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Submitted by Floyd Vincent

 

Sir Hilary Beckles Principal of UWI, Cave Hill

I have listened and watched the debate about access to university education with some interest over the past few weeks, especially after the announcements in the budget speech of November 22, 2010. I have a Bachelors and Masters degree for Cave Hill, fully funded by the tax payer and my degrees have provided me with many opportunities in life and I would like others to reap the same benefits.

According to my research, UWI Cave Hill has three main categories of students on entry to the university. Normal matriculation students who can be full time from the start of their degree and therefore can complete their degrees in three years or over six consecutive semesters. Lower level matriculation students who are required to be part-time for the first two years of their degree and therefore can complete their degrees in at least four years or over eight consecutive semesters. Advanced standing students (so called two plus two degrees) who are exempted from the majority of the first year of the degree (on the basis of CAPE, Associate Degrees or other qualifications), and therefore can complete their degree in four or five consecutive semesters.

The key elements of the higher education policy outlined in the budget seem to be that the government wants students to enter the university as preferably Advanced Standing students or if not, Normal Matriculation students, and for all students to complete their degrees in certain time limits. To inform myself on the issues I went up to campus and got my hands on a brochure, “Financial Information for Undergraduate and Graduate students 2008-2009” outlining the fee structure at UWI, Cave Hill. The following table summarizes the fee structure outlined in the brochure:

Faculty Annual Fees Paid By Government for A Full Time Student Annual Fees Paid By Government for A Part-time Student
Pure and Applied Sciences $32,993 $20,845
Humanities and Education $32,993 $20,845
Social Sciences $32,993 $20,845
Law $52, 848 Not quoted
Medical Sciences 105,169 Not quoted

 

Now according to my calculations for a Normal Matriculation student who completes in six consecutive semesters, the degree costs the tax payer $98,979. For a Lower Level matriculation student who completes the degree in four years or eight consecutive semesters the degree would cost the tax payer$107,676. While for an Advanced Standing student who completes in five semesters the degree costs the tax payer $74,662. The first thing that jumped out at me is that my degree at Cave Hill as a normal matriculation student cost the tax payer a lot of money and I am eternally grateful. The second thing that jumped out at me is that in the absence of a cap on the budget, the university has a financial incentive to maximize the head count at the university. It also made me pause and become more aware of the logic behind the government’s policy. Since every year spent at Cave Hill will typically cost between $20,845 and $32,993, time limits are important. Also, by trying to push Advanced Standing the government appears to be looking at reaping a $25,000 saving per degree, while maintaining access for students.

A perusal of the Handbooks of various Faculties and Departments at UWI Cave Hill provided some information on the requirements for Advanced Standing and exemptions at the university. According to the Handbooks, a number of BCC Associate degrees with a GPA of 2.75 or better allows for Advanced Standing. CAPE passes from Grade 1 to 4 also allow for exemptions from a number of UWI level one courses. I would have qualified for Advanced Standing if the current options had applied in my day.

If my reading of the situation is correct, then at a minimum, the debate in the country should be about the cost to the government of funding increased access to CAPE, Associate degrees and other means towards Advanced Standing or Normal Matriculation versus the anticipated savings on UWI fees. My own limited research suggests that tuition fees are $8,000 for a two year Associate degree at the Barbados Community College, which suggests that savings may be possible, but more detailed research is needed. The transfer and Subsidy to UWI currently stands at around $142ml per year. It is larger than the rest of the education sector combined. Any savings in the delivery of university education should not be sniffed at.

In my opinion, the government should ignore the grand standing and public relations campaigns of the university and the opposition and use its authority to mandate UWI, and the various tertiary institutions to work together to find efficacious means of allowing a majority of students to enter the university as Advanced Standing students or Full Matriculation students, instead of the current situation where over half the students entering the university are Lower Level Matriculation students. The opposition will oppose, and given that some costs of delivering education are fixed and the government pays per student per year, the university has a financial incentive to admit as many students as possible and has no incentive to rush them out of the system. However, a government must govern for the interests of the country as a whole.

We all recognize the crucial role access to higher education plays in Barbados. I am convinced that if the institutions work together, the government policy as stated in the recent budget will work to preserve access to university education for future generations by reducing the cost to the tax payer and hence the financial viability of free university education. By the way, I have focused on the financial issues, but exactly what is wrong with asking students at tax payers expense, to properly qualify themselves for university? What is wrong with our education system that the majority of students at UWI are Lower level matriculation?


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44 responses to “UWI Debate”


  1. The last point it very simple Floyd. The amount of students that registered into bcc or A level school fall far below the amount that can be registered into uwi. Therefore if we wish to implement such a policy we need to expand bcc and a level student capacity first so that is not bottleneck into getting into uwi. Now as for the lower matriculated student when i was at the campus they didn’t need to be part-time but need to complete a year of prelim to be fully matriculated. Therefore i say this is just cart before the horse policy and they really didn’t think it thru before starting it.


  2. @Floyd

    Thanks for the submission, and be patient next time 🙂

  3. Mash Up & Buy Back Avatar
    Mash Up & Buy Back

    This is the type of discussion we need to be having about UWI – Cave Hill.

    Brother Bush Tea I would really like to hear your input on this matter.

    I have long felt that this one graduate (at any cost ) per housheold was a lot of bullcrap being pushed by hilary for his own agenda.

    41 million dollars every year and rising for a small 275-300,000 island people with limited resources is way too much for government to find.


  4. The government of Barbados appears to be married to the idea of free education to the point where the burgeoning subsidy appears to be of no consideration. Why should Sir Charles or Sir David’s children, to cite as an example, benefit from ‘free’ education? Why should the son or daughter of the banker or civil servant not have to pay?

    That time when ‘free’ education was conceptualized to enfranchise the people has long past. We are at a different time and a different thinking needs to apply. Hilary Beckles, we have blogged in the past, is padding his legacy. How quickly he has gotten comfortable with the corporate sector, how quickly he has reconciled his differences with Owen Arthur and the BLP. How many people remember Beckles speaking DLP political platforms?

    Unfortunately this government or the next have neither the balls or brains to see that they are being played.


  5. To do such david is be discriminated. Now The constitution forbids that so they would either have to abolish all of it or none at all. Abolish it means death at the poll and politicians aren’t going to do that unless than have no choice.


  6. @anthony

    What are you saying? Only political considerations will inform our decisions now and forever more?


  7. Isn’t that how it currently is. we aren’t going to change the status quo anytime soon.


  8. How can we speak of enfranchisement through education and then claim our country has been sold for peanuts?

    One or the other is not true.


  9. I am presently a part-time student at UWI, I work hard and pay taxes. It is impossible for me to complete in 4 years. So should i have to pay then? Should i stop paying taxes as well, Chris SInkler has more than enough money to send his kids to overseas universities. I don’t. I hope he retains his seat next election bearing in mind his constituency is full or poor and working class ppl who have to work and study.


  10. […] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Kammie Holder. Kammie Holder said: UWI Debate: http://t.co/UlMcjdS […]


  11. but young bajan if you need more time you canm simply make your case.


  12. Floyd your missing the point I made. It a backward approach in trying to fix the system. they will always be student applying due to lack of space in bcc or a levels to qualify for advance level or normal matriculation. With the minister instruction of only full matriculates student would the student getting in on lower matriculation standard now have to pay their way?


  13. last time i heard the acceptance rate to bcc was at about 25% with a level school being even less. If those figure are true or less now shouldn’t they be address first before killing most people chance and university. The working class man who goes to uwi part time most of the time will not have a change to have gone a level school in his youth or applied to bcc but was turned down due to lack of space. How do we solve the problem if the minister requires full matriculation for the student to be paid for. It’s a cart before the horse scenario.


  14. Trinidad and Barbados are the only Caribbean countries that provide 100% free education right up to the PHd level. In the case of UWI most other Island governments provide a cess to students on campus. Trinidad has oil and gas, Barbados economy is built on a precarious model called tourism. I don’t know how long we are going to continue to keep up this facade, but the issue of free education should be re-visited. People will make a lot of useless political and emotional noise about this , because we have become so accustom to free education in this country that it has now become an entitlement program.Wiser heads among us know this is not sustainable going forward.We are just delaying the inevitable.

    One of the moral hazard of free education at Cave Hill is the professional students- people who take years to fulfill graduation requirements. On another more serious note is the issue of course relevance. We have too many people graduating from the system with degrees that is not relevant to the realities of the demand of the market place.


  15. Well course relevance is decide by the institution. The labour and private sector would have to get on uwi case for that. Professional students are a hazard but can be dealt with if the regulation already there where actually enforced.


  16. @ Zion

    “We have too many people graduating from the system with degrees that is not relevant to the realities of the demand of the market place.”

    Depends on your definition of the ‘market place’.


  17. I am intrigued by anthony’s argument which seems to say, can’t get into BCC so accommodate them at UWI instead. Are you saying that someone qualified for BCC automatically qualifies for UWI? Forgive me for being Old School but that strikes me as wrong.

    My sources tell me that CAPE Unit 1 in a number of subjects could be introduced in a number of secondary schools across Barbados from the 2011 school year if we could only get past the notion of a “Sixth form school.”

    From the numbers here one lower level matricualtion year at uwi costs 20,845, it seems to me that if 500 students did not go straight to uwi the govt would save around $10ml. That $10 ml could build a few sixth form annexes at secondary schools, or even some physical expansion at BCC or polytechnic.

    The govt may be on to something here.

    I personally believe that in terms of personal development it is better to go to bcc or sixth form or polytechnic before uwi. I would not have liked to be on a campus fresh out of fifth form. I find a lot of commentators are totally insensitive to the potential impact on the young people. The exceptional student will handle it and do well, but I suspect many suffer.

    I am calling on the govt to outline its plans for bcc, sixth form, polytechnic expansion.

  18. Trained Economist Avatar
    Trained Economist

    Anthony is conveniently ignoring the argument made in the submission that the current system provides uwi with an incentive to maximize student head count. Is there not a real danger of quantity over quality?


  19. Not only that Trained Economist but it makes no financial sense to take a student who could not get into BCC at a cost of $8,000 in order to fully matriculate for UWI and give them the opportunity to matriculate at a cost of $25,000 per year. In addition when students go to UWI and are overwhelmed there is also an additional cost. Students who are not properly prepared are more likely to encounter difficulties and wash out or take longer to finish. This again represents a significant cost which Government has to fund.

    These issues probably don’t bother UWI management because whether the student performs or not the tuition fees are paid.

    The Government has to ensure that policies are put in place which ensure the greatest returns for funds spent and limit wastage and inefficiency if government funded UWI tuition is to continue.
    The funny thing is that I think there were limits imposed on the number of medical students the Government was willing to fund so the concept of limiting intake to a certain matriculation level or to a certain level of funding is not new.

  20. Trained Economist Avatar
    Trained Economist

    My concern is whether or not the government will stand its ground.

    We certainly would like to hear from secondary schools what resources are really needed to offer unit 1 of cape subjects. Of course everyone will be inclined to ask for an arm and a leg.

    Maybe someone like Matthew Farly will be bold and step up to offer unit 1 of a number of cape subjects from sept 2011.


  21. An actual discussion of one of the important underlying issues in relation to funding of students at local tertiary level institutions. Thank you, Mr Vincent.


  22. @Trained Economist

    Appreciate your comment but education has become both a political and emotional topic in Barbados. Who will step up indeed!


  23. excellent discussion…this is what the govt of barbados should be doing more of: taking a position based on hard quantitative evidence. I always amazes me how much ‘debate’ and arguments occur in barbados which are not based on any sound data at all.

    there definitely needs to be some disincentive to higher headcount for the sake of it and for .

    what would be interesting to see would be the average number of semesters that a ( full, lower level and advanced separately) student actually takes to complete a degree…then we can get a clearer picture of the financial strain that the uwi is costing the GoB. For what? cricket studies? endless management and sociology degrees?

    Uwi’s purpose and raison d’etre need to be reassessed and a rigorous plan vis a vis it’s *future* (not past) relevance to the country and it’s developmental needs to be thought through and implemented. I guess ultimately wee need to ask ourselves theh questions:
    Are we getting the best we can from UWI? If not then why?
    In it’s current form, is UWI able to help Barbados(= Barbadian graduate) reposition itself in a uber competitive global marketplace? If not, why?
    Can UWI / the gov’t justify quantitatively or otherwise the annual multimillion govt subsidy? If not then there has to be change.


  24. I have a suggestion for UWI. UWI should send all students an invoice of the cost of their education for each semester. The invoice should indicate the size of the scholarship you have received from the tax payer towards those costs. maybe it might help people get serious.


  25. @Enuff. I meant the job market.Too many are going to Cave to go for the easier degrees. That is why the overwhelmingly graduates are from the humanities and the social science.There is so much Mass comm graduate we need in Barbados.

    We need to start to offer our own agriculture degrees in specializing areas like green house technology, hydroponics, tissue culture etc. In the areas of International economics we need more trade specialist in this area. There is also a need for specialist in forensic and crime scene investigation.


  26. Old School
    I am intrigued by anthony’s argument which seems to say, can’t get into BCC so accommodate them at UWI instead. Are you saying that someone qualified for BCC automatically qualifies for UWI?

    Yes you do. Your qualified for admission via lower matriculation.

    Trained economist
    Anthony is conveniently ignoring the argument made in the submission that the current system provides uwi with an incentive to maximize student head count. Is there not a real danger of quantity over quality?

    The danger of quantity over quality will only happen if standards are reduced. yes the system does make uwi want to maximize the head count but so does any other university the most student the more fund for it,. University in itself is a business and seek to have more money to research other things.


  27. Anthony, the incentive thing is not as clear as you are saying. In many countries various univerisites have to compete for students, and their degrees have to compete with each other. Things are a little different here. The fact that government pays for you to go to UWI and not other universities gives UWI a level of dominance in the market. This dominance creates a need for greater vigilance in terms of quality.

    Anthony, I cannot help thinking that Lower Level Matriculation should be the exception rather than the norm, which UWI now seems to be claiming. I could understand the need to push lower level matriculation back in the day (50s, 60s, 70s and even 80s) when for a variety of reasons very capable students left school and went straight to work. Providing a means for those persons to access university makes sense. You mean to tell me that since the 1990s a lot of capable students have been going straight into the workforce and now need some to come back to university. I am open to persuasion.

    Is it just possible that to expand its revenues UWI has ramped up on the student population by making lower matriculation (meant for the exception) now the norm? Anthony are you open to this possibility and the consequences for the society. Not only would the costy escalate as it has, but we may not be able to reap the productivity benefits because of graduates of a lower quality.

    This may or may not have happened but in the absence of budget cap, quotas for full versus lower level matric and or time limits the danger is there and steps should be taken to deal with it.

    It seems to me that having more schools offer CAPE offers the greatest potential for cost savings.

    Also, why do all of us need a university degree. The qualifications at BCC and the Polytechnic should be terminal degrees for some persons who can go on and make a larger contribution to the society than the endless Management and psychology graduates UWI seems to produce. There seems to be some kind of reverse snobbery going on. If a go to BCC and do an associate degree in marketing, why I am somehow less than someone who foes on and does a degree in Sociology. I don’t get that. You do not need a degree to be an educated well rounded, sophisticated and highly productive memebr of society.


  28. I have no problem with affirmative action or giving persons a chance. Call me old school, but something just seems wrong to me if you are saying that over half of the students at our premier educational instutions do not meet “normal matriculation” requirements. Shoildn’t the majority of students meet the normal entry requirement and then special cases make up a minority?

    You speak of cart before horse, the cart before horse seems to be our current policy. We are providing sixth form, BCC type education at UWI fees for a majority of students. The money being pumped into UEWI should be spent getting more students ready for normal matriculation or advanced standing.


  29. Old school
    You mean to tell me that since the 1990s a lot of capable students have been going straight into the workforce and now need some to come back to university. I am open to persuasion.

    It not even that the the go straight into the workforce. It that the apply to go a levels , bcc and uwi. At which a levels & bcc turn down most while uwi accepts most.

    see the space problem i been trying to get across http://www.nationnews.com/index.php/articles/view/full-house-at-bcc-and-sjpp/

    Old School
    It seems to me that having more schools offer CAPE offers the
    greatest potential for cost savings.

    I agree whole heartedly. Cape schools plus the polytechnic and bcc need to further expanded which is what I had stated in my first comment. The minister plan seems like a backward approach into lowering the intake number at uwi. It just going to bottleneck at the amount of student bcc and alevel school can process. Now most working folks get in via the lower matriculation at bcc since they never got chance to go a levels or bcc at their time. By make it full matriculation you now block these people for free further education after paying their due to society.

    Old School
    If a go to BCC and do an associate degree in marketing, why I am somehow less than someone who foes on and does a degree in Sociology. I don’t get that. You do not need a degree to be an educated well rounded, sophisticated and highly productive memebr of society

    This is true you don’t need to bsc or msc or phd to be educated or well rounded but if you wish to be able to advance in a career in the private or public sector you need the degree(s) otherwise for majority of occasion they will just say your not qualified for the post due to lack of degree even if you have more than enough experience to make up for lack of the degree.
    Only place where degree plays no real matter is if your self employed but that a whole other topic in itself.


  30. Old school
    You speak of cart before horse, the cart before horse seems to be our current policy. We are providing sixth form, BCC type education at UWI fees for a majority of students. The money being pumped into UWI should be spent getting more students ready for normal matriculation or advanced standing.

    It is the current policy. which is why i said you should address the problem first not symptoms. The problem being not enough a level or bcc spots for most students. the symptoms of such a problem is that uwi can let in these students via lower matriculation and charge government for it. If i wish to cure the symptoms I just say full matriculation or no payment to solve the symptoms but to solve the problem I need to expand a level schools and bcc.


  31. The ingratitude, indifference and other attitudes of so many students at UWI, who are given FREE tertiary level education, a luxury unheard of in the UK and the great USA, one day will come crumbling down, as too many Bajans, especially this present generation are so ungreatful regarding what this little nation of ours offers so many of us for FREE!
    One day it will all come to and end, all of this freeness!


  32. good points all around..what i findd isconcerting however is tha fact that despite all this free education does not seem to be benefitting the country the way I believe that Errol Barrow et al first conceptualised


  33. Quoting David “Why should Sir Charles or Sir David’s children, to cite as an example, benefit from ‘free’ education? Why should the son or daughter of the banker or civil servant not have to pay? ”

    Dear David: Because the education is not free. Because Sir David, and Sir Charles and the banker and this civil servant pays a lotta. lotta taxes in my case $21,000 per year in income taxes alone, and God only knows how much in VAT.

    So what freeness you talking ’bout?

    The education ain’t free David.

    THE EDUCATION IS TAX FUNDED not free.

    When my little Susie enters Cave Hill this September I wouldda dun pay fa she education 10 years ago.

    Freeneess what!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Don’t get me started now.

  34. simply anonymous Avatar

    i’m reading that part time students or lower matriculations should complete a degree in 4 years. when i entered as part time the letter did say 4 yrs but the booklet instructed a part time student to complete 5 courses in 2 semesters ( this equals to 6 years) the full time student completes 10 courses in 2 semesters. is there a conflict? i am working so i go part time but i have done 5 courses in one semester and pass all of them. i would not recommend that for most part-timers tho. what i don’t understand is why the minister seems to be targeting part time students only. the full time students still have the chance to complete in 3 yrs, the part time students always complete in 6. if you push and take on more than is necessary, ur Adviser usually advises u to take fewer classes in order to complete ur degree with first class or upper class honours


  35. Ok I know this not drawing to much attention but this is probably the best topic without people start being partisan or cursing or insulting each other out. We need more discussion


  36. Given the size of the transfer to uwi its a crucial topic.

    It seems to me that thye current policy says whatever your level of academic aptitude displayed we want to put you through a Bachelors of Science or Arts type education.

    What is the argument for it? Why do we think that such a large percentage of the population need a university type degree?


  37. The argument for it would be that the degree gives you greater opportunities. The argument against would be we have more than enough people to fill all those opportunities with degrees already. One of the ideas was after all to use people as resources and let uwi grads find employment all across the world. This plan hasn’t really come to much fruition at all. Honest I wish uwi would expand the engineering school here as those degrees may prove more practical for many people to hold and go out and get jobs with them either here or abroad.


  38. Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what can you do for your country.


  39. Listened to Sir Hillary with great interest as reported in the news today. Let’s see if we understand his argument:

    UWI is adding value to the society and giving value for money when it educates Barbadian students paid for by the Barbados government. He castigates, by calling them one sides, those who are calling for a cut in the subsidy. BU agrees that tertiary level education is a wonderful thing and it must be encourages.

    He ends his defence of UWI receiving a government subvention by agreeing that a scientific method to allocate funds to UWI must be found. So if we read Sir Hillary correctly the government should continue to sustain the subvention in the face of challenging economic times but there should be no cap placed on what we as a country can afford at this time.

    Please explain, anybody.


  40. A lot of government members have benefited from fulltime UWI education and on being voted for say that government workers can only get 6 hours to go to the university; that means 2 subjects a semester. Therefore 20 subjects at 2nd and 3rd year at 2 subjects a semester, how much time will that take. Added to this, the tutor that says that if after a certain time he will shut the door and no student will be allowed into the classroom. I see the university seems to want to cater to full-time students only.


  41. I was pleased to hear Sir Hilary Beckles latest stand.

    The thing is, in the current world environment, higher education will, be the bedrock of island success in coming years. ‘

    Those educated now will bring prosperity to our island in the future, so the investment will be well worth it.

    Trust me, it is critical that we push higher education and ensure efficient and free delivery to our people.

    As time goes by, you will see the benefits, it is imperative to remain viable as a nation.

    That said, why are so many so casual about kicking the ladder behind them???

    Be careful of so-called ‘experts’ that you take advice from, they too have an agenda!


  42. It seems the education minister has finally actually had some consultation with uwi and has come to conclusion the part time student should be given 5 years. I think we should all be happy the minister has finally seems some of the light. Though as before it seem like government is doing everything in reverse and trying to fix afterwards.


  43. I’m curious about how does UWI arrive at the annual cost of 32,000 + per student that they “invoice” Government for?


  44. It’s truly very complex in this active life to listen news on
    TV, so I only use world wide web for that purpose, and get
    the latest news.

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