Submitted by the Barbados Association of Professional Engineers (BAPE)
The Barbados Association of Professional Engineers (BAPE) issues three press releases:-
Barbados Association of Professional Engineers Issues Statements on Potholes and South Coast Sewage Problems
Submitted by the Barbados Association of Professional Engineers (BAPE) The Barbados Association of Professional Engineers (BAPE) issues three press releases:- The Potholes Problem (1) The Potholes Problem (2) The South Coast Sewage Problem
136 responses to “Barbados Association of Professional Engineers Issues Statements on Potholes and South Coast Sewage Problems”
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Who represents the drivers on the committee? Where is a member of the general public or even a taxi driver? Why do you need more than one minister on the Committee, they will only take up time during discussions and gang together.
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steupse
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These engineers, like the lawyers, seem to assume that financial resources have not been a problem for Barbados.
That somehow they should have a first claim on national resources
That these cannot be any other less ‘first world’ way
This is just like saying, as one of their member has, that 90% of local housing cannot withstand a Cat 5 hurricane.
While true, it is another truism which cannot have real meaning in and of itself.
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Many have been calling for the local talent to get involved and be part of the solution. The government revealed last week they will find 12 million to fix the South Coast Sewage plant. The roads are also falling to bits. We know the solution, now we have to find the money. A crumbling infrastructure will get us nowhere fast.
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@David
“Talent get involved” good idea, talent have suggested another huge burecracy level be established to help drain the treasury and no doubt be dysfunctional like all other boards.
“$12m to fix south coast sewage” This $12m is merely for the bandaid, it will not solve the problem. Only a mental adjustment of Bajan philosophy will correct this and other BARBADOS ills.
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@Wily
Agree with you because the maintenance record of government through the years must be described as poor.
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Is it only Wily that finds it SAD that BARBADOS does not have $12Mbds to go ahead with the EMERGENCY repairs without having to BORROW the money. Barbados FOREX is this low or is there ANY Forgien money at all.
SAD STATE OF AFFAIRS
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@Wily
Isn’t the 12 million attached to technical assistance as well?
On another note, we hear this morning that the South Coast Sewage Tourist Stripe resembles a swamp after heavy rains this week. If BAPE engineers are monitoring this blog can they advise how difficult is it to repair the 10 inch pump that the minister claims will perform the mitigation bypass measure more effectively than the six inch doing the job now? This is getting ridiculous man.
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Wily can confirm the south coast sewage was definitely awash yesterday around Worthing Post Office and Massey parking lot. Effluent running down the street flowing into a storm water catch basin and then directly out into the Worthing beach, hummmmmm.
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It is not hard to see that routine financial provisions must be made for the ongoing maintenance of major assets. Nor that such systems need to be managed outside of partisan politics. No town hall needed to work that out….
LOL@ Pacha
“…..This is just like saying, as one of their member has, that 90% of local housing cannot withstand a Cat 5 hurricane.
While true, it is another truism which cannot have real meaning in and of itself.”
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Boss, how can something be true …and not have real meaning in and of itself?
….is that the case if it does not fit into your pre-defined paradigm?Truth is absolute….even when inconvenient.
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Bushie
Barbados will never be able to make 100 percent of its housing stock resistant to cat 5 hurricanes
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@ Pacha
True.
But that is a totally unrelated fact, and clearly not even an optimal objective from a cost-benefit perspective.As you concur however, the original statement about the 90% is likely to the accurate.
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@ David February 14, 2018 at 7:51 AM
This is what can happen when you play a game of Russian roulette with public sanitation and the concomitant physiological and economic health of the nation.
The current government was warned (on a number of occasions) about the inevitable consequences of pulling the trigger after the first chamber was a dud in 2015.
Now you have shit splattering all over the place not only on the South coast but soon in the environs of the Bridgetown Port to generate ‘gaseous’ smells pungent enough to make cruise ship visitors hold their breaths and head back to the safety of their cabins while warning others not to go ashore and to avoid stinking Bridgetown at all cost.
What is going on is a classic case of truly understanding the meaning contained in the old Bajan adage: “Hard ears, yuh won’t hear, bye-‘n-bye yuh gine feel”.
An ounce of prevention is always worth more than a pound of cure equivalent to more than $12 million and doubling by the month of delay.
Now where are those Murray Chandler’s sewer monkeys hiding begging for just peanuts to do the job of removing the Bajan made massively overgrown fatbergers et al?
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David February 14, 2018 at 2:09 AM #
Many have been calling for the local talent to get involved and be part of the solution. The government revealed last week they will find 12 million to fix the South Coast Sewage plant. The roads are also falling to bits. We know the solution, now we have to find the money. A crumbling infrastructure will get us nowhere fast.++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Wonder how much was spent on the Military Hardware we purchased and what sort of maintenance program will be instituted to ensure the vehicles don’t end up on the junk heap?
I was told that 7 out of the 8 backhoes at MTW are down when I started looking closely at the issues with the drainage channel at Graeme Hall!!
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@ John
What may be even worse is when such equipment is given as a gift, where the recipient has no plan, or means, to properly maintain and upkeep the stuff.As they say, who give you a big-mouth horse don’t help you to feed it….
You just end up with vet and burial expenses – that you also cannot afford. -
Putting the canary deeper into the mine gives an earlier warning.
Any fool can suggest a committee -
What an extraordinary opening statement made by BAPE in their recently released press release:
“1 – After careful analysis of the Barbados pothole problem, and of the general state of
disrepair of our roads, it is BAPE’s considered opinion that the current unsatisfactory
state of road disrepair is unrelated to any major technical, labour, or design issue.
There are no fundamental, underlying technical challenges, shortages of expertise, or
lack of available resources that – ultimately, accounts for the current poor state of our
road network.”And, we wonder why Barbados is such a poorly run country? Yes, we know that the roads are poorly maintained – if at all! But, please do not tell me that this is the major reason why we have huge potholes in our roads. It is clear to me that corners are being cut when we build and refurbish our roads. Are those who design and build our roads conforming to an approved code of road building that is internationally acceptable?
I have driven on some old plantation roads which are scarcely used and many are in a better condition then the so-called modern roads. Personally speaking i have little faith in BAPE.
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“the city has 30 pothole crews — more than 100 employees — dedicated to fixing the damage throughout the city.”
” more than 2,600 potholes have been filled so far. ”
Doan have to read an spell fuh wunna.
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The pothole exercise is a waste of money. As soon as the rain falls or there is traffic over a relatively short time, it is back to square one. To repeat a waste of resources.
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@ David wrote “The pothole exercise is a waste of money.”
What is the solution for Barbados?
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Good night Mr Blogmaster
Thank you for publishing our press releases and comments on pot holes and on the sewerage project.
Many thanks also for the comments received from your various subscribers. We apologize for nor responding earlier, but will endeavor to respond to the comments. -
Thanks, a good place to start is how effective is the pothole remediation exercise being undertaken give scarce resources.
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Looking to the future. Cow?Bizzy?MaloneJerkum?
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My old cane cutter friend observed that there are no more “rock machines” in operation fixing roads.
In more familiar language … no more Steam Rollers!!
There probably is a perfectly reasonable explanation.
Maybe the technology is now different.
I no longer see many tar machines either.
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The pot hole patching exercise is a case of treating the symptoms of a less than optimal initial exercise. Pot holes are caused by a number of factors such as shoddy utility works, excessive heavy vehicle weight distribution, drainage issues etc.
Preemptive design and planning, enforcement of proper repair standards, and improved management of water settlement on the roads are much more cost effective ways of preventing pot holes in the first place.
There will always be some need to deal with flaws like pot holes, but this should not be a primary means of upkeepSome persons see just another committee
BAPE sees a professional controlling authority which should be non-political, and focused only on reaching and maintaining international performance standards, and which replaces the current politically driven methodology that exists.
Resources should then be allocated based on scientific and not political considerations..The general public would be represented on the authority by the MP or his nominee. Obviously user groups representing drivers, cyclists, pedestrians, sports persons etc would be engaged to set priorities, give feedback etc.
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Ours is not a “first call on scarce national resources”.
It is a call for gross income generated from the national road network (road taxes, license fees) to be used to upkeep that network so that it remains fit for purpose. The net income then goes to the consolidated fund.
Many countries employ exactly such a road fund for this purpose.
This avoids a situation where urgent roadworks or equipment has to be deferred for years awaiting funds from the national budget. -
The comment about pot holes “not being a consequence of lack of resources” is a bit elusive.
The main causes of pot holes are related to abuse of the design limits of the road by utiiity repairs, excessive loading, water penetration from faulty drainage etc.
A quiet plantation cart road may well outdo a busy main road in resisting pot holes -
I have always wondered why heavy vehicles aren’t limited to certain roads purpose built for heavy traffic.
It is torture to meet an oversized vehicle in a road that struggles to even fit them.
There is an Industrial Access Highway, aka ABC highway, stay on it if you are driving a heavy duty truck.
Dodging through a small road to avoid the delays is counter productive.
The worst offenders I see are the fuel trucks.
Sure, there are gas stations requiring service not on the ABC Highway but perhaps smaller trucks might be more sensible.
Other option is to make the license fees more reflective of the potential damage the vehicle can do to the road.
What are the rates on numbers of axles and do they make sense?
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Minister Michael Lashley you are reading? Does it matter with a general election soon? Our infrastructure is crumbling, who will make Barbados great again?
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Forget potholes and sewage now. There is no money anymore for that. … Be happy if you can buy food during the following two months … Tourists started to bring in big cash in USD to resists the coming storm.
Downgrade to C is coming very soon. The Canadian banks have already made preps for the disaster, namely 20% interest on mortgages and other debts per year plus securities in Forex to compensate for devaluation.
Happy Valentine´s Day Massacre!
My advice: Buy enough canned food, bottled water, fuel and – most important – ammo for your legal guns.
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@ Bape President
It’s no wonder how all you ‘engineers’ sound alike.
Maybe as a result of putting steel ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, even in ordinary writing.
Again you seek exclusivity for government revenues derived from road taxes, licenses, tolls, whatever.
That has certainly not how central government expenditure planning has ever worked. The problem with so-called ‘professionals’ is that they all seem to think that theirs is of most importance.
The businessmen in the past have tried to tie government revenues so derived to expenditures they wanted to see.
You are not describing a country. It’s more like competing gangs!
That is why we need a strong government, controlled by the people on a daily, an hourly basis. Not the further empowerment of ‘professional committees’
And what of the opportunity cost your budgeting proposal will likely cause?
If you are going to posit such a proposal surely your discipline must require an accounting of the areas which might have short falls.
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@ Bush Tea February 14, 2018 at 10:52 AM #
“@ John
What may be even worse is when such equipment is given as a gift, where the recipient has no plan, or means, to properly maintain and upkeep the stuff.
As they say, who give you a big-mouth horse don’t help you to feed it….
You just end up with vet and burial expenses – that you also cannot afford.”But why defence-related equipment? Shouldn’t the Defence force be at the top of the list as a main culprit of a fiscal parasite ripe for top to bottom restructuring?
What does the Mighty Gabby have to say now?
Why not the badly needed garbage vehicles reconfigured for the Bajan streets?
What about public transport vehicles reconfigured to fit the seating requirements of obese Bajans?
What is happening to the many vehicles and pieces of equipment left to languish in the MTW junkyard? Can’t the Chinese send of their technical savvy inmates to fix and restore those relatively youthful pieces of mechanical equipment to make those in Cuba look like a teenager?
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@BABE
Susanne SS here.
I would like to know which standard or standards are the Barbadian roads constructed according.
What is the ” fix by date” of an asphalt paved road?
Is it true that in order to keep persons employed in the construction industry, roads in Barbados are specificially designed to deterioriate in less than five years? And, that Ministry of Transport deliberate patches potholes poorly to keep persons in employment?
I am interested in finding out the answers to these questions because in the context of Barbados, we speak about standards but show very little propensity to following them. Also, who determines, after a road is contructed, that it has been built according to approved road construction standards (if they exist at all).
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Just another pressure group seeking to further its own interests.
Do not the road builders/ repairers not have members of their profession employed in the process? Do they park all of these ideas/ solutions in their lockers at the work place?
Altruism would suggest that these ideas be passed onto their colleagues directly engaged in these projects first, then the public which has no skills in evaluating the solutions.
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David at 4 :11 AM
Who will stop our physical infrastructure from crumbling?
Competent and committed structural engineers.
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@Bernard
What about the politicians?
What about the âgangsâ charged with repairing the roads?
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@ David at 12 :05 PM
Except for former minister Neville Boxill, I never witnessed any Minister repairing or building roads. Do you want to add that to their job descriptions?
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@Bernard
You ignore the ethos that pervades how business is done in the government sector in Barbados?
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David at 12 : 26 PM
I happened to have worked in the Public Sector not many moons ago. That has not been my experience.
Ethos is not built or destroyed overnight. As a fellow member of BU pointed out in another blog, Barbados had/ has the reputation for being among the top three most competent public service in the Western Hemisphere.If what you believe is now true , it is time for a change. Please concentrate your effort to effect this.
On the other hand, if one repeats an ” untruth” long enough it becomes” truth”. What we repeatedly tell ourselves, we become. -
“Typically, the city has 25 crews out on the road repairing potholes, Tory told reporters,
but this weekend that number will more than double to 55.”
Is there any reason why Government of Barbados cannot copy Toronto ?
Every pothole in Barbados could be repaired over 2 or 3 weeks.
I think the real problem is that Barbados is “broke”.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/pothole-repair-blitz-weekend-across-toronto-1.4495345
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And is the kpi/performance measure used to determine we are better?
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Could the BAPE discuss concrete wearing surfaces? And their repair/maintenance?
I appreciate all wearing surfaces are at the mercy of the sub grade materials and their compaction, as well as sub surface water/drainage.
I note upon some inspection, the asphalt wearing surface appears “quite thin” in some areas.
While I do not know of the success; several jurisdictions have hired ‘road and utility’ coordinators, to try and avoid newly paved areas being ripped apart by some utility. They communicate so that all work is done at one time. -
@ Bernard Codrington February 15, 2018 at 12:45 PM
“Ethos is not built or destroyed overnight. As a fellow member of BU pointed out in another blog, Barbados had/ has the reputation for being among the top three most competent public service in the Western Hemisphere.”We would accept that as the go(d)spel(l) of truism when the same public service can be managed in such a manner as to have the detritus and muck removed from the roads, gutters and verges within a reasonable time instead of remaining in such nauseatingly unsightly and disgusting piles of public ‘insanitation’ for weeks and months on end.
What about the perpetual pile up of garbage all over your proudly promoted island paradise?
Why not take a leaf out of Bermuda’s books before boastfully comparing yourself to those which has been identified by Trump in the dirtiest of fecal adjectives?
Aren’t these low–level and easily achievable managerial functions which any ordinary public sector manager with his or her University designation and worth his ‘salarium’ in taxpayers’ money should see as easy as eating a piece of cake while walking in the park of a 2×3 island with a population no bigger than half the population of Kingston Jamaica?
Shouldn’t a housekeeper clean her or her dirty house before casting aspersions about the neighbour’s?
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How difficult would it be for an engineer to survey the destruction of our roads, determine the weight limits allowable and sign post the roads like is done in big countries.
Having done repeated rounds of fixing potholes surely there must be data on the worst affected roads.
Start with these and determine what weight limits are permissible, then signpost the road and enforce it.
Does a whole new act need to be passed in parliament or just a few rules and regulations set out?
Here is a sample of what you would see in countries who actually control their road network and determine what weight vehicles are allowable where.
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Would it not be wiser for Barbados to reduce the use of the motor car and to look at introducing the tram as our major form of transport. Barbados is not a car manufacturer and has to import her fuel. This is costing our economy dearly.
“In praise of the tram: how a love of cars killed the workers’ transport system
At their peak in the late 19th century, trams provided working people with a fast, efficient means of getting around. Now, argues Christian Wolmar, it is time to follow the Swiss model and put them back at the heart of urban transport policies” -
John at 4 :39 PM
The processes which you have outlined were in place before. There were maintenance schedules.
Perhaps we should take on board the observations of SSS at 11:21 AM.
In this modern age the question of load bearing and drainage should have been a piece of cake for a ministry with the responsibility for transport. -
…..not a car manufacturing nation…….
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It seems ridiculous to be constantly going over the same potholes again and again and doing nothing to discover the causes.
Just take some of the worst roads, fix them and ban any heavy equipment.
Put a height restricting bar and you will probably eliminate 80% of the heavy equipment.
See what happens and how long the fix stays in place.
The blogmaster invites you to join the discussion.