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carl mooreWe have been bombarded with emails about an article which appeared in the Nation newspaper of 20 April 2008 under the by line Carl Moore – The More Things Change . Unlike Carl Moore we respect his right to foist his opinion on others. The right to free speech is something which our democracy has been built. The fact that some people have chosen the Internet to disseminate views which have been stifled in the traditional media appear to be lost on Carl Moore. This is a journalist who has used the traditional media to fight a perennial one man battle against noise pollution with a negliable result to date – spoken with the proverbial tongue in cheek like only Bush tea can. As an aside, Carl Moore maybe surprise to learn the identity of some of our commenters which include politicians, priests, civil servants current and retired, and believe or not, journalists!

Let us clear-up a misunderstanding which Mr. Moore seems to be labouring under. His willingness to criticize the blogs, we assume he means Barbados Free Press (BFP) and Barbados Underground (BU) when he really means some commenters suggests that he has some misunderstandings about what is a blog. A blog is Barbados Underground which is owned by blogger David and the BU household, the main objective of the blog is to promote the opinions of the blogger. The blog offers the opportunity for commenters to interact with the blogger by sharing opinions which hopefully benefit all the participants. More importantly blogs have the functionality which allow other blogs from all over the world including Barbados to ping(link) stories. The interaction leads to a blogosphere which is enhanced by the knowledge which is shared.

Like anything which involves human beings there is good and bad. Carl More seems to have a beef with the quality of journalism and the pseudonyms which BFP and BU and commenters have had to resort to in order to achieve the objective of sharing important information. Unlike Mr.Moore who seems to be a retired person they are others who because they fear victimization have used the Internet and blogs to share information. We are the first to admit that some have misused the blogs and where possible we have tried to filter those commenters while recognizing the individuals right to freedom of expression. During the last general election when the traditional media was restricted by a government that was known to be very hostile towards the media, subsequent events demonstrated that the media cowered in the face of the intimidation. The blogs were used to break stories which the traditional media refused. We have discussed issues regarding the cost of living, the crying need to identify alternative sources of energy, issues associated with a growing ethic and illegal population, increasing barriers to intra-regional travel, the role of the Church, a sensible land use policy, regionalism and the list goes on and on.

Let us debunk the inexactitude perpetrated by Carl Moore about the Bajan blogosphere. The Barbados Underground have never promoted ourselves as journalists. We have associated with the idea that the free-wheeling nature of the Internet allows the blogs to complement traditional media by protecting freedom of information. In the face of admissions by David Ellis and other journalists that they have been challenged at times to do their jobs, developing other avenues to protect the people’s right to freedom of speech, which is an important tenet in any democracy become paramount. The willingness of Carl Moore to remain committed to his single line notebook and pencil in an age of the computer and the Internet we accept as part of the challenge as Barbados and the world transition from old to new. There is a role for Carl Moore to play to ensure that key ingredients of the old media culture is transferred to the new. Whether he agrees or not it will call for an acceptance of blogs. We agree that some of our credibility is compromised because of our current anonymous configuration, but Mr. Moore should regard this as part of the process which will lead to an inevitable result of improving the unfettered distribution of ideas and information.

Barbados is a small community and the wholesale adoption of how blogs have been accepted in other parts of the world must be seen against this background.

Let us provide an example:

Both the Nation and Advocate newspapers have not incorporated blogs into their online format. If blogs were allowed, the journalists would be able to interact with the readers and get immediate feedback. A scan of the Trinidad and Jamaica newspapers this morning confirmed that this practice is in place. The same can be said about the online radio stations in Barbados which have struggled to maintain blogs or other fora to interact with their readership. Carl Moore who appears to have no respect for citizen journalists or what some refer to as the social media should explain why traditional media has been unable to integrate new distribution channels i.e. blogs.

We have deliberately not mentioned the phenomenon of Face book, My Space and other social networks which politicians in the USA have been using with mind blowing results. The point we are making Mr. Moore, you need to remove yourself from the archaic practices of the past. While your stubbornness in your current approach may still allow you to have your message resonate with the dinosaur era (no disrespect intended), there is a new generation who cares not for your nostalgic beliefs. It might explain the rapid growth of visitors of the BFP and BU (we continue to be surprise at the number of our unique and repeat visitors).

Mr. Moore we hope that you can come to the blogoshere and engage us on this important issue. If you retain your thin-skinned approach then we advise that you stay in the comfortable environs of Fontebelle. In deference to your cause we have placed a button on our sidebar to highlight the scourge of noise abuse.

By the way we love bananas!


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139 responses to “Carl Moore, Retired Journalist, Broadcaster & Former Chairman Of The Broadcasting Authority Calls Barbados Free Press & Barbados Underground 'Cowards'”


  1. Mr. Hinds, for goodness sake, give me something stimulating to respond to. Are there any issues we can discuss like adults on this medium?

    I said almost two weeks ago that the amusing thing about the Internet is that, at any given time, one does not really know to whom one is talking. It could well be a monkey. I even coined my own phrase: “a gaggle of monkeys”, borrowed from the geese.

    For goodness sake, man, how do you translate that to mean you?

    True, we all belong to the genus known as primate, but aren’t you stretching it a bit to extrapolate from the foregoing paragraph that you, Adrian “homo sapiens” Hinds, are a monkey? Come on, man, behave like an adult.

    Over the past week I was called dinosaur, irrelevant, idiot, maverick, loser, failure, racist, Uncle Tom, a 1960s version of Peter Wickham, old fogey; everything except a paedophile.

    I even found myself in the illustrious company of Sir Conrad Reeves, the first black Chief Justice of Barbados who died in 1902. And I said: “Ah, at last someone thinks I’m a distinguished jurist!” I was disappointed as I read on to find that I am a negrocrat, like poor old Sir Conrad was, according to Adrian Hinds.

    One helpful researcher traced my lineage all the way back to Ossie Moore. I could’ve saved him all that time digging around in my background and confirmed for him that Ossie and I are first cousins.

    When you step into an ants’ nest, expect to be bitten. Interfere wth me at the personal level and I will mall-sprig yuh, Adrian.

    Give me something sensible to reply to in a week’s time. Take time to do some thinking before you write gobbledygook.

    Almost everyone looking in or participating on this website must’ve noticed by now that I’m having some fun here. But enough is enough.

    We’re wasting bandwidth, as well as our time and energy. I’m off to Brighton Beach for a walk on the sand. Get up from the computer wherever you are and do something similar.

    Life is short. Don’t take yourself too seriously.

    Out.


  2. It good to see other people who have a more realitic position about blogs.

    =================================

    Don’t see blogging as a threat but a help to Press
    Published on: 4/29/08.

    “Suggest to an old-school journalist that Weblogs have anything to do with journalism and you’ll be met with howls of derision.” – J.D. Lasica, Blogs And Journalism Need Each Other.

    J.D. LASICA’S entire article is worth reading. One cannot help but notice that each time blogging is spoken of by some of the established media practitioners, they are almost always cast in a negative light. An understandable, yet unbalanced position.

    This is not just a local phenomenon.

    “They are opinionated, ranting, often incoherent and frequently biased with little regard for accuracy or balance. They are also compellingly addictive and threatening to emerge as a new brand of journalism, writes Jody Raynsford, “If you are part of the blogging community, you are also part of the blogosphere – presumably with its own weather system.” How wonderfully clever.

    Love them or hate them, blogs are here to stay (comments and all). Right alongside Facebook, YouTube, GodTube, MySpace, LinkedIn and other social networking sites and services.

    The enviable Chris “he-could-go-all-the-way” Berman of Sportscenter fame once said that there are no foolish questions, only foolish people who ask questions.

    Here are a couple: Will blogs kill the old media? Probably not anymore than Amazon’s kindle device will “kill” books. Is blogging journalism? No one ever claimed it was.

    Blogs should be seen as complimenting rather than threatening the traditional media establishment. The Media Bloggers Association (www.mediabloggers.org ), describe themselves as, “…supporting the development of ‘blogging’ or ‘citizen journalism’ as a distinct form of media; and helping to extend the power of the Press, with all the rights and responsibilities that entails, to every citizen.”

    They adhere to the following values: honesty, fairness and accuracy; transparency; accountability and trust; respect for the privacy of private citizens. Especially interesting is the “note on anonymity”.

    I will let J. D. Lasica have the last word: “The vast majority of media companies have missed the boat so far, and readers are turning to expert amateurs, people with a deep knowledge about a niche subject, and others with a flair for writing or interesting stories to tell – hundreds of thousands of bloggers who have become part of the media ecosystem.

    If the news media chooses to ignore it, it’ll continue to lose a chance to connect with readers on an intimate daily basis. And they’ll become a bit less relevant with each passing day.”

    – ADRIAN SOBERS


  3. It is regretable that Carl Moore persists on selecting convenient commentary from BU to support his rant that blogs have no place in the universe of information flow.

    We have resisted up to now to respond to his position which other markets have already shown has no credence. The Bajan blogosphere is in its nascent stage and at this point we have decided to categorize Carl Moore’s opinion as feedback and leave it right there.


  4. Somehow Carl Moore thinks that i am writing here for his pleasure, or that i need his permission to stop. 😀

    ha ha ha ha Loser, failure, Modern day Conrad Reeves the self confess Negrocrat, and a black man who takes pleasure in making disparaging remarks about blacks to blacks are labels that i can and have substantiated. I have not extrapolate from anything that i am a monkey, I have however truthfully link your “gaggle of monkeys, comment to the earlier title of your last article “give them a ripe banana” and to which you justified this linkage by offering me/us as many bananas and now mangoes as we can eat. You stand rightfully accused of making disparaging associations, familiar with racists. You are not the only one having fun, as i have said before it is fun for me to cuss you and point out the ugly truth about your comments that you may have thought were well hidden. Sweet! 😀

    I have absolutely no fear of you and no biting that you maybe capable of, so your maul-springing i will have to endure.

    I can sit at a computer and type as many as ten replies in ten minutes in fact that is what i do almost everyday as i hardly have the time to devout more, in one sitting.

    I am not even going to reply to your rouse about exercise.


  5. Sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me.

    I really don’t mind being called a monkey because sometimes that is just what I am.

    Carl, I realise that you are sensitive about the “L ” word but I came across this story which I found amusing.

    Islanders File Suit Over Term ‘Lesbian’
    By NICHOLAS PAPHITIS,AP
    Posted: 2008-04-30 12:42:15
    Filed Under: Weird News, World News

    ATHENS, Greece (April 30) – A Greek court has been asked to draw the line between the natives of the Aegean Sea island of Lesbos and the world’s gay women.

    Three islanders from Lesbos – home of the ancient poet Sappho, who praised love between women – have taken a gay rights group to court for using the word lesbian in its name.

    One of the plaintiffs said Wednesday that the name of the association, Homosexual and Lesbian Community of Greece, “insults the identity” of the people of Lesbos, who are also known as Lesbians.

    “My sister can’t say she is a Lesbian,” said Dimitris Lambrou. “Our geographical designation has been usurped by certain ladies who have no connection whatsoever with Lesbos,” he said.

    The three plaintiffs are seeking to have the group barred from using “lesbian” in its name and filed a lawsuit on April 10. The other two plaintiffs are women.

    Also called Mytilene, after its capital, Lesbos is famed as the birthplace of Sappho. The island is a favored holiday destination for gay women, particularly the lyric poet’s reputed home town of Eressos.

    “This is not an aggressive act against gay women,” Lambrou said. “Let them visit Lesbos and get married and whatever they like. We just want (the group) to remove the word lesbian from their title.”

    He said the plaintiffs targeted the group because it is the only officially registered gay group in Greece to use the word lesbian in its name. The case will be heard in an Athens court on June 10.

    Sappho lived from the late 7th to the early 6th century B.C. and is considered one of the greatest poets of antiquity. Many of her poems, written in the first person and intended to be accompanied by music, contain passionate references to love for other women.

    Lambrou said the word lesbian has only been linked with gay women in the past few decades. “But we have been Lesbians for thousands of years,” said Lambrou, who publishes a small magazine on ancient Greek religion and technology that frequently criticizes the Christian Church.

    Very little is known of Sappho’s life. According to some ancient accounts, she was an aristocrat who married a rich merchant and had a daughter with him. One tradition says that she killed herself by jumping off a cliff over an unhappy love affair.

    Lambrou says Sappho was not gay. “But even if we assume she was, how can 250,000 people of Lesbian descent – including women – be considered homosexual?”

    The Homosexual and Lesbian Community of Greece could not be reached for comment.

    Copyright 2008 The Associated Press. The information contained in the AP news report may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or otherwise distributed without the prior written authority of The Associated Press. All active hyperlinks have been inserted by AOL.
    2008-04-30 12:03:23

    http://news.aol.com/story/_a/islanders-file-suit-over-term-lesbian/20080430115909990002

  6. Adrian Hinds Avatar

    John, an interesting article. The things i learn on this Blog. 😀
    I had discarded an entire people, simply becuase i did not care for the lifstyle difine by the word Lesbian.

    …..The blogs serving to educate, what says you Carl Moore? or is this not good enough since you are not the teacher? I know it’s all about you. 😀


  7. Adrian

    I know this is pushing the envelope but next time you picture the Leader of the Opposition in your mind, take a deep breath, control your Blood Pressure and just think of her as possibly having Greek ancestry.

    Nobody knows for sure about these things and very often DNA testing is required.

    Carl

    There are some people, both men and women, who may actually be willing to fight and die for the honour of being known as a Lesbian.

    You obviously don’t have any Greek ancestry, at least that you are willing to admit.

    There is a very interesting project where DNA testing can tell what paths our ancestors followed before we became who we are.

    I plan to get mine tested and will also be looking to see if I have Greek ancestry.

    Keep walking with those Bananas and Mangoes as I will be expecting mine next time I see you.

    Hopefully by then I will have found out if I am part Greek.


  8. ha ha ha ha ha ha ha LOL John you are the best. 😀 now i will have to found out if the Island of Lesbos offers honorary citizen status to anyone, and see if I can get such a title confer to Mia, …hope that that this lawsuit fails and i will be able to legitimately call her a citizen of Lesbo. 😀 until then she is not right?

    ….But John even if your ancestry turns out to be part Greek, to Carl Moore that just makes you “part Greek Monkey” it better not show that you have lineage to the island of Lesbos. 😀
    …Carl what would that make him? 😀


  9. Some amazing discussion going on under several of the blogs here Carl Moore, e.g Dr. Robinson’s submission, issues about concern on the East and west coast of Barbados and others. We have searched for a comment from you but can’t seem to find a single one.


  10. Adrian

    …. a proud Lesbian of course!!

    I notice the dead tree edition carried the story today.

  11. Adrian Hinds Avatar

    John // May 2, 2008 at 8:38 pm

    Adrian

    …. a proud Lesbian of course!!

    I notice the dead tree edition carried the story today.
    ================================

    Hi John:
    what story would that be???? I don’t have access to the dead tree edition in Rhode Island, and the online skeleton of it has not being updated.

    …Are you referring to Carl Moore’s 2nd episode,… “Of Blogs and Gaggles of Monkeys??


  12. The Nation carried the article on the island of Lesbos and the court case!!

    Perhaps his friends at the Nation are having a laugh at him or else they are trying to show Bajans that it is ok to be called a Lesbian.

    Tomorrow is the day for his next article where he has promised to destroy us disrespectful, ill mannered louts.


  13. I waited expecting “more”, but alast there was nothing there.

    I have never bothered too much about trying to please – because those whose interest I consider paramount, might not be able to afford a computer… but I hope I write the truth.

    We have a few people in Barbados who believe they are of a higher order; how dare others, who they deem inferior have the audacity to challenge their views. To confront them in an aside is unthinkable, but to do so on an open forum is tantamount to declaring war, by your actions you are seen as a termagant.

    Previously some had influence in media outlets ,and were able to bin opinions and ideas contrary to what they believed… or perhaps promulgated.

    Now, in seeking to uplift themselves and squat on higher ground they have metaphorically embraced the whip, mantle and terminology of former oppressors. It indicates how far they have mentally tried to distance themselves from kin, in so doing they have torn themselves from an umbilical cord, they swim in the fetid blood of their own.

    When the question is asked why after so many years the situation in Barbados is as it is. The reverbation of this question rings like an echo in a canyon and the ring of the echo explains why we are what we are, and even today we are not “masters” of our destiny despite our massive percentage of the population.

    Why? the reason simply is, some think they are of us but not “really” of us, while others laugh at us, as we dissipate our energies in molasses and mud, dare I say it we have done it for a long time.

    Often the abundance we read in the print media here, gives few ocassions for reflection, we read, bin and move on there is no need for quiet contemplation on the ideas, or the desire to change things, we simply go marching on, but the view as we peep repeatedly from the corner of an eye, indicates we are going nowhere.

    “How happy is he born and taught
    That serveth not another’s will;
    Whose armour is his honest thought
    And simple truth his unmost skill!”

    Sir Henry Wotton, Character of Happy Life


  14. Here is the link to the Part II Carl Moore article. We read it and there was emptiness:-). This is the extent to which we will highlight his failed attempt to critique the Bajan Blogosphere. As we expected he and the Nation were cowards and did not refer to our website by name. We observed however that he was careful to cite the other works he referenced with great clarity. They continue to bury their heads in the sand.


  15. David, did u expect me to read all dah. If the f***er does n’t know what a blog is then let him go and find out before posting trash (him). I’m all in favour of a campaign against excessive, noise pollution but to criticise the blogs which help to secure our freedoms in our own country – the man deserves a public flogging!


  16. The man is so out-of-touch. I am 66 years old, now retired, and I had an attitude when I first started to read and join in on the forums and blogs in cyberspace.

    I am a person who stuck with my profession (school-teaching) for nearly 40 years, and I re-trained myself several times to anticipate the changes which were being forced on us.
    I still enjoy a good book, away from the computer screen, but to keep up-to-date the websites now provide all. Carl Moore should be citing some URLs, not books. Quoting from him, I think this is classic:

    “The information business is being transformed into the sheer noise of a hundred million bloggers all simultaneously talking about themselves.”

    Apart from the numbers, I think it describes beautifully what goes on in most rum-shops, therefore it describes exactly what we want to do! If some-one takes notice, all well and good, but at least we have a platform, to express our views, and not be told what to say by a bunch of sceptics (reference to his second book).

    I try to hold on to what I think is worth saving from times gone by, but I have learnt to work with the present times. It took me two minutes to find this link for instance, by Googling “blogs forums cyberspace criticism” (or something like that).

    http://theory.isthereason.com/?p=1502

    Mr. Moore, in 2002 you say you got into this cyberspace business, which is at the same time as myself. As a journalist, you should be running your own blog by now, not wasting your time writing for the dead tree press.


  17. How do you stay anonymous and talk about yourself?

    “The information business is being transformed into the sheer noise of a hundred million bloggers all simultaneously talking about themselves.”

    What a letdown.

    Anyway he has admitted that he isn’t giving away any more bananas which is to mind mind admitting he is a windbag.

    He had his moment in time.


  18. Good morning John.

    permres // May 4, 2008 at 10:08 am
    Mr. Moore, in 2002 you say you got into this cyberspace business, which is at the same time as myself. As a journalist, you should be running your own blog by now, not wasting your time writing for the dead tree press.
    ===============================

    permres : Go to the nationnews online, search for Carl Moore, and you will see from the quality of his articles, he wouldn’t survive blogging.

    Just two of his predictions:

    May 25, 2007:
    Chris Gayle, as spokesman for the West Indies cricket team, will be as injudicious with his mouth as he is with his bat.
    ———————————————–
    January 16, 2006
    DLP will have to splinter; I SEE only one way out of the present problems of the Democratic Labour Party: splinter off into two separate political organisations.


  19. Morning Adrian

    I agree.

    It is all about floating extreme positions to appear different from everybody else.

    In the dead tree edition where responses can be cut and most people do not have the time to enter debate, he will survive and in his own eyes appear a giant.

    He has a problem on the blogs where there is too much instantaneous and spontaneous diversity of opinion for an extreme position to survive if it hasn’t got merit.

    He should stick with the noise control.

    He has a point there which needs to be addressed and he can make a contribution and be different.

    I notice he no longer mentions the L word anymore as the worst thing someone could call him!!

    He must have read about its origins on the blogs. Maybe he does have Greek ancestry after all.

    If there is only one thing the blogs do it is educate. I think he would have to admit he was educated in the discourse even if he does so grudgingly.

    He now uses “child molester” as his bookend, a rather extreme apellation and not one in common use.

  20. Straight talk Avatar

    Far from quoting from “The Cult of the Amateur” he should be addressing the cult of the professional journalist as exercised in Barbados.

    No research, poor analysis and constant regurgitaion of verbatim press releases.

    If his claim to investigative journalistic fame is going to be the revelation of Obama’s lineage, he as usual will be four or five weeks behind the local blogs.

    Sorry to spoil your “scoop” Carl but just in case you missed it being reported by an amateur, Obama is 50% white, 43%Arab and a tad over 6% black ( thanks to his grandfather’s grandfather ).

    If your solution for making Barbados quieter is the enforced dumbing down of your percieved inferiors, you have already lost the battle.


  21. … maybe he should spend some time on Tiger Woods’ lineage.


  22. I believe Carl’s objective must be to get himself banned from the blogs so he can complain in the dead tree editions.

    His one simple position, which has merit, is that there should be more decorum in the discussion on the blogs.

    But it is concealed in the noise he creates and not discussed on its merits.

    I think that there is a reason for his approach, but he doesn’t realise that on the blogs there are quite a few smarter than even he believes himself to be.

    The blogs are a close approximation to the real world and there is no protected environment like there is in the local dead tree editions.

    We sink or swim based on the merit of our contribution which in many cases is namelessly made.

    Nice try Carl. I suspect readership of the blogs has soared with your intervention.

    Try reducing the noise level and lets discuss the signal, that is if you really want it discussed.


  23. Thank you John, and I fully endorse this sentiment:

    “His one simple position, which has merit, is that there should be more decorum in the discussion on the blogs. ”

    The freedom and license of the Internet is abused, I think. It is not an RL conversation, and everything we type is recorded just like the printed media. In a well-regulated/moderated forum or blog, this problem is addressed.

    If we do not like the way a particular site is run, then we simply leave. Well, that is my experience, anyway.


  24. Just for the record…

    I would like to point out that in his latest missive published in our Gated Fourth Estate, Mr. Moore claims “I accurately predicted that [the Blogs] would reproduce my column in its entirety…”

    I could be corrected on this point (there are several Blogs, after all), but to the best of my knowledge Mr. Moore’s language was never reproduced. There’s this wonderful thing called a hyper-link, and some (but, significantly, not all) of what’s printed on dead trees here is available online.

    And while I’m radiating… Mr. Moore: I don’t know why you seem to feel you can claim “I was one of the first Barbadian bloggers in 2002”. Can you provide a link to any of your online blogging language circa 2002? A link via the “Way Back Machine” would suffice, if necessary.

    For context, I’m quite sure a great many of us (or is it we?) predate you; for example, yours truly was first involved in this form of communications starting in 1986. At the time, it was the Bulletin Board System (BBS) scene — users would take turns dialing up to a modem at a phone number at 300 baud. Ahh, the memories….

    How old we are; how long we’ve been doing this — all immaterial. What matters is what we’re doing, saying, and *achieving*, here and now.

    Kindest regards to all.


  25. Chris Halsall // May 4, 2008 at 7:43 pm

    Just for the record…

    I would like to point out that in his latest missive published in our Gated Fourth Estate, Mr. Moore claims “I accurately predicted that [the Blogs] would reproduce my column in its entirety…”

    I could be corrected on this point (there are several Blogs, after all), but to the best of my knowledge Mr. Moore’s language was never reproduced. There’s this wonderful thing called a hyper-link, and some (but, significantly, not all) of what’s printed on dead trees here is available online.
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    Perhaps the Editor at the Nation will correct this possible factual inaccuracy in Carl’s article today so it cannot be accused of misleading the public.

    Based on his statement, the public might flock to the Blogs to read his article and bring the whole Internet down.

    Carl should really have been more specific about which blogs reproduced his article in its entirety because alot of time will be spent searching.

    Maybe a blogger copied it in verbatim in one of the over 100 comments but then he should correctly have given credit to the particular blogger to avoid hurting the feelings of that blogger.

    Hopefully the Editor of the Nation will get to the bottom of this and act in accordance with the Nation’s stated policy of being accurate!!

    Maybe the Nation needs to state which blogs reprodced its article so there can be no doubt and the public can check.

    We can’t have the public going around depending on the accuracy of Carl’s predictions made in the leading daily Newspaper as his interpretation of them coming to pass may very well be flawed.


  26. Poor Carl. Look who delivering the licks, lol.


  27. Does anyone remember a blogger called BGR?

    What sort of positions were routinely taken by this blogger?

    There are two comments in this thread which seem strange.

    I am a bit leary about following the link given to presumably another blog called bimchat to see if Carl’s article is published there in its entirety.

    Can anyone say which blogs published Carl’s article in its entirety?

    At the moment, BGR seems to be the best example I can find of any evidence of the publication of Carl’s article.

    Carl, can you enlighten us on the blogs to which you refer?


  28. I really cannot believe that so many persons would continue to argue about a position held by a man who admits to having Ossie Moore’s DNA…


  29. Bush tea this blog has attracted many comments because of what Moore represents. He represents many things which the blogs are fighting against. There is a comfort level practiced by by our senior journalist which is disgusting. Someone suggested that many of the retired journalist should start a blog or used the blogs to agitate against injustices which they are very much aware. Instead they prefer to sit on their patios and read a book thinking that their job is done.

    We are reminded of Nasser’s position, many Barbadians have failed education.


  30. Yes, David, and what I find depressing is that the Nation should give such a prominent place for his piece in the Sunday Sun, and he gets paid for it.

    The big problem at the moment is, I guess, that most people do not have easy access to a computer, so the daily paper and the radio/TV are still their only means of trying to keep informed.

    As a young radical in the UK we would give out flyers in the shopping areas, until we were moved on by the police when the contents were too revolutionary!


  31. Anybody discussed anything with BGR before this thread or should we welcome this new blogger to our fold officially?

    Carl probably won’t be back in any hurry and we’ll probably never find out which blogs carried his article verbatim.

    Doubt very much the Nation will seek to clarify the ststement he made, c’est la vie!!

    Perhaps we might see alot more of BGR in the future to make up for Carl’s absence.


  32. Dear friends:

    Nearly all of you are right: I am a failure. I have failed, over the past few weeks, to engage you in what I thought would’ve been a simple, straightforward analysis of this new and powerful vehicle for human expression known as the Internet.

    I wanted to hear you discuss its strengths, its drawbacks and its potential for improving the human condition.

    Instead, you’ve chosen to become personal; to attack Carl Moore, a flawed human being like yourselves, with a thousand and one faults.

    Before I go, let me thank you for your varied responses, angry and bitter as most have been. I learned a lot from you, not the least of which is how complex, yet fascinating, is the English language.

    If I could be so presumptuous, let me recommend what I consider to be one of the most intellectually stimulating websites. It is http://www.aldaily.com, a veritable buffet of ideas, criticism, philosphy, breakthroughs … everything.

    I will now therefore take my leave and wish you success in your efforts in making sense of the great privilege of living in these fascinating times.

    You will find your daily discourse much more rewarding and valuable if you can avoid discussing people and concentrating on ideas. Nothing is more exciting to me than a new idea; the more “outrageous”, the more I’m attracted to it.

    Bye now.


  33. Schuupppssseee. You could have contributed in your own way just like the rest of us, but no, you had to ride in on your elitist horse barking orders, giving directives, issuing insults and disparaging remarks. As a result of this, i have decided to ignore all that you have offered.


  34. Mr. Moore I am delighted that our status has improved and that we are now being addressed, and thought of as “friends” and not quadrupeds.

    However I am wary, as a certain fellow in an address once started: “Friends”, Romans countrymen”… you know the story, I will leave it at that.

    There has been improvement, there is a change in behaviour, we must all rub along.


  35. Carl Moore wrote: “I have failed, over the past few weeks, to engage you in what I thought would’ve been a simple, straightforward analysis of this new and powerful vehicle for human expression known as the Internet.

    With all due respect, kind sir, I personally have found that you are unwilling to discuss or respond to any of the substantial posts on this blog. Even those of us who have used our real names, and refrained from insult.

    Why is this? It is the standard practice in such unmoderated forums to ignore the noise, but to focus on, engage and debate valid points. Why do you seem to feel that because there are some participants who choose to anonymously make personal attacks upon others that the entire exercise is pointless?

    As I wrote above, the only reason the Barbados Blogs are successful is because they are fulfilling a need. Specifically, truly anyone can have a voice. If that voice brings value, it will be heard. There is no gatekeeper limiting what message is allowed to be radiated.

    Here in Barbados the traditional Fourth Estate is perceived as being too timid, too distracted, and too dependent upon advertising revenue. The “message” is filtered in a way that we, the consumer, are not comfortable with.

    Just about every serious international news agency have blogs directly integrated into their sites. Why isn’t that done here? Moderation is always possible (and, in my opinion, preferred).

    Just how long are you (read: the profession) going to continue to try to hold back water? Or are you (again, read: the profession) uncomfortable with serious debate with an educated and knowledgeable readership?


  36. Newspapers don’t talk back!!

  37. Adrian Hinds Avatar

    To those of you who find utility in Carl Moore’s ill-defined call for decorum, and decency, I have no intentions of being dictated too by your whims and fancy. If there is to be some form of guidelines to post here, I would rather the owner publisher display what such might be for all to see. My own opinion, one based on an online experience that supercedes those of many posters here is not to place to much emphasis on this one complaint.


  38. Adrian

    I agree.

    But if a blogger feels it is worth discussion, put it up, discuss it on its merits and see what comes of it, …maybe nothing, maybe something.

    I find more often than not the bloggers themselves are a self regulating community but sometimes there are extremes that the moderator needs to deal with.

    Most bloggers I see who have stuck on the few blogs I visit are concerned about their country and the direction it is heading and are for the most part sincere in offering suggestions and criticisms.

    It is easy to expose a blogger who is trying a con because all that is needed is to engage the blogger in conversation and see if they really have a position and belong in the discussion and just how sincere they really are.

    Sometimes some of the topics are emotive and the language can be excessive but that is how adults communicate in an informal setting.

    It is difficult to treat grown adults like children and not spoil what are really useful forums for discussion, interchange of ideas and which create pressure where many people feel it needs to created.

    … and then there is always the saying “sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me”.

    I continue to learn by being a part of the blogs. There is always a different, sometimes unexpected angle that comes to light.

    None of the newspapers can do that.

    Why they don’t start blogs which encourage these types of discussions just to get news, create pressure and get direction for their reporters I will never understand ….. I kind of have my own guesses!!


  39. Is this the Carl Moore of ‘Society for a Quieter Barbados’? – sorry to stray from the point being discussed.

    Sure is!

    David

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