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Time To Get Real

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Submitted by St George’s Dragon

David Cameron, UK Prime Minister (l) Hillary Clinton, US Secretary of State

The recent debate about gay rights started with the UK Prime Minister saying that in future some UK aid would be linked to adherence to “proper human rights”. His statement was related to one of the recommendations of a Commonwealth report which recommended ending bans on homosexuality.

The UK’s stance has not been well received in Barbados but it is important to note that despite the uproar, this is only peripherally aimed at us.

This for two reasons:

– Most importantly, we do not receive any aid which will be subject to these criteria. Please note this well. We receive no money from the UK which is at risk because the UK Government has decided to bring in these rules. It is therefore a complete non-issue for Barbados.

– The policy is aimed more at States which ban homosexuality completely. See for instance Uganda’s proposal for an “offence of homosexuality” which would normally make any homosexuality carry a penalty of life imprisonment. This would be increased to a death sentence if the offender was HIV positive.

But make no mistake; the pressure will continue to mount.

As an example. Hillary Clinton has just made a speech at the United Nations in Geneva, where she said that US Government Agencies will now “consider gay rights when making aid…… decisions”.

With the USA taking this position, we have to recognise that the game is really starting to change across the world.

You can say its colonial pressure; you can argue the Biblical interpretation; you can debate the morality. What is clear is that in the near future, if we want to continue receiving international aid and loans, we will have to review our laws.

The by-product might be that Barbados will be a more tolerant place.

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152 responses to “Time To Get Real”

  1. Caswell Franklyn Avatar
    Caswell Franklyn

    What you are really saying is that Barbados is for sale to anybody that gives us aid, and that we must accept any perversion if we want their money. Mind you this has been happening for as long as I could remember, the difference is they are now bold enough to actually come out and say it. I am prepared to accept homosexuality as normal when two of those perverts produce offspring and the “shemale” go into a delivery room at QEH and squeeze the baby out. Good luck!

  2. The Doc Avatar
    The Doc

    We’re being idiotic.

    Our current laws are a relic from colonial times. We got these laws from other people in the first place.

    Let’s not pretend that they represent some sort of native Caribbean perfection.

    If we really want to have our laws represent the religious makeup of our country, we can certainly draft laws that do so, while taking current human rights standards into account.

    Our current refusal to budge is both backwards and idiotic. If we want to legislate morality, let’s at least do so with modern laws that don’t make us look like idiots and leave us vulnerable to international sanction.

  3. ac Avatar
    ac

    DOC””We are being idiotic”

    So whats new. I would have been surprised if i heard differently on this subject from the literate educated more intelligent than any one Barbadian who is always quick to remind others about”If the shoe was on the other foot” or “what if you were in that persons place” Some how all of those rationalities flys out the window when dealing with human rights of the homosexual. On this one the show no mercy!

  4. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ ac | December 7, 2011 at 10:55 PM |
    “Some how all of those rationalities flys out the window when dealing with human rights of the homosexual. On this one the show no mercy!”

    So what are yo saying here? That homosexuals have no human rights that should be respected and afforded just like any other minority group in the society?
    We are not sure of your stance. We know Caswell’s and we know Sir Eroll’s. But what is yours? Are you for them having rights to practise their sexual orientation in a consensual and private way or do you want to see them treated like the Ugandan counterparts?
    Just asking for clarification!

  5. ac Avatar
    ac

    well to clarify “Some how all of those irrational rationalities flys out the windowwhen dealing with human rights of the homosexual.

  6. Caswell Franklyn Avatar
    Caswell Franklyn

    Homosexuality has the potential of destroying a society. If enough men practice this vile behaviour the birth rate would decline until it reaches a point where the society would no longer be viable. Already the birth rate in Barbados is declining. National Insurance has made adjustments to its conditions and rate of pension to take into account this declining birth rate. Fiddling with the retirement age is not the way to fix that problem. The only way to reverse a declining birth rate is to breed and I don’t see two bullers doing so.

    The only problem with increasing the birth rate is that Government would have to plan and provide employment or create the environment for the private sector to provide jobs in a 18 years. So far both political parties have fallen down in that regard since the only thing that they come up with for the youth is football competitions.

    Human right my foot! How can you have a right to destroy your society. If I were a religious man, I would say that this nonsense about human rights is the work of Satan, and he sure is recruiting many followers.

  7. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ Caswell Franklyn | December 8, 2011 at 12:05 AM |
    “The only way to reverse a declining birth rate is to breed and I don’t see two bullers doing so.”

    Where are your “equal opportunities” credentials. You might be” anti-man” but not “anti-woman” too.
    What about lesbians? Or they can go to the sperm bank?
    To be serious, though Caswell, you keep overlooking a major problem with the declining rate of population replacement in Barbados.
    First, there is a fairly high incidence of low reproduction among university educated and professional females in Barbados. May so-called career women don’t have children or are not in stable long-term relationships.
    There is also a high use of condoms among the young in their most “fertile” reproductive years. This is not a bad thing since it helps reduce the incidence of aids among heterosexuals who are not in stable long-term relationships. But rubber barriers mean very low rates of sperm meeting egg to unite and divide in little “caswells” and” cathys” or even “casthllyns”.
    Low reproductive rates are not a problem among people of East Indian background especially of the Islamic religion. It is a problem among educated blacks (mainly females who seldom have reproductive sexual intercourse with men beneath their educational and social standing) and whites generally.

  8. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    What exactly do the local Camerons and the Sir Errols want?
    Who has been prosecuted in Barbados for homosexuality? Who has been denied any human right? What legal right has been denied?

    The Bushman is tempted to think that some doth protest too much. Almost as though they are seeking ‘approval’ rather than justice.

    How can this be a problem when so many who clearly are of this persuasion have operated openly in all areas of our society?
    How can it be an issue when practically all of our young men walk around with their trousers below their backsides – A now universal sign of availability for homosexual pursuit?

    Man look! If you is “ONE”, just do what you have to do and accept the consequences if others disagree – like Christians, Muslims, drunkards, Paros, the physically challenged, and Chris Hassell all have to do on a daily basis…..AND STOP COMPLAINING.

    What legalize what?!
    This constant begging for approval only suggest a strong sense of guilt feelings and an instinctive knowledge that, diplomatically correct or not, Caswell is right…..

  9. David Avatar
    David

    It does not matter that many Bajans do not accept this as a human rights issue – what matters is that the Gay Movement commands the support of the most powerful governments in the world. Woe betide anyone who would stand in the way.

  10. imf-keep-17.5-vat/ Avatar
    imf-keep-17.5-vat/

    http://www.nationnews.com/articles/view/imf-keep-17.5-vat/

  11. balance Avatar
    balance

    miller ‘bullers’ or homosexuals or gays as they are now referred to and ‘wickers’ or lesbians as the uninitiated like myself now know them to be have been accepted in barbados without fear of persecution from as long as i know myself and i am over sixty years. matter of fact persons categorised as having a penchant for what was referred to then as ‘sucking’ and not the socially correct word cunnilingtus were more harassed and stigmatised than ‘bullers’. i have quite a few friends who have been so inclined for reason or the other and have enjoyed their company in and out of each other’s homesw but i would not wish for my son to be homosexual just as i would not wish for him to be a thief which to my mind is a deviant and unnatural behaviour as well and it has nothing to do with the bible but i would not like him to miss out on the joys of a sexual encounter with a female or the joy of witnessing his female wife or girlfriend give birth to another human being. i empathise with my friends but i am not going to support same sex marriages or the right to adopt children. i do not see anything discriminatory in my stance.

  12. Sunshine Sunny Shine Avatar
    Sunshine Sunny Shine

    Call it what you like; Barbados is not in any position to take a stand against Britain or American on this ”Want Aid then change your Gay law” policy. If we had our own resources and was an industrious affluent island who was not dependent but more independent we could afford to blow our trumpets loud and say NO WAY JOSE to your homo policy Mr. England and North America. But we are a dependent nation and need aid to help us build and grow our fragile economy. It only takes one bulletin of negativity to disturb our very up and down tourist industry.

    Oh I understand some of the points made on the moral issue and the stances are admirable but the reality is…Britain and North America do not need us we need them. And so conformity to their stated policy is just around the next corner when the pressure is reverberated. Sorry but we will accept because we have more to lose than we stand to gain.

  13. David Avatar
    David

    Perhaps here is the opportunity for a group of countries which share a moral right position to come together in an economic/social partnership.

  14. ac Avatar
    ac

    Sorry to burst your bubble Caswell , Homosexuals men do contribute to the birth rate many of them have children with heterosexual as a matter of fact if genetics plays a role the probabilty of passing that gene to one its children is real.

  15. ac Avatar
    ac

    THE USA and UK do see the laws which some countries have against homosexuality as an hindrance in the fight against HIV. this should be of real concern to the moralist as we all know that living a lie can be detrimental to all.

  16. lemuel Avatar
    lemuel

    I am not getting into this conversation, but our laws are against “BUGGERY” not homosexuality. Next Britain shall be insisting that our tourism product be modified to allow big grown men to come to Barbados and have sex with little children and babies. On a recent raid of one of these sordid places in the USA they found mice greased up with men waiting to have sex with them. We are opening the pandora’s box.

  17. lemuel Avatar
    lemuel

    To Miller;
    Shall your friends when we have changed the buggery law be expecting to be allowed to open a “bathroom” in Barbados where men have anonymous sex with men by one poking his thing through a hole and the other backing back on it. They had to be closed in New York City.

  18. ac Avatar
    ac

    Call it what you want lemuel.same tune different lyrics.

  19. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ balance | December 8, 2011 at 5:54 AM |
    You ought to appreciate the difference between “legalising” an act and “decriminalising” an act.
    No one is pushing for the legalising of homosexuality. If that were so it would mean that people would have to obey the law and become a ‘homo’ or suffer whatever stupid penalties would be attached to such an idiotic act. And don’t tell us that such a law can’t be passed! The Law is an ass (no pun intended)! Remember that once the enslavement and trading of black people was “legal” in Barbados. Its more sophisticated manifestation in the form of Apartheid was only recently dismantled but still exists in subtle ways. Blacks own and control very little of the ‘commanding heights’ of the economy, thanks primarily to many discriminatory practices in the world of business and high finance.

    No one here is pushing for homosexuals to have the right to get ‘married’ although many are married but hiding in the closet on the low-down!
    There is very little justification in my view for them to be married. I don’t accept that the basis of “marriage” is love. If this were the case then two men or two women could be entitled to the same right as in “a man and woman’ loving relationship.
    Marriage is based on a commitment between a man and a woman to procreate and to raise children for the betterment of society by taking that direct vital responsibilities of economic maintenance and values inculcation off the community or the State. If people don’t to have or intend to have children there is no need to get married. They can still love each in a loving caring relationship. On this basis homosexual couples don’t have much of a leg to stand on and should settle for a civil partnership arrangement where other contractual rights (property, etc) can be protected.
    What enlightened people like Sir Errol are arguing is that the sexual acts between two “consenting” (emphasis here!) homosexuals in the privacy of their homes should not be circumscribed by the law as with the case of heterosexual couples.
    In other words “decriminalize” the consenting behaviour once it is practised in private.
    All other sexual deviance involving minors or non-consenting adults ought to be dealt with under the prevailing criminal laws as applicable to other members of society.
    If one objects to the practice of anal sex on the basis of hygiene or health that’s an enlightened position to take and I would support you 100%.
    And that is the line that “intelligent” people should be pursuing. Getting homosexual males to practice “safe” sexual activities to reduce the associated health risks. Homosexuality is a fact of life and has been with humans from “god knows when” and will be with us when this lot of living humans are converted to dust and ash.
    No one is pushing any homo agenda. Just recognising a legal constraint that is discriminatory and inhibiting a fight against a major threat to the country’s development in the form of AIDS. And don’t tell us that ‘AIDS’ is a “homo” disease because it would reinforce the concern about the high number of “low-downers” we have here in this little “paradise”.

    Now if you plan to respond, please respond in a “balance” and intellectual way, not with fulmination of moral rectitude and personal innuendo about other people’s sexual inclinations. We expect that from Caswell or lemuel because we know where they are coming from but from an acclaimed “balanced” person please don’t bend down so low.
    PS: What is your view about decrimialsing the smoking of marijuana and in the case of drinking alcohol? Just an offshoot! No need to respond!

  20. Caswell Franklyn Avatar
    Caswell Franklyn

    Miller
    I am not anti woman. I am not as prudish as you think. I am anti nasty unhygenic practices. I call it nasty when a man insert his penis in the anus of anybody and go in search for feces and E.coli. It sounds nasty when you put it like that doesn’t it? When I use the bathroom and a little fecal accidentally matter gets on my hand I wash my hand several times each time smelling to make sure that there are no tell tale signs on my fingers.

    To those of you who practice this aberrant behaviour what happens when your genitalia gets covered in feces. Then again don’t tell me my stomach is already turning. Nasty boy!

  21. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ lemuel | December 8, 2011 at 8:48 AM |
    “Shall your friends when we have changed the buggery law be expecting to be allowed to open a “bathroom” in Barbados where men have anonymous sex with men by one poking his thing through a hole and the other backing back on it. They had to be closed in New York City.”
    I don’t know what you are on about! I have no personal experience of those things neither do I care to know or experience such! You seem to have a very keen penchant for “investigating” these types of weird and excessively abnormal deviant sexual activities that could have perverted your imagination.
    Or are you informing us based on your closeted experience or brave anonymous visits to Greenwich Village.
    Read your contribution again and you ought to identify an underlying thread of confessional desire. Your priest can come in handy but you might have to make a monetary contribution for exorcising the “gay” demon.

  22. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ Caswell Franklyn | December 8, 2011 at 9:35 AM |
    Read my thread again and tell us if I personally support anal sex!
    Au contraire, I too am personally totally against it! On the fa(e)ce(s) of it, it is unhygienic and I agree with you. No argument here! Moreover, it sounds as if a measure of trauma and muscular violation are also involved. Another health risk! I am more of an oil donkey than a grease monkey (if you get my turn of phrase)!
    But where I beg to differ with you is the ‘forceful’ way you want to deal with an “abnormal” behavioural syndrome and health issue. In this so-called enlightened age we ought to employ more imaginative and productive methods to deal with this challenge than by any morally condemnatory or antiquated legal trap that has its origin in colonial control legal system by the same English you so clearly opposed for their intrusiveness into our ‘independently’ cultured crucible of morality and self-determination.
    Here I stand! Facing the opposite number! I trust you get the message!

  23. lemuel Avatar
    lemuel

    To Miller:
    Alright I shall concede to something; as we are talking about rights, I am willing to support the recognition of a gay relationship when accrued property or estate is involved. for it would be wrong for either partner’s family to turn up in the case of death to disadvantage the surviving partner. But You can not expect me to support and sanction the act of homosexuality or lesbianism. How did you know about greenwich village and those bathrooms. You must tell Father Blackett that a study clearly identified Roman Catholic males as the main users of these facilities.

  24. smooth chocolate Avatar
    smooth chocolate

    @The Doc | December 7, 2011 at 10:29 PM |
    “Our current laws are a relic from colonial times…Our current refusal to budge is both backwards and idiotic.”

    Adultery was and is still wrong. no one is debating that nor calling it backwards and idiotic. homosexual had it genesis around the same time as adultery. it was wrong in colonial times, from a religious perspective it was wrong and an abomination. Nothing has changed. 100 years from now it will still be wrong. the difference is and would be, is that man is hell bent on dictating God’s standards and God is determine that HE WILL NOT CHANGE. so bring all the laws to make a perversion accepted…it WILL NEVER be. when we face God and we will, adultery will still be a sin, homosexuality will still be a sin. Grown up. why should barbados succumb to anymore sexual filth, look around u, we are acting little more than beasts

  25. Christopher Halsall Avatar
    Christopher Halsall

    @BU.David: “Perhaps here is the opportunity for a group of countries which share a moral right position to come together in an economic/social partnership.

    Just for clarity…

    Do you mean right of center, or “correct”?

    In either case, within which moral context and framework?

  26. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ smooth chocolate | December 8, 2011 at 3:44 PM |

    So how come your god blessed Solomon making him the wisest man on Earth with a harem of 700 wives and 300 concubines? How about King David from whom Jesus descended (stem of Jesse and all that!) who sent a man to war to be killed so as to “get at” his wife?
    And there are many more “immoral” stories to be told!
    Forget about the Bible when it comes to morality for modern humans, for god’s sake!

  27. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ lemuel | December 8, 2011 at 1:53 PM |
    “But you cannot expect me to support and sanction the act of homosexuality or lesbianism.”
    Not for one moment do we expect you to sanction and support such an act.
    Neither do we expect some white people to accept that blacks are their equals in the sight of the law (I nearly said “lord”!) or for a white woman to marry a black man. Neither do we expect you to accept your daughter wanting to marry an unemployed socially challenged one-hand man on the block but with a third leg to stand on in the middle of the road. Neither do we expect you accept that your daughter can marry a Muslim man or a Muslim family to accept their daughter marrying your son. But discrimination based on race, ethnicity, gender, religion, cultural background, disability or sexual orientation should not be tolerated in a modern democratic society that boasts so much about education and Christian principles.
    Get where I am coming from?

  28. balance Avatar
    balance

    miller, i have no difficulty with your intellectual discourse/response other than to say that your view of my comment is not accurate and cannot be considered as homoswexual bashing. indeed, i was at pains to point out that i have homosexual friends with whom i socialise and while i empathise with their aberrations, i would not like my son to be so inclined. yes, i would legalise marijuana. it is my feeling that like any other product the profit through scarcity through prohibition is fuelling the drug trade. alcohol consumption is not a problem in barbados. you get drunk, puke, sleep it off and go again.there is no evidence to indicate that the few accidents we have in relation to the number of vehicles on the road are caused b excessive alcohol drinking.

  29. enuff Avatar
    enuff

    97% literacy = ability to read and ‘write’. Critical analysis/thinking, however, is another kettle of fish.

  30. Random Thoughts Avatar
    Random Thoughts

    Quoting balance” alcohol consumption is not a problem in barbados. you get drunk, puke, sleep it off and go again.there is no evidence to indicate that the few accidents we have in relation to the number of vehicles on the road are caused b excessive alcohol drinking.”
    You’re joking right?
    When you puke do you clean it up before falling asleep, or do you leave your STINKING VOMIT there to offend other members of the household. Or maybe you believe that other people enjoy cleaning up your puke.
    Excessive alcohol consumption in Barbados as elsewhere causes job loss as some people as still sleeping their drunkenness off when they should be on the job, and sometimes they lose a very good job or a very lucrative contract. Excessive alcohol consumption causes loss of production in the government service and the private sector.
    Excessive alcohol consumption in Barbados as elsewhere puts people in the psychiatric hospital, estranges excessive drinkers from families, damages livers, induces hypertension, heart disease, diabetes, and cancers. Excessive drinkers drive up the cost of health care because they are hospitalized more frequently and for longer periods. Excessive alcohol consumption drives up the cost of health insurance premiums, and of car insurance.
    We Bajans are so afraid of the truth that no government is willing to introduce breathylyzer testing. We prefer to believe the nonsense that Bajan physiology is so different from other people’s that we rarely become drunk, and that when we are drunk our judgement is not impaired. Drunk drivers maim and KILL people on the road in Barbados whether we want to believe it or not.
    Please balance tell me that your statement is a sick joke.

  31. Random Thoughts Avatar
    Random Thoughts

    Notso long ago an acquaintance of mine lost a job that was paying $115,000 per year.

    The cause? Too many Mondays spent sleeping off a stale drunk.

    School mates husband died at 39. The cause alcoholism.

    A relative’s son has permanently disabled 1 person, and killed another person in 2 different accidents while drunk on the road.

    Etc., etc. etc.

    All right here in this sweet Barbados. And I am sure that everyone on this blog knows of similar cases.

  32. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ Random Thoughts | December 8, 2011 at 8:07 PM |
    So you have identified the problems associated with alcohol consumption. Other than the introduction of the breathalyzer testing what measures would you recommend to curb this dangerous activity?
    Would you support the total ban on alcohol consumption (as is found in some Islamic countries)? How about closing down the rum industry altogether? Would these measures help in the eradication of the scourge?
    Does the smoking of cannabis have similar negative effects on human behaviour and health as the drinking of alcohol?
    Just asking!

  33. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ balance | December 8, 2011 at 6:53 PM |
    Apologies for misconstruing your “balanced” position on this highly controversial topic. But sometimes the scales might be in need of an adjustment to ensure they are in excellent working condition. Otherwise one might be weighed in the balance and found (not) wanting (lol!).
    You have to be rather “straight” in your choice of words when it comes to a topic like this. Otherwise ‘oddfellows’ like our ‘behind the scenes’ man lemuel or ‘forceful’ caswell might jump on your back just because you “empathise” with fellows who might show a little bendiness in their back arm when returning a stroke from an ‘odd’ couple game of tennis or trying to run out a bat(ty)sman from silly mid-on or backward square leg.
    Take it easy fellow, I am with you.

  34. David Avatar
    David

    @Chris

    Good question Chris.

    How does a society build the standards of morality it wants?

  35. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    Malawi has caved in to the pressures linking the removal of discriminatory homosexuality laws to the granting of Western Aid. Now here is one of the poorest country in Africa with one of the highest rates of AIDS in sub-Sahara Africa and a despotic, outrageously extravagantly-living leader with some of the most draconian anti-homosexual laws in a fast spreading ‘Christian business’ environment.
    But just to get their hands on the Western outstretched alms bowl to splurge on consumption they decided to “review’ (aka remove) laws discriminating against homos. What a climb down blaming pressure from its citizen for this volte face!

    The love of money is the root of all evil. The things politicians say and do for a vote or money beggar belief. The other boys will follow suit and Cammie and Bammie will smile from ear to arse.

  36. Random Thoughts Avatar
    Random Thoughts

    Quoting miller etc.

    Other than the introduction of the breathalyzer testing what measures would you recommend to curb this dangerous activity?

    No I would not ban alcohol, because alcohol bans do not work, since alcohol is so easy to make. I’ve made wine myself on more than one occasion. And contrary to popular belief alcohol is readily available in those Arab countries which ban the importation, manufacturing and sale of alcohol. Yeast, sugar, fruit, 3 common grocery items, as well as water and warmth are readily available so alcohol bans will not work in Barbados nor in Arabia although such bans may work in the high Arctic where it is often too cold to make alcohol.

    1. Introduce breathalyzers.

    2. Consistently enforce the law related to breathalyzers.

    3. Continuous education about the dangers of excessive alcohol consumption. This education would be directed particularly at young people so that fewer of them become problem drinkers. Public education programs do work in Barbados. The worked for contraception in the 1960’s; and they are working in the fight against HIV.

    4. Encourage people to use designated drivers, so that the drunk one doesn’t drive.

    5. Realistically tax alcohol so that the troubles caused by alcohol are paid for by those who manufacture, import, sell, and consume alcohol.

    6. I am sure that there a lot of people out there with good ideas, if only we can find the will to use them.

  37. Random Thoughts Avatar
    Random Thoughts

    Who is/was Bammie?

  38. Random Thoughts Avatar
    Random Thoughts

    1. Quoting The Doc December 7, 2011 at 10:29 p.m. “We’re being idiotic. Our current laws are a relic from colonial times. We got these laws from other people in the first place. Let’s not pretend that they represent some sort of native Caribbean perfection. Our current refusal to budge is both backwards and idiotic. If we want to legislate morality, let’s at least do so with modern laws that don’t make us look like idiots and leave us vulnerable to international sanction.”
    The doc is right. Caswell et. al. are wrong. I can’t add anything to what the doc has said.

  39. Random Thoughts Avatar
    Random Thoughts

    Miller etc. There are a certain % of people who should NEVER touch acohol or cannabis, because once they touch they move to excess and harm themselves and others.

    I too wish that it was not so.

  40. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ Random Thoughts | December 8, 2011 at 10:31 PM |

    Very practical and implementable suggestions. At least you did not support a ban. It did not work in bootleg prohibition 1920-30’s America with that hypocritical evangelical Temperance Movement. Neither are the religious laws of equally hypocritical Islamic caliphates adhered to when it comes to alcohol (an Arabic word in origin, BTW) consumption, albeit underground and “behind closed doors”.
    But do you think we are capable of policing this regimen of alcohol consumption within tolerable limits when it comes to driving on the roads?
    Look at the state of law enforcement when it comes to the PSVs!

    Bammie is rhyming slang pet name for Obama to rhyme with Cammie (or should I say “Clintie”).

  41. Random Thoughts Avatar
    Random Thoughts

    Quotinh millet etc. “But do you think we are capable of policing this regimen of alcohol consumption within tolerable limits when it comes to driving on the roads?”

    YES WE CAN.

    But will we?

  42. readydone Avatar
    readydone

    one question i havent got answered for a while now.

    is gay humman?

    i mean gay people willfully dont produce offspring, so can they be called hummans? tecnicaly?

  43. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ readydone | December 9, 2011 at 2:28 AM |
    “i mean gay people willfully dont produce offspring, so can they be called hummans? tecnicaly?”

    So what do you call those heterosexual “beings” who are sterile some of whom resort to infertility clinics for help or even try adoption as a last resort?
    Are you aware that many so-called non-human gay people (closeted or in the open) have offspring of their own? What about people who are born severely disabled either physically or mentally and cannot have offspring? These simple occurrences not only answer your query but also defeat your argument.
    BTW, nature has a way of building in certain redundancies in its procreation process. Natural infertility is a characteristic found not only in fauna (including humans) but also flora. The inability of the mule to reproduce is also an example of Nature’s way of genetically engineering a reproductive cul-de-sac.

    Can you imagine what the world population would be like if every human being “willfully” reproduce without any constraint-natural or otherwise?

  44. lemuel Avatar
    lemuel

    To Miller:
    What do you want me to say. You have your position ably assisted by Random Thoughts. I have my position that God, not me, shall never compromise on the acceptance of SODOMY as being a natural sexual act. Caswell has been very vivid in his description of that act so I have no need to repeat it. From Eve and Cain (not Hermann), man has been trying and struggling to tell the OWNER of this universe what to do and what he GOD should accept and what he should not accept, but that shall not happen. I can not condemn the person, but the act must be condemned. And I still remain a BIB BIG Sinner, but that has nothing to do with God’s standards for human life and existence, not the hairy fairy things you want me to believe. I do care how many priests David and you line up here from you tube. Sodomy will never be natural.

  45. lemuel Avatar
    lemuel

    To Miller:
    Please one can not speculate or extrapolate from a position of extremism, and that is what you are purposely doing here right now. This earth in its fullness can feed billions of people; we humans in our desire to extend and ingrain our greediness have decided that that must not be. The problem has little to do with how many people are on the earth; it has more to do with how we as human beings are facilitating the distribution of those natural resources on earth.

  46. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ lemuel | December 9, 2011 at 8:43 AM |

    Please, please lemmie, for once open your mind and don’t be so blinded by bigotry! No one is arguing that “sodomy” is natural. It is an abnormal sexually non-reproductive human activity and risky to the health of those who practice it. Whether is man in man or man in woman.
    Neither are we humans telling your god what to do or to accept.
    But we also know that “sodomy’ can never be as bad as killing your brother or having children from your own sister. If those behaviours were not acceptable in the sight of your god and he had punished the perpetrators as you would have him done as in the case of the inhabitants of Sodom you would not be walking on this “limitless” resources earth today to take a moral stance against people of different sexual leanings and behaviours or even of different religious persuasions that blatantly deny the divinity or even existence of your Jesus.

  47. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    For the human body to remain healthy, the various components must constantly reproduce. Every component of your body replaces itself in this way over time in order to maintain a healthy system.
    When certain cells malfunction and they lose the ability or tendency to reproduce themselves normally, we call that cancer – and the consequences for ongoing health of the whole body are well known.

    It is the same identical thing.

    Any society that supports and encourages the development of cancer can only expect one result.

    Some very vocal contributors to the discussion are very good at seeing the situation from the perspective of the unnatural cancer cells…. Fair enough – but only an idiot would allow the “cancer cells” themselves to make the decision as to how the problem should be treated.

    When BBE destroyed Sodom and Gamorrah it was a case of major surgery being performed to remove the tumor and restore system health. It is interesting to hear intelligent persons arguing a case of a need to respect and embrace a cancerous growth in our society, but maybe that represents advanced logic….
    Did Sir Mickey advise his cancer patients to respect their cancer cells and treat them like the normal cells – or did he recommend irradiation?

  48. lemuel Avatar
    lemuel

    To Miller:
    The first five books of the Bible are very clear on those practices you are outlining. They were never ACCEPTED By God. You are making an argument for God over looking heterosexual sins but condemning and destroying those for the homosexual sins. He God has been the same towards all sins, including King David’s sin of murder. King David was punished. But you need to read what Bush Tea said earlier.

  49. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ Bush Tea | December 9, 2011 at 9:17 AM |

    So tell us Bush Tea, what would you recommend that we do withthese cancerous and deviant cells in our society? Hit them with a dose of radiation from above thereby eliminating both bent and straight cells from the nuclear fall out. What about the other sick and unproductive cells in the society? The congenitally malformed, downs syndrome, blind and death, the prostitutes and single mothers with 7 children from 7 different fathers, the perennially unemployed unproductive lazy boys on the blocks, the resiivdist criminals at Dodds especially those who have committed serial rape, paedophilia and murder.

  50. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    millertheanunnaki | December 9, 2011 at 9:58 AM |
    ” …recidivistic criminals…. ” should read “recidivistic criminals”.

    But Bush Tea, do you think a good bush bath with some forgiveness from above might be a better and more “Christian” course of therapy to helping these unfortunate lost souls than the terminal (final) solution of Nazi proportions?

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