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Barbados Underground (BU) welcomes the Barbados Today report about the George Payne v Edmund Hinkson: Storm Clouds Hovering Over MAM court matter even though it has come several days after we posted. The fact that Roy Morris (Chief Editor) and shareholders in the Barbados Today have chosen to expose one side; that of the plaintiff, and not the defendant is evidence of the stain which the traditional media continues to blot the media landscape of Barbados. BU is aware how matters before the Courts must be treated in the public domain. Given its public profile a media house can easily be joined by either side to a matter like this one. What it does not mean however is that ALL the facts should not be reported. In this case why not ensure that the Statement of Defence (SOD) is included in the report?

BU continues to find this matter intriguing but not for the reasons  political yardfowls on either side will show glee. There are the political ramifications of the court action by Payne for the Barbados Labour Party (BLP). Also, it gives BU the opportunity to explore a related issue associated with libel and slander which are now interchangeably referred to as defamation under the Act.

As we understand it, when we had the legal difference in Barbados between libel (written) and slander (spoken) libel was always actionable without proof of damage. On the other hand with slander one had to prove damage except in a few instances, one of which was imputing criminal offense.  As far as BU is concerned the Payne v Hinkson matter falls into the category of slander actionable. Based on the Barbados Today report it is also alleged that the allegations were published which brings libel into play (no details available).  The legal people will see this as a moot point because the distinction between libel and slander have been removed in the Defamation Act.

Why are we making a big deal of the distinction?

In cases where damages were awarded based on slander the quantum of the damages was dependent on the number of persons who became party to the slanderous statement.  Invariably the awards were quite small. Libel to compare is published and obviously reaches many people which has the greater potential for larger awards. The legal eagles would described libel as something to be viewed as perpetual in this context.

A critique of the Defamation Act may force some interested spectators to ask the eminent jurist Sir David Simmons, who had oversight at the time, why craft the legislation that would ‘limit’ pay outs by media houses if libel was eventually proved?

The political dimension to this matter is equally as intriguing.

If Alair Sheperd QC was man enough to apologize for skinning his botsy at a female Judge, why not newbie Edmund Hinkson as a member of a BLP party looking to chart a new path behind the second coming of MAM?  Seem simple enough a matter to arbitrate, after all these are public figures who represent our government in waiting.

Obviously there is some political strategy playing out deep in the bowels of the Barbados Labour Party which will make for interesting theatre in the weeks to come. Has Hinkson agreed to be the rabbit to force Arthur’s hand much sooner than planned? As Payne sued to counter the Hinkson move? Has MAM decided once and for all to facilitate the bloodletting at this early stage to accrue time later for healing to take place?  If the Hinkson move has forced Payne to move sooner than plan it may mean MAM has the upper hand or has she? What will be the response to Hinkson’s behaviour? How influential are the elders in the BLP party? Will MAM be blamed given her legacy as leader to date? Will the hammer fall on the man of many hats whose legacy in parliament is likely to be recorded in invisible ink?  What about Payne’s sidekick Dale Marshall and Sutherland who appears to be someone being mentored by Payne. Is there an opportunity for the crossing of the floor?

Bottomline, whether Payne or Hinkson wins there is heavy collateral damage which the BLP Battleship is likely to take on. Will MAM call it quits? Will another  leader emerge? Why are we not discussing these issues given the importance of a strong Opposition in our system of government? We all saw what a decimated Opposition caused by the ruckus between Mascoll and Thompson did to the Democratic Labour Party. At a time when BU and others have been asking the political parties to foster a esprit de corps we have this BS.

We look forward to the Hinkson view filed on this matter.

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  1. Adrian Hinds Avatar

    Really now! Do we really believe that Payne lost his ministry for writing to or cussing David Thompson? There is likely to be something more; and Hinkson seems tuh know what. Does MAM have Payne right were she wants him? 🙂 could be. 🙂

    Some person wrote the following on BarbadosToday.
    mickey May 5, 2013 at 2:17 pm

    Payne is so unlucky.He got fired for allegedly using government stationery to write to the leader of the opposition (David Thompson) He suffered with parliamentary laryngitis for nearly 10 years ,and now he has seemingly recovered he is being called a “crook and a criminal”.All this after the ministry he was in charge of handed Al Barrack a contract (without a even the slightest hint of scandal mind you)to build that building in warrens .Gosh, I wanted to say so much more but my tongue is starting to hurt my cheek.


  2. @Adrian

    Like you some are not ready to dismiss Hinkson yet. We are hoping Hinkson’s SOD will be ‘revealing’ and be a gamechanger in politics in Barbados. Maybe naive thinking but we will see.


  3. If we are talking about suing, didn’t David Estwick sue the Nation newspaper over the E11 business? Status?

    Didn’t Arthur sue Sinckler for suggesting he said the BLP would send home 10,000 public servants? Status

    Many more law suits which always seem to disappear from the radar after a while.


  4. If there was the authority to recall members of parliament these guys would think twice about making asses of the taxpayers and our governance system.

  5. Carson C. Cadogan Avatar
    Carson C. Cadogan

    Is this the same Pain who told ADRIAN LOVERIDGE that he is not indigenous enough to represent hotels in Barbados or words to that effect?

  6. Carson C. Cadogan Avatar
    Carson C. Cadogan

    Let the men fight. It is their right.

    You all are trying to deprive me of a ring side seat. This is classic BLP stuff, cannibalization at its best. DAVID is doing his utmost at damage control.

    One thing that I cant understand, why does the truth bother people so?

  7. Gabriel Tackle Avatar
    Gabriel Tackle

    This is all about political and power posturing.The banter took place in a private meeting and should have been settled on the spot by MAM once she was elected leader.One is therefore left to conclude that MAM has demonstrated incompetence in not snuffing out the parties’ differences.
    My view is that the Parties’ seniors such as Sir Henry,Sir Louis,Sir Richard,Dame Patricia, inter aux,should meet with the offending parties to resolve the tiff out of the public domain,since I agree with David of BU that the BLP continues to represent the trust and aspirations of a large segment of this country Barbados and this issue might sully the image of the party.


  8. @Gabriel Tackle

    If Sir Richard is representing GWP what elders what!?!

  9. Carson C. Cadogan Avatar
    Carson C. Cadogan

    Soon after Pain made his now famous “indigenous” remarks about ADRIAN LOVERIDGE, Seethru removed him from his post and the two of them cuss each other stink.

    Following that he sat in the house Assembly for nearly ten years without saying a single word.

    I guess that he felt that Hinkson should have remained silent just like he did for nearly ten years.

  10. Adrian Hinds Avatar

    David, I don’t think this is intended to be a game changer of the sort you or I may want. I see MAM’s hand in this; she simply cannot afford for Payne to remain at large and in charge and risk a repeat of the activity that saw her losing the LOTO in the past. He must be weakened, must be made to realize that he will not have an easy go at it this time around. Now if he decides to continue with this Lawsuit, MAM and her proxy Hinckson will have to up the ante and call his bluff and let known what may have been thought to be dead and forgotten.

  11. Carson C. Cadogan Avatar
    Carson C. Cadogan

    I am at painS wondering when Barrack gets his coppers who is he going to share them with.

  12. Adrian Hinds Avatar

    But Gabriel Tackle, who is to say that the BLP seniors AKA the elders don’t have a hand in Hinkson’s fight with Payne? Remember that the BLP Elders for the most part where with MAM in the fight for LOTO when Owen emerge as the winner. Also, how could this group have any love for Payne? He dismissed them out of hand when they suggested that they should have a say in resolving the then leadership issue; Payne famously said “there is no group known as the elders recognize in the general laws of the party. He denied their existence, did not want MAM who was their preferred choice, so I am convince that there are many more than Hinkson in this fight to silence Payne.

  13. Gabriel Tackle Avatar
    Gabriel Tackle

    @David
    @Adrian
    A conundrum indeed.I don’t see GWP backing off short of an apology and Hinkson vows to defend his position.Five more years in the wilderness seem likely.


  14. Some of you have become so high falutin you pretend you do not understand the mentality of the average Bajan.
    They will believe Hinkson.

    Quite frankly the party should discipline Hinkson if he said what he is reported to have said…….unless he can provide “evidence”

    Barbados is a democracy and needs a strong opposition in parliament.


  15. @Edmund Hinkson

    Here is another angle. BU has received two submissions from Edmund Hinkson in the lead up to the last general election which were posted and we therefore assume that he follows BU.

    Mr. Hinkson BU has made the assumption based on your incendiary response to the Sunday Sun and – quoted by commenter “lawyer” – that you have hard evidence to back up your defense.

    Here is the thing. Even at this late stage we know that the two lawyers representing the two sides Messrs Cheltenham and Smith can meet to resolve the matter. Of course you (Hinkson) would have to settle cost incurred to this point most likely. Why would you Hinkson not do such if your case is weak?

    Why the hell make statements if you can’t back up knowing that GWP is a mercurial character, is rich and is a Kingmaker in the party (read gang of 5) and doesn’t give two craps?


  16. @Edmund Hinkson

    Here is another point to consider. If you have had evidence that Payne committed a criminal act are you not guilty as well? Of withholding said info/evidence? What this means is that even if you win your case both you and the man of many hats would be open to prosecution? (correct BU lawyer please?). If as BU and other believe that other BLPites maybe complicit does this not raise the political stakes for the BLP given the narrow margin at play in the House?

    The ignorance here has no bound.


  17. @ David
    A man is under no obligation to VOLUNTARILY give evidence of anything ; mere knowledge of wrongdoing does not bring guilt with it ; If on the other hand Hinkson was an accomplice in what he accused Payne of then that is a different matter ; he would be equally as culpable . However the pleading does not suggest any complicity on his part ; it appears to be a naked case of Hinkson going after Payne . That is why I say he must have a cast iron case based on the TRUTH of his accusations or else HE IS IN REAL TROUBLE. Hinkson should be rushing to an out-of-court settlement if Payne is amenable to one.


  18. What am I seeing David is passionately positing reasons why Payne and Hinckson ought to settle their deep rooted differences out of court? David correct me if I’m wrong but Ive never seen this magnanimous behaviour from you towards the DLP? How come?

    As a neutral I would like the matter in court so citizens can hear full details from both sides and be in a position to make informed decisions. Both men have rights to argue their cases under our democracy. Let them do so in court.

    To the DLP please stay out of this matter. There should be disciplined silence from the Dees. This is a BLP internal crisis let them battle it out themsevles. No need for MOF to be on Wickham’s program to be tricked by Wickham into easing the pressure on Owen when he said BLP will privatise the social services. That intervention by MOF hurt the Dems.

    Let Payne and Hinckson fight it out. Mia is caught between a very hard rock and a very hard place. Owen in the garden smiling.

  19. Carson C. Cadogan Avatar
    Carson C. Cadogan

    DAVID

    You fighting TOOTH AND NAIL to keep this out of the Public domain.

    However I am backing Hinkson, he is no Jackass as you are implying he knows what he is talking about and he said THAT HE CAN BACK UP ALL OF HIS WORDS. Why should he pay costs? His pockets are deeper than the other fella own?

    You are a STRANGE person, on one of your Threads you are trying desperately to get DAVID WEEKS to sue the Geriatric hospital. No mention of costs if he looses the case, but on this thread you are trying desperately to get pain not to sue and warning Hinkson about “costs”.

    DAVID, strange person indeed, reminds me of another strange person on this blog called PRODIGAL SON.

  20. Carson C. Cadogan Avatar
    Carson C. Cadogan

    DAMAGE CONTROL in full effect by DAVID the blog owner.

    You would never see that coming from him if it was the Democratic Labour Party.

    DAVID would be throwing gasoline on the fire!!!!!!!


  21. Here on this Monday morn “David” a non lawyer giving legal advice to a lawyer echoing “now is the time for all good men to come to the aid of their Party” notwithstanding the fact that the lawyer is all lawyered up.

    No one (at least anyone I know) likes to be embarrassed and humiliated, now that the embarrassment and humiliation has been magnified by its exposure in the media and likely to be repeated by all the denizens of rum shops and “sotto voce” by those at the elegant receptions which Mr. Payne frequents and hosts, some abject grovelling is going to be demanded.

    Politics in Barbados is always good for a laugh, when you think you’ve seen and heard everything there is always another surprise around the corner so I am waiting for the next shoe to drop.

  22. Carson C. Cadogan Avatar
    Carson C. Cadogan

    DAVID

    Blog owner, “fair”, “non partisan”, “neither B nor D”, “impartial”, “unbiased”, “objective”, “dispassionate”, “equitable”, and all the other nice lies he likes to use.

    HAHAHAHA

    Everyone is seeing your slip, DAVID!! How do you plan to live down this one???


  23. @Sargeant

    Can you say with certainty?

  24. old onion bags Avatar
    old onion bags

    Now you all see what I mean about dog fleas and fowl lice…..how they like the cellar…run and bite ya and den ..off to stick their noses in what they kno nuttin off…..PUMP FLIT CAN time boi…..bring D Sheltox


  25. Of course humiliation and embarrassment is par for de course for some people as de old people say ‘dey aint got no shame”,dem must be slow learners who get into skule thru de back door.


  26. Is there no way that the monthly salaries, from taxpayers, of these two jackass MPs can be put on hold until they settle their catfight?……..i believe it is fundamentally unfair for them to be leeching off the taxpayers while playing out their little drama, they may well use taxpayers funds in their brawl………sick of these creeps.


  27. @David
    If you had the interest of this country at heart and were willing to put country first, you would never try to deprive the people of Barbados from possibly knowing whether or not a sitting MP is indeed a criminal and a tief, This defamation issue is now a national issue and the people of Barbados have a right to hear the facts related to this case!

  28. Carson C. Cadogan Avatar
    Carson C. Cadogan

    Oilman

    This is the same person who is always calling for “Integrity Legislation”.


  29. @Carson C. Cadogan
    I get the impression that some power somewhere tell David he got to mek this blog a BLP safe house. This ent de same David I used to follow years gone by.


  30. David

    Why are you fighting so hard to protect Payne? Hinkson must know Payne quite well so why not just wait for the litigation to take its course and see who is guilty of what, if anything?

    The fact is that Payne is now widely believed (as a result of the publicity of the litigation) to possibly have some skeletons in his closet. Everyone involved, save and except Mia, looses, Payne looses, Hinkson looses and the BLP looses.


  31. David

    This is just a orchestrated attack on the gang of 5. Each of the 5 can expect to be attacked within the coming months so as to ensure none of them can rival Mia again for leadership of the party.


  32. Which is it? Is BU defending Hinkson or Payne?

    As always continue to share your opinions the BU household will do the same.


  33. The taxpayer is losing………..paying the monthly MP salaries of these two lawyers…………

  34. Carson C. Cadogan Avatar
    Carson C. Cadogan

    Skeete

    “This is just a orchestrated attack on the gang of 5”

    What foolishness you talking?

    Is it not a member of the gang of 5 who started Legal proceeding?

  35. Carson C. Cadogan Avatar
    Carson C. Cadogan

    Even if a scorched earth policy is being used by Mia, I support her one hundred percent.

    She is doing what she has to do. Only an idiot would allow lightning to strike her twice.

    Get rid of them Mia.

  36. Carson C. Cadogan Avatar
    Carson C. Cadogan

    OILMAN

    “This ent de same David I used to follow years gone by.”

    I AM GLAD THAT SOMEONE ELSE RECOGNISE IT BESIDES ME.

  37. Carson C. Cadogan Avatar
    Carson C. Cadogan

    DAVID is defending the Barbados Labour Party.

  38. Carson C. Cadogan Avatar
    Carson C. Cadogan

    Who will be called as witnesses in the case?


  39. BU understands that Hinkson must file his acknowledgement no later than today. Naturally the SOD must follow 14 days later. Will continue to keep following the buzz and bring it as we get it.


  40. This is for some on this blog. BU’s position is clear and has been painted such above. If Hinkson has a solid case against Payne BU is the first to say go to court, we want to hear it. If Hinkson’s position is rant and bluster and emotional bullshit, what is the point burdening an already overloaded court system? Such a position fits snugly with BU’s position regarding the court system anyway. If Hinkson knows he has no case be a man and apologize if Payne is willing to accept and eat humble pie like a man. Now what is wrong with such a position?


  41. @lawyer

    Point taken on an individual’s obligation to report criminal activity. How do you respond to the point that Hinkson having been elected to the highest court in the land has a responsibility to the electorate of Barbados IF he is privy to such info? Wouldn’t this be a ‘betrayal’?


  42. To the politically motivated:

    It is obvious this is a matter which DLPITES Will want to exploit. Nothing wrong with it at all. The BLP did same when Thompson and Mascoll were going at it.

  43. Adrian Hinds Avatar

    But David why you would want to call out a new boy like Hinkson for something that the old boys and women haven’t set the example for him to follow? What responsibility to the electorate what? Since Bree once said ” No man is bigger than the party,” have you seen anything to disprove it?


  44. @Adrian

    The point is if this is about a rush of blood by Hinkson what will be the point going to court? When we read his SOD in less than 14 days we will know. BU wants him to have a good case but based on what we have been hearing he will have to pull something out of the hat.


  45. “What soberness conceals, drunkenness reveals.”

  46. Carson C. Cadogan Avatar
    Carson C. Cadogan

    DAVID

    I have never seen you extend such courtesies to the Democratic Labour Party.

  47. Carson C. Cadogan Avatar
    Carson C. Cadogan

    “BU understands that Hinkson must file his acknowledgement no later than today”

    So this is why DAVID was on a crusade today to get hinkson to forget about it.


  48. David wrote “It is obvious this is a matter which DLPITES Will want to exploit.”

    What about the opposing factions within the BLP?

    Anyway in 5 years it will all be forgotten.


  49. The saga continues.

    Mia is one smart women. Someone said “scorched earth policy”. Now, that’s a good one.

  50. Let them know Avatar
    Let them know

    I am struggling with dealing with these two jokers as neither is clean, cast your minds back to the pre nomination process where Payne and Skeete in an effort to gain the nomination over Hinkson they distributed a 36 item document with all the reasons why Hinkson was unfit to be selected by the BLP as its candidate in the 2013 Election included in that list was the reason that he associates with Jamaician young prostitutes.
    To me neither is fit or decent to be in the Lower House of Barbados.

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