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Earlier in another post someone mentioned Handel’s Messiah, here is one of my favourite pieces during the Xmas season. A peaceful and enjoyable Xmas to all.
GP:
First and foremost, a happy Christmas and a blessed new year to all.
Good job.
There are of course various views on eschatology, but a good summary with an emphasis on the significance of the parousia.
D
PS: I note that there are odd typos and you probably need to pull back a bit on the authorship of Hebrews. School of Paul yes. (I tend to go with Nash’s suggestion of Apollos in the Gospel and the Greeks.)
PPS: Wiki again! Here is the link on the relevant Christian eschatology.
@GP
Unfortunately the story of Christmas has been forgotten and overrun by materialistic motives. Here is the big question GP, can the Church pull it back? Serious doubts on whether the arcane approaches to a modern thinking will ever work.
Sargeant
Oh my Lorddddddddddddd, ya jus touch a ‘nerve’ man. De Classics is rite up my street man. Ya swoiteeee thang.
I also love “Joy to the world” by Royal Philharmonic Orchestra & Chorus with Peter Knight the Conductor.
Lorddddddddd mek peace.
All the best to you n yours for this Yuletide Season from me n mine.
Dr.Porgie,
Season’s Greetings to you n yours also from me n mine.
The people in that picture look very white. If the Christ that you speak of look anything like that lemmatellya I want he stay far far from me..!
@ BU David
Re
Unfortunately the story of Christmas has been forgotten and overrun by materialistic motives. Here is the big question GP, can the Church pull it back? Serious doubts on whether the arcane approaches to a modern thinking will ever work.
———————————————
In a recent post on BU I referred to Christ’s rhetorical question in Luke 18 (better appreciated in the Greek) When he asked, in veres 8b, “Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth? ”
The implied answer is NO. And the current errant behavior of the apostate
Church, and the onvious apathy of the TRUE church, indicates that his prediction was/is correct.
Hope this helps.
David // December 22, 2009 at 7:37 AM
@GP
Unfortunately the story of Christmas has been forgotten and overrun by materialistic motives. Here is the big question GP, can the Church pull it back? Serious doubts on whether the arcane approaches to a modern thinking will ever work.
+++++++++++++++++++
David
What …. or rather …… who …. is the Church?
GP
I sat and listened to Messiah piece by piece in a church a few evenings ago.
It may be that the tradition of standing was because the King stood and everyone followed suit …. but I found it impossible to sit …..
… the Hallelujah chorus as the final act of praise is beyond what I associate with human effort …… and yet it was humans doing it
…… inspired by their faith and wanting to praise their Maker and Redeemer.
Every voice, every instrument every person, fat, thin, short, tall, “black”, “white”, ugly , good looking seemed for a brief moment to have come together for one purpose.
BAFBFP
It really don’t matter what colour the people are in the scene …. or even what they look like.
Blessed and happy Christmas to all.
@ Dictionary
With respect to your comment against the Pauline authorship of Hebrews, I posit hereby my submission from the Study Guide on Hebrews that I wrote as part of th requireents formy Masters in Christian Education.
INTRODUCTION TO THE BOOK OF HEBREWS
1-AUTHOR:
The human author of the Epistle to the Hebrews has always been a keenly debated question. Although the Authorized Version has the heading, “Epistle of Paul the Apostle to the Hebrews,” there is still a question as to Authorship.
The Revised Version and other later versions simply entitle it the Epistle (or letter) to the Hebrews. Perusal of the literature on the Scriptures reveals that there is no unanimity of thought or agreement as to who is the author of this epistle, although many do accept Paul as the author.
However, the human author is not the important thing. It actually makes no great difference as to who wrote the book, but the fact that the Epistle to the Hebrews is part of God’s inspired Word is important. In any case the fact that the Book is written anonymously does not lessen its value, for, although there was doubt and mixed opinion over the authorship, the Book was declared canonical and the epistle was in use as early as 95 A.D.
Three reasons may be suggested why the Book is written anonymously, and why the human author of Hebrews was not disclosed at the time of its writing. From the divine standpoint: because God did not wish the name of the writer to be known, and thus saw fit to withhold it.
From the human standpoint, we might suggest that it was because of strong Jewish prejudice (if Paul is the author), or because the author was considered so well known there was no need to mention.
Although it is not possible for us to be absolutely certain who wrote the Book of Hebrews, and despite the fact that the Pauline authorship cannot be stated in a dogmatic fashion there is abundant evidence that Paul was the author.
Both internal and external evidence support the authorship of Paul as is discussed below.
THOSE WHO HAVE BEEN CONSIDERED AS THE AUTHOR OF THE BOOK….
A. The Apostle Paul is the earliest suggestion of the Church. He takes lead as to authorship, despite heavy debate in other directions. Clement of Alexandria, Origen, Eusebius, and Augustine all name Paul. Many others follow them.
B. Barnabas is also suggested, but the personality of Barnabas does not suit (cf. Galatians 2:13).
C. Apollos is also strongly presented. But Apollos was an orator more than a logician and teacher, and came from Alexandria. There is no record of an Epistle such as this by him, and no early tradition for him at all.
D. Several others have been suggested: Clement of Rome, Luke, Silas, Philip the deacon,
Priscilla, etc. But none of these has any ancient testimony, and there is actually nothing actually nothing factual upon which to base possibility of their authorship. They are really only guesses, the realm of pure conjecture.
III. THE EVIDENCE FOR THE PAULINE AUTHORSHIP OF THE BOOK…
A. The External Evidence Supporting Pauline Authorship:
1. The Ancient writers ascribe the Epistle to Paul. Such church fathers and early
writers as:
Clement of Alexandria 194
Origen 230
Dionysius 247
Theognostus 282
Eusebius 315
Cyril 347
Athanasius Before 360
Council of Laodicea 363
And many others, including many Latin writers in the 4th, 5th, and 6th centuries.
2. The early Church held almost universally to Pauline authorship,
3. The Greek order of the New Testament Books always placed Hebrews with the Pauline Epistles, between Thessalonians and Timothy.
4. Peter says Paul wrote a Book to the Jews of the dispersion. Compare I Peter 1:1 with II Peter 3:1, 15,16. I believe that Peter identifies Paul as the writer in 11 Pet. 3:15-16), and that there is good and sufficient reason for Paul’s changing his style and for not giving his name in this particular epistle.
5. Paul testifies that his salutation is affixed to every Epistle, Compare II Thessalonians 3:17 with Hebrews 13:25.
6. The order in Romans, Galatians, and Hebrews suggests Pauline authorship, Hebrews.10: 38; Galatians 3: 11; Romans 1: 17.
Romans expounds first two words: “The just”
Galatians expounds second two words: “shall live”
Hebrews expounds third two words: ” by faith”.
7. Paul’s yearning for Isreal are expressed would find logical expression in the Book
of Hebrews. cf. Romans 9:1-3,
B. The Internal evidence supporting Pauline authorship,
1. The writer is a Jew and a Christian who identifies himself with readers, 1: 2, 2: 1; etc. and makes statements not applied to those other than believers, 3:1,6; 4:14-16; 10:23-25; etc.
2. There is evidence of Pauline authorship in the style of writing in the Epistle.These include:
a. The use of words and phrases:
(1) The words: ” signs, wonders, and miracles” – sometimes rearranged,
Hebrews.2:4; cf. Rom. 15:19; Acts 15:12; II Cor.12:12; II Thess. 2:9.
(2) The reference to “high -or- holy calling,”
Hebrews 3:1 cf. Phil.3:14; II Tim.1: 9.
(3) The use of the expression “milk and strong meat,”
Hebrews 5:12, cf. I Cor. 3:2.
(4) The reference to “the right hand of God,”
Hebrews 8:1 cf. Eph. 1:20.
(5) The allusion to Christ “The Mediator,”
Hebrews 8:6; 9:15; 12:24; cf. Gal. 3:19-20; I Tim 2:5; and nowhere else in the N.T.
(6) The similarity of Hebrews 10:33 with 1 Cor. 4:9.
b. The Writer closes the Epistle in characteristic Pauline style:
(1) The use of the word “grace,”
Hebrews 13:25, cf 1-Thess. 5:28; II Thess. 3:18; Col. 4:18; ITim. 5:21;II Tim. 4:22.
(2) The request for the readers to pray for him,
Hebrews 13:.18,with Rom 15:30;Eph.-6:18-19;Col. 4:3;I Thess.5:25; II Thess. 3:1.
(3) The writer, asking for the prayers of his readers, also prays for them,
Hebrews 13:20-2l, cf. Rom.15:5-6,13; 16:25-27;Eph.6:19,23; I Thess.5:23-24; IIThess.2:16-17; 3:16
(4) The writer’s closing word of salute,
Hebrews 13:24. with Rom. 16; 1 Cor.16:19-21; IICor. 13:13; Phil.4:22; Col.4:15; Tit.3:15.
c. The Writer is intimately acquainted with his readers, and has been well treated
by them, 10:34; 13:9, 23.
d. The content of the Epistle Is Pauline in order.
(1) Doctrine, up to 10:19,
(2) Duty, from 10:19 to the end.
e. If the Epistle was written in Rome, as suggested by 13:34, this would indicate Pauline authorship, since:
(1) The Apostle Paul was In Italy, i.e., Rome, a prisoner of the Romans, and wrote several of his Epistles from Rome.
(2) The writer desires his readers to pray for him that he might be restored to them the sooner, 13:18-19.
(3) The writer mentions Timothy, 13:23, who was with Paul during his first imprisonment in Rome (See Philippians and Colossians.) Note that when the Apostle writes to Timothy (I Tim.1:2;II Tim.1:2), he calls him “son.” But when he mentions him to others, he calls him “brother,” cf. II Cor. 1:1; Col.1:1; I Thess. 3:2.
Sargeant
Your posting of piece #15 from the first or Christmas part of Handel’s Oratorio is of course very important and most germane to the concept of the Second Coming of Christ.
The words used in this peace are those of the text of Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born , unto us a son is given : and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor , The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
First we must note that a child is born, but that a son is given. Because in the OT economy a boy child and a son are NOT necessarily synonymous. That is a very important point that some one who though only being exposed to the collect, epistle and gospel on Sundays will challenge. But I will deal with that then.
Next we must point out that whereas the prophecy before the colon in the text refers obviously to the first advent of Christ, that the prophecy after the colon clearly refers to the second coming of Christ, since at his first advent, Christ did not really fully assume any of the characteristics of the several names ascribed to him in this passage.
Thirdly we would point out that it was not at all by accident that the most vivid of all the Old Testament prophecies relating to the coming Davidic King (Messiah) were made during the reign of Ahaz (Isa. 7:1—12:6), and that this prophecy was part of that particular series of prophetic utterances by Isaiah.
In the time of Ahaz exemplified things were so bad that at this time in her history the nation needed a faithful Son of David more than ever. Isaiah. Was a prophet who spoke in Ahaz’s reign and promised that He would appear (Isa. 7:1—12:6).
It is necessary to turn to Isaiah 7 for a full picture of what occurred at this critical time in the affairs of the kingdom of Judah..
During Jotham’s reign, clouds had begun to gather on the political horizon in the shape of a military combination of Syria and Israel against Judah, who had menaced Judah at that time. As a result of Ahaz’s wickedness, what was only a cloud during the reign of Jotham his father had now become more acute now. In Ahaz’s reign as these two kingdoms united with the intention to conquer Ahaz and overthrow the throne of Judah put a man of their own choosing on the throne of Judah in the place of Ahaz. They were threatening to exterminate the house of David. Con¬sequently God had to act.
God would not allow them to carry out this plan, or to invade Jerusalem at this time, and sent a message to the frightened king, assur¬ing him that the plans of the two confederate kings to drive him from his throne would not be carried out, and pointing out the consequences to himself of refusing to believe in God (Isa. 7:5-9). Ahaz might have had God for an ally against the enemies who threatened him, if only he had turned to Him and trusted Him. But Ahaz would not do this, and so God showed him how helpless he was to fight against Syria and Israel in his own strength.
And yet the Lord condescended to plead with Ahaz that he put his trust in Him. So he sent the Prophet Isaiah to counsel and encourage the king at this time of crisis.
This prophecy is part of the counsel and the encouragement to the king .
The second part of the verse that Handel uses here is very interesting. It refers to the common practice of ancient kings to ascribe to themselves the titles of the kings they captured in battle, and to give themselves lofty names which they could not live up to.
In Isaiah 9:6b, however, the prophet is telling Ahaz that although the Nation of Judah would soon come to nothing because of their sin, that God would one day restore the kingdom in the future when David’s greater Son would come to reign first for 1000 years, and the for ever. The coming king would live up to his names, unlike any other king before him, and will truly be Wonderful, Counsellor , The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
I try not to get caught up in the frenzy of Christmas. Some how I used to like the old time Christmas of when I used to be a little child, the giving and receiving of simple but genuine gifts were more realisitic. For me now, Christmas is going to midnight mass or 5 a.m. service and singing ‘Good Christian men rejoice” among my favorites, then returning home and spending the rest of the day with family. This Christmas my sister and her family would be in from overseas and along with my wife’s close relatives, we would have a great time God willing.
To each and every one, have a joyous Christmas and remember the true reason of the season. For me it is a special season because I have had a very trying year and I’m thank God for bringing me to this point where I can mix with friends and relatives and give special tthanks to the ALmighty.
@ Dictionary
There are of course various views on eschatology, but a good summary with an emphasis on the significance of the parousia.
Re The powerpoint submitted was projected on Sunday here in Fl to a very receptive audience including several men, who are all themselves very capable of expounding on the subject.
I am fully aware that they are some that dont belive in a rapture (parousia) at all , and some that enter in to debate concerning the timing of the rapture, in relationship to both the tribulation and the millennium. But it would be futile here to plumb the depths of such a debate with the current audience to whom I am reaching out in cyberspace.
The first part of the discussion gives a 10 point outline that may be used to simplify and classify the doctrine, and provides ten pegs on which one can hang the information gleaned by SEARCHING the Scriptures.
For example though the concept of the millennium is only mentioned in a couple verses in Revelation 20, the time line in the general 10 point outline allows the reader to realize that all the scriptures on this subject grasped from surveying the streams rivers and tributaries of OT prophey enters into the sea of rEvelation at this point in time.
It also gives a clear and simple indication of God’s agenda for the future as taught in the Scriptures for novitiates to the subject. As one studies further, one can import one’s gleanings from their search, study and right division of individual prophetic passages.
Not every one is able to delve in and pour through Dwight Pentecosts seminal tome on this doctrine– THINGS TO COME!
Following this informative introduction I proceeded to explore some of the interesting things about the second coming in a simple superficial way, providing initial exposures to novitiates, and needful review for the better informed.
By Graham Smith
Last updated at 4:57 PM on 21st December 2009
*
Father Tim Jones
‘Highly irresponsible’: Father Tim Jones has been criticised after advising his congregation to shoplift following his Nativity sermon
A clergyman has been criticised as ‘highly irresponsible’ after advising his congregation to shoplift following his Nativity sermon.
Father Tim Jones, 41, broke off from his traditional annual sermon yesterday to tell his flock that stealing from large chains is sometimes the best option for vulnerable people.
It is far better for people desperate during the recession to shoplift than turn to ‘prostitution, mugging or burglary’, he said.
The married father-of-two insisted his unusual advice did not break the Bible commandment ‘Thou shalt not steal’ – because God’s love for the poor outweighs his love for the rich.
But the minister’s controversial sermon at St Lawrence Church in York has been slammed by police, the British Retail Consortium and a local MP, who all say that no matter what the circumstances, shoplifting is an offence.
Delivering his festive lesson, Father Jones told the congregation: ‘My advice, as a Christian priest, is to shoplift. I do not offer such advice because I think that stealing is a good thing, or because I think it is harmless, for it is neither.
‘I would ask that they do not steal from small family businesses, but from large national businesses, knowing that the costs are ultimately passed on to the rest of us in the form of higher prices.
‘I would ask them not to take any more than they need, for any longer than they need.
‘I offer the advice with a heavy heart and wish society would recognise that bureaucratic ineptitude and systematic delay has created an invitation and incentive to crime for people struggling to cope.’
He added that he felt society had failed the needy, and said it was far better they shoplift than turn to more degrading or violent options such as prostitution, mugging or burglary.
Father Jones cited the example of an ex-prisoner who had been forced to live on less than £100, including a crisis loan, over six weeks after his release from jail.
He continued: ‘My advice does not contradict the Bible’s eighth commandment because God’s love for the poor and despised outweighs the property rights of the rich.
‘Let my words not be misrepresented as a simplistic call for people to shoplift. The observation that shoplifting is the best option that some people are left with is a grim indictment of who we are.
‘Rather, this is a call for our society no longer to treat its most vulnerable people with indifference and contempt. Providing inadequate or clumsy social support is monumental, catastrophic folly.’
But a spokesman for North Yorkshire Police said: ‘First and foremost, shoplifting is a criminal offence and to justify this course of action under any circumstances is highly irresponsible.
‘Turning or returning to crime will only make matters worse, that is a guarantee. We recognise some people find themselves in difficult circumstances but support is readily available and must be sought.’
Local Tory MP Anne McIntosh, who has campaigned in Parliament for stronger sentences for shoplifters, admitted that there had been an ‘over-commercialisation’ of the festive period which encourages people to spend.
But she said: ‘I cannot condone inciting anyone to commit a criminal offence, shoplifting is a crime against the whole local community and society.’
Richard Dodd, spokesman for the British Retail Consortium, said he was surprised that a priest was encouraging his congregation to steal.
‘He’s failing to appreciate that it’s the job of our welfare system to deal with vulnerable people,’ he said. ‘That’s how to deal with the vulnerable, not calling for them to steal from shops.’
Mr Dodd added: ‘Stealing is wrong and it isn’t less wrong to steal from a big retailer than it is to steal from a small retailer.
‘I thought this was a central part of every religion.’
This isn’t the first time Father Jones has courted controversy.
He hit the headlines in May 2008 when he protested against a shop stocking Playboy stationery aimed at youngsters. He tossed the items onto the floor complaining they were ‘cynical and wicked’. The shop bowed to his one-man protest and agreed to stop stocking Playboy-branded merchandise.
GREAT ADVICE!
Got to start calling this the gospel blog.
@BAFBFP
The pic is meant to be symbolic.
@ROK
Is yours a fair comment? BU as you know blogs about wine to iodine. What you infer maybe the religious element is very active with comments.
This man does not celebrate any christian festivals.I would not not be part of any religious doctrine that was used to enslaved the body & imprisoned the mine of my African fore-parents.The church played a vital & pivotal role in slavery and I would not insult the memories of the pain & suffering my enslaved for-parents endured at the hands of white European savages.
I would love to encourage my fellow black brothers & sisters to come & celebrate Kwanzaa with me.Kwanzaa is a more purposeful & meaningful activity for us African Black people than the nonsense Christmas with its hypocrisy & deceit.
Black people get over the nonsense associated with Christmas and come celebrate Kwanzaa.
@BU David
BU as you know blogs about wine to iodine. What you infer maybe the religious element is very active with comments.
===========
There is indeed a very high standard of Bible teaching on BU.
Last night I picked some more at Part 2 of Prostate diseases Sir, and I promise to continue doing so each day to meet a possible deadline by week end.
None of the local papers can approach the standard of teaching and information sharing on Bible or Sience that BU is doing.
I wonder if when, as Anon, I suggested the Jokes Corner (now doing very well) if the BU family would have scoffed and mocked as they have on the other threads that I have started, or participated.
@ John
Re David
What …. or rather …… who …. is the Church?
==========================
With out going into an erudite exposition of the doctrine of the church or Ecllesiology.
We can say that the True Church exists as the Church Universal comprising of all local churches everywhere.
The local church is the active or millitant functional units of the church (like a plattoon or squadron).
According to NT teachings a local church is composed of RGENERATED BAPTIZED BELIEVERS (baptized by immersion- as baptism by immersion is the ONLY method of baptism taught anywhere in the Scriptures).
On reading the record of the origin and growth of the early church, it is clearly stated that those who were added to the church had all believed the gospel message concerning the vicarious substututiobary sacrificial death of Christ as the salve and solution for sin. …….and that they had done so by grace through faith.
It is also clear that following regeneration (or being born again out from above) that believers such as the Ethiopian eunuch sought to be baptised by immersion, which is a symbol of the acceptance or identification of Christ’s death and his arising again to life according to the definition of the gospel ennunciated in 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 thus
For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures
This in a nutshell is “what the church is.”
But if you read a Systematic Theology Text (or take a course in Systematic Theology at a proper Bible school) such as EVAN’s Great Doctrines of the Bible or Thiessen’s or Chafffers’s Systemaic Theology you will see there gathered all the sScriptures that pertain to the church that describe it as
A BRIDE
A BODY
A BUILDING
That speaks of its origin, its purpose, its rewards, its judgement, its trials and hatred by the world etc
You will also possibly then be able to distinguish the TRUE CHURCH from Christendom!
Peace and good health to all men, may we dwell in a house of “love”; and let our hearts reach out to those less fortunate than ourselves as we seek no reward for so doing.
May our thoughts encompass those to whom our festivities mean little, and grant us grace so we cease to complain about the darkness but light a candle of peace.
A happy Christmas to the BU Family and Barbadians everywhere.
I made this video about Christ’s birth, life, death, & resurrection. May we remember the real meaning of Christmas this year!
Trina
Thanks for your video.
It contains some paintings I found on the Oremus Hymn site; but there are some very good ones that I had not seen previously.
Could you kindly send me the link for this presentation or a copy to
lswiltshire@hotmail.com
for use in Sunday School and Good News Clubs?
Here are the lyrics for the songs I sang on Sunday Night for my church’s Christmas party.
They reflect the contemporary contempt for Christ, and ask pertinent, poignant questions.
THE KEEPER OF THE INN
Long years ago in Bethlehem the keeper of the inn,
for Joseph, Mary and the Babe would make no room within,
He bolted fast the wooden door and made them go away
into a bed less stable where they slept upon the hay.
Now you are keeper of the inn and Jesus stands outside,
the latchstring hangs inside the door will you let Him inside?
Then, Jesus came in human flesh to die for all our sin.
Now He in spirit comes to man and asks to enter in.
Now you are keeper of the inn, the inn which is your heart,
the choice is yours to ask him in or bid him to depart.
Now you are keeper of the inn and Jesus stands outside,
the latchstring hangs inside the door will you let Him inside?
Now you are keeper of the inn the inn which is your heart,
the choice is yours to ask him in or bid him to depart.
DO YOU KNOW THE CHRIST CF CHRISTMAS
Do you know the Christ of Christmas? Precious Babe of lowly birth
Gift of love from God the Father; Savior given to all the earth
Do you know the Christ of Christmas? Does he live within your heart?
Can you say to Him “My Savior!? Worship Him as CHRIST THE LORD?
Do you know the Christ of Christmas? He’s the Christ of Calvary.
Heavenly guest, despised, rejected; Crucified for you, for me.
Have you room for Him 0 listen! Do you bid Him to depart!
Take Him now to be your Saviour, Christ of Christmas in your heart.
When you know the Christ of Christmas, Joy of Joys to you belong;
Peace that passeth understanding, Wcndrous, new redemption song.
Life eternal your possession, precious promise now of God!
When you know Him as your Saviour Christ of Christmas in your heart.
@Bonnie Pepper & John
You aint hear or seen the Messiah performed like it was by the Boston Philharmonic under the conductor ship of the great (in my estimation) Seiji Ozawa. Man, it brought tears to the eyes. Music sweet for days.
I also watched the taping of Jessye Norman’s arias and other operatic pieces, also conducted by Seiji, music to die for.
I have my TV hooked to my stereo and the sound comes through my Goodman (British) speakers with excellent separation. The speakers are bo0kcase, three way, and over 30 years old and I would never part with them, nor my amplifier also old and a Toshiba. I have two turntables, both wood. In those days products were well made. Made to last with real wood and chrome.
I have three copies of Handel’s Messiah by different orchestras and choirs. Each set is some 6 or 8 LP’s. It takes half a day to play. Have to dig out one and check my stylus in case I feel like that music during the week.
To all who celebrate, A Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. To the Jews among us a Happy Hannukah. I think you should be on the eighth or ninth candle last night (not sure).
Takes three hours to perform Handel’s Messiah.
Some one just sent me this Alphabet, so I will share it.
Although things are not perfect
B ecause of trial or pain
Continue in thanksgiving
Do not begin to blame
Even when the times are hard
Fierce winds are bound to blow
God is forever able
Hold on to what you know
Imagine life without His love
Joy would cease to be
Keep thanking Him for all the things
Love imparts to thee
Move out of ‘Camp Complaining’
No weapon that is known
On earth can yield the power
Praise can do alone
Quit looking at the future
Redeem the time at hand
Start every day with worship
To ‘thank’ is a command
Until we see Him coming
Victorious in the sky
We’ll run the race with gratitude
Xalting God most high
Yes, there’ll be good times and yes some will be bad, but…
Zion waits in glory…where none are ever sad!
‘I AM Too blessed to be stressed!’ The shortest distance between a problem and a solution is the distance between your knees and the floor.
The one who kneels to the Lord can stand up to anything. Love and peace be with you forever, Amen.
@ GP
You are right it is about 3 hours or half a day. I have not played my copies in years.
Pat
I know cause I grew up on it from age 8. LOL
Are we not all gods children
I AM a Child of the SUN
Pat,
So was your father into music too?
Pat
London Philharmonic Orchestra and
The Royal Philharmonic are really good too. I just love the Classics girl. This music is enjoyed at a really romantic candle-lit dinner with the ‘significant other’.That is a romantic setting girl. Blow ya mind. Along with the ‘sweet-nuttins’ being whispered in ya ear. LOL. Lord mek peace.
ROK, tek note.Murtherrrrrrrrrrrrrr.
Sargeant
Pull up ‘Ave Maria’. I think it is by Schubert. And also ‘I know that my Redeemer liveth” by Handel. Please. And while ya at it, please post, Brooke Benton’s ‘You’re all I want for Christmas’. ‘Special dedication to my ROK.Thank you kind sir.
Hopi
When I heard about what this Reverend advised his congregation to do, I could not help but laugh. Guess the commandment about stealing doesn’t apply in his church. Somebody should cah way de offering collection and see how stink he would ‘buse. LOL
My Negro d Hero
Happy Kwanza ta you n yours from me n mine.
Bro.Scout
Save a plate for me pleezeeeeeeeeeee.
I ain’ wishin’ a fella a t’ing dis year.. it would be hypocritical of me as a practicing Atheist… but if anybody pass by me I got a barrel ah see-t’ru fah a li’l merriment..!
Georgie
“for use in Sunday School and Good News Clubs?” Are really prepared to expose Black kids to this sort of imagery and preach divinity? You’d be setting them up man… I beg cease and desist…!
@ Crusoe
Yes, but not as much as my son and I. I started my classical musical phase in univeristy where we got tickets free from the music department. We also got for the ballet and other musicals as well.
I had subscriptions to the orchestra for my son from age 7 as he was taking conservatory. I got my father to take him once as I had work to catch up with on that Saturday and would you believe that was the first time he had heard a live orchestra?
He introduced me to Handel’s Messiah. He had the London Philharmonic rendering. After taking my son, he would phone and ask if I needed him to take him to the concerts. He would never think of buying tickets for himself, or me and my son. lol
BAFBFP // December 22, 2009 at 4:59 PM
I ain’ wishin’ a fella a t’ing dis year.. it would be hypocritical of me as a practicing Atheist… but if anybody pass by me I got a barrel ah see-t’ru fah a li’l merriment..!
********************************
You can still wish people “Merry Whatever and Happy Everything”!
I have a 6 gallon carboy here filled to the neck with home made red wine. It is the best you would taste. Medium dry with a hint of cherry and aroma of apples. Alcohol content about 12 – 15%. Not quite a port, but good in my estimation. ha ha ha
Will be bottling this weekend. If you drop by my place you will get a bottle.
BAFBFP // December 22, 2009 at 5:05 PM
Georgie
“for use in Sunday School and Good News Clubs?” Are really prepared to expose Black kids to this sort of imagery and preach divinity? You’d be setting them up man… I beg cease and desist…!
@GP…
There is a part of Revelation that describes…’ hair like sheep wool and skin like bronze burnt in the furnace’…can you explain to me what this about?
I was watching a program last night where these scientists were trying to determine what Jesus looked like as a boy and on into manhood. They took the skull of a kid from Galilee (did I spell it right) and used this reconstruction technique to show what he most probably looked like growing up and into manhood. The end result is nothing like what I saw as a kid growing up in the Church. I have always wondered about the pictures in Churches which depict Christ as a blue eyed, blond haired Caucasian from that geographical part of the world.
Can you shed any light on this?
I merging this year… yah gettin turkey ham and pork wine
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAghhhhhhhhhhh
rapture of the church will be 1st
then the 2nd comming
grace and peace
Rapture of the church or parousia is part of second coming. At this stage Jesus comes in the air FOR the saints or the church.
Then a t the Glorious apearing in ephiphany or glorious appearing he comes down to the Mount of Olives with the saints to fight at Armageddon.
After reading some of the exchanges on the religious blogs the following extract from the Barbados Constitution came to mind.
19. (1) Except with his own consent, no person shall be
conscience. hindered in the enjoyment of his freedom of conscience and for the purpose of this section the said freedom includes freedom of thought and of religion, freedom to change his religion or belief,
and freedom, either alone or in community with others, and
both in public and in private, to manifest and propagate his
religion or belief in worship, teaching, practice and observance.
(2) Every religious community shall be entitled, at its own
expense, to establish and maintain places of education and to
manage any place of education which it wholly maintains.
(3) No religious community shall be prevented from providing
religious instruction for persons of that community in
the course of any education provided by that community
whether or not that community is in receipt of any government
subsidy, grant or other form of financial assistance designed to
meet, in whole or in part, the cost of such course of education.
Part (3) of the section of the constitution cited is surprising to me.(One learns something on BU everyday). It suggests that Gov’t may provide financial assistance to a religious group to promote religious instruction. I would prefer that the constitutional provisions be:
(3) No religious community shall be prevented from providing religious instruction for persons of that community in the course of any education provided by that community.
(4) The government shall not provide any religious community any government subsidy, grant or other form of financial assistance designed to
meet, in whole or in part, the cost of such course of religious instruction.
The education act actually makes religious education a compulsory part of the curriculum. I believe this should be removed from the act and public schools should recognise the multi-faith composition of the student body and not promote an Anglican world view as if dis-establishment had not taken place.
@David
Never thought you would have gotten in the way of stone throwing. That was quite a laugh.
I hope that the extract from the constitution has demonstrated how people like Zoe, Gp, and that ilk infringe the constitutional rights of their victims by getting on here and cursing people who don’t share their opinions; calling them idiots, ignorant, secreting bovine excrement and all the derogatory words they could find.
After they do that, they don’t expect the same to be done to them and so go crawling and complaining if it is done to them. It is one thing to propagate and have that freedom, but then expect me to propagate too; it is my freedom.
That is what makes my comment fair in principle. Nothing wrong with my hands, I could pelt stones too. By the way, that was a grain of sand, not even a pebble.
Sorry David but I am not following this thread. I may not come back to it either.
I agree with you Anonymous.
Your submission is fair and balanced.
All religious groups should fund their own agendas.
This is scriptural and in keeping with the Biblical teaching of the separation of Church and State.
We are very happy not to have Rok on these threads.
It seems that God is definitely still on the throne!
I dont think that Zoe or GP have ever crawled or complained, and we have been battered all year.
I remember in the thread on Rise Of Antichrist & The Dead Sea scrolls Mr King comment on one of my exegeses of one of the chapters in Daniel with the words “SWINE FLU”!.
Its archived! Its also arcived how he sought to persecute me all year and that I have ignored him. I simply refused to get in the muck and mire with him LOL.
None of the men from the so called “Bat Cave” have crawled and complained to any one. The record will show that. You see we expect that we will be hated for “his names sake.”
We justkeep on giving sound exegesis on commentary ofthe word having SEARCHED IT AND STUDIED IT. So we can BOLDLY DIVIDE IT CORRECTLY AND WE ARE NOT ASHAMED TO DO SO. LOL ROTFLMAO!
We are not going to ask you to follow or come back Rocky ma boy. The debaesand discussion went very far and long even after you ducked out early on Biochemistrey and Evolution! LOL ROTFLMAO!
wa after ver ing if it is done to them. complained hope that the extract from If a man is an idiot — he is an idiot, and his idiocy will rise to the surface.
If a man DOES NOT KNOW HE IS IGNORANT (Latin derivation is ignoro-ignorare — ignoravi — ignoratum = to know) . There is nothing wrong with telling the truth.
And bovine excrement is just an elegant eay of saying bull shit. Such a product made by methanagogs is harmless, and in dried form is used as a fuel for cooking!
Swine flu on the other hand Mr King? LOL RATFLMAO!
I submit to onlookers (quoting the eloquent Dictionary) that there is nothing derogatory there. LOL ROTFLMAO.
We know that you can pelt stones Mr King Sir. We have seen you do it all year. And neither your stones or your grains of sand or pebbles, has affected us one bit.
We know that you have nothing of substance to share on the nuances of the doctrine of the Secnd Coming, and we do appreciate your absence, as we did on the subject of Biochemistry.
Do have a lovely Season Mr Rok. Go make Bonny Peppa happy. LOL ROFLMAO!
Handel Encore
@GP…
There is a part of Revelation that describes…’ hair like sheep wool and skin like bronze burnt in the furnace’…can you explain to me what this about?
Techie ma boy.
It seems that you are quoting from Revelation 1:14& 15.
14 His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire;
15 And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace, and his voice as the sound of many waters.
16 And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword; and his countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength.
These verses come from a section of this chapter that deal with the deity or God head of Christ (vv. 13-16). John is describing Jesus from the viewpoint of His deity.
In verse 13-14 he speaks of his PERSONALITY.
In verse 14-15 he speaks of his POTENTIALITY OR POWERS.
In verse 16 he speaks of his PREROGATIVES or RIGHTS.
In verse 16 also he speaks of his PREEMINENCE
The significance of the description of the snowy white hair of His head is to declare his eternity or duration of existence and to recognize that HE IS GOD!
This demonstrates the necessity for SEARCHING the Scriptures to find Christ as Jesus him self affirmed in John 5:39, and the importance of STUDYING SO THAT ONE CAN RIGHTLY DIVIDE THE WORD OF TRUTH.
When we go back to Daniel 7:9 we see the same description for the Ancient of Days.
These symbols as we know fro Daniel 7 9 set forth the glory of god as judge upon his throne. His throne. Thus we learn that the Son of Man, Himself, possesses the characteristics of the Ancient of Days seen in the vision of Daniel.
Notice that Jesus’ hair is white like wool. This is a simile! Note the word “like”. It does not say he had wolly hair, or that he was a blonde! Wool is only used to represent something white, and white represents purity. This is the point, which John re-emphasizes with the image of snow. It’s the spiritual representation of absolute purity and righteousness that’s important about the appearance of Christ’s head and hair in this passage, not a mundane matter like physical hair texture.
Here the pure white head and hair matches exactly the scene of Dan. 7:9. There it represents the everlasting antiquity of God the Father, and here it can symbolize only this same thing with reference to the Son. He too is eternal; He too is God.
Thus John describes his vision of the appearance of the empowered Christ as He is in the heavenly realm. Like a parable, the elements of a vision represent something else. Unlike a parable, in which ordinary items or situations are presented to represent spiritual things, depicting a vision requires the teller to do just the opposite, and describe spiritual things in ordinary terms. This is far more of a challenge, to writer and reader alike. What becomes important are the concepts behind the images described.
His flaming eyes show His supernatural ability to see everything. He sees what is going on upon the earth at all times; He sees into the heart of every man—He is omniscient. How fearful is this portent of judgment to the one who has yet not asked Christ in repentance to wash away his sins (Rom. 10:9,13). His eyes were as a flame of fire; ” setting forth the searching character of that gaze from which nothing can be hid.
The phrase ” His feet like unto fine brass as if they burned in a furnace,” speaks of the in¬flexible holiness of walk, that never turns to any crooked way, or is undefiled by any soil of earth. The imagery or symbolism of his brazen feet has nothing to do with his skin color, but His omnipresence is signified by feet of brass, beautiful and terrible, but set for judgment (cp. John 5:22 where he states that the Father has given him the authority to judge.
His feet seem to be clad in brass boots, still glistening white hot from the furnace. This symbolizes the fierce judgment which is about to fall upon the ungodly from the feet of the Son of Man. In Dan. 7:7 the third beast, the Grecian empire, stamped in judgment and in de¬struction with its feet. Christ will stamp in judgment all through the seven year Tribulation and especially at Armageddon at its close, Rev. 6:16-17; 14:19; 16:1; 19:15-21.
Here we have compared scripture with scripture, as required by 2 Peter 1:20, and followed the principles of John 5:39 & 2 Tim 2:15 to arrive at the correct answer by sound exegesis.
Sargeant
Thanks for that piece.
The text is of course from Isaiah 40:4
@ Technician
RE I was watching a program last night where these scientists were trying to determine what Jesus looked like as a boy and on into manhood. They took the skull of a kid from Galilee (did I spell it right) and used this reconstruction technique to show what he most probably looked like growing up and into manhood. The end result is nothing like what I saw as a kid growing up in the Church. I have always wondered about the pictures in Churches which depict Christ as a blue eyed, blond haired Caucasian from that geographical part of the world.
Can you shed any light on this?
Yes I CAN TECHIE.
THIS IS ALL RUBBISH! NOT SCIENCE! EVEN THOUGH THEY WERE USING A SCIENTIFIC TECHNIQUE USED CURRENTLY IN FORENSICS. But now they use the skull of the victims.
WE SIMPLY DO NOT KNOW WHAT CHRIST LOOKED LIKE. HE IS NEVER DESCRIBED IN THE BIBLE OR IN LITERATURE ANYWHERE.
Unlike you, I have never wondered about the pictures in Churches which depict Christ as a blue eyed, blond haired Caucasian from that geographical part of the world. I appreciate the pictures as very great art by great artists of that era of history, and use the pictures for what they are worth.
For those who like LSO
GP
Does the Bible detail any specific events that will precede phase 1? If so what are these events?
BP
Jessye Norman- Ave Maria
Besides the verses in Isaiah which appear in Handel’s Messiah, others exist which help with day to day life.
Here is one as it appears in the various versions of the Bible.
http://bible.cc/isaiah/40-31.htm
Handel’s Messiah is long, no two ways about it.
The performance I watched only lasted about an hour which means I have alot more to see and read.
Youtube provided a six part series on it and also a 14 part series.
I tried the six part series. Each part lasted about 9 minutes, about an hour in all with music and explanation.
Here is the link to the first part.
I think I will do some more googling to find all of the verses used from the Bible and make a point of reading around each one so I get it straight from the Bible.
That is my new year resolution which I have already started. I expect it will take me some time …. but at least I am not starting from scratch.
@Anonymous // December 22, 2009 at 11:30 PM
GP
Does the Bible detail any specific events that will precede phase 1? If so what are these events?
===================
The Bible give general details of events that will precede phase 1 in what is referred to as the OLIVET DISCOURSE as recorded in Matthew 24-25; Mark 13, Luke 21.
Mostly the OLIVET DISCOURSE deals with signs for the TRIBULATION.
Remember that in the Olivet Discourse Jesus was speaking directly to JEWS – i.e the two pairs of brothers (Peter & Andrew and James & John) who were Jews, and knew about the Tribulation since this was/ is a big topic in OT prophecy.
He was answering three questions posed to him about the end of the age or dispension or era (aeon) not end of the world as in the KJV. (Note that none of the words translated “world in the NT are in evidence here.)
In in his answer, beginning at Matthew 24:15 he included a discussion of events leading up to the tribulatin period.
Now there are two general camps here. OK Some opine that there are not two phases and there is only one coming (although there is a list of verses that speaks of his coming in the air, and those that speak of him alighting on the Mount of Olives) . I am in the other camp as can be seen from my ppt.
I believe in a PRE TRIBULATION RAPTURE; and so I believe that once you see signs for the tribulation you are approaching the rapture which occurs 7 years before the tribultion.
But some believe that the rapture will be in the middle of the tribulation. Others believe that the rapture and the second phase will occur at the end of the tribulation.
I illustrate my belief this way.
Say the arch by the swing bridge is the beginning of the tribulation and maks the entry to Bridgetown proper for arguement sake.
Soo if by the time you hit the Garrison you start seeing signs every 100 yards saying Bridgetown ahead, you know that you approching the tribulation period = Bridgetown.
So some where maybe down Bay Street the rapture must occur.
But there is no specific signs for the rapture per se. The signs are for the onset of the tribulation period.
The blogmaster invites you to join the discussion.