in hard times. Nobody wants to tighten the belt. The scene is plating out as predicted by bloggers 4-5 years ago.

  4. Observing (and observing) Avatar
    Observing (and observing)

    the clouds have gathered. Umbrellas would make a worthwhile business investment. 🙂

  5. GEORGIE PORGIE Avatar
    GEORGIE PORGIE

    All scholars should be bonded and should field the need to return to serve the folk who paid for their education.
    A difficulty here is that some scholars might not find suitable work at home on completion of their studies.

    But we can not only give scholarships to those who study subjects for which their is a need in Barbados.
    I wonder if BU could put up a link of the Nation article on Rhaj Paul, who is now begging for money -some $50,000 to go to train in the UK. I wonder if his parents cant help him, and who else he plans to fleece.
    Rhaj Paul may be talented, BUT HE IS EXTREMELY LAZY, and he has had tremendous support from one of his friends, and his friend”s father at the beginning of this decade. This included the use of several used industrial sewing machines bought by his friend”s father , and the use of a building where he lived and worked and left owing thousands of dollars in rent, which his friend is still paying. Rhaj Paul then sold bits of furniture that was not his that he found in the house.
    Rhaj Paul just does not have the necessary drive. Over the last 10 years, he ought to have earned and saved the money he needs for his studies. Who else is he going to fleece and depend on now?

  6. David Avatar
    David

    @GP

    Here is that link you mentioned.

    http://www.nationnews.com/index.php/articles/view/rhaj-paul-in-a-quandary/

  7. GEORGIE PORGIE Avatar
    GEORGIE PORGIE

    thanks David

  8. David Avatar
    David

    It was interesting to hear a UWI employee who is studying post graduate call the talk show today to share a recent experience: when the UWI office called the ministry of finance to enquire about outstanding funding, it was directed to the education ministry. Yet another matter about to be aired in public. Well bring it on. Now is the time to wash in all in public because it is probably the only time the public will get an appreciation as a result of the debate that adjustments have to be made.

  9. One Sound Avatar
    One Sound

    We are in deep $hit and most of us are not even remotely aware of the gravity of the situation. The non-partisan “experts” predict that the true storm will begin between June and Dec 2013 and likely to last 4 to 5 years. Our educational system, health care, civil service, transport board and possibly even the value of our dollar will take the greatest pounding. Our country is in for a very rude awakening. Even our so called rich will not escape the beating from this most violent of economic storms. While everyone will be affected, our most vulnerable will be our young and our elderly. We all need to start growing more of our own food, replace the concrete and lawns around our homes with vegetable and herb gardens. We need to do this at the family and community levels. We need to introduce a bartering system (i.e. exchange of services) within our communities. We need to recycle more of our garbage. Essentially we need to start thinking and acting outside of the box if we, our family and our country are going to successfully get through the economic storm whose feeder bands we are experiencing currently. Sad but true, the worst is yet to come.

  10. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    “Are the storm clouds gathering?”

    Have been for a while now!
    Most of us have been too busy with petty political games to look up at the sky. What is imminent now is not the clouds, but the approaching “Eye of the storm” that will catch most off guard ….having ignored the ominous clouds until too late.

    ….and Ping Pong only threw in that CSME red herring to get Bushie vex!! He knows very well that CSME has been the single largest and most wasteful smokescreen thrown up by any government in its wild grabbing at straws to avoid drowning….
    It was ill-conceived, wasteful, and idiotic. ….as Bushie has been saying from time immemorial…..

    WE ARE DOOMED….but it has been mostly suicide 🙂

  11. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ One Sound | August 27, 2012 at 3:41 PM |

    Welcome aboard the rudderless ship SS Barbados.
    You have seen the storm clouds ahead and have issued a warning and more aptly ‘sounded the one alarm bell’ to the mostly drunk crew and big living credit card passengers behaving like those on board the Titanic.
    Expect them to call you a prophet of doom and gloom. The senior crews are telling the credit card customers everything is stable just a little choppy caused by high winds in the North Atlantic. The cruise ship is heading south so we will soon be out of the turbulence. Just relax, eat, sleep, gamble and be merry for tomorrow will take of itself.
    Expect to be ignored and even condemned by the likes of ac and! After all, the ship is now in safe hands.

  12. Christopher Halsall Avatar
    Christopher Halsall

    @millertheanunnaki: “By September 2013 there will a fee structure at UWI for Bajans in which students will be required to pay at least 50% of their tuition costs.

    Wow. What an amazing idea! If the students actually have to pay for their education then maybe they (and/or their underwriters) will take it a little more seriously.

    At the same time, if attending “UWI” costs money, then maybe people will question if the money (and time) spent there is worth it. What is a piece of paper from UWI worth these days?

  13. islandgal246 Avatar
    islandgal246

    Georgie Porgie I must say that you know quite a bit of the plight of many local fashion designers. You are correct and he is not the only lazy one BUT MANY if not most of them are. They expect someone to give them their training for free, give them their materials for free, give them their machinery for free and their business places for free. That is one of the many reasons they cannot move forward and are still in the the 80’s.

    One would think that a plan would have been in place to raise the money before before applying. The clothing industry in Barbados lacks skilled people and will never be a big Industry. There are many fashion courses available at the University of Trinidad and Tobago. Why doesn’t he try out other avenues? What about Project Runway? Anya Ayoung-Chee from Trinidad and Tobago won the last one. She won enough money to start her collection and business.

    The problem is that many feel that someone owes them and that mindset MUST change. Storm clouds have been hovering on the horizon for some time BUT many failed to see them. Now they are overhead and dripping some are saying that it is just a passing cloud and that it is just sprinkle. The deluge will soon be here.

  14. Ping Pong Avatar
    Ping Pong

    OK the ship is in danger of crashing into the iceberg but are there any “lifeboats”?

    I have young people (of university age) to face. What advice can I give them as they face an increasingly bleak economy? With little extra cash available, parents living from paycheck to paycheck, the only land available is the 4000 sq ft house spot their families are living on compliments of a mortgage, little work experience and few marketable skills, what do these young people do in an economy that is faltering?

    Are the “national leaders” considering the problem and if not trying to steer the ship away from the iceberg at least making sure the lifeboats are ready?

    There are about 8000 students at Cave Hill. What is on offer for them? Halsall raises the question that a UWI degree may not be worth much. UWI fees may seem reasonable but when I read that the Salvation Army is receiving more requests from citizens for help with school uniforms then UWI seems to be out of the question.

    We can’t throw our hands in the air and do nothing but what do we do? I don’t want any fancy philosophical posts about education reform (leave that for the cocktail parties). I am in search of practical actions that the average Kingsland, Grazettes, Kendal Hill etc residing individuals can do which can help them to weather the advancing storm.

  15. David Avatar
    David

    We need to change the current system which regales the top 5% performers of the academic variety.

  16. Christopher Halsall Avatar
    Christopher Halsall

    @Ping Pong: “I have young people (of university age) to face. What advice can I give them as they face an increasingly bleak economy?

    IMHO, the best advice you can give them is to get *really* good at something that truly interests them. Or, even better, get really good at more than one thing which interests them. The rest will usually take care of itself.

    “Getting paper” (read: getting a degree) can automatically open some doors. But often those doors lead to places where the student won’t be happy, and they’ll end up leaving after a number of years. Or else they’ll spend the rest of their lives being unhappy.

  17. Christopher Halsall Avatar
    Christopher Halsall

    @BU.David: “We need to change the current system which regales the top 5% performers of the academic variety.

    I would argue it somewhat differently.

    We need to change the current system to ensure that everyone has the opportunity to achieve what they want to, but only if they’re able and are driven.

    Some want to go to University. Great. Why?

    Some want to do a vocation. Great. Why?

    In all cases, the “Why?” is the most important question.

  18. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ Ping Pong | August 27, 2012 at 5:04 PM |

    Let them eat cake! LOL!!)
    Seriously though there is a future for some in agribusiness, alternative energy solutions and environmental protection and sustainability enterprises. They would just have to change their materialistic excessive consumption ways of living and operate in more environmentally sustainable ways.
    The Minister and his Cabinet Colleagues have been apprised of the coming food shortage that would be with us on a long term basis like NCDs; if we could even afford the expected larger import bill.
    What are they doing? Like Smokey Burke just “WAITING” to see what happens.

    Seems like LIFE is just one circle. The young people might just be the reincarnation of the great grand parents who depended on the land to survive. Back to the land, we say! By the sweat of their brows they shall eat food.

  19. JRB Avatar
    JRB

    “By September 2013 there will a fee structure at UWI for Bajans in which students will be required to pay at least 50% of their tuition costs.”

    “Wow. What an amazing idea! If the students actually have to pay for their education then maybe they (and/or their underwriters) will take it a little more seriously.”

    What about the poor ones who still achieve good grades?

    How about raising the minimum GPA one must be above to avoid being placed on warning, and if a student remains below for a second semester, forced to withdraw. It is currently set at 1.00 which is a D average (40-42%). I can assure you if it was set at a 2.00 minimum, or C average, a lot of money would be saved from time wasters being removed. Some students currently at UWI only seem to be following friends, avoiding work and do not even try. I know a few personally.

  20. ac Avatar
    ac

    it is going to take somebody or somebodies to take on that “sacred cow” UWI , not going to be easy . i for one belives the time has come for all to pull the load, good times don’t last forever,

  21. Enuff Avatar
    Enuff

    @ Bushie
    I maintain CSME is what could save us from doom because it is a gold mine!!

  22. Christopher Halsall Avatar
    Christopher Halsall

    @Enuff: “I maintain CSME is what could save us from doom because it is a gold mine!!

    I know you’re joking, but let us please recognize the elephant in the room.

    The CARICOM Single Market and Economy (CSME) is a stillborn idealistic idea.

    It’s never going to happen. Particularly not after the EU and Greece.

  23. Christopher Halsall Avatar
    Christopher Halsall

    @JRB: “What about the poor ones who still achieve good grades?

    If they have access to the internet, there are many resources available to them which can teach them a lot.

    Just one example is https://www.edx.org/ — free courses from MIT, Harvard and Berkeley. Not easy, but worth the effort.

    UWI has a lot of competition. It just doesn’t realize it yet….

  24. JRB Avatar
    JRB

    The problem with that is that those courses are few and rather limited, E.G. the lack practical sessions for the natural sciences or hands on experience for the social sciences and humanities. Also, there is the problem of being accredited. If you have not noticed, most of those free courses are computer science.

  25. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    @ Enuff
    @ Bushie
    “I maintain CSME is what could save us from doom because it is a gold mine!”
    **************
    LOL ….YUh gallows- bait! If you think you going make Bushie sin he soul here cussing O$A again yuh wrong… 🙂

    @ Ping Pong
    What to tell the youths…?

    You Should tell them…
    “….hard luck, wunna born 40 years too late to enjoy the materialistic goodies that dad did….
    HOWEVER, if they can instead change their focus to the REAL IMPORTANT THINGS in life, then they may well reap where we jokers from our “well- to – do” generation have so far failed.

    ….They may yet come to know of BBE and of the unbelievable good news (gospel) that was brought to us by his son.

    …but you will probably instead encourage them to chase after the same shadow that our generation has allowed to distract us from the proper bone….no matter how far and elusive that shadow has become…POOR SOULS 🙂

  26. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    JRB said….
    “Some students currently at UWI only seem to be following friends, avoiding work and do not even try. I know a few personally.”
    *************
    Bushie knows of some lecturers in an identical situation too…. 🙂

  27. Hants Avatar
    Hants

    In times of plenty we focused on raising the living standard to “First world”.

    Nouveau riche Bajans had to have Bimmas, Benzes and 3 car Garages.
    I remember seeing board and shingle houses with satellite dish on the roof and new car park outside.

    Car and a University graduate at every house was the mantra of a short man from st.Peter.

    That very simplistic concept of saving for a rainy day eluded us and now all we have is debt and very little prospects for an economic recovery.

    Is there a leader who can motivate Bajans to work to save the country from ruin.
    Who has the testicular fortitude to turn the Golf courses into vegetable farms when the time comes?

  28. Christopher Halsall Avatar
    Christopher Halsall

    @JRB: “The problem with that is that those courses are few and rather limited, E.G. the lack practical sessions for the natural sciences or hands on experience for the social sciences and humanities. Also, there is the problem of being accredited. If you have not noticed, most of those free courses are computer science.

    What you might not have noticed is that “paper” is not really that important any more — it is what the student can do when faced with challenges.

    I present to you et al these four questions:

    1. What is the total of 1 through 100 inclusive? Show me how you derived the answer. (Hint: optimally you fold the set, and only have to do a single simple multiplication to get the answer.)

    2. What is the sound of one hand clapping? (Hint: This is a Buddhist question — some students spend years on this one.)

    3. What is the last digit of pi? (Hint: You might spend forever answering this.)

    4. Prove that God exists / doesn’t exist. (Hint: An understanding of quantum mechanics helps here.)

    At the end of the day the employer doesn’t really care what courses the employee took — they only care if the employee can do the job the employee are tasked with.

  29. Christopher Halsall Avatar
    Christopher Halsall

    @Hants: “Car and a University graduate at every house was the mantra of a short man from st.Peter.

    Here’s a question just for you Hants.

    Is everything about politics here in Bimshire? Or might some actually be acting solely for the good of Barbados?

  30. BAFBFP Avatar
    BAFBFP

    The BIGGEST joke in all of this is that the legal council for the UWI advised the principal not to accept the offer given by the Min of Fin to repay the indebtedness “because of its origin, might not be binding on a returning or new administration.” Well I never hear more truthful shite in all my life … This alone exposes the SHAM that is West Minister styled Government. Barat you see how much shite you in … Oh loss Miller wah you say … HA HA HA MURRDAAA !

  31. BAFBFP Avatar
    BAFBFP

    Look wunna leff Raj Paul alone hear. Look at the spend on overseas travel on senior public servants EVERY year, and tell me that they ain’ even more lazy than any being around, with absolutely NO chance on a return on investment NONE. Leff Paul be, he at least has a chance at being productive. 50,000 is trivial.

  32. JRB Avatar
    JRB

    “At the end of the day the employer doesn’t really care what courses the employee took — they only care if the employee can do the job the employee are tasked with.”

    What would be the point of bring up online courses then? Note that I’m not saying they are useless, I even check out a few myself and other online material (Khan Academy is very useful). I just think we shouldn’t put more dependence on overseas resources. What happens if these universities then decide that these courses aren’t overall financially feasible and focus on physically taught course which would bring in more money? Alot of these initiatives are pilot projects to determine that feasibility.

    “I present to you et al these four questions:”

    I’m am not sure what is the point of these random questions. What university or job would particularly focus on the four of these. If the paper is not really important anymore shouldn’t we work on turning that around? Usually the “paper” indicates that you at least have some basic capacity academically. Not every task needs a degree or certificate but not every task can be done with CSECs only and while some employers do extensive training, some expect to only build on already acquired knowledge; theoretical, practical, or both. Therefore there may be issues with no accreditation whatsoever where anyone can say; they have these skills, they did this and that on their own, on applications and in interviews, and when employed turn out to be a totally different story and a waste of time.

    I say we should work on optimizing UWI not abandoning it all together. I think the problem is too many individuals are applying for university without any specific goal, just because the government pays (used to pay?) the economic and tuition fees for a first degree. Therefore I suggest that in order to qualify for this, students should achieve a certain grade standard each academic year and failure to meet this standard would result in them either self financing their degree, or dropping out. Not everyone is academical inclined and nothing is wrong with vocational jobs, and we should also focus on removing the stigma against them in the country.

  33. Enuff Avatar
    Enuff

    @ Hallsall
    The EU and the Caribbean are two different kettle of fish. If we can’t see our future lie in a CSME I am sorry for us.

  34. Christopher Halsall Avatar
    Christopher Halsall

    @JRB: “I’m am not sure what is the point of these random questions. What university or job would particularly focus on the four of these.

    They are “out of the ball-park” questions. The thing as an interviewer is to see how the candidate responds. Most do badly — as you did — and refuse to answer rather than taking on the questions.

    @JRB: “Usually the “paper” indicates that you at least have some basic capacity academically.

    Ah, no. Not always.

    What it often means is the candidate was able to sit through classes (possibly while sleeping) long enough to “get the paper”.

    Have you heard about “Grade Inflation”? Please let me make it easy for you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grade_inflation

  35. Christopher Halsall Avatar
    Christopher Halsall

    @Enuff: “The EU and the Caribbean are two different kettle of fish. If we can’t see our future lie in a CSME I am sorry for us.

    Bovine excrement.

    Please tell me when Jamacia and Trinidad et al are going to sit at the table with Barbados as equal partners.

  36. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ Christopher Halsall | August 27, 2012 at 7:09 PM |
    “1. What is the total of 1 through 100 inclusive? Show me how you derived the answer. (Hint: optimally you fold the set, and only have to do a single simple multiplication to get the answer.)”

    Bossman, am I allowed to use a spreadsheet package like Excel?
    Then I will just fill a series with a step value of one to a stop value of 100; then sum the series; and Bingo! 50: 50!
    Heads I win tails you lose! Now give me the job, boss.

  37. BAFBFP Avatar
    BAFBFP

    Miller man respond to me do …

  38. Christopher Halsall Avatar
    Christopher Halsall

    @MTA: “Am I allowed to use a spreadsheet package like Excel?

    No. This is a simple problem — use your brain…

    What is 101 * 50?

  39. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ Christopher Halsall | August 27, 2012 at 8:28 PM

    But Bossman, I already told you that six is half-dozen. Isn’t that a 50:50 deal?

  40. Christopher Halsall Avatar
    Christopher Halsall

    @millertheanunnaki: “But Bossman, I already told you that six is half-dozen. Isn’t that a 50:50 deal?

    Don’t call me “bossman”. I’m not your boss (yet).

    And you didn’t get the answer correct — and you’re taking pleasure in doing so.

  41. Bus Driver Avatar
    Bus Driver

    @Halsall

    1. Pair off the numbers:
    1+100=101
    2+99=101
    3+98=101
    etc; so the total in this case is 101, 50 times=5050
    (In general (n*(n+1)/2))

    2. Hmmm

    3. Pi is irrational and irrationals have no terminating decimals.

    4. A working knowledge of quantum mechanics is absolutely not going to allow you to prove the existence or otherwise of “God” but we can discuss further.

    If successful I’m available to start work with you tomorrow ; Java, C#, Drupal, some Python. Let me know. Thanks

  42. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ BAFBFP | August 27, 2012 at 8:21 PM |

    Truthful shite indeed! And to think that this shite is being excreted by lawyers who are presumably graduates from the same shitty law school on the Hill.

    Poor Barrack! He should have sold the debt to a factor long time ago thereby saving the taxpayers a few million in interest payments. The government would have pissed itself before giving short shrift to a foreign factoring house as it is doing to Al Barrack. Both BA and Virgin would have been advised to suspend flights until the debt is paid.
    Now we have OSA promising CLICO policyholders another pie-in-the-sky dream. Let them first levy on the property and chattels of Leroy and we would take these politicians a bit serious

  43. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ Christopher Halsall | August 27, 2012 at 9:06 PM |
    The not yet bossman, you like you is a nerd or something else? I told you 5050. You can’t read between the lines? Ya want me put in a semicolon (;) or leave it out altogether or a comma after the first 5? Which one, boss pretender?
    If you ever give da job to Bus Driver I gine let ya wife know because she is the one dat gi me the 5050 answer when we was in bed while you was at wuk yesterday.

  44. Bus Driver Avatar
    Bus Driver

    I showed my workings, Miller. I get the job.

  45. Zoe Avatar
    Zoe

    “Are The Storm Clouds Gathering?” Abso-polutely! And way BEYOND the silly details here discussed; we ain’t SEE nothing yet!

  46. Sargeant Avatar
    Sargeant

    There were two issues raised but most people have ignored the issue of finding jobs for young graduates and focused on tuition cost and level of indebtedness of UWI. Even if a solution is found which addresses the tuition cost we are still going to be faced with finding suitable jobs for young people.

    As the advice columnist used to write, “it’s time to wake up and smell the coffee”. In North America many young people who have graduated are either unemployed or under employed which means that they are doing what is euphemistically termed a “Mc Job”. Many of them have postponed dreams of family and home and returned to live with their parents after the promising job was down sized or outsized. In the past the Barbados avoided the impact of severe unemployment through large scale immigration to Britain, Canada and the USA, unfortunately those welcoming mats have all but disappeared.

    I don’t have a solution but I am in good? company, neither do the politicians.

  47. David Avatar
    David

    @enuff

    How can we have a vibrant common market and only focus on immigration?

    What about trade and settlement (monetary market).

  48. JUST ASKING Avatar
    JUST ASKING

    THE DEMOCRATIC LABOUR PARTY -(DLP) IS A BLIGHT ON THIS COUNTRY

    GET RID OF THE DLP NOW !!!

    NEXT ELECTION RESULTS
    BLP = 29 SEATS
    DLP = 0 SEATS
    INDEPENDENT = 1 SEAT

    1999
    BLP = 28 SEATS
    DLP = 2 SEATS
    INDEPENDENT = 0 SEATS

    DO WE WANT BARBADOS TO RISE AND SHINE ?
    GET RID OF THIS BLIGHTED GOVERNMENT

    WUNNA GWINE LET IT DESTROY THE UNIVERSITY OF THE WEST INDIES ????

    JUST ASKING

  49. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ Sargeant | August 27, 2012 at 11:21 PM |
    ” I don’t have a solution but I am in good? company, neither do the politicians.”

    Do what humans have done through the ages. Destroy and rebuild.
    Start wars as happened in the 1930/40’s era to cull the excess numbers and find work for the unemployed as happened in Germany, England and USA. Therefore making room to make your observation a reality: “In the past the Barbados avoided the impact of severe unemployment through large scale immigration to Britain, Canada and the USA”

    If man does not do it to himself, Nature will.

  50. Sargeant Avatar
    Sargeant

    @Miller
    You are overlooking the fact that in a major war someone may push the nuclear button and only a few stragglers will survive along with cockroaches and rats.

    In the new reality Bajans will have to do something that has been anathema to them they will have to become entrepreneurs, they will have to create their own jobs, they will have to be inventive and industrious and invest in themselves. I don’t mean become vendors distributing the plastic junk that comes from the far East.

    How do they achieve that? The Education system will have to be revamped, O Lord here we go again….

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