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Jeff Cumberbatch – Chairman of the FTC and Deputy Dean, Law Faculty, UWI, Cave Hill

Last week, the first part of this column treated the submission by Sir Hilary Beckles, Vice Chancellor of the University of the West Indies, that the statue of Lord Admiral Horatio Nelson had outlived its incongruous presence in Heroes Square and that its continued presence there makes Barbados a deviant and a pariah in the community of progressive nations that oppose publicly revering persons (such as Nelson) known to have committed โ€œcrimes against humanityโ€.

In that first part, I also bemoaned the absence of a popular discourse on the Vice Chancellorโ€™s proposal, an absence that I found mystifying. In the past week, however, there has been some public reaction to the proposal, most of it predictably defensive of preservation of the status quo rather than of its alteration by one jot or tittle.

For example, in last Fridayโ€™s edition of the Barbados Advocate, a correspondent, Mr Michael Rudder, chose to pray in aid the undeniable reality of the criminally forcible mix of the races present in most if not all slave societies and to wonder โ€œif any of my African ancestors were responsible for selling any of their โ€œbrothersโ€ to those who carried on the slave tradeโ€ while he admits knowledge that the family of one Caucasian ancestor did have slaves.

He then proceeds to make the amazing rhetorical point that since we are all mixed, โ€œwhat does it matter that some ancestor was a so-called white supremacist? And he continues still rhetorically, โ€œDid your ancestor see him/herself as such? Do we see ourselves as black supremacists?

Essentially, he makes the point that we should acknowledge our history and move on and not โ€œkeep holding up the rear mirror of our pastโ€.

It is tempting to read this opinion in a sense clearly not intended by the author and to treat it as an agreement with Sir Hilaryโ€™s thesis that officially to maintain the statue of Lord Nelson in its current location is to hold up the rear view mirror of 1813 Barbados when Nelson was a hero to the existing societal structure, the identical structure that was to be the target of a slave rebellion a mere three years later, officially recognized by the elevation of one of its reputed leaders to the highest national status. Indeed, there is a bit of a paradox in having both of these men elevated to this lofty status, even if that status of one of them is now merely situational.

It is a conundrum that seems to pervade Barbadian society, where the general attitude appears to be โ€œI do not really care what they do about Lord Nelson, but he is part of our historyโ€ OR the more extreme and silly, โ€œif we move Nelson then we should remove all traces of English influence, including place names, titles and perhaps surnamesโ€ฆโ€

Veteran columnist Patrick Hoyos in his column last Sunday required โ€œsome sort of consistent rationale if Nelson should be movedโ€ although he did not spell out what would constitute such consistency or who would be the ultimate arbiter of it.

Mr Hoyos also appears to have interpreted Sir Hilaryโ€™s letter in a way different to me. He construes the following passages from the Beckles letter as indicating that Sir Hilary would not have minded Nelson remaining standing so long as he was overlooking Carlisle Bay contemplating his exploits beyond the horizonโ€ฆโ€

โ€œ The Democratic Labour Party turned it around and deepened its roots when it had the opportunity to move it to a marine park on the pier.

โ€ข The Barbados Labour Party did not wish the Right Excellent Errol Barrow at the centre of Parliament Square and placed him out of sight of the Assembly in what was a public car park. Nelson remained in the more prominent placeโ€.

Perhaps owing to my professional training, I prefer to base the gist of an opinion on the interpretation that what is stated later should generally overrule an earlier statute or decision that is inconsistent with it through the doctrine of implied repeal. I prefer to ascertain Sir Hilaryโ€™s sentiments from his final paragraphs-

โ€œThe assumption is growing, I have been informed, that the Government might rather citizens, in an act of moral civil disobedience, to take matters in their own hands, and remove the offending obstacle to democracy. This has been the case in the United States and South Africa.

Quietly, state officials could slip away and say that the people have spoken. Such alliances of active citizens and passive state have moved many societies. Barbados must move on.โ€

This most assuredly does not read as a paean to a mere relocation of the statue to me.

O Dominica!

I should wish to express my sincere best wishes for the full renaissance and recovery of the island of Dominica after its devastation by Hurricane Maria during last week. Owing to my occupation, I have come into contact with many of the people of that island whether as teachers, classmates, or most latterly students, and they have been without exception, some of the most gracious and warmest people you will ever encounter. Dominica was also the first country that I slept in outside of Barbados when as a member of the Animation Choir under the leadership of Mr Harold Rock, I sailed there by the Federal Palm, I believe, in 1968. I do not remember much of it now; except partaking of the sweet lime fruit and hazarding a taste of stewed mountain chicken.

My more recent visits unfortunately have been severely limited in duration and in free time, but I have seem the photographs of the recent destruction wrought and I weep for the country I remember.

O Dominica, the land of beauty

The land of verdant and glorious sunshineโ€ฆ


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499 responses to “The Jeff Cumberbatch Column – “…The Ball that Shot Nelson” (2)”

  1. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    Really John??? An MA thesis? Not peer reviewed and not by a qualified scholar and researcher. Are you serious? Will you be citing high school term papers next?

    You are aware, I presume, that the fragment of MA thesis that you quoted could have been pulled directly from Dr. Eric Williams now discredited Marxist thesis that the reason the British abandoned slavery had nothing to do with humanitarian arguments from the Quakers, but was solely that sugar had become unprofitable. I had no idea you were a closet Marxist… ๐Ÿ˜‚

  2. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    @Vincent,
    Of course sugar was subsidized in the 20th century. We were proving that it was profitable in the 200 years before emancipation.

  3. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    @Vincent,
    If you read the research that I pointed you towards you would have learned that โ€œthe benefits over tobacco and cottonโ€ were that in the early years of the sugar industry it was extremely profitable, earning rates of return on investment of 40% to 50%.


  4. John September 28, 2017 at 1:30 PM “You are confusing crime and sin. You canโ€™t accept the concept of sin because you are an atheist and to do so would be accept God. So you invent โ€œcrime against humanityโ€ when all you need to call it was sin. Because God deals with that.”

    Slavery was both a sin and a crime against humanity. And this is how God instructs us to deal with sin “if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother has something against you, leave your gift there before the altar. First go and be reconciled to your brother; then come and offer your gift. ” Matther:5:24

    Your “God deals with sin” is wrong. God instructs us to deal with sin BEFORE we bring gifts to him.


  5. @John
    I am spiritual, not religious, though I respect the right of others to worship whomever they desire. Hence
    “God honoured Quakers with business success because they honoured Him.
    He made it so they only had business on which to depend.”

    loses me. It is a premise, I can neither prove, nor disprove.

    “What is our wealth today? I say, our history!!”

    ipso facto….reparations will provide an ongoing revenue stream? The continuing subsidy.


  6. Simple Simon

    Hmmm…..some very interesting biblical quotes above…..how are you applying them to present day slavery besides praying……how are you helping your enslaved brothers and sisters in Mauretania as shown above.

    You have never met far less spoken to a slave,why not take a trip so you can understand their experiences first hand as opposed to believing every tom,dick&harry rubbish that can never be proven or disproved……..talk is cheap on BU.

  7. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    @Vincent Haynes September 28, 2017 at 6:13 PM # asked
    “how are you helping your enslaved brothers and sisters”

    I donate money and other resources to HERA UK a charity that helps trafficked (enslaved) women, mostly from the Balkans or eastern Europe, to escape their captors and build new lives through entrepreneurship (my ex-wife’s sister is the founder).

    How are YOU helping your enslaved brothers and sisters Vincent??

  8. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    Actually folks, you can do a world of good by donating to HERA UK yourselves:
    https://www.globalgiving.org/projects/entrepreneurs-against-trafficking/


  9. Chuckle…..always the easy way out……money solves everything…….. A true albino centric mindset……no leading a delegation to discuss with the perpetrators……no forming a band of brothers to fight for your brothers and sister……..just money…….hahaha.


  10. Chuckle……a true albino centric….eh Bushie…..helping European tribes to besides……nothing for his African siblings and yours.

  11. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    @vincent haynesw September 28, 2017 at 6:34 PM #
    I said “I donate money and other resources.” My professional expertise is in entrepreneurship and fundraising so I will leave you to connect the dots.

    It’s easy to be dismissive of my efforts when you yourself do nothing.

  12. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    @vincent haynesw September 28, 2017 at 6:38 PM #
    You are embarrassing yourself now Vincent. I already confessed to being a Black man who is of 25% European ancestry. I help human beings of any colour or ethnicity Most of the women HERA helps are from Europe but some have been from Somalia and some from Chad. I do not know if we’ve helped any Mauritanians.

    How are YOU helping your enslaved brothers and sisters Vincent??

  13. Well Well & Consequences Observing Blogger. Avatar
    Well Well & Consequences Observing Blogger.

    Vincent just keeps his begging bowl handy to rob bajans…waiting for subsidies…read, free taxpayer’s money from descendants of slaves.


  14. For those who arrived late to this show I self identify as a Pelau whose siblings are his fellow Caribbean Pelau their progeny and its Diaspora. African and European tribes are part of my DNA and that is the alpha and omega of their involvement with me. Those who wish to claim either need to discover their tribe and carry on smartly.

  15. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    @vincent haynesw September 28, 2017 at 7:06 PM #
    My tribe is human beings.
    How are YOU helping the brothers and sisters of your tribe Vincent??

  16. Well Well & Consequences Observing Blogger. Avatar
    Well Well & Consequences Observing Blogger.

    Exactly…I am from the human tribe, the human race, every other description is manmade…lol


  17. John

    I asked for a download on Nichols paper but not received as yet….do you have another source for it?…..I wonder if he is related?


  18. In Johnโ€™s opinion Slavery was legal because it was codified by the laws of the day, apologists for the National Party of South Africa could make the same claim for Apartheid, they could even state that it was sanctioned by the Dutch Reform Church.


  19. I was exposed to it since my arrival in 1964 which is why I would like to know definitively when it was profitable.
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    After the slaves in Haiti destroyed the economy in 1791 until Beet Sugar in Europe became available as a replacement for Caribbean sugar and began to compete pricewise.

    There will have been fluctuations in that period.

    The Parish Churches were rebuilt after the 1831 hurricane with sugar money.

    Schools were built.

    If you look at Plantation houses you will find only two substantial ones dating back to the 1650’s, perhaps before, Drax Hall and Nicholas Abbey.

    Jacobean Architecture or so I am made to understand.

    There are others from that era but not built on the same scale and not Jacobean and if you look closer at some of these you will find extremely modest base structures.

    Brighton is 1666 vintage I believe, no way extravagant.

    You will not find conspicuous extravagance associated with enormous profits.

    The substantial plantation houses we see today date from after the 1790’s. Please check that and confirm or show me wrong.

    They are mostly Georgian Archtecture if I understand the term, and the Georgian period was from 1714 and 1830.

    The plantation houses in the Scotland District …… well, none could be said to have been the result of huge profits.

    The money was ploughed into the land and sugar works.

    That’s why I feel the Cumberbatch story and Cleland was concocted.

    There are other periods when the price of Sugar rose that would have been profitable, particularly but not always during wars.

    People always knew there would be a slump after a boom and operated to suit.

    Erroll Barrow in 1975 saw the world sugar price rise and chose to sell our sugar on the world market and not meet the commitments to Britain and its subsidized prices.

    The fireside chat … GOB imposed a tax on the windfall and gave the BWU some for the Labour College at Mangrove … finance corruption!!!!!

    Barrow’s bag man had an option to buy Mangrove which the BWU had to pay off before it got possession!!

    In 1976 Brazil had planted to take advantage … there was a glut …. and prices went through the floor.

    … EWB got kicked out of power … Duffus Commission.

    In 1976, Britain merely said, sorry old chaps, your quota is reduced, we found another way to make up your shortfall last year which is more dependable!!

    That’s a year after I got a scholarship!!!

  20. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    @John September 28, 2017 at 8:40 PM # wrote
    “If you look at Plantation houses you will find only two substantial ones dating back to the 1650โ€™s, perhaps before, Drax Hall and Nicholas Abbey.”

    You do realize of course that If you search for Jacobean Mansions in the Americas three examples pop up, Drax Hall Great House and St. Nicholas Abbey, both located in Barbados, and Bacon’s Castle in Surry County, Virginia. Bacon’s Castle is nowhere near as impressive as either Drax Hall or St. Nicholas Abbey. Imagine that: little tiny Barbados with more and bigger Jacobean Mansions that the whole of British North America.

    So what does this tell us? It shows that Barbados in that era was by far the richest and most prosperous British colony in the Americas. Since this is before the British colonized India, John has proven that Barbados was the richest colony in the entire British empire at that time.

    It is so amusing when John provides the examples that prove his argument to be completely false.

    But it gets even better… he points out that looking at most plantation houses “none could be said to have been the result of huge profits;” the profits mostly got repatriated to Britain (absentee landlords and paying moneylenders) so the lion’s share of the profits from Barbados plantations didn’t even stay on Barbados plantations.

    Thanks John, for exposing your own lies once again.

  21. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    @Vincent asked
    ” I would like to know definitively when it [sugar] was profitable.”
    John answered “After the slaves in Haiti destroyed the economy in 1791 until Beet Sugar in Europe became available as a replacement for Caribbean sugar and began to compete pricewise.”

    It will be clear to you by now Vincent, that John’s answer is a transparent lie.

    Sugar was profitable in Barbados throughout the era of slavery until, as John points out, when Beet sugar could out compete it in the mid 20th century.

    It is pathetic that John feels he has to falsify history to prop up his racist notions of slavery, but it is even more disturbing that you seem to swallow his lies.


  22. absentee landlords !!!!

    Might be in Jamaica, not here!!

    Read your history!!

    Family might be in Britain but most “plantations” in Barbados were small, some tiny!!

  23. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    @John September 28, 2017 at 9:52 PM #
    “absentee landlords !!!!”

    You are right that this was more common in Jamaica, but look at your own example of Codrington plantation; owned by absentee landlords after Christopher Codrington himself died in 1710.

  24. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    @Vincent & John,
    In case you have any interest in the actual history of slavery in Barbados rather than apologist lies, you will find the Centre for the Study of the Legacies of British Slave-ownership at University College London to be a useful tool.
    https://www.ucl.ac.uk/lbs/


  25. It shows that Barbados in that era was by far the richest and most prosperous British colony in the Americas. Since this is before the British colonized India, John has proven that Barbados was the richest colony in the entire British empire at that time.
    ++++++++++++++++++++++

    Of what era are you speaking?

    Has it ever dawned on you that they brought their riches to Barbados when they left England?

    After New England was settled in 1620, Puritans left England in droves taking their riches, and wealth!!

    The Puritans needed Barbados/St. Kitts because of their location in the Atlantic currents.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puritan_migration_to_New_England_(1620%E2%80%9340)

    “The Puritan migration to New England was marked in its effects in the two decades from 1620 to 1640, after which it declined sharply for a time. The term Great Migration usually refers to the migration in this period of English Puritans to Massachusetts and the West Indies, especially Barbados. They came in family groups rather than as isolated individuals and were motivated chiefly by a quest for freedom to practice their Puritan religion”

    The English Government took to turning back ships in the Thames because when the Puritans left they took what ever they could carry … and their skills.

    It was making England poorer!!

    Most of the people leaving were literate, and economically contributing members of society

    http://www.newenglandhistoricalsociety.com/the-great-migration-of-picky-puritans-1620-40/

    Even Cromwell ….. little did the King know!!

    “It would appear that in 1634 Cromwell attempted to emigrate to Connecticut in America, but was prevented by the government from leaving.”

    When the Quakers appeared in 1648, New England was not open to them as a refuge as it had been to the Puritans.

    So they came to Barbados, St. Kitts and New Amsterdam/New York where they were welcomed by the Dutch.

    Captain James Drax was a member of the 1639 Assembly, certainly a Puritan … and a rich one!!!

    No sugar supposedly then!!

    No Quakers either!!

    …. and probably few if any slaves.

    In fact, George Fox would have been 15 years old!!

    In the same Assembly was … you guessed it …. Captain Benjamin Berringer!!

    So, both families were originally Puritan, rich in all probability, who may very well have built their houses before sugar, and before Quakers arrived on the scene!!!!

    About Drax Hall the web says “No one knows for sure, but it is generally believed that Drax Hall was built by the brothers William and James Drax in the 1650’s”

    So where did James and William hang their hats from before 1639 to the 1650’s?

    About Nicholas Abbey the web is more definite: “St.Nicholas Abbey, located in the parish of St.Peter, was built in 1658 and is one of only three genuine Jacobean mansions in the Western Hemisphere.”

    Same question applies to Benjamin Berringer. “Where did he call home from before 1639 and 1658?”

    … and it looks like the Benjamin Berringer in the 1639 Assembly could be the father of Benjamin Berringer who arrived in Barbados in 1656 who was supposed to have been killed in a duel!!!

    Assuming they were both rich they built their houses when they were young, they did not hang about … so my inclination is towards the early 1640’s, maybe before sugar.

    You see the problem with our historians, they never had access to the Internet or other databases designed for easy searches.

    I reckon in the next ten years our history will have been rewritten, if not sooner.

    No shame on them, its just that more information is available now, and easier.

  26. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    John September 28, 2017 at 10:50 PM #

    Drax Hall Estate was where the first sugar cane was cultivated in 1642. The Jacobean Mansion was built with sugar money in the 1650s, perhaps a few years before St. Nicholas Abbey. “Captain James Drax was a member of the 1639 Assembly,” but it is only with sugar that the scale of the family fortune grew to afford the ostentatious mansion.

    Col. Benjamin Berringer built St. Nicholas Abbey in 1658 after he had lived in Barbados for 24 years and was married with three kids. There is not the slightest doubt that if he could have afforded to build before that he would have… but he could not afford it until sugar had made him rich.

    So you are dead wrong again… neither mansion was built before sugar, they were both built with sugar money.

  27. Well Well & Consequences Observing Blogger. Avatar
    Well Well & Consequences Observing Blogger.

    Those broke ass enslavers left UK looking to get rich by any means…what brought what riches what…..most of them washed ashore half dead and disease ridden, some wrote journals and the horrors were animalistic in nature…in the US they ate each other to survive…in some instances.

    Trying to paint some picture of wealth before the slave trade is deceitful, if they were so wealthy and comfortable, they would never leave UK.

    ….they had nothing and left UK traveling around the world to see what they could thief.


  28. @peterlawrencethompson September 28, 2017 at 11:15 PM “So you are dead wrong againโ€ฆ neither mansion was built before sugar, they were both built with sugar money.”

    CORRECTION: Berringer and Drax became rich through slavery. Neither mansion was built before sugar, they were both built with the labour of enslaved people.

  29. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    @Simple Simon September 29, 2017 at 12:28 AM #
    Of course you are correct that the basis of these fortunes was the labour stolen from enslaved people, but neither Berringer or the Drax brothers were ever in the business of selling enslaved people insofar as I am aware. They made their money buying enslaved people and stealing their labour to grow sugar.


  30. Byer, seller of people. Same thing as far as I am concerned. All participants in evil.

    And very likely the hands of enslaved people also built the mansions.


  31. Drax Hall Estate was where the first sugar cane was cultivated in 1642. The Jacobean Mansion was built with sugar money in the 1650s, perhaps a few years before St. Nicholas Abbey.
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Like I said, nobody knows!!


  32. So it looks like we have established that Benjamin Berrenger and James Drax could not possibly have been Quakers when sugar took off because Quakers came on the scene in 1648.

    We agree this fact … right????


  33. James Drax’s son, Henry, however was.

    Will RB6/12/358

    Friends Christopher Codrington, John Codrington, Richard Guy, Samuel Newton and John Hothersall


  34. Henry left no issue.

    …. but he left his land to ALL of his nephews provided they changed their surname to Drax,


  35. SS

    CORRECTION: Berringer and Drax became rich through slavery. Neither mansion was built before sugar, they were both built with the labour of enslaved people.
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Seems to be factually incorrect!!

    “In the early phase of sugar production, planters claimed that these qualities were rare in most Africans, and when they were present, thought it politically necessary to suppress or eradicate them. As a result, they became heavily dependent on the labour force of white indentured servants to make the critical transition to sugar production. ”

    In this period, servants brought skills to the colony which were adapted to meet the planter’s demands. Their emergence from a rapidly developing technological tradition made them suitable: The planters’ importation of servants was conceived of not only in terms of labour inputs, but also as an injection of technology.

    The majority of planters found indentured servants adequate for sugar production. The result was a very large increase in the demand. for servants during the sugar boom of the late 1640s and early, 1650s., The Civil War in England was critical in releasing large numbers of labourers, and between 1645 and 1650 at least 8,000 men joined the labour-force of Barbados. By 1652, some 13,000 servants were employed in sugar product1รถn: “


  36. Doctor of Philosophy in the University of Hull
    by
    Hilary MacDonald Beckles, B. A.


  37. โ€œThe early profitability of sugar was itself the factor that encouraged the lopsidedness of the Barbadian economy.

    …. James Drax, Benjamin Berringer ….. up to 1660’s, 1670’s

    When the sugar industry ceased to be profitable on a long term basis, the planters were in no position to retrench and diversity.

    ….. 1680’s “Groans of the Plantations” … Quakers in control

    Their resources were geared to the production of the export crop, and the debt which they had by then accumulated forced them to go on concentrating on the production of the export staple as the only means of earning the foreign exchange necessary for meeting debt payrnents to the metropolitan merchants. Protection in the metropolitan market helped the planters to maintain the plantations intact during the Eighteenth Century.โ€

  38. Well Well & Consequences Observing Blogger. Avatar
    Well Well & Consequences Observing Blogger.

    “Byer, seller of people. Same thing as far as I am concerned. All participants in evil.

    And very likely the hands of enslaved people also built the mansions.”

    Slavemasters and their families were so greedy and lazy, you can guarantee that slaves built Barbados and the whole Caribbean….UK and Europe, US and Canada, slaves built every brick and building and roof, every road. Slaves built the WH.

    To this day, these crooks believe that stealing labor from people is ok.


  39. LOL
    John is so possessed by this legacy of evil, that he is unable to sleep …and despite being made to look the fool over and over and over again by PLT, he is constrained to keep getting up off the mat and presenting his chin for yet another upper cut…..
    What a punishment…
    What a price to pay…

    Reminiscent of the legendary Pharaoh of Egypt when Moses kept on hitting him with the plagues… and he kept coming back for more…
    …this is worse than the death that came to niggers from the lynchings or worse…

    @ Vincent
    Do you understand the concept of cockroach avoiding fowl cock party….?!!?

  40. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    John on September 29, 2017 at 2:23 AM
    โ€œLike I said, nobody knows!!โ€

    Youโ€™re lying again John. We have definitely proven that Drax Hall was built in the 1650s with money from the nascent sugar industry which was so profitable that it made Barbados the wealthiest colony in the entire British empire at that time.

  41. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    @John September 28, 2017 at 10:50 PM #
    “Has it ever dawned on you that they brought their riches to Barbados when they left England?”

    Honestly John, your argumets are so pathetically weak that they are totally boring in addition to being evil and racist.

    From Wikipedia “James Drax became one of the earliest English migrants to the island of Barbados: he and his companions arrived and lived for a time in a cave, hunting for provisions…”
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Drax

    Living in a cave and being a hunter gatherer… sounds like he really brought his riches to Barbados.


  42. The profitability in the early days of sugar, the 1640’s and 1650’s came at a time when free labour from England was available .. Civil War, 1642-1651.

    Drax and Berrenger built large houses out of the profits of Sugar and their labour.

    They may or may not have had riches before coming to Barbados.

    The investment in buying the cane plants and the means to grind the cane took riches.

    So they must have had riches before they got into sugar or have been able to convince someone to lend them those riches.

    They had an idea which someone with money believed in.

    Cromwell invaded Ireland in 1649-1653 continuing to make prisoners of war available for shipment to Barbados.

    wiki -“The Navigation Acts were a series of Acts passed in the English Parliament in 1651,1660 & 1663. The colonies represented a lucrative source of wealth and trade. The Navigation Acts were designed to regulate colonial trade and enabled England to collect duties (taxes) in the Colonies.”

    Once the profitability of sugar was established, and with the cessation of the flow of servants from England, large scale importation of slaves from Africa begun.

    We know African slaves were already in Barbados in the period 1647-1649 from Ligon

    We know the Quakers arrived on the scene in England and Ireland in 1648.

    The earliest will I have found of what appears to be a Quaker is from 1649, a Goddard.

    We also know that in 1655 Mary Fisher and Ann Austin were the first Quaker itinerants to visit Barbados.

    … and we also know that at least up until 1676, Quakers in Barbados were routinely persecuted for their beliefs.

    We also know that their population was growing as their message gained favour.

    Henry Drax and Christopher Codrington, either II or II became convinced Quakers prior to 1682, the date of Henry Drax’s will.

    And we also know from the treatise written by Lillington in the 1680’s that Sugar was unprofitable.

    So we can say that up to the 1680’s, sugar was profitable.

    Thereafter, when the French colonies and Brazil came on the market, the price of sugar fell.

    It doesn’t take much of a leap of faith to get to the realization that Barbados is a pinprick compared to Brazil, Haiti, even Martinique and Guadeloupe.

    Thereafter, periods of boom and bust followed, to the current day.

    Sugar provided the means to clothe, feed, house the population and eventually, sugar made us all free.

  43. Well Well & Consequences Observing Blogger. Avatar
    Well Well & Consequences Observing Blogger.

    They made money from trading slaves on and off island and then from sugar, after they were able to accumulate their ill gotten gains and diversify, selling slaves came first.

  44. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    @John September 29, 2017 at 11:16 AM #

    Didn’t you even READ the basic research I linked you to??

    Drax “arrived with a stock of no more than ยฃ300.”

    “Concurrent with the rise of sugar came large-scale and intensive exploitation of slave labor, and here too Drax was a notorious pioneer. Prior to 1640, the primary source of labor in Barbados had been European indentured servants. Although there were African slaves in Barbados before this point, it was only after 1640, and frequently in tandem with the cultivation of sugar, that slave labor began to supplant indentured servitude as the chief mode of production. Drax was deeply involved in this transition, acquiring 22 slaves in early 1642, just as he was getting involved in sugar. In 1644, he purchased another 34 slaves. By the early 1650s, his huge estate was manned by some 200 slaves of African descent.”

    So by the time Drax had enough money to build Drax Hall, he had already bought 200 enslaved people.

    Why do you persist in lying about this John, when the truth is so easy to find?

    Everything that you have said about sugar profitability in the period of slavery in Barbados I have proved to be absolutely wrong by quoting easily accessed and reputable research and historical records. Why are you so dedicated to White supremacist ideology??

  45. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    John September 29, 2017 at 11:16 AM #
    “So we can say that up to the 1680โ€™s, sugar was profitable.”

    The data that YOU posted above about the Codrington Plantation proves that you are lying again here John by trying to imply that sugar was not profitable throughout the period of slavery in Barbados. Why put up this hopeless denial of the plain obvious facts?


  46. Bushie

    Chuckle…likkle bwoi…..hush do….

    I have a lot of time for John’s research of historical FACTs every time a point is disputed he returns to it in a dispassionate manner with more evidence to back it up or acknowledging as all intelligent people are aware that none of this historical debate can be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt.

    On the other hand I have little time for PLTs histrionics which are based on his 5 decades old beef with John over the fact that he is more learned than he is,so instead of having a mature conversation on issues his mind is closed and his only intent is to disprove John by whatever means.

    I am intrigued by the fake news of Drax living in a cave…..was it sheltering after a storm at Ellesmere…..was he an eccentric with 300 pounds to his name……intriguing indeed.

    If you and the other duffuses on here would take time and study John’s facts and responses ,you would learn a lot as opposed to tossing ad hominems all over the place as well as making false statement against the young chap.

    But as GP has stated before…..thats what the idiots on here enjoy doing.

  47. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    @Vincent Haynes September 29, 2017 at 1:38 PM #
    “I am intrigued by the fake news of Drax living in a cave”

    If it’s fake Vincent you can argue the point with Jerome S. Handler, โ€œFather Antoine Bietโ€™s Visit to Barbados in 1654,โ€ Journal of the Barbados Museum and Historical Society, 32 (1967), 69

    I am amused by those who cannot prove a single one of their assertions so they fall back on the popular Trumpian tactic of declaring it “fake news” because it proves them wrong.

    “was he an eccentric with 300 pounds to his name…” If you had taken the time to read the simple resources that I linked you to you would have discovered that that nugget comes from one of John’s favorite resources Richard Ligon, A True and Exact History of the Island of Barbados (1657), 96.

    You “have little time for PLTs histrionics” because you have little time for learning, only for defending your prejudices.

    I do “take time and study Johnโ€™s facts and responses” meticulously because I am hoping to learn things that I did not know before. I have actually learned a lot from the historical material that John has cited… it just so happens that all that historical material that John himself has led me to disproves all of John’s major assertions about colonial Barbados. The historical material that John has cited has proven John wrong about:
    1. the profitability of sugar plantations in Barbados under slavery
    2. the wealth generated by the Barbados sugar industry under slavery
    3. the treatment of enslaved people in Barbados
    4. the starvation of Black people in Barbados under slavery and after emancipation
    5. the riches that English immigrants brought with them to Barbados
    6. and on and on…
    I did not prove John wrong on these points… the historical resources cited by John proved John wrong.

    People have asked me why I persist in this fruitless exercise… do I actually expect John to admit any of his errors? Well I’m an optimist, whenever he tells me I have made an error I apologize immediately and go back to double check my sources… I guess I am hoping my example will rub off on him. Actually, I do it because I am learning a lot, not only about the history of Barbados, but more importantly about its present. I am developing a deep understanding of why we have failed to make progress in the 40+ years that I was away from here. This is invaluable to me in my efforts to make a positive difference now that I’m back.


  48. The data that YOU posted above about the Codrington Plantation proves that you are lying again here John by trying to imply that sugar was not profitable throughout the period of slavery in Barbados. Why put up this hopeless denial of the plain obvious facts?
    ++++++++++++++++++++

    It proves that Codrington’s estates were well managed and even so, there were periods of losses!!

    A bug windfall occurred when Codrington’s heirs chose to contest the will

    But like all plantations, subsides were the order of the day


  49. big … not bug … that’s what I appear to be doing to you

  50. peterlawrencethompson Avatar
    peterlawrencethompson

    @ John, as you know the only period of Codrington losses was during the American revolution, and that was a four year period of very modest loss in comparison to hundreds of years of substantial profits. You can find data on other estates in the The Profitability of Sugar Planting in the British West Indies, 1650-1834 by J. R. Ward

    His findings for profit rates in Barbados as a percentage of invested capital are as follows:
    1689-1697 War โ€”
    1698-1702 Peace โ€”
    1703-1713 War 6.2%
    1714-1748 โ€”
    1749-1755 Peace 3.4%
    1756-1762 War 11.2%
    1763-1775 Peace 5.6%
    1776-1782 War 2.3%
    1783-1791 Peace 5.3%
    1792-1798 War 6.1%
    1799-1819 War 5.8%
    1820-1834 Peace 7.7%

    This shows that other estates must have been better managed that Codrington because the overall profit during the American revolution remains positive even though Codrington and its losses were a part of the sample for the above table.

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