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@GP
“We’ve seen the argument from Scripture, the argument from history, now here’s the argument from eternity. ”
What argument from eternity what? Where you get that from the bible? The very book upon which there is no proof of anything and all the proof that it was written by the intelligensia of that fraternity?
More fear-mongering?
Some quotes for you; for what they are worth:
“The most powerful tool in the hand of the oppressor is the mind of the oppressed” – Stephen Biko
“If you have no critics you’ll likely have no success.” – Malcolm X
“Condemnation Without Investigation Is The Height Of Ignorance” – Albert Einstein
“Believing” without thinking is criminal” – unknown
“Each time a person stands up for an ideal, or acts to improve the lot of others they send forth a ripple of hope, and crossing each other from a million different centers of energy and daring, those ripples build a current that
can sweep down the mightiest walls of oppression and resistance.” – R.F.K.
“There Is No God Higher Than truth” – Gandhi.
Exegesis of 2 Peter 3:10
How will the day of the Lord come is a question that Peter answers in verse 10.
The day of the Lord is a technical term with which all believers and serious Bible students should be fully conversant.
It is an Old testament expression used first by Amos [5:18], the first of the writing prophets, and continuing down through the prophets.
It refers to a time of judgement that is coming upon the earth which starts at the onset of the tribulation, continues through the millenium to the great white throne judgement; it is a period in which God will certainly straighten out the affairs of this world.
This is a period of time onto which the world is hasting as a boat into a storm, or tornado, or typhoon at sea. God’s people are however promised that they will be spared the disasters of this period.
Since believers will not go through the tribulation, believers are not looking for the Lord’s coming as a thief, since for the believer the Lord’s coming is a comforting and blessed hope.
To prevent thieves from entering our homes, we lock and bolt the doors and use the additional protection of wrought iron burglar bars, to shut them out. Believers are not however trying to shut Jesus out; rather we want to open our hearts door and welcomes him in. We are looking for his appearing but not with fear as one does in anticipating burglars.
Jesus will however come swiftly secretly and suddenly for those who are unprepared for his advent as taught in this verse and in I Thessalonians 5:2-8.
Next Peter tells us that the heavens will pass away and be burned up. This is a most remarkable and relevant passage especially for this present hour, because it has silenced a lot of the more honest scoffers.
This verse once occasioned much laughter and mockery as the question was posed, “How can the world burn when most of the world is water .” It then seemed inconceivable to the scoffers that water could burn.
That criticism is now out of vogue with the discovery that water is composed of two very inflammable gases which burn most readily.
Based on the theory of the eternity of matter –a premise on which much of science was based until early this century, with the work on atomic theory by Bohr, Rutherford et al—the critics opined that this passage could not be fulfilled since matter was indestructible and eternal.
Whereas once the critics ridiculed this passage and humble sincere Bible scholars who had no answer of explanation, had to be quiet; now, believers have had the last laugh. Not only do we know that it can happen we also know how it can happen.
In verse 7 we are told that the earth as it exists has been stored up for fire and literally with fire; thus signifying that there are resident forces present in the world which could destroy it.
The concepts learned about chemical bonding which is the glue that keeps matter together, and the knowledge that most chemical reactions are exothermic– that is they give off heat proves the claims of this verse.
The effects of the release of the atomic bomb on Hiroshima and in experiments in the dessert in New Mexico, demonstrated conclusively how accurate a scientific statement this verse is, and how simply it was put 2000 years ago. It is just that man has finally now caught up with his Physical Chemistry homework!
In verse 10, “Noise” (Greek rhoizedon) is the word used for the swish of an arrow, the rush of wings, the splash of water the hiss of a serpent. This is a word from classical Greek and used by the poets such that the sound of the word carries its own meaning.
This word is used in the New Testament nowhere else and this specific sound implied is the best description of an exothermic chemical reaction and that of the sound of atomic explosion.
Next it is worthy of note the fact that the elements will be dissolved or melt or untied with fervent heat . The word “elements” refers to basic material, atoms, the building blocks of the universe. This word is used of putting building blocks in a row or series, or of the first steps of a child. It is that which is primary or foundational, that out of which a thing is made.
“Fervent heat” is energy. These descriptive words make us think of an atomic explosion.
Whereas we are not saying that atomic fission or atomic bombs is the way in which God will destroy the world that is, we are saying that God has revealed to us that this passage makes good sense and has simultaneously silenced the critics.
We can see both a logical and scientific way in which the world that is, can be destroyed . This verse is also saying that GOD will destroy the world— and not man.
Whereas man may have the chemical knowledge and power or potential to destroy the world HE SIMPLY DOES NOT HAVE THE PERMISSION.
All believers everywhere ought to know and understand that we are not to be looking or fearing atomic destruction from heaven, but we are to be looking for the LORD from heaven.
God’s people are not to be alarmed by current affairs, but be warmed or stirred up to the soon occurrence of the Lord’s coming, which we call the blessed hope. ( Titus 2:12)
Our final comment on this verse is that we need to recognize that it is coincident with the great white throne, and the heaven and the earth fleeing away as described in Revelation chapter 20.
In Revelation we are told what happens after the mighty conflagration foretold in this verse, whereas here we have described how and what produces the mighty conflagration.
Man’s infidel and carnal thought is that everything is so stable that it can never be moved. Man says mere materialism is the right thing. “Stop,” says Peter, “ Your resting upon, the eternal continuance of all things is a delusion, it is all going to be dissolved.
Everything on which the hopes of the flesh are founded will disappear for ever.
In the next verses, however he will encourage the believer today and the contemporary church to look by faith beyond the coming conflagration to the eternal state of bliss.
It is imperative to see that in verses 9 & 10 that Peter is making it clear that in spite of the delay in the fulfillment of His promise, and in spite of what scoffers might say, “the day of the Lord will come”, in which the heavens will pass away and the works of the earth will be burned up.
The apostle does not speak of the coming of the Lord for His saints, or of the appearing of the Lord with His saints; he speaks of “the day of the Lord ” that will be introduced by these great events.
It is the day when the Lord will be supreme on the earth and rule with a rod of iron, putting down all opposition to God with a strong hand.
This day is introduced by the appearing of the Lord, but will stretch on through the thousand years’ reign, finally introducing the eternal state by the last great intervention of God in judgment.
Then the whole face of nature will be altered, for “the elements shall melt with fervent heat” and all trace of the great works by which men have sought to glorify themselves through the ages will disappear, for “the works that are therein shall be burned up”.
The apostle takes up the language of prophetic Scriptures which, he has already told us, are as a light shining in a dark place (See Psalm 102: 26; Isaiah 34: 4, 66:22; Micah 1: 4; Zephaniah 3:8).
To complete this discussion on this verse I wish to quote from an online source which has put the truths of this verse very well in this summary “ But despite the merciful patience of God, the Day of the Lord will come! Having just been reminded that with the Lord “one day is as a thousand years” (v. 8), it is clearly possible to think of that Day as covering a lengthy period of time, and not a few brief days. Here Peter telescopes together events that other scriptures indicate cover perhaps as long as 1000 years, as he does also in Acts. 2:14-21.
The coming as a thief in the night is used by both Jesus and Paul to refer to the initial appearance of the Lord to take the church to be with himself (see Matt. 24:36-43, 1 Thess. 4:13-5:5, Rev. 3:3).
As a thief removes treasure from a house without the knowledge of its inhabitants, so the Lord will remove his church from the world. His presence (parousia) then continues on earth behind the scenes of judgment until his unveiling (apokalupsis) in power and great glory, when every eye will see him (Matt. 24:29-30, Rev. 1:7).
During that time the terrible predictions of the prophets concerning the darkening of the sun and moon, and the falling of the stars, will be fulfilled.
This is followed, according to many, by a thousand years of the righteous rule of Christ over the earth (judging evil with a rod of iron), and then occurs the event which Peter now describes—the destruction of the present heavens and earth.
It would be as previously stated, by fire. The structure (Gk. stoichea) of the universe would melt and the present civilization of men would disappear. This would complete the predictions of the prophets concerning the Day of the Lord. ”
Exegesis of 2 Peter 3:11 & 12
Since all these things are to be destroyed in this way, what sort of people ought we to be in holy conduct and godliness in light of His coming is the challenge of this verse.
In view of these inevitable facts of the future, the lives of believers now should become serious and important. We ought to exhibit a powerful testimony characterized by right living.
If we as Christians are to have a powerful testimony before the world, we have to take seriously the call to right living. We must take seriously the call to be holy in our conduct and to be godly in our attitudes.
We must show by our lives that we really believe Jesus were coming back at any time, by our conduct and attitude, by our devotion to Bible reading and to prayer and to witnessing,
and a life of holy separation from the world around that is going to be dissolved and separation to the life of godliness which the apostle has so blessedly unfolded in the beginning of his Epistle.
Thus walking, we shall be looking for and hastening the coming of the day of God, when every form of evil will disappear for ever. Since we do not have the luxury of knowing the exact day, we must be ready and in faith cling to the promise of His coming with the certainty that all the seen things of the present order of the world will be dissolved.
Not only will our faith have the effect upon our lives as described, but we will take heed to the prophetic word, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, the dawn of a glorious day begins to arise before faith’s vision, and “the day star” – the One whose coming will introduce the day – will get His rightful place in our hearts.
“With striking incisiveness Peter returns to his exhortation to godly living, set against the fearful background of the Day of the Lord. Personal character is all that will be left after the destruction of the heavens and the earth. His appeal is to the desire in each of us to live worthwhile, meaningful lives. Holy behavior toward others and genuine worship toward God are the two qualities that will survive and be honored beyond the conflicts of time. ” (14)
Verse 12 is a powerful testimony concerning the future, which is certain as to its reality.
As believers, we are to be constantly looking for or towards the day of God at which time the heavens will be destroyed by burning, and the elements will melt with intense heat, since at the termination of this event, the next item on God’s agenda for “that day” will be the eternal state !
Right now, however, we told to “watch and pray.” We are told to be ready, to be on our guard. By constantly looking for His appearing we give testimony to the world of the reality of His soon coming again.
But how do we hasten His coming? I believe that with every soul won to Jesus Christ, we hasten His coming again. At some point, all of those who will receive Jesus will have done so. I believe that is the only thing which delays His coming. At some point in time and in history, that last soul will come into the kingdom. We don’t know when that will be. It may be today. I believe at that point Jesus Christ will come again.
The future is sure. His coming is certain. We must as believers in the contemporary church be witnessing to hasten the advent of this day.
Exegesis of 2 Peter 3:13
In verse 13, Peter starts now the third major division of this chapter. In the first section he spoke of THE WORLD THAT WAS, which was destroyed by water. Then he discussed THE WORLD THAT IS, which will be destroyed by fire. Finally he foretells about the WORLD THAT IS TO BE – the new heaven and the new earth, which will never be destroyed. ”
We”, says the apostle, “according to His promise, look for new heavens and a new earth”. It is not according to our imaginations, or according to our feelings, but according to His unfailing word – “His promise”. For the second time the apostle reminds us that it is “His promise” and, being His, will surely be fulfilled (verses 9 and 13).
The apostle Peter injects a contrast at this point which we must pick up. What believers wait for and even, by godly living, hasten in its coming; and the reason why the present heavens and earth must be destroyed (Gk. di hen “because of which”), in verse 12 is not the same thing as what believers are looking forward to. What believers are anticipating occurs a little later in “ that day “ as it were.
We must constantly remember that the day of the Lord is a long time, and although the conflagration described in verse 12 is at the end of the day, believers are looking beyond that to the eternal state.
Believers await what is described as the new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells. It is, therefore, the eternal state, pictured in vivid imagery in the New Jerusalem of Rev. 21 and 22.
Thus we learn the character of the new heavens and the new earth. It will be a scene “wherein dwelleth righteousness”. Every form of corruption and violence, lust and lawlessness characterises the present world, but abiding righteousness will mark the new creation.
It will not be the reign of righteousness as in millenial days, which implies the presence of evil to be held down. In the new scene, evil having been dealt with, righteousness will dwell. In the present age, righteousness is under constant attack; righteousness suffers. Iin the millennium righteousness will be the dominant lifestyle, though evil is present; thus in the millenium righteousness reigns. However, in the new heavens and earth, righteousness will dwell, i.e. be at home, in its natural environment, without having to struggle with sin or weakness. It will find repose where God is for evermore.
Verse 13 is a powerful testimony which facilitates our preparation for the future. It is a bold statement of assurance. Peter says according to HIS promise,( not man’s) promise we are looking for new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwell.
This word of assurance is given as an incentive for living right and keeping our priorities in His order, and thereby prepare for that day when we leave this earth behind and dwell with Him in glory.
The Bible teaches that one day Jesus shall return and that in the twinkling of an eye our bodies shall be changed. We shall ascend to meet the Lord in the air and we shall ever be with the Lord. ( I Cor 15:51-54 & I Thess 4:16-18).
The surety and imminence of his coming is an incentive for us to be working, watching and waiting expectantly as we walk and witness in preparation for his coming! It could be today! It could be tomorrow! We must be ready. And if we are not ready, we must get ready.
Verse 13 is a comforting and exhilarating word for contemporary believers and the church today.
“But how do we hasten His coming? I believe that with every soul won to Jesus Christ, we hasten His coming again. At some point, all of those who will receive Jesus will have done so. I believe that is the only thing which delays His coming.”
A plea for followers… but you need not hasten his coming. Certainly he does not need followers to return but if this thing overpowers man, he will have to return and put them to death. You sure you want to hasten that?
@GP
With the “absolute truth” in your hip pocket, why are you speaking of believers?
Exegesis 2 Peter 3:14
On the basis of the surety of the Lord’s second advent, Peter admonishes believers to be engaged in holy living.
He appeals to us to let such a glorious future that awaits us to have a present effect upon our present lives. The knowledge that this present world is devoted to judgement should also lead us to a separate walk on godly fear.
The knowledge of the coming blessedness of the new heavens and the new earth should keep us in peace, without spot, and blameless.
The appalling condition of Christendom in the last days, as depicted by the apostle, might in itself distract and disturb the soul, but the prospect of this new scene will keep us seeking so to walk that when Christ comes we shall “be found of Him” walking in calm peace, unspotted by the present world, blameless in our lives, and waiting in patience, knowing that the longsuffering of the Lord is salvation. We may well challenge our hearts with the question, How will He find us when He comes? (See Luke 12: 37, 38, 43; 2 Peter 3:14).
Peter now returns to his word of 1:5 and 1:10 “be diligent,” to urge a practical result of their forward-looking hope. Jesus is coming again, it could occur at any moment, what will you be like when He returns? That is his question. That is his challenge!
Peter suggests a diligent response that seeks to avoid the shame of the false teachers -“spots” and “blemishes”- (2 Peter 2:13 & Jude 12) Peter would undoubtedly want us in our diligence to make our calling and election sure to be diligent too, in recalling the several incentives in the light of the Lord’s coming which are to be found all over the New Testament. I will list here some which I have marked some years ago.
Philippians 4:5 –an incentive to rejoice and be moderate.
Colossians 1:4&5 — an incentive to love the saints and have faith.
Colossians 3:3—an incentive to appear with Christ.
1 Thessalonians1 –an incentive to work, wait, and witness.
1 Thessalonians 2: 18-19 – an incentive to work for rewards
1 Thessalonians 3: 12-13—an incentive to love the saints and strive for perfection or holiness.
1 Thessalonians 4:18 — an incentive for comfort
1 Thessalonians 5:1-11– an incentive for preparation, comfort and edification.
2 Thessalonians1:7 ff — an incentive to prepare for rest ( c.f Heb 4:9)
2 Thessalonians 3:3 — an incentive to be comforted and stablished.
1 Timothy 6–an incentive to lay hold on eternal life. This involves diligence and correct doctrine [2], being dutiful and durable [5], being prepared for departure or to die in the process [6], to be a good fighter, finisher and faith keeper [7], and to beware of desertion, distraction and disobedience [10].
2 Timothy 1: 10 — an incentive to obtain life and immortality.
2 Timothy 3:8 — an incentive to gain the crown of righteousness.
Titus 2:12– an incentive to sober, righteous and godly living.
Hebrews 10:25– an incentive to assemble together.
James 5:7& 8– an incentive to patience and stability.
These are but a sample of the incentives to be embraced with respect to the hope of the Lord’s coming. If we can do this we will not be ashamed, but confident at his coming
Eexegesis of 2 Peter 3:15 &16
In verse 15, we are told “The patience of our Lord leads to salvation.” It’s because He doesn’t want anyone to perish, but He wants all to come to repentance that He waits. God is using His time to express His patience for His grace that people might be saved.
When the fullness of the Gentiles comes in and the last person is saved, He’ll gather His church, His patience has ended, judgment comes.
Paul and Peter may have once had some difficulties and differences at Antioch about eating with Gentiles, but here Peter speaks of Paul with great affection to remind us that Paul also wrote of these truths in depth, and that when it same to the Word they were in perfect consonance.
Probably several of Paul’s letters had reached Peter’s readers and they were well aware of both his wisdom, and as v. 16 indicates, something of the difficulty experienced in understanding his penetrating insights.
In terms of affection the apostle links Paul with himself as a witness of “these things” to the Hebrew believers. He speaks of Paul’s writings as forming part of the Scriptures and warns us that there are those “untaught and ill-established” who wrest his writings, as well as other Scriptures, to their own destruction.
Peter again returns to the theme of v. 9, the reason for the delay of the parousia and reminds us that the delay is to permit greater opportunity for salvation among men, as the gospel spreads throughout the earth (see Rom. 2:4).
Paul, too, had written of this salvation and its effect upon the behavior of those who find it. He wants us to appreciate that patient waiting is mental adjustment to the present world situation.
verse 16
How many of Paul’s epistles Peter had read it is impossible to know. Certainly there was nothing unusual in the apostle’s reading of one another’s letters, for after the meeting of Paul with James, Peter, and John, described in Gal. 2:9, there was full acceptance of Paul’s apostleship among the Twelve.
What he here calls things hard to understand probably describes Paul’s discussion of justification by faith (See Rom. 3:5-8, 6:1 and Gal. 3:10) for Paul himself admits that his teaching of freedom from the law was often twisted to condone license to sin.
This was exactly what the heretical teachers of 2 Peter were doing. He has already said that their abuse of Christian teaching was leading to their own destruction (2:12).
Not only did they twist Paul’s teaching, but also the rest of the Scriptures. This phrase puts Paul’s epistles on a par with the writings of the prophets, calling them equally Scripture. All the apostles were aware that what they taught was inspired by God (see 1 Thess. 2:13).” (15)
One of the beautiful things that we can learn from Peter in this paragraph at a time when we face scoffers is the love that believers must exhibit for each other.
Here Peter shows that he” forgot how Paul had withstood him to the face at Antioch, and had been compelled to put him to shame before all.
This is what grace can do. Grace is a fine thing, and this is a fine touch of it as the curtain drops on the Apostle Peter. Every ruffle in his heart that the scene at Antioch may have produced had been stilled for ever and he only loved Paul, and loved him the more deeply, because of his faithfulness.” (16)
Exegesis of 2 Peter 3:17 & 18
Having put us in remembrance of these things,[chapter I] and warned us against false teachers,[ chapter 2] against scoffers of the last days, and those who wrest the Scriptures to their own destruction, the apostle finally warns us against being led away by “the terror of the wicked”, thus losing our assurance by falling from the steadfastness that is proper to the believer.
When faced with or surrounded by doubt, scepticism, and infidelity, as is the case today, Peter teaches that the coming of Christ is an incentive to live a stable and steadfast life, and warns us to beware lest we be led away with error of the wicked , and fall from our own steadfastness.
In stead we are to let Christ be the One that is kept before our hearts and mind by seeking to grow daily in grace and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.
Peter is saying to the contemporary believer and church that the knowledge of the truth which he has shared with his readers— and Bible knowledge in general– puts the responsibility on us to watch ourselves carefully so that we do not fall away from Christ.
Although he speaks with great affection (beloved), he is once again reminding us that it is possible for even stable Christians to be led astray if they listen to the teaching of those whose lives do not measure up.
verse 18
For the fifth time in this short Epistle, Peter points out that our blessing is connected with the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ (1: 2,3,& 8; 2:20).
The apostle has pressed upon us the value of the prophetic Scriptures, the commandments of the apostles, and the deep importance of resting upon the Word of God, but he realizes that mere knowledge of the letter will not keep us. Scripture is only rightly used as we gain through the word a deeper knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.
GROWING IN THE GRACE AND KNOWLEDGE is the all-important program for the child of God now. Jesus said “Search” Paul said, “Study”, Peter said, “Grow.” Both refer believers to the Bible and the study of it.
“The purpose of salvation, of scripture, and of Christian teaching is to bring one into deeper and more intimate experience of Christ.
Knowledge of Christ and knowledge about Christ are not the same thing, though the latter is necessary to achieve the former.
It is fitting that Peter should end his letter with an acknowledgment that glory belongs to Jesus, for he had seen Him in shining glory on the Mount of Transfiguration. To worship, praise and obey Him is to give Him the glory due to His name in this present life.
It should continue to the day of the age, translated here forever. What Peter means is till the parousia of Christ, when believers will see His face and be with Him forever. That was Peter’s great expectation and desire, and one he seeks to bring his readers to share. Let us say Amen with him!”
To Him is the “glory both now and for ever. Amen”. Let us not forget that little word “now”. We all admit that glory will come to Him for ever, but we may well challenge our hearts by asking, Is He getting glory from our lives even now? We must all search our hearts for a truthful and sincere answer to this question.
Any good fairy tale story states you do not fight evil you resist evil…
Common Elements of Fairy Tales
• Do NOT need to include fairies.
• Set in the past—usually significantly long ago. May be
presented as historical fact from the past.
• Include fantasy, supernatural or make-believe aspects.
• Typically incorporate clearly defined good characters and evil
characters.
• Involves magic elements, which may be magical people,
animals, or objects. Magic may be postive or negative.
• May include objects, people, or events in threes.
• Focus the plot on a problem or conflict that needs to be
solved.
• Often have happy endings, based on the resolution of the
conflict or problem.
• Usually teach a lesson or demonstrate values important to the
culture.
Oh go ROK…!
Today we want to remember that Jesus is God’s answer to
MAN’S DISAPOPINTMENTS John 2…no wine
MAN’S DOUBT John 20:29 no belief cf 1 Peter 1:8
MAN’S DISABILTY John 5 no man to help
MAN’S DARKNESS John 9 no sight no light; but this man got to know and meet the TRUTH c.f 1 Peter 2:9
MAN’S DESPAIR Philippians 4:6-7 no anxietry, no care c.f I Peter 5:7
MAN’S DEATH Hebrews 9:28, 2 Cor 5:21; I Peter 2:24 no more appointment for spiritual death
@GP, That man, ask you:
“With the “absolute truth’ in your hip pocket, why are you speaking of believers?”
He is constantly saying that when we Christians claim to KNOW, that God’s Word, the Bible IS absolute truth, why then DO we still have to *BELIEVE*!
What a stupid question…does KNOWING something, logically remove one from *BELIEVING*?
How many things do we KNOW for sure in our daily lives, that is then qualified by us saying, “I BELIEVE” saying that you *believe* does NOT invalidate what you KNOW, it confirms it.
When one has confidence in one’s Doctor, or Lawyer, etc, one can then say, I *BELIEVE* in him/her to do what they are qualifed to do. Therefore BELIEVING is KNOWING, and KNOWING is BELIEVING!
What is FAITH according to the Word of God; what does it really mean?
Gk. ‘Pisteuo (to BELIEVE, TRUST), ‘Pistis’ (faith truth). ‘Pistos’ (faithfulness, trusting), ‘Pistoo’ ( to make someone trust).
The opposite: ‘Apistos’ (faithless, unbelieving), ‘Apisteo’ (to disbelieve, to be unfaithful), ‘Apistis’ (unfaithfulness, unbelief). ‘Oligopistos’ (of little faith), ‘Oligopistis’ (littleness of faith).
‘Pisteuo’ as ‘to believe’ in the New Testament, the group becomes a leading one to denote the *relationship* with God, partly on the OT basis, and partly in connection with the Christian and its call for *FAITH* as turning to God. The verb is often used for *believing* God’s Word, i.e., Scripture (Jn. 2:22), the prophets (Acts. 26: 27), Moses (Jn. 5: 46-47), or what God said through an angel (Lk. 1:200, or the Baptist (Mk. 11: 31). Along these lines the NT says that people should *believe* Jesus and His Word (Jn. 3:24; 5:38).
‘Pistis’ as acceptance of the Message. Especially when used with the preposition ‘eis’ ‘Pistis’ is saving acceptancre of Christ’s Work, as proclaimed in the Gospel. This including *believing* obeying, trusting, hoping, and being faithful, but, it IS primarily faith, *believing* in Christ. For Gentiles, it means conversion to the One, True, and Living God, who has brought salvation IN and through His Son, Jesus Christ.
The content of Faith. Paul states the content of faith in Romans 10:9. It involves acknowledgment of the risen Christ. Faith in Christ means faith in His resurrection, and His resurrection implies His prior death for sin, (I cor. 15:11; cf Rom. 4:24; I Thess 4:14; Phil 2: 6ff.). Kerygma, (proclamation) and faith always go together ( cf. Acts 2: 22ff), and the reference IS always to Christ, and what He has done (cf. Jn 20: 31; 16: 27; 14: 10; 8:24; Rom. 6:8).
Faith as Personal Relation to Christ. BELIEVING ‘eis’ (in) Christ involves a personal relation similiar to the relation to God in the OT, although the NT tends to use constructions for *BELIEVING* in God and in Christ. Acceptance of the Gospel IS acceptance of Christ as LORD. For Christ and salvation history CANNOT be severed. Faith accepts the existence of Christ and its SIGNIFICANCE for the *BELIEVER*. It rest on the message, but as faith in the message IT IS FAITH *BELIEVE* *BELIEVING* in the PERSON whom the message mediates. The personal aspect comes out in Rom 19:9; Gal 2:20; Phil 1:29; I Pet 1:8).
Believing. Faith may be acceptance of the message, as in Acts 20: 21, or it may be CONTINUING in *BELIEVING*, as in I Cor. 2:5. Since BELIEVING is *dynamic* it may be weak or strong ( Rom 12: 3; 14: 1), it may grow ( 2 Cor 10:15), it may endure ( I Thess 1:3), and unity (Eph. 4:13).
(Theological Dictionary of The New Testament) emphasis added.
Therefore, BELIEVE, BELIEVING, naturally IS *dynamic* in what one KNOWS, to be absolute Truth, God’s Word, The Lord Jesus Christ, AS we have *TASTED* of His Love, Mercy and Grace, HE IS REAL, LIVING, and the Eternal Creator of the Universe, and HE LOVES US, demonstrated in the most amazing way the HE *paid* the DEBT we owed, as we had NOTHING to offer Him. As God, HE paid a DEBT He did NOT owe, He LOVINGING, gave His Son in our stead, on our behalf, and bore the DAMNATION we ALL deserve in Hell, no greater LOVE has the world EVER seen, than on Calvary’s Cross, when God became man, and took the full brunt of God’s Holy Righteous demand, that someone HAD to satisfy God’s Righteousness and Justice, in order for US to be forgiven, cleansed, and *Restored* to a relationship with Almighty God.
This JESUS CHRIST *DID* so that anyone who repents, and sincerely BELIEVES in Him, shall NOT perish, BUT, have Everlasting Life! (Jn. 3:16)
ROK:
When all else fails, these ultimate cut and paste merchants, will attempt to drown your responses in meaningless, and endless, stone age twaddle.
They’ve spent their whole lives seeking to make sense of these ambiguous fairy tales, and to admit they’re wrong at this stage would be catastrophic to their obvious self belief.
The role of any scientist is to be a sceptic, testing and retesting theories until they are reproducable to all and so become laws.
Invective and ultra long submissions of theory are not proof of their position, but rather signs of desperation when a candle is held up to the rantings.
It reminds me of the paraphrased saying, they use the lightpole of the bible, as does the drunkard, not for illumination but support.
Continue the joust, it may not in the end be productive, but it certainly is entertaining to see adults held in such thrall of the supernatural.
@Technician…………How are you doing? [commission by omission] but its never too late. So Peace Love and Blessings to you my brother!
Yes I did read Carter G Woodson and here’s another apt quote from him…
“If you control a man’s thinking, you do
not have to worry about his action. When you determine what a man shall think you do not have to concern yourself about what he will do…..AND if you make a man think he is justly outcast, you do not have to order him to the back door. He will go without being told; and if there’s no back door, his very nature will demand one.”
That’s the state of today’s negro…..’educated’ uneducated or miseducated.
@GP……How is it that the word of God was first given to Moses when Moses of the christian faith is a fictional character based on TutMoses of Kemet? Were there no people on this earth before this christian Moses? Or God really didn’t give two hoots about them? Don’t you know that Noah’s Ark was based on Khufu’s boat which is one of the oldest if not the oldest on the planet…and wait for the name……..Noark! Did you get that GP? The holy trinity christianity, judaism and islam were all stolen, copied and plagurized from the Ancients and No damn ‘jew’ was ever enslaved in Ancient Egypt that’s another DAMNABLE HERESY. ITS ALL LIES! What was Jesus called before the English alphabet got the letter “J” sometime around the 15th century?
and BTW please explain how it is that Jesus Christ is the only child that is OLDER than his mother….and please no biblical booboo just give me a straight up bio-chemical explanation.
Long before you chaps were born, it was written of you thus:
2 Peter 3
1This second epistle, beloved, I now write unto you; in both which I stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance:
2That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:
3Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
4And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
5For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
6Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
7But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
8But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
10But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
14Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.
15And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
16As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
17Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.
18But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.
Straight talk
Note that I have cut and paste from my own work, derived from my personal SEARCH of the Scriptures and my personal STUDY of the Scriptures—-just as was the case with the Biochemistry.
I am teaching Bible not jousting Sir.
My “ultra long submissions of” Biblical exegesis is reaching those in cyberspace for whom it is intended for Isaiah 55:11 teaches “So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper [in the thing] whereto I sent it.”
Which is better too spend your whole lives seeking to make sense of the Word of God, or bowing to the dictates of a politician, or being enslaved by sin, sex or drink?
We are studying Scripture Sir- not Science. And how do you know that we have not tested and retested the Word of God by its effect on our lives?
The proof of our position is being clearly worked out on the world stage today, my dear friend. Who are you to say why we use the Word?
Your silly statements will one day be replayed to you………at the Great White throne judgement. It will not be so entertaining then.
And you still claim to be a scientist?
ROTFLMAOFTISM!!!
Tell us all of your reproducable experiments, rather than an instilled blind faith brought about by the accidental geography of your birthplace and time.
I would hate to ponder your broughtupsy in a middle eastern environment.
A second coming issue
Bow thy heavens, O LORD, and come down: touch the mountains, and they shall smoke [Ps. 144:5].
This is a call for God to break into human events, for God to intrude into human history. This is confirmed in Isaiah 64:1–2 which says, “Oh that thou wouldest rend the heavens, that thou wouldest come down, that the mountains might flow down at thy presence, As when the melting fire burneth, the fire causeth the waters to boil, to make thy name known to thine adversaries, that the nations may tremble at thy presence!” God is going to intrude into human history one day. I don’t want to take a fanatical position and say that He is going to do it tomorrow, or even in this century, but the fact is that He is going to do it.
Cast forth lightning, and scatter them: shoot out thine arrows, and destroy them [Ps. 144:6].
When the Lord comes again, He is coming in judgment. The whole tenor of Scripture, including the New Testament, is that the Lord is coming in judgment one day. There is no more vivid and dramatic picture of this than the one given in Revelation 19:11, where John saw heaven opened and beheld a white horse, “… and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.” That is a picture of the Lord Jesus Christ coming forth as a conqueror to conquer. Maybe you don’t like this picture, but it is the picture that the Word of God presents.
At that time, the psalmist says:
I will sing a new song unto thee, O God: upon a psaltery and an instrument of ten strings will I sing praises unto thee [Ps. 144:9].
Not until after the Tribulation will the children of Israel be able to sing this new song unto their God.
@Kiki
That is deep.
@Zoe
It is one thing to perceive what you believe to be true, but quite another when it comes to absolute truth.
If for example, I say that I believe in my lawyer, it is that I don’t know if he will ever rip me off, but up to now he has not.
However, if I knew for sure (absolute truth) that he would not rip me off, then I would have the confidence that he would never and I can then say that he will not.
In the latter circumstances where I am sure, I would never resort to the use of the word “believe” if somebody questions my judgment, because I have absolute truth.
Stop quoting fallacious verses of the bible to prove your point. I have proved my point above by simple reasoning. Do you have any of that?
@Straight Talk
You notice… but you mek me laugh though. You mean that if he was born of the other persuasion, he would be a serious suicide bomber for Allah? I see. So we lucky to have him here? LOL!
zoe is doing a pretty poor sales job converting ungodly christians to get down on their knees and pray for forgiveness.. he is far too overzealous and screwed up for anyone to join… it’s better to follow your own path to sanity I mean destiny
II Thessalonians Chapter 2 is another Second Coming Chapter of great import
Before I exegete it, here is the text, followed by a great outline of the chapter by the late Adrian Rogers.
1. Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2. That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3. Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4. Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
5. Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things? 6. And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
7. For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
8. And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming
9. Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
10. And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
11. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
12. That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
13. But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
14. Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
15. Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.
16. Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God, even our Father, which hath loved us, and hath given us everlasting consolation and good hope through grace,
17. Comfort your hearts, and stablish you in every good word and work.
1- THE MOCKERY OF GOD IS RECOUNTED v 3
2- THE MYSTERY OF INIQUITY IS RESTRAINED v 6
3- THE MINISTRY OF THE SPIRIT WILL BE REMOVED (verse 6&7)
4- THE MASTERY OF SATAN IS RELEASED v 7
5 THE MISERY OF MAN IS REDOUBLED v 11-12
6 THE MAJESTY OF THE SAVIOR IS REVEALED
Onlookers:
A few footnotes.
1] On knowledge and believing.
Probably the best definition of knowledge as we commonly use it is that it is well-warranted, credibly true belief. (I use “warrant” instead of “justification” to address the Gettier counter-example problem of epistemology, in which one may be justified in believing something that happens to be true, but the justification is inaccurate.)
So, belief is not the opposite of knowledge, it is the superset. And, if one does not believe [i.e. trust it enough to act on it], one does not know.
2] On turnabout accusations
Above, ROK — unfortunately, all too predictably — resorts to the classic compound form of the selective hyperskepticism fallacy, turnabout rhetorical accusation, attempting to drag those who have corrected his errors into the same problem. (In effect if you disagree with me, it is because you are the closed-minded and selectively hyperskeptical one . . . nyah nyah nyah nyah nah! [Observe, he has failed, yet again, to cogently address the trend and basis of relevant scholarship as I have linked and excerpted.])
This leads us to the importance of . ..
3] Worldviews and morality
A basic educational problem in our region is that we are trained to think either to parrot a tradition [do it right in school and you get the tick; full facts full marks, half facts half marks, no facts no marks, etc], or else to argue rhetorically by manipulating clever words that impinge on emotions, response to allegedly credible sources or the like.
What we are generally not taught is how to think worldviewishly.
And, here it shows, for the basic point of contrast between Egyptian paganism and the hebraic theistic tradition is that they are utterly distinct worldviews, so that the one is not — and cannot be — the derivative of the other. for just one instance, in paganism, the cosmos or a proto-cosmos is a product of the wars or intrigues of the gods, it is not the creation ex nihilo of the necessary being, the Creator God.
And, once we see that we live in a contingent cosmos [one that either had a beginning or comprises entities that can go out of existence — cf here Big bang cosmology] we see that this entails a necessary being to be its source and/or sustainer. Indeed, that is a basic role of the genesis account of Creation: it sets the record straight on the roots of the contingent world in which we live.
In so doing, it provides the only stable basis for moral governance: the necessary Being and Creator is the IS who can ground oughts by having an inherently virtuous character.
Otherwise one runs smack into the Humean problem, whereby IS cannot ground OUGHT, and so AMORALITY is the result. So, in pagan, polytheistic systems, one has the dilemma that the gods are either arbitrary in their requirements of moral behaviour, or else morality is independent of the gods, revealing hem to be less than Sovereign over creation.
In the case of Egyptian paganism, the whole exchange over Isis and her husband and the associated battles of the gods shows the moral bankruptcy of the system.
(And BTW, evolutionary materialistic systems are equally amoral, as they have only survival, not morality save as a convenient, culturally relative, social fiction. In other words morality boils down to a human level dust-up and the winner makes the rules as s/he pleases. Our inner cry for justice and fairness is testimony that this is utterly wrong.)
In effect, such systems simply respond to the inbuilt nature of morality, they do not ground it. And, when ROK points to the similarity of mortal codes and insights of praqgmatic wisdom, he is missing the point that morality is in-built, and once we see a more or less coherent sysrtem of values founded on mutual respect and duty in light of fundamental equality, one will see the points of core morality emerging. Indeed, that is exactly what Paul adverts to in Rom 1 – 2 and 13.
Again, only theism can ground morality stably; by giving the grounding is that founds all oughts.
[ . . . ]
4] Worldviews and warrant vs circularity and closed mindedness
The easiest way to get at this is to dismiss selective hyperskepticism and take an abstract chain of truth claims, starting with A:
>> Why should we accept it? Generally, because of B. But, why should we accept B? Thence, C, D, . . . etc. Thus, we face either an infinite regress of challenges, or else we stop at some point, say F — our Faith-Point:
A <– B <– C <– D >
This brings up . . .
5] How is the Christian faith warranted at core?
As already linked, this is based on the 55 AD record from the prime source document excerpt in 1 Cor 15:1 – 11, and the reality of the experience of millions who through the promises in this text have met and found life-transforming forgiveness and empowerment by the Spirit in the face of Christ:
>>. . . before rushing off and dismissing the gospel without further considerations as “obviously” inaccurate to history, one should consult the implications of the AD 55 eyewitness lifetime primary source record . . . (and the associated life-transforming experience of the millions across 2,000 years who have encountered God in the face of the crucified and risen Christ through the gospel; including many thousands of your neighbours all across the Caribbean), as well as discussions by men like professor Yamauchi here . . . .
millions all around us and over the years report that they have met and come to know the real God in the face of Jesus and have had their lives transformed by the resulting release of resurrection power through the “great and precious promises” of the scriptures. (Advice: a little humble listening to people who — however ill-educated and lacking in eloquence — actually know God, would save many of us the highly educated a lot of grief here and in eternity.) >>
that foundational warrant in teh historic jesus of nazareth, crucified for our sins, dead, buried, and riwsen with 500+ witnesses, who then ascended and poured out the Spirit who has transformed millions all around us makes moot any attempts to rot the gospel in the claimed myths and teachings of Egypt, Greece or India etc.
And, since the relevant knowledge is easily accessible in the lives of our neighbours, this constitutes what we know or should know; sop we are morally accountable over the truth of the gospel. For, ignorance here would be willful and based on unwarranted dismissal.
______________
G’day
D
PS: Anticipating a dismissive rebuttal, you will see that I am mostly excerpting training materials I have developed over the past 25 – 30 years, and elsewhere I am pointing to world class experts who are giving serious factual summaries. At no point has ROK or any other objector seriously engaged much less actually provided superior factual adequacy, logical coherence and explanatory power. that should tell you the onlooker much on the actual balance of the case on the merits.
@Dictionary
“So, belief is not the opposite of knowledge, it is the superset. And, if one does not believe [i.e. trust it enough to act on it], one does not know.”
How erroneous. Belief could only be a sub-set of knowledge. Nobody said that belief is the opposite of knowledge. It certainly is not knowledge, or are you telling me that a wall is only a wall because I believe it is a wall?
@Dictionary
“And, here it shows, for the basic point of contrast between Egyptian paganism and the hebraic theistic tradition is that they are utterly distinct worldviews, so that the one is not — and cannot be — the derivative of the other.”
What utter rubbish! You use words to stigmatise people and put them in your little pigeon hole and talking foolishness about world view. What world view what? You lumping everybody that you perceive to be against you into one.
Yes, you are either a Jew or a Gentile? Same corrupt thinking.
@Dictionary
“[one that either had a beginning or comprises entities that can go out of existence — cf here Big bang cosmology] we see that this entails a necessary being to be its source and/or sustainer.”
That is your assumption. Has nothing to do with truth.
The ‘demoniacal’ inspired and led emissaries of *darkness* falsehood, lies and deceit, are gathering in the FACE of *Truth* Light, and Liberty, which they CANNOT refute with one iota of any senseable, cogent, response, absolutely NONE, true to FORM! Formless, voidless, empty rhetoric!!!
‘And without controversy great is the mystery of Godliness’
“God WAS manifested (revealed) in the flesh” (Jesus Christ)
Justified in the Spirit
Seen by angels,
Preached among the Gentiles,
BELIEVED on in the world,
Received UP in Glory” ( I Tim. 3: 16) emphasis added.
Those of us who stand resolutely on the side of God’s Word, absolute Truth, are warned:
“Yes, and all who desire to live godly in Christ Jesus, will SUFFER persecution.”
“But EVIL men and imposters will grow WORSE and WORSE, deceiving many, and BEING DECEIVED.”
“But you must CONTINUE in the things which you have learned and been ASSURED of, *KNOWING* from whom you have learned them. And from childhood the Holy Scriptures which are able to MAKE you WISE for salvation through FAITH which IS in Christ Jesus.”
“All (every) Scripture IS given by *inspiration* of God, and IS profitable for *doctrine*, for *reproof* for *correction* for *instruction* in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, throughly equipped for every good work.” (2 Tim. 3: 12-16) emphasis added.
To the ‘scoffers’ of God’s Word, the Bible; how many Athiests, Agnostics, Alcoholics, Drug Addicts, wayward, lonely people, rich, and from every other kind of affiction known to man, across the world, HAVE *unbelief* ever SAVED from lives of utter DESPAIR and HOPLESSNESS? Tell me!
Wheras, the Gospel of The Lord Jesus Christ, HAS rescued untold multitudes across the cultural and racial spectrum for 2000 years, and CONTINUES to do so, MILLIONS are coming to HIM, across the Nations of the world, Hindu’s Muslims, Africans by the MILLIONS are FINDING, *PEACE* *JOY* and the REAL purpose for living, with the ASSURACE of Eternal Life, if, they endure to the End!
You ‘Scoffers’ have NOTHING to offer anyone in despair, may be a ‘rum’ or a fete, go and get a woman…BUT, next morning the SAME depression that plagued you the night before…REMAINS…nothing changes…the same old SIN stained life… filled with MEANINGLESSNESS.
But, GP, Dictionary, me and countless others, right here in B’dos, across the Caribbean region, of ALL colours and classes, HAVE a COMMON testimony, WE have been *TRANSFORMED* from WITHIN, for that IS where IT must start, NOT RELIGION, and dead ritualism, NO!NO!NO!,
Only Almighty God, IN, BY, and THROUGH, The Lord Jesus Christ, can effect THIS transforming *Miracle* Spiritual regeneration through the ‘New Birth’ being Born Again, from above, nothing LESS can EVER change the SIN stained heart of mankind!
That IS why we PROCLAIM:
“For I AM NOT ashamed of the Gospel of CHRIST, for IT IS the *power* of God to *salvation* for EVERYONE who *believes* for the Jew first and also the Greek” (Gentile)
“For in IT the *righteousness* of GOD Is revealed from FAITH to FAITH, as it IS written. ‘The just shall LIVE by FAITH.” ( Rom. 1: 16,17) emphasis added.
A LIVING, *DYNAMIC* FAITH, that no one, can EVER take from US!!!
For, IT IS *absolutely* ASSURED!
@Dictionary
“In so doing, it provides the only stable basis for moral governance: ”
Yes, got you now. The whole ploy is to control societies, right? You decide on the rules of what is moral and immoral, right? Then everybody must fall in, right? And like King James, you shift the goal post when it suits you.
@Dictionary
“>> Why should we accept it? Generally, because of B. But, why should we accept B? Thence, C, D, . . . etc. Thus, we face either an infinite regress of challenges, or else we stop at some point, say F — our Faith-Point:”
“Accept”? We talking about absolute truth, what accept what? This is a further admission that you do not have absolute truth. Your truth is by deduction based on faith, not fact.
@Dictionary
“millions all around us and over the years report that they have met and come to know the real God in the face of Jesus and have had their lives transformed…”
And what does this face look like? How can you come to know something that you believe in and have never seen or know nothing about?
That is an erroneous statement. Very misleading. It is merely your belief and you should say so. Remember that to believe is a matter of probability of the truth. Also remember that given the fact that not one iota of evidence is available to even prove the most minute detail of the bible, it means that the probability that you have truth is tending to zero.
@Dictionary
“At no point has ROK or any other objector seriously engaged much less actually provided superior factual adequacy, logical coherence and explanatory power. that should tell you the onlooker much on the actual balance of the case on the merits.”
You see, you need the experts because what you have is not on all-fours with the truth. You need to jumble it up and confuse it so that by the time you give the verdict, everybody’s head in confusion. You asking the onlooker to judge on merit, but yet you bring your notes. How is that different from mine?
If you have absolute truth, why are you asking people to judge on merit? There can be no judgment when it comes to truth. Anybody who has truth does not engage in lengthy discussions to prove the truth and at the back of it have so much trouble establishing that they have even one shred of truth.
@Zoe
Somebody trying to take away your faith? Not me… and you can keep it. You can have faith for me and you but you keep it. All the faith you want, man.
But do not under any circumstances try to convert people by deceitfully representing your faith as the absolute truth. The same way you want freedom to believe what you want to believe you should respect people’s right to believe what they want to believe because you don’t have absolute truth; not even raw truth.
You should also stop the fear-mongering because, again, you do not have the truth. So to come here and claim that the worst things will happen to those who don’t believe is morally and spiritually wrong.
Stop trying to berate people for their beliefs when you have one. Stop trying to con people into becoming christians. Use the truth and you know what the truth is; christianity is merely a faith.
Dictionary
with no attempt to take any sides on the substantive issue, I am somewhat taken aback by your sweeping and (in my very honest opinion) unsupported and incorrect view that in the Caribbean:
“What we are generally not taught is how to think worldviewishly.”
If this were to be actually true then your arguments (assuming these to be “worldviewish”) would be falling on deaf ears.
Dictionary, All of your submissions, ARE, as usual, deeply and profoundly sound, based upon, meaningful, cogent, coherent, historic, Biblical, and philospohical REASONING, which CANNOT be refuted!
That man, who you are so graciously attempting to enlighten, CANNOT, WILL NOT, even begin to comprehend the vastness of your enlightened posts, they ARE way beyond his intellectual ineptness, he IS void of such mental capacity!
Thank God, that David and BU are granting such indepth, teaching, so that the quiet “observers” in cyberspace, are literally witnessing the the DIAMETRIC worldviews, FAILED, ruined, washed-up, PAGANISM, and the Life Transfoming TRUTH from the Historic, Judeo/Christian worldview, backed BY warranted BELIEF, evidence, that cannot be refuted, scoffed at, Yes, BUT, cannot be refuted, Biblically, Philosophically, nor Scientifically.
So, paradoxically, that ‘man’ is an opportunity, for the onlookers, to SEE what is it like, when DARKNESS meets LIGHT, when RIGHTEOUSNESS confonts UNRIGHTEOUSNESS, in short, when *IGNORANCE* is blatantly exposed in the FACE of TRUTH!!!
This IS not in anyway intended to be insulting, as IT IS FACTUAL!
?
@Zoe
“So, paradoxically, that ‘man’ is an opportunity, for the onlookers, to SEE what is it like, when DARKNESS meets LIGHT, when RIGHTEOUSNESS confonts UNRIGHTEOUSNESS, in short, when *IGNORANCE* is blatantly exposed in the FACE of TRUTH!!!”
Really? Having already admitted that yours is a faith, who then is ignorant? What truth what?
He who believes but know not that he believes is more ignorant than he who believes and knows he believes.
All you are doing is placing christianity into disrepute. The words of Father Massiah are not falling to the ground. His words are of great wisdom and deep understanding. You and Dictionary and GP have a lot to learn. You are all fundamentalists.
Come ‘Judgement Day’,some people on either side of the fence will be soooo disappointed….but hey, power to the people, to each his/her own.
@ Hopi…thanks for the wishes, I am doing great…-8*C as I type but it is winter eh?
That book is such an inspiration to me as a young black man, it is prophetic.
Those similarities you spoke of have been puzzling to me for a long time, the parallels are amazing.
I always thought that it was a compliment for a believer to be called a fundamentalist! LOL!
A fundamentalist is one who holds tenaciously to the fundamental truths of the Bible.
I have been a fundamentalist since 1968……..and will die a fundamentalist!
And yes I have a lot of Scripture that I have not fully yet plumbed the depths on, as I have mastered certain areas.
Technician
Re Come ‘Judgement Day’,some people on either side of the fence will be soooo disappointed
Clarify man.
You think that the believers will be disappomted when the scoffers get consigned to the lake, or you think that they will be dissapointed that they were so consigned?
The Word says that there are two camps man. In one se there will be rejoicing (and fundamentally so) and in the other camp there will be wailing weeping and gnashing of teeth or gums (and fundamentally so too!) And I am speeking purely as a fundamentalist of course. LOL
FUNDAMENTALISM:
The worst kind of religious animal. These were known to burn people at the stake, stone them to death, create wars, persecute people and stigmatise them. Most important, they are fear-mongers and spewers of all kinds of untruths.
If readers check the contributions of GP, Zoe and Dictionary, you can see how cleverly they have employed these mechanisms to win readers over.
If we were to listen to them, we would attribute everything to god and try not to learn anything. The same teachings tell you that god helps those who help themselves. Seek and ye shall find. Knock and it shall be opened.
Serious principles which these people restrict and then got the gall to tell me about closed mindedness.
Anonymous Ma boy
Whuh happen man?
You done wid de Biochem already man?
You let the Krebs cycle wipe you out man. I still got the likkle thing that I prepare for you on it man (the tricarboxylic acid cycle) LOL
“The Word says that there are two camps man. In one se there will be rejoicing (and fundamentally so) and in the other camp there will be wailing weeping and gnashing of teeth or gums (and fundamentally so too!)”
Sounds like a summary of the last elections.
“You think that the believers will be disappomted when the scoffers get consigned to the lake…”
Thing is, only believers in the lake will get consigned to the lake.
The idea that “God helps those who help themselves” is a Bajan invention. IT IS NOT TAUGHT ANYWHERE IN HOLY SCRIPTURE.
“Seek and ye shall find. Knock and it shall be opened” includes SEARCHING THE SCRIPTURES & STUDYING THE SCRIPTURES in accordance to the tenet of Hebrews 11:6 But without faith [it is] impossible to please [him]: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and [that] he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
Nah GP
I actually discussing things with a doctor friend of mine. He cussing me because he thought that he would never see PFK and ATP again after leaving medical school.
You could still post the new stuff under the “evolution” thread. I got two youngsters also reading. They are actually understanding it faster than I am. They are plenty brighter than me and they studied chemistry and biology at university.
My friend also happen to say that it is not easy to find all this biochem info in ONE place. Usually you have to consult more than a few books.
Anonymous
Re I actually discussing things with a doctor friend of mine. He cussing me because he thought that he would never see PFK and ATP again after leaving medical school.
I can just imagine! I just can not understand why folk hate Biochem so much. For me many of the other areas e.g Immunology were/are harder to grasp. People just struggle with Biochem for some reason.
I never had that problem. I have always enjoyed it from the days at BCC down at the Harbor in 1970 , when we were proud to read a little paper back book by Stephen Rose, called The Chemistry of Life. That was our introduction. One rich lad actually had Lehninger’s Bioenergetics.
Re My friend also happen to say that it is not easy to find all this biochem info in ONE place. Usually you have to consult more than a few books.
LOL You better believe that! LOL
I will select some interesting easy to follow slides for you to enjoy, man. I am so happy to hear that you are exited about the Biochem man, and that you beating it out with your young friends.
So soon we can have a real Biochem battle! Annonymous & the annonymi vs GP in a royal rumble at the BU Biochem stadium!
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