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NUPW_StrikeThe report coming out of the International Monetary Fund (IMF) that it  ‘failed to realise the damage austerity would do to Greece’ makes for an interesting observation as Barbados is negotiating its own brand of economic austerity.  The moral of the story for Barbadians is simple, we need to solve our problems  by leveraging homegrown knowledge capital – see article IMF admits: we failed to realise the damage austerity would do to Greece. .

The admission by IMF Chief Christine Lagarde brings back the memory of pre-2007 and how global credit rating agencies contributed to the global recession by feeding demand for helter skelter consumption and ignoring a financial framework built on a questionable financial market which continues today to peddle questionable securities the like of credit default swaps, derivatives and electronic trading to mention a few.

During the recent presentation of the 2015 Financial Statement and Budgetary Proposals minister of finance Chris Sinckler insisted it was a home grown effort. However a visit to the IMF website supports the position the economic prescription the government seems committed to is NOT home grown. The huge debt to GDP gives Barbados little or no wiggle room to ignore the advice of international financial agencies largely responsible for influencing credit rating agencies. Despite what the prime minister and finance manager would have us believe a good sovereign credit rating does matter. The junk credit rating of Barbados makes borrowing on the capital market an expensive undertaking. Ask the Cahill people!

The news making the rounds this week and publicized at the BLP Tyrol Cot meeting last Sunday night: the government has been ‘analysing’ an IMF report on the state of the Barbados economy for about three weeks since the delivery of the Budget, and is yet to give permission for its release to the public. It supports the widely held view the Stuart government is inclined to manipulate information and  engage in a lack of transparency for political advantage. The minister of finance was forced to  hurriedly confirm the IMF report story the Monday after the BLP Tyrol,Cot meeting. What should be 0f interest to Barbadians – minister Sinckler confirmed  the IMF is still concerned about the level of quantitative easing being practiced by the central bank of Barbados and government.

On a related note: the industrial relations climate in Barbados is ‘hotting up’  and it makes one wonder how effective the social partnership has been in the last couple of years, and we add minister of labour Esther Byer to the mix. BU suspects both unions have not forgotten the ‘black eye’ given to them by government and private sector in recent years. NUPW must still be smarting from the NCC matter  and under a new management seems to be bent on retrieving its flagging reputation. There is also the Caswell Franklyn factor whose union has been making more noise than the two which are more established. It is unfortunate both sides have reached a point where dialogue has broken down, the last thing Barbados needs at this time is a national strike and low productivity. In the case of the BIDC  – the current matter which has triggered industrial protest – it seems to be one better left to the law court to determine, but any issue maybe a good issue for the union to claw back its influence and membership.

The perilous state of the economy requires Barbadians to leverage the benefit of the large investment in education by resolving our problems. The rising tension in industrial relations in Barbados is symptomatic of a dearth in leadership in all facets of society.


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290 responses to “Is the Economy Improving and Why Strike Now”


  1. Barbados is already a nasty stinking place plus you also have sargassum to deal with.

    Allowing or making sanitation workers strike is lunacy.


  2. For the doubting thomases like AC and Eagerman who continue to clutch at straws ; here is another fact beyond dispute for the loquacious snorting Minister to deal with; and the relevant Circular from Ministry of Civil Service to Permanent Secretaries and heads of department refers:

    The Pensions (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 2004-25, which was published in the Official Gazette dated December 23, 2004 makes provision for all persons in the public service at January 1, 2005 to retire compulsorily at the age stipulated uner the National Insurance Scheme. That ae is presently sixty-five (65) but will move to sixty-seven (67) by 2018.

    The main provisions of this Act are outlined below:

    (1) The compulsory retirement age in the public service has been harmonised with the retirement age under the National Insurance Scheme. That retirement age will graduallymove to 67 years by 2018. Among other things, the amendment means that officers listed in the Schedule to the pensions Act Cap. 25 under Section 13C (2) will have the same retirement age as other public officers.

    (2) The effective date for the commencement of the provisions contained in this Act was January1 ,2015.

    (3) THE NEW PROVISIONS WITH RESPECT TO THE COMPULSORY RETIREMENT AGE ARE ALSO APPLICABLE TO STATUTORY BOARDS WHICH FALL UNDER CAP.384. THOSE PERSONS WHO HOLD THE POST OF GENERAL MANAGER 9BY WHATEVER NAME CALLED0 AT STATUTORY BOARDS CAN NOW RETIRE IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE PROVISIONS OUTLINED AT PARAGRAPH 2910 ABOVE.

    (3) It is imporatant to note that the AMENDMENT SUPERSEDES THE OPTION WHICH MIGHT HAVE BEEN EXERCISED BY OFFICERS AT THE TIME OF THE 1984 AMENDMENT TO THE PENSIONS ACT TO RETIRE AT SIXTY(60). THEREFORE, WITHOUT TAKING ANY ACTION, OFFICERS WHO HAD OPTED TO RETIRE AT SIXTY(60) CAN NOW CONTINUE TO WORK BEYOND THAT AGE. HOWEVER, OFFICERS WHOSE SIXTY-FIFTH BIRTHDAY FALLS BETWEEN jANUARY I, 2005 AND DECEMBER 31, 2005 MUST RETIRE ON OR BEFORE THAT DATE.

    STOP TRYING TO DEFEND THE INDEFENSIBLE


  3. Simple Simon July 7, 2015 at 2:31 PM # @ac July 7, 2015 at 2:24 PM “the economy have started to rebound and it is a must and a true test patriotism under an umbrella of intelligence and not politics to destroy and divide.”

    If that be so; then why force workers to retire.


  4. Clone July 7, 2015 at 4:40 PM # The government has a good chance to get out of an embarrassing situation. They should embrace the BLP policy at the last election which they opposed. Privatize all statutory organizations. I suspect that is also IMF policy that they are resisting.

    If you do your research you would see that a policy paper on privatisation was first promulgated by the late Mr David Thompson when he was Minister of Finance in 1994.


  5. @Bajanfuhlife

    You are saying Mia is also influencing the BWU, CTUSAB, Unity and the others?

    LikeLike
    0 0 i
    If Ms Mottley can’t influence her own party up to now; how can she influence others.

  6. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ Bajanfuhlife July 7, 2015 at 3:59 PM
    “Either user fees or cuts in expenditure (including staff). We can try as Donville and the BIDC are doing to do it in a structured way or as Owen Arthur called it privatization- either way, there will be dislocation.”

    Retribution is a bitch, isn’t it?
    So you are now ‘enjoying’ the fruits from your “No layoffs, No Privatization” tree of lies and deceit planted in the minds of the naïve people?
    Wasn’t the same Donville a major player in discrediting Owen Arthur’s proposals of privatization?
    Why should the people trust the devil incarnate?
    But there is a saying: “what you reap is what you sowed”. You won a general election based on a mantra of “no layoffs, no privatization”. You will soon lose one based on: “we lied to you, please forgive us and let us right the wrongs we have done”.

    Too late my friend, Bajanfuhlife, your botulism infected goose is fully cooked, now serve the poisoned stew.

  7. Fractured BLP Avatar

    I can see that Toni Moore and Akani Mc do- all gine soon have to tek up all the Garbage dumped across Barbados.

    Watch and see…….

  8. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ Fractured BLP July 7, 2015 at 6:39 PM

    Now where should they start to clean up the shit? In the Cabinet office on Bay Street or the cesspit in George Street? The tipping fee would be in the thousands of dollars for that stinking job of cleaning up after clowns ‘monkeying’ around with the serious business of government.
    Do you realize that nothing your administration has done since March 2013 has been positive to Barbados’s socio-economic development?

  9. Fractured BLP Avatar

    Breaking News

    Rosalind Smith on the CBC news tonight that the NUPW have authorised the:

    Shitting down of the country……the SSA will not be picking up garbage or assist with the burial of the dead!

    All of this for LOVE of country…….


  10. It is called “tough love”.
    Anything to rid ourselves of the DLP cancer…


  11. @Bushie,

    Get rid of the DLP cancer and you get BLP diabetes .

    Barbados is screwed.


  12. @ Hants
    One tends to focus on the currently active disease …and to leave worry about future ailments to fate. Wuh how do you think we ended up with this cancer? ..the lotta ‘sweets’ shiite engaged in by the Diabetic BLP led us to it….
    But you are correct…
    Nothing more depressing than a diabetic brass bowl with terminal cancer…
    On the positive side, you may be shocked at how much healing a national dose of sackcloth and ashes could achieve….

  13. are-we-there-yet Avatar
    are-we-there-yet

    Hants;

    Cancer ultimately leads to painful death, often rapidly. Diabetes can be treated.
    Which you prefer; Cancer or Diabetes?

  14. are-we-there-yet Avatar
    are-we-there-yet

    David asked why strike now?

    Let me try to give a few reasons.

    The former leaders of the two major unions ensured that their unions did not strike at the time when strikes might have made some difference to thousands of workers. Those leaders are now retired.

    The new leadership of the two unions are at last working for their pay.

    The rationale for the strike is a good one that will ultimately affect all workers. Backing down from the challenge and handing the Government another undeserved victory would not be in the best interests of the workers.

    There is and will be no better time than now when the Government is showing some signs of vulnerability. Recent disclosures of apparent movement from its traditional faux stance of being the party of the people, on a number of fronts (Commissiong summarizes some of them in a new blog) and the success of the Tipping fee strike point to that. The HoGs conference was a good time to test the waters. Having tested it, the Sanitation strike is the next best choice for phase II.

    Barbados was becoming even more apathetic under this Government than previously as the Government seemed to escalating its attacks on the needs of the people. The trajectory did not look good. If it continued the Government would be able to do almost anything and get away with it. Striking now, in the strategic manner that the new NUPW leadership appears to be doing, has the potential to allow the people to take back their country from an inept and seemingly trending towards a totally corrupt government. If the union continued to be the government doormat that was evidenced in the last 7 or so years we might well be placed in a position where it would be impossible to remove this government if we wanted to.

    The phase 1 and hopefully phase II action of the Unions is like a breath of fresh air in this country.

    I’m certain that several other posters can add to this short list of reasons why it is necessary for the unions to strike now.

  15. De Ingrunt Word Avatar
    De Ingrunt Word

    LOL Are-We, as they say be careful what you ask for…not saying you made the request.

    Very funny: “Cancer ultimately leads to painful death, often rapidly. Diabetes can be treated. Which you prefer; Cancer or Diabetes?”

    Remember now, some cancers are quite curable too. You gotta catch it early and pray it ts not the type to tek you to the grave.

    And yes, diabetes is generally curable but if you don’t treat it early you liable to lose toes or a foot or the whole leg.

    So at the end of the day both of them very painful, And whereas one is more likely to kill you, the other one can be a slow painful agony for years before death.

    It’s six feet down of Dem or down half dozen sweet stinging of Bees…Oh lawd, why we gen do!


  16. Bajanfuhlife July 7, 2015 at 3:59 PM #

    “I love how the partisans on this blog who have obvious political motives are rallying behind the Mottley backed NUPW executive in their folly to stop garbage collection over 13 BIDC workers.”

    Bajunfuhlife, you are an out right jackass political pimp and yard fowl.

    You come to this blog with pro DLP opinions or views, and are trying to convince BU you are NOT PARTISAN. Yet if anyone dares disagrees with any of the DLP’s policies or comes with an alternative view, you deem them as being partisan and a member of the BLP. What a load of shiite.

    It seems as though you are trying to tell sensible Barbadians that everything these DLP politicians do is CORRECT because you believe they ARE PERFECT AND CAN DO NO WRONG, SO ALL BARBADIANS MUST ENDORSE WHAT THEY DO. IF THEY DON’T THEY EITHER SUPPORT THE BLP OR ARE UNPATRIOTIC.

    By your standards, if anyone disagrees with the DLP and you are partisan…… you are a typical jackass yard-fowl political pimp who can’t think for himself.

    You choose to support the Democratic Labour Party, that is your right and we have to respect that.

    If other individuals choose to support the BLP, NDP. PEP, PDC or KFC, that is their right. You need to respect that.

    People like you really need to get a life. Imagine…. liking a political party much more than you like yourself. That is showing insecurity.


  17. For better or for worse this is called the democratic process at work although influenced by political mongrels, this type of demonstration would never have been allowed in a society the kinds that Bush shite like to adore like Castro Cuba ( who as of recent had a Damascus moment and bend to the WILLS of capitalism) or Venezuela dictator now deceased chavez ,
    it is amazing how the lovers of these dictatorships would be so eager to jump on the bandwagon to kick down the bucket that they themselves one stood on to give them assistance. how ironic,


  18. The govt must stand firm not flinch sooner or later strike fatigue would step in and the hundreds in numbers would decrease, bills still have to be paid mouths to be feed and the NUPW would have to contained the numbers by paying the strikers or calling off the strike either way it would put more pressure on the Unions,for govt on this issue silence is golden, the govt message should be one of no resolve. the govt have already spoken,


  19. Look……..the DEMS of the NUPW…. to wit……. Joseph Goddard, Walter Maloney and Dennis Clarke GONE, wunnah got to deal wid dat.

    How come when DEM did there and taking a DLP line, it was alright fuh wunnah, but now the union tekking a different line, it now partisan?

    The DEMS gone…….. deal wid it!!!


  20. the above comment confirms what everybody knows that the BLP are the drvers behind this strike by putting the new guards in place at NUPW after the ole guard left office

  21. Commander in Chief aka -Prankster the Mankster eating Mangoes sunnyside up and egging off while Alfing around to the Max Avatar
    Commander in Chief aka -Prankster the Mankster eating Mangoes sunnyside up and egging off while Alfing around to the Max

    But the electorate will take note Mr ac. Strike is like a boxer giving you a punch to chin. Might not knock you out but will certainly weaken you and down the road will tell on you when another punch (elections come around) then you will be knocked out


  22. I thought greek thinking was flawed…..bail us out again so we can renege on the payments and vote no to the plan we accepted to get the bail out.
    Barbados is no different, they workers want more money and benefits or we will shut the island down fill it with garbage to get our way and screw the tourist who’s money we need to pay for those raises.LOL
    The bajan donkey is not dead , this is one animal that will never be on the endangered list.


  23. “the govt message should be one of no resolve. the govt have already spoken”
    You mean even in the face of irrefutable evidence that they are wrong.
    I really have to believe that you ,Fractured and Eagerman are just playing devil’s advocate.


  24. @ balance
    I really have to believe that you ,Fractured and Eagerman are just playing devil’s advocate.
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    Ohhhh?
    ..so why can’t they be just brass bowl idiots?
    There is no shortage of this commodity.


  25. .’.so why can’t they be just brass bowl idiots?
    There is no shortage of this commodity.”
    impossible Bushie; even idiotism has its limits.


  26. LOL @ balance
    …you ever heard of AC?


  27. Greece given until Sunday to accept rescue package or be booted from the Eurozone.


  28. Barbados Government given until Friday or the country will be “shut down “.

    We are racing to the bottom of the pit.


  29. @Hants

    There is an irony somewhere in our last comments.


  30. ac July 8, 2015 at 12:06 AM #

    “the above comment confirms what everybody knows that the BLP are the drvers behind this strike by putting the new guards in place at NUPW after the ole guard left office…”

    The above comment proves beyond reasonable doubt that the DLP was actually running the unions. Walter Maloney, Dennis Clarke, Joseph Goddard and Leroy Trotman are known DEMS.

    The BLP being “the drivers behind this strike by putting the new guards in place at NUPW after the ole guard left office…” is sheer speculation.

    You don’t have any evidence to prove this nonsense. But “what everybody knows” is that Trotman, Maloney, Clarke and Goddard are members of the DLP.


  31. “and Goddard are members of the DLP”
    that Mr Goddard is a member of the DLP could be speculation as well. He was a candidate for the NDP in their disastrous foray as a political party.


  32. @Jeff

    Have you been able to cogitate on the widely publicized view of Tricia Watson re: the BIDC matter and the letting go of the 13?

    On 8 July 2015 at 22:09, Barbados Underground wrote:

    >


  33. My reading of the matter is that the language in the BIDC documents governing the body is dubious and both sides are interpreting them differently.

    This matter may not have escalated had Donville Innis not have been so arrogant and condescending. Earlier in this DLP self inflicted economic downturn, he declared that he did not want any salary cut as he has bills to pay. He who is alleged to have millions know that he has bills to pay but he does not think that the employees have bills to pay.

    Artaxerxes, forget ac, it is useless engaging them.


  34. @ David
    “..widely publicized view of Tricia Watson…”
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    LOL …she was at pains today to prove Bushie’s point that women should be kept as far as possible from serious leadership responsibilities….First of course by getting all worked up and emotional on the subject – to the point where she REFUSED to open-mindedly entertain contrary views…..
    …and then her attitude reeks of an immaturity that is REALLY scary.
    Her position seems to be typified by her contention that the LAW overrides relationship based protocols….and hence that the BIDC were justified in ignoring the union and following ‘the Law’.

    In the first place, ‘The Law’ is total and complete SHIITE, conceived and drafted by what we now know to be a set of corrupt and UNTRUSTWORTHY brass bowls who are Bajan Lawyers.
    Have you noted that EVERY SHIITE that they ‘draft’ have at least ten DIFFERENT possible interpretations? Cuh shiite man!!! you telling Bushie that we spend THOUSANDS of dollars sending to Sir Cave’s kingdom and then thousands more getting the LSC (or whatever the hell Mia don’t have) … and they cant write a SIMPLE law to detail when people can be sent on pension or not…?

    steupsss… do you know that those JAs could not even COPY the seat belt law properly…and as we speak it remains incomplete and open to different interpretations?

    Of course David, you would know that this is a DELIBERATE ploy to make THEIR ‘services’ critical…as well as to permit possible court judgements to go ‘any way that they determine’ based on who is involved….Imagine she is suggesting that based on a ‘Law’ like this, the BIDC has the right to arbitrarily send a particular set of people home WITHOUT any discussion with the people’s union?

    OBVIOUSLY a company has the RIGHT to make staff adjustments as they see fit, however it is not difficult to see why a FAIR, TRANSPARENT and consistent process should be applied…and why it should be transparent enough to pass muster with the Union. Having AGREED to such a protocol, what nonsense are they now saying…?

    What options does such stupidity leave the Union?
    …actually she sounded just like the two others (women also) who represented the BIDC who seem to be just repeating the shiite that they had been instructed to say….without thinking.

    LOL ….women seem to be able to carry out such instructions very well….and ‘Lawyer women’ are the pick of the crap….


  35. Forget ac , prodigal u talk nuff jobby forget ac steupse like ac looking for favour from any one . look the truth hurts and the govt is right the NUPW has tried pushing the goal post out of reach to stiffle and hijacked the process, fuhget ac could not care less ” had not for the blp bloating the public service after pm sandifords had cut it done to a substantial level of adequacy the present govt would not be having these major challenges that affects govt servants and require making hard choices
    a lot of this shite the blp owns since they were the original sponsers due in part to their reckless decision making which now has been past on to present govt, of course the blp pretends as if all these problems happen six years ago and should now be ashamed of inviting the citizens of this country to break up and mash up in the name of political gamesmanship,


  36. bush shite is just a jack a.ss who wants to take control of the blog, most agree with what he says because they are mental midgets and cowards but ac does not give a flying shite what he says or thinks, the imbecile cannot even manage his own blog but got answers for all the worlds problems pleazeee guve me a f,,king break, steupse,


  37. Akani Mcdowell the new star boy of trade unionism orders from his big mouth that no garbage will be collected and he is not changing his mind on a national strike no matter what the PM and his government does or says. The inmates have completely taken over the asylum. Caswell Franklyn a man with a dubious record and the notorious teachers Redman and Shepherd (this is smoke the fire coming ) are running riot. Someone asked when they get time to teach. The garbage which went uncollected in the best of times is rapidly getting to the stage of squalor of shanty towns in Latin America and Africa. Barbados is sinking to its knees over an issue that grown people should sit across a table and work out. The new general secretary of the NUPW a star (mon) in her own right is a power broker. Her every word has the potential to cause millions to vanish in capital flight not only that but lost confidence in the state of Barbados. Quo Vadis Barbados. This strike is uncalled for the repercussions could be disastrous. Meanwhile we have to keep our nasty maggot infested garbage with its health related consequences in our homes as the new star boy decreed. Yes siree.


  38. mia mottley and the blp misfits running around town talking about unfair speaking of unfair how about mia getting never obtaining her LEC when others were required to do so,


  39. “This strike is uncalled for the repercussions could be disastrous. Meanwhile we have to keep our nasty maggot infested garbage with its health related consequences in our homes as the new star boy decreed. Yes siree”

    MR MY TWO Cents -You could talk until the cows come home. The demonstration would take on strike proportions with the nasty maggot infested garbage uncollected unless those letters of dismissal are withdrawn and the BIDC sit down with the UNION to find alternative methods for the BIDC to cut costs in their purported restructuring exercise without forcing workers to retire


  40. Mr BUSH TEA-The Pensions (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 2004-25, which was published in the Official Gazette dated December 23, 2004 makes provision for all persons in the public service at January 1, 2005 to retire compulsorily at the age stipulated uner the National Insurance Scheme trumps and supersedes Section (8) of Cap 384 which the BIDC and Ms Watson are using as a red herring.


  41. @ balance
    The pertinent question is not about compulsory retirement age, but about the Board’s RIGHT to enforce earlier retirement….two different things.
    Generally one would EXPECT a Board to have the power to manage such issues as early retirement.

    Even if her interpretation is accepted, the idea that it can be EXECUTED in a high-handed arrogant manner without even the courtesy of speaking to the Union as agreed on the protocol is immensely IMMATURE.
    …somewhat like putting one’s hand in a lion mouth because some book says that man is king of the jungle….
    …and then complaining bitterly about having a prosthesis…..


  42. Big Talk Balance the govt is not going to renege , The Unions called for action is a disadvantage against the citizens of barbados where innocence would have to pay a price , This talk about telling govt What IT should do is not going to fly unless the law courts step in and says differently, In the meanwhile the govt can take action to rehire skilled labour who are retired to fill in areas if necessary, they are returning nationals also who would be happy to give of their services under these circumstances, the Unions have pick a big fight which in the long run might run them over,


  43. Can any one believe the nerve of Deputy Dawg alias bush shit to be questioning Mrs Watson expertise in an area where sh e is accomplished and successful have attained her LEC to practice law in Barbados ,question to u deputy dawg which college or university did u attend to get your LEC . clown.


  44. This inept incompetent bunch of misfits came to government in 2008 and went on a rampage hiring their yard fowls………….you ac, can deny this all you want but this is a fact causing the big problem where the idiot for a Finance minister began borrowing 40million dollars per month to pay salaries.

    Look how many the boo boo doctor took on at NCC from Christ Church East

    Look at how many the one from St Philip took on at NHC and look despite the so called freeze on hiring, he took on a relative at Transport Board that caused the recent strike.

    Everyone of the dems who had power get their people hired………

    You could really hush, you think we have short selective memories like you!

  45. Harold Yearwood Avatar
    Harold Yearwood

    No one is talking about the truck situation at the SSA. There are no trucks at the SSA. Blame the NUPW


  46. @ AC
    …you have NO class; no manners; no style; and no damn sense….
    Look to women like Pat, Donna, and Simple and learn…since your mother seem to have failed you…

    ….and when you go on Bushie’s blog talking shiite …don’t leave personal information
    – yuh goat!!


  47. Latest report confirmed the minister of labour is hard on the job to resolve the BIDC NUPW dispute. Contrary to Minister Inniss’ pronouncement the matter was reopened. Any wagers how it will be resolved? BU suspects those who have negotiated their cheques and want to early retire the decision will stand and the two or three who have not will be rehired.


  48. Oh shut up DEputy Dawg alias bus sh,it The Truth hurts .. got uh a,ss now,, YOU are in no position to set an agenda about How govt or any body should managed their affairs , First get Your F,,king house in order,then show the BU classroom how You did so.
    Get up in the BU classroom all day long huffing and puffing but ain;t got one ra,ss hole to show for it

    On another note the govt has cards that they can play against these rabble rouser , bring out the artillery i,e manpower and skilled workers who have a love for this country , Bring them OUT put them to work. This is a National emergency, no need to argue with idiots of the bush sh.it type , There Motto is SELF FIRST COUNTRY LAST,
    . It seems like the Union day to day strategy is weakening as the sight of Garbage is leaving a stench in the noses of the citizens as they say enough is enough and the Union leadership is finding itself in disagreement, Their strategy is foolhardy the repercussions from the fall out of the strike would find the unions disproportionate and less favorable with the people ,


  49. When ignorance is bliss and credibility is no-more.

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