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COVID 19 Challenges for SIDs – A Lack of Discipline Exposed

  Last week Minister of Health Jeffery D. Bostic advised the nation that critical equipment needed by Barbados to fight COVID 19 was being blocked by the United States of America. In the case of Barbados it was 20 ventilators, Cayman 50, 000 masks, Bahamas a country with a close relationship with the USA has…

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Last week Minister of Health Jeffery D. Bostic advised the nation that critical equipment needed by Barbados to fight COVID 19 was being blocked by the United States of America. In the case of Barbados it was 20 ventilators, Cayman 50, 000 masks, Bahamas a country with a close relationship with the USA has also experienced issues clearing PPE originating in the USA.

The restriction on export of critical equipment can be traced to President Trump invoking powers under the Defense Production Act.

… the order gave the federal government more control over the procurement of coronavirus-related supplies, it also allowed the administration to ban certain exports. Trump invoked the act following a Twitter attack against U.S. manufacturer 3M over the export of its highly sought N95 respiratory face masks.

We can discussed the action by the USA from a few perspectives, one being the role of a developed country like the USA in the global humanitarian effort. What the action by the USA has exposed is that we live in a world where the sovereignty of nations will be tested. Governments of SIDs will have to find ingenious ways to implement frameworks for functional cooperation to optimally procure and deploy resources to ensure OUR citizens are protected. Since the launch of globalization, a wave of protectionist polices by developed countries makes the contrivance of the concept an opportunity for developing state to be perpetually trapped in a state of being poor.

One of the more instructive videos being shared in the social media space is one featuring Vivian Balakrishan, Minister of Foreign Affairs of Singapore, it is a must watch. One of the key takeaways for the blogmaster is the confidence with which he spoke about the committent of all citizens of Singapore to being disciplined at an individual level to ensure decisions taken by government are efficiently executed. One of several conclusions that can be made is that Barbados and many countries across the world have a long way to go if we are to wear the label a mature people, mature nations.

 

The blogmaster thanks Amit and the Anonymous member for sharing important links responsible for this blog – David, blogmaster

175 responses to “COVID 19 Challenges for SIDs – A Lack of Discipline Exposed”

  1. David Avatar
    David

    https://www.facebook.com/liz.thompson.7509/videos/3220549927984553/

  2. robert lucas Avatar
    robert lucas

    3M was supplying foreign countries with the equipment and not the US. The Florida deputy head of FEMA reported on the problem he was getting from 3M. The 3M company in China was ordered by the Chinese not to export any of the equipment although the company was American. Trump acted. Some may not like it but charity begins at home despite all the crap Peter Wickham had to say in the Sunday Sun. Globalization is dead as a result of the Wuhan virus.
    China is selling to Italy, equipment that Italy donated to China to help fight the virus.

    Singapore carries the discipline to extreme lengths: such lengths cripples initiative.

  3. Critical Analyzer Avatar
    Critical Analyzer

    What this says is we must get self sufficient in the things required for our very survival. All countries including the US are learning this lesson the very hard way.

  4. David Avatar
    David

    @Dr. Lucas

    Is this the thrust of the blog post? What is the thesis position?

  5. Crusoe Avatar
    Crusoe

    Critical Analyzer
    April 13, 2020 6:14 AM What this says is we must get self sufficient in the things required for our very survival. All countries including the US are learning this lesson the very hard way.

    And ALL of this was discussed many years ago on these very blogs. The old Barbados Free Press and this Barbados Underground, where a few of us pointed to the necessity of producing more locally and relying on local food production for just such as is now happening.

    It is all there for those who wish to research it. Yet, the politicians never took it on. Again, it is there written as proof.

    This situation was envisaged and the actions needed stated clearly. Again, many years ago.

  6. Crusoe Avatar
    Crusoe

    Actually, now is a good time to go back and see what such an excellent thinker as Yardbroom considered on matters such as this.

    We miss Yardbroom and Old Onion Bags.

  7. Vincent Codrington Avatar
    Vincent Codrington

    @ David Bu

    Barbadians are a disciplined people. Singapore is not. Where citizens of a society have to be publicly flogged to obey simple regulations, that is not a mature society.
    We passed that line mark since 1838. Barbadians are behaving maturely when they disobey regulations that are repugnant to common sense.

  8. David Avatar
    David

    @Vincent

    If you are happy with the growing behaviour of running traffic lights on amber and red. The ZR sub culture. Our inclination to litter without thought to impact to the environment. Hopefully you get the drift.

  9. Vincent Codrington Avatar
    Vincent Codrington

    @ David BU

    No. I do not get the drift. What percentage of ZR drivers run traffic lights?What are the primary factors that drive the propensity to do so ? Is it not the compensation package? Who should be punished ? Owners or the operators? Is there a conflict of interests?

  10. David Avatar
    David

    @Vincent

    It does not matter. It is not a problem to ascribe blame to different sectors of the society. The whole society is suffering from the malady of indiscipline.

  11. Vincent Codrington Avatar
    Vincent Codrington

    @ David BU

    It does matter.
    Some of us have a tendency to generalise from the particular. You used two insignificant examples to shore up a weak case that Barbadians are an indisciplined people. There is no creditable evidence to support that assertion. The same with the refuse. We have a situation where the garbage collection system is deficient and you do not expect to see litter. Where do you want the unthinking citizen to dispose it?

  12. David Avatar
    David

    @Vincent

    Let’s agree to disagree. You are way off mark on this issue let it be stated.

  13. robert lucas Avatar
    robert lucas

    What this whole thing shows is again the lack of initiative by the University. A couple of weeks ago, Oxford University researchers came up with a ventilator using materials which were available locally. The ventilator was not high technology (no digital stuff consisted of bellows like machine). It said that it would place the blue print on-line so that other countries could use it. for free). Surely, the science departments at the University should have an ample supply of Tygon tubing which could be used in the manufacture of the ventilators. If the University has not got the necessary metallurgical/engineering skills, it should get help from the local polytechnic.

    The role of universities is mainly one of finding and solutions and solving problems. In this respect the local University is a dismal failur

  14. David Avatar
    David

    @Dr. Lucas

    Is it fair to describe UWI, Cave Hill as NOT being a research university?

  15. robert lucas Avatar
    robert lucas

    @ David April 13, 2020 6:49 AM

    Not really, but the post started off by referring to equipment being held by the Americans. The statement was not modified to explain why such action was taken.
    I addressed the main thrust of the post in the last sentence of my post. I could have gone on to lament about the lack of discipline among Barbadians, but what would that prove? We all know that there is lack of discipline: it permeates the society( from the politicians to the man/woman on the streets).

  16. David Avatar
    David

    @Dr. Lucas

    The reference to Trump activating the Defence Production Act was a preamble to make the substantive point SIDS have to work together to leverage resources.

    >

  17. robert lucas Avatar
    robert lucas

    @ David April 13, 2020 11:42 AM

    After seventy-two years, the University should have graduated from just teaching to doing meaningful research.. Over that time-period, the cadre of skilled local scientist should have been built up. The character of an University is formulated by its leaders. There is a saying from the Bible: ” where there is no vision, the people perish.” This saying sums up the University. We live in an area with lots of problems which need scientific solutions. There is also another problem: smallness of size which results in professors holding rancor against their own students who show any signs of brilliance(holding up of degrees, lack of supervision and so on ).because of the fear of competition in a small market for positions. Therefore, it is better to just be a teaching platform as far as they are concerned. How else can the idea of a teaching university alone be justified?.

  18. David Avatar
    David

    @Dr. Lucas

    This blogmaster has been disappointed at the lack of advancement on the late Oliver Headley’s work. Given where he took the solar technology we should have been able to build and patent a hybrid technology by now. It seem we have regressed if we look at where countries adopting the technology later have gone.

  19. robert lucas Avatar
    robert lucas

    The extract below may interest some readers. What it shows is that national identity trumps all.

    Mexican factory making ventilators for the US is shut down by government after it refused to sell the machines to local hospitals
    American-owned Smiths Medical plant in the northern border town of Baja, California, that was making ventilators, was shut down Friday
    Gov. Jaimie Bonilla closed down the plant after the company refused to sell the machines to Mexican hospitals to treat coronavirus patients
    Bonilla said the firm had continued to operate its local factory as an ‘essential service’, after non-essential plants were ordered closed to combat the pandemic
    But Bonilla ordered the plant shuttered because he argued it was providing no such essential service to Mexicans
    Bonilla adds that the company said the ventilators being assembled at the plant were committed to ‘other countries’
    Headquartered in Minneapolis, Minnesota, the company is owned by UK-based Smiths Group
    Mexico now has 3,844 case of the new coronavirus, with 233 deaths nationwide
    Learn more about how to help people impacted by COVID
    By RALPH R. ORTEGA FOR DAILYMAIL.COM and ASSOCIATED PRESS

    PUBLISHED: 02:58 BST, 13 April 2020 | UPDATED: 07:43 BST, 13 April 2020

  20. robert lucas Avatar
    robert lucas

    @ David April 13, 2020 12:09 PM

    Headley was an organic chemist who developed an interest in solar technology. He never came up with anything new in the field.. he did not have the necessary mathematical and physics background to really push forward the research. I often wondered how he supervised his students in organic chemistry. He was a lecturer in organic chemistry at St. Augustine when I was there. The University was developing a pigeon pea sheller and it was this that apparently piqued his interest in the matter .He was ignored by the mechanical engineering department. The next I heard of him was as an expert in solar energy. I saw him one day by the Cloisters’ Book Store and I asked him how, as an organic chemist he was now claiming to be an expert in solar energy. He could not really explain. That young fellow who has a masters’ in the field would have done great things for Barbados: but Headley was a professor at the University and therefore he was the expert.

  21. David Avatar
    David

    @Dr Lucas

    The more substantive point is why the UWI has not move advanced the technology.

  22. Critical Analyzer Avatar
    Critical Analyzer

    That is why we in the Caribbean have to wake up, smell the rum and start working closer together.

    All the money being pumped into UWI is wasted producing lawyers, economists and managers that can’t produce a single thing. It should be used to fund research projects for our specific needs like studying the efficacy of our old-time remedies and local plants instead of turning out medical doctors that just dole out medication that treats the symptoms and makes the pharmaceutical companies richer and us poorer.

  23. lyallsmall Avatar
    lyallsmall

    David and Dr Lucas

    About 2 weeks ago. There was a big story from UWI Jamaica about a collaboration between all the relevant departments and 2 UWI graduates to produce a working model of a ventilator. I seem to recall that they were at the stage of commercialization.

    The group was also doing a lot of work in the area of PPE’s.

    Seek and ye will find! I’ll try to see if I can find the reference. But UWI Jamaica (Still part of UWI) is doing some relevant work.

  24. Critical Analyzer Avatar
    Critical Analyzer

    @ David April 13, 2020 12:52 PM

    UWI has not advanced technology because it takes money and time to do research and unless some company or government brings forward money to fund a specific project, that research will never happen.

  25. lyallsmall Avatar
    lyallsmall

    Around the same time, an old acquaintance, Dr Henry Lowe, was making news about a Marijuana based chemical that seemed to be far advanced on the road to being accepted as a candidate for a Covid 19 treatment. Just waiting.

    All is not lost, at least Jamaica is carrying the ball so far.

  26. robert lucas Avatar
    robert lucas

    @ David April 13, 2020 12:52 PM
    UWI is a closed shop and the color thing still seems to rife there especially in the sciences .I will give an example of what I mean. A post was advertised for a plant pathologist. A very well qualified black Barbadian applied ,was interviewed and was told the position was his. There was a white person ,not trained in plant pathology who made a late application. The post was re-advertised and the requirement parameters changed to suit the qualification of the white person ,who got the position. Then there is idea of only being a teaching University. There is also the idea of a team-player. Team-players are not needed in the sciences. Team players are only required by mediocre institutions in the sciences. The really bright scientists are so far removed from the ordinary ones that team playing is an impossibility..

  27. David Avatar
    David

    The references to UWI is mainly Cave Hill. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

    >

  28. Crusoe Avatar
    Crusoe

    robert lucas
    April 13, 2020 1:13 PM

    On the issue of the team player assertion, I think that term to be a fudge, to get mediocrity through the door, not speaking of the case that you were discussing specifically, but in any environment.

    The team player thing is rubbish. Brilliant people, who can get the work done, are needed. In the corporate world, the label of team player is to get individuals to comply and not challenge the status quo, of the hierarchy. This helps the senior management, some of whom are mediocre, to keep their positions, bonuses and so on.

    Individuals who think for themselves, ergo, who do not follow everything that they are told blindly, are dangerous to the powers that be. Hence, they are not team players. Those corporate bonuses are worth fighting for, methinks. You get the idea.

    For what it is worth, there is some validity in being able to work with a team, but the term has been overused misused and abused. It is an out for those who wish one.

    One of those phrases that is now tiring to hear. Like all of the corporate gobbledegook. Does the person have the ability, oh yes. But is he or she a team player?? Stupse.

  29. ks Avatar
    ks

    As a science grad …. back in the old(er) days of UWI, when Dr. Lucas was there (I believe), I applied for a Commonwealth Scholarship for further studies in Electronics (Computer Tech.) … this was early 70’s when the Bill Gates & Apple’s of the world were starting…… one of the old men on the committee (political appointee, no doubt, with zero science background), said point-blank to me: ” why should our government send you away to study dat, to come back home and fix TV’s?”.

    My point is: we still have too many square pegs in round holes making important decisions solely because they are part of the ‘old boys club’ or ‘know somebody’ in power. We will never properly invest in our sciences/techs sufficiently…… all our decision-makers are lawyers, financial ‘experts’, insurance CEO’s, etc…. making money off others…… not making anything ‘real’!

  30. TheOGazerts Avatar
    TheOGazerts

    But I got a UWI scholarship and later a teaching assistantship in the US.

  31. robert lucas Avatar
    robert lucas

    @Crusoe April 13, 2020 2.30 PM

    You are one-hundred percent correct in your assessment of things.

  32. Donna Avatar
    Donna

    In my opinion a brilliant innovator should indeed have a team – TO WORK TO FACILITATE HIS/HER BRILLIANCE. The innovator need not be a team player but there should be a supporting team. This team should remove any hurdles for and mop up any spills made by the innovator. Brilliant and creative people are known to be very difficult because they are impatient with those who cannot see their vision. There is great value in being able to support brilliance. The world may remember Sherlock Holmes. They also remember Dr. Watson. He was no less valuable. I would rather be a Dr. Watson to a Sherlock Holmes than be a wannabe Sherlock Holmes clutching at straws in deep water. Or to be more current a Constable Crabtree to a Detective Murdoch.

    Being a facilitator is an invaluable talent.

  33. Donna Avatar
    Donna

    Indeed, “Where there is no vision, the people perish.” Embalmed brains need to be removed to the cemetery.

  34. lyallsmall Avatar
    lyallsmall

    Dr Bob Lucas

    Covid 19 changed the World and It will surely change UWI and even the Barbados Campus in the near future. The current UWI students are no less brilliant than some of the past ones who fitted into a system that stultified their growth and which, along with a lack of resources, and the social imperatives that moulded them, ensured that they constituted an arguable lost generation. Covid 19 will make deep changes in most aspects of the Barbados Society and its institutions. It might well be the catalyst that, throughout the World will cause the renaming of the epochs into Pre and Post-Covid 19.

    It may be useful to brainstorm what the future will be like in the near term in Barbados. Eg. Barbados is a mini-country. There are Millions of different Coronoviruses. Might there be a need for us to have serious resources put into Epidemiological Programmes at UWI that will work to fine tune epidemiological inputs to forecast and provide relevant purpose fitted models for Covid 19 as it spawns new outbreaks as well as other Coronaviruses as they come on stream. The last decade or so has seen the birth of a few of these like SARS, MERS, EBOLA, etc. Many more might be in the offing and it would be good if we had our scientists working to make outbreaks less ominous to life and economy.

    With the changes that Covid 19 will precipitate in the economics, and even possibly the age related demographics of the World (which includes Barbados), I have some hope that new blood and urgent needs of the Country will together force significant changes at the institutions which should serve our Science and Technology better than our current reliance on models that do not fit our needs in many respects..

  35. Sargeant Avatar
    Sargeant

    @Crusoe
    The team player thing is rubbish. Brilliant people, who can get the work done, are needed. In the corporate world, the label of team player is to get individuals to comply and not challenge the status quo, of the hierarchy.
    +++++++++++++
    Where did you work? Isn’t some of that contradictory? Brilliant people who can’t work with anyone don’t get anything done and are often detrimental to the organization. Being a Team player doesn’t mean you sign off on everything, it could mean that you raise your concerns and good manager(s) (management) will ensure that it will receive consensus, it doesn’t mean that everyone will agree with everything but most people will find a way to move forward.

    BTW some “brilliant” people find something to object to in every project, and eventually they are eased out of the company to find their own path.

  36. Miller Avatar
    Miller

    @ Crusoe April 13, 2020 2:30 PM
    “One of those phrases that is now tiring to hear. Like all of the corporate gobbledegook. Does the person have the ability, oh yes. But is he or she a team player?? Stupse.”
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    We would never have thought that you and Lucas could be that ‘radical’ in your work culture thinking.

    You guys are clearly not corporate ‘Yes Men’.

    This pseudo requirement of being a team player to do a job competently will soon be removed from the HR list of hiring criteria as Artificial intelligence makes it presence felt and overtake many of the jobs currently done by emotionally-driven humans.

    Wouldn’t working online and working from home -as is being pushed because of Covid-19- reduce the need for mental and physical interaction thereby reducing the opportunity for conflict among ego-driven employees?

  37. robert lucas Avatar
    robert lucas

    @ lyallsmall April 13, 2020 4:09 PM

    I would hope so. For more than forty-years I have waited to see the change and I don’t have much longer before I shuffle off.

    @ David

    The sociologist (COVID-!9 CZAR) has been mouthing off on TV as though he is trained in the scientific disciplines. What a travesty.. He admits that the country has not got the pandemic under control..

  38. lyallsmall Avatar
    lyallsmall

    Bob;

    Covid-19 trumps everything that happened in the last 40 years! No occurence, anywhere in the World comes close.

    What was the Czar’s role in the Ebola outbreak in Sierra Leone some years ago? Perhaps it was managerial and similar to the role he plays here now. In any case, his qualifications for the job here should have been published to give more credence / heft to the importance the Government placed on Barbados’ management of the Covid-19 pandemic outbreak.

  39. lyallsmall Avatar
    lyallsmall

    Bob;

    Yes, the Czar admits that Covid-19 is not yet under control.

    Obviously he is not giving any details, but the graph of the incidence and spread here clearly shows that if there is any community spread at present it is very low.

    I feel, if we are to believe the numbers, that He and the frontline Min of Health workers have been doing a very good job so far, since, given the 4 weeks or so that they have been working, there has been no published, appreciable increase in incidence and the operation seems to be just one of mopping up. But perhaps some different numbers might be on the horizon.

    Must keep an eye out for new stats.

  40. lyallsmall Avatar
    lyallsmall

    Bob;

    I forgot to mention above. What constitutes control for a disease as important and virulent as this one? Is it the situation where the lab technicians cannot find any instances of live Covid-19 propagules for, let’s say, 21 days (one week more than the highest observed incubation period) after the last observed case? Is it when there are no more cases in the Quarantine campuses (I wonder who came up with that totally unscientific appellation for a quarantine facility?). Is it when widespread random testing (x weeks apart) finds no virulent particles?

    The Epidemiologists need to set the parameters. Not the Czar. Not the Ministers. Not the CMO.

  41. Enuff Avatar
    Enuff

    Isn’t cutting edge research and development heavily reliant on location, clustering to be exact, and nuff funding? I know of a situation around a new pharmaceutical lab with ancillary offices and the intended location fit right into this concept. I also know of a situation involving a university, and the inclusion of new labs to facilitate research between nearby industry and students was identified as very important. So I am just curious about how we establish such an industry in Bim.

  42. David Avatar
    David

    @enuff

    You are correct and this raises the question if UWI, Mona is ahead of the game with research does it make sense for UWI, Cave Hill to consider a similar model.

  43. lyallsmall Avatar
    lyallsmall

    Enuff;

    Cave Hill, Barbados was or is considered to be a Teaching Facility but there is no good reason that useful Graduate studies in several areas could not be done in the absence of clustering, location near high tech facilities, etc. There is a medical faculty here which, for several years, has been conducting low resource but yet valuable research. The kind of research I envisage in my posts above would be primarily low resource research funded by the University, Government and other Philanthropists. On Coronoviruses it could be such things as investigating the parameters under which zoonotic spread of such viruses occur; the development of foolproof PPE that could be reliably used by non-medical personnel; Development of systems for safe use of PPE by the general public; interdepartmental studies that develop recommendations for systems to identify when an outbreak ends; development of a smart phone app for use in surveys of disease epidemics; etc. etc.

    David;

    It makes sense if Cave Hill were to do the type of research that does not exactlyape what Mona does but instead complements it. In addition the University is regional. One researcher could do some of his/her work at Cave Hill and part at Mona or the Congo, or Sierra Leone, or US or Europe.

    There are some of the Coronaviruses that, despite having high virulence did not become pandemics, eg. Ebola. There are a number of coronaviruses that cause diseases in dogs and other pets. Collaborative research with Veterinary faculties or government departments should pay some dividends.

  44. robert lucas Avatar
    robert lucas

    @ lyallsmall April 13, 2020 7:43 PM

    “What was the Czar’s role in the Ebola outbreak in Sierra Leone some years ago”

    I googled his name in relation to Ebola in West Africa. There is no data on him at all in connection with Ebola.

    Ask yourself the question: what could he have been doing during the Ebola affair? Certainly none of the following : a front-line worker (nurse, medical doctor. microbiologist/virologist or an epidemiologist).

    I find it an outrage to hear him trying to do what the epidemiologist is trained to do. He tries to depict himself as an expert. He is no expert, he is a fraud.

    Seems as though there is some political connection here.

  45. robert lucas Avatar
    robert lucas

    @ lyallsmall April 13, 2020 7:59 PM

    There is obvious community spread. The very fact that an appeal was made for those who entered Barbados between 15-22 March 2020 to come forward says it all. Note, the almost daily, increase in .the numbers. There has to be a number of hot spots out there which have yet to be identified, The problem is the unknown person Z, who came into contact with an infected person ,for example in a supermarket. No one knows who Z is. Z is free to mingle and pass on the infection.

    I have said contrary to the wide spread idea that transmission was by droplets alone, that aerosols were also a means of transmission.

  46. David Avatar
    David

    https://youtu.be/VNkgHKSjEPA

  47. Dullard Avatar
    Dullard

    There is also the idea of a team-player. Team-players are not needed in the sciences. Team players are only required by mediocre institutions in the sciences.

    What nonsense! Most modern scientific advancements are accomplished not by some hermit hunched over his laptop but in collaborative teams. The fact that most here agree with this folly is further evidence that Bdos has a long way to go yet.

    The technology and methods are advancing so quickly that collaboration is often the ONLY way to keep up.

  48. Miller Avatar
    Miller

    @ robert lucas April 14, 2020 2:11 AM
    “I have said contrary to the wide spread idea that transmission was by droplets alone, that aerosols were also a means of transmission.”
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    There is a great measure of validity (based on ‘simple’ commonsense) to that argument which you have postulated previously.

    Why are the authorities now insisting on the wearing of ‘good quality’ masks in public whereas they were previously downplaying this form of PPE for general use by the public?

    Your contributions on this rather serious pandemic have been underpinned not only with your own sound scientific knowledge and training but also infused with a good dose of commonsense; something gravely lacking by those in charge of the handling of this viral enemy.

    One thing that can be genuinely said about you is that you are NOT in the game of cover-up and political ass-licking to please the authorities to garner favours or personal financial gain.

  49. robert lucas Avatar
    robert lucas

    @ dullard April 14, 2020 7:46 AM

    You obviously are not trained in the sciences.

  50. Miller Avatar
    Miller

    @ lyallsmall April 13, 2020 1:13 PM
    “Around the same time, an old acquaintance, Dr Henry Lowe, was making news about a Marijuana based chemical that seemed to be far advanced on the road to being accepted as a candidate for a Covid 19 treatment. Just waiting.
    All is not lost, at least Jamaica is carrying the ball so far.”
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    A rather interesting contribution worthy of further comment. The marijuana plant-based alternative will never be pushed by Big Pharma and its political parasites.

    Man must first look into the medicine cabinet of Mother Nature containing her healing plants to find a cure for human and animal ailments.

    Then the scientists can go about, synthetically, simulating or replicating the active ingredients in these naturally occurring plant remedies in the labs using the technologies of their time.

    Every thing beneficial which mankind has “created” (like antibiotics) is a copy or simulation of something already present in Nature.

    Dr. Lucas can correct me, if what was said is pure BS!

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