As a UK citizen of Bajan parentage, I’m alarmed at the news coming out of the Carribean – especially with regard to Barbados.

I will be visiting Barbados for the first time in 15 years in a couple of months; only than will I be truly informed as to what is going on over there.

On my last visit I was staggered with the complacency that greeted me. I was left with the impression that Bajans were “work shy”. For example vegetables and fruit were left rotting on the trees or on the ground or I was unable to find a decent level of service throughout the island; I will not mention those private buses!

I would ask my fellow Bajans whose ancestors shed their precious blood for this island to wake up, take reponsibility for your future and to demand immediate action from your government. Their’s no point blaming those immigrants or questioning their motives. If you want to reclaim your country, you will have to implore your government to start representing you. If you are united in your efforts than a change can be made.

I looked forward to living one day in the land where my ancestors were transported to. I have always believed that as a black man, Barbados was a safe haven where I could stand tall with my fellow brothers and sisters. I believe that dream may be dying. Is there another black country out there as successful as Barbados? Will this black mecca have to be ultimately shared with others who despise you?

The signs are not healthy; history screams the names of Kenya, Uganda, Trinidad, Guyana, etc who all slept walked there way into the abyss.

For the sake of your ancestors, yourself, your family and the future generations: please – WAKE UP!

PS – Will someone please tell me what are the advanatages of Barbados been a member of Caricom. Do we need to be a member of a club with so many dysfunctional players. After all if these were members of my family, I would probably of cut them adrift a longtime ago. Answers please.

X-man

Quoting “Anonymous”:

“Their’s no point blaming those immigrants …

“Who all slept walked there way into the abyss.”

Perhaps mostly what your homeland wants is someone who grasps the difference between “their” and “there”.

If you don’t grasp the difference, perhaps you should extend your very long visit to the UK. Clearly, you can’t say anything to young Bajans about grammar.

@AH
We’ve been over this. My suggestion, honestly, is to ask him. I see the offending article is presented on Norman Girvan’s blog, http://www.normangirvan.info/category/caribbean-integration/sir-shridath-ramphal-caribbean-integration/, so you could even offer a comment there. I would see no problem in being direct. If he refuses to comment, then so be it.

i ain’t backing down. i want sonny ramphal out of barbados. i want compton bourne removed as president of the CDB and kicked out. these men offended us and tried to nasty the image of our country by their stupid statements and we have to make an example of them because they should know better. rickey singh also. if a bajan was in guyana and had made the statements these men did, the bajan would be put out. you have that in particular if he is black.

@Adrian Hinds // July 6, 2009 at 9:31 pm

I sought to correct the citation made by sylvan. A terrible habit, but there you have it.

I then asked sylvan if I should take the words he/she wrote or change them to what I want them to be. (I actually offered no correction.) sylvan did not reply. So be it.

I engaged the author directly, and he/she responded or not, as is his/her right.

I suggested you engage Sir S. directly rather than asking someone else to divine his meaning. I don’t know if you did that. It’s your choice.

AH

Good luck on getting LIB to comment on Ramphal’s statement. His response to me was the same i.e. that I should ask Ramphal.. I plan to do so when I see him at the next cocktail party in the environs of Sandy Lane.:-)

@ Adrian Hinds // July 7, 2009 at 10:11 am
“If you did not seek to correct someone for incorrectly attributing words and meanings to Shridath” Accuracy is really important. Certain words used are contentious enough, but let’s attribute to him what he said. I would hope that is acceptable. I trust that you know the difference between the two verbs concerned, which to me is like chalk and cheese.

In the same way that we can deduce that ‘PUBIC convenience’ might actually have been mistakenly written instead of ‘PUBLIC convenience’, we cannot be sure, so one checks. And I repeat, the author did not respond to the probing, which bothers me not one jot.

@AH
“Well can you apply your meaning to the two verbs and let us know what you thing he meant?” [NO. What little media training I did warned me that even the most innocent of expressions can get taken out of context and turned and twisted and it’s then a devil of an effort to get back to what you meant. On my own statements, I will gladly exchange on their meanings. ]

“Anti-Bajan individuals such as yourself” [I fear, no regret, that this is the kind of remark that tells me that when a mind is closed, it is truly closed. But, you have your position, and appear comfortable with it. Over the past few months, I have started to make a matrix of remarks made by Barbadians, about their own country and its situation: not just any persons, but those who are deemed to be revered and patriotic. By your standard they are all turning out to be “Anti-Bajan Bajans”. They make very interesting reading, and it’s really hard to know how you for example really view your compatriots who make critical remarks about the country. It would seem, but I may be wrong, that you and some others are of the view that those who dare say anything critical about Barbados and Barbadians cannot possibly help us. For that reason, it’s interesting to see how David Thompson has been flipped from hero to goat in a few short days. Like a teacher who can only give good marks even on the worst of essays, you seem to want to nurture the bad as if it were the good. To me, that seems like a real dis-service, in the same way that some of your apparent compatriots think that to look smuggly at Jamaica’s smouldering social and economic ruins and argue that because that is so terrible they need not give a hoot about the tinderbox of similar social and economic disorder here is any solution.

Live a life surrounded by yes men/women and cowtowers and you will live a life surrounded by those fearful of telling you the truth. Much as I may not have liked the policies of now Dame Thatcher, her notion of “Don’t give me problems, give me solutions” is instructive, because it realises that most situations are imperfect but can be improved. But if you believe that all is perfect then of course you will never see what is to be fixed.

Love your country and all its people, as you should, but always do so with real honesty.

LIB

Over the past few months, I have started to make a matrix of remarks made by Barbadians, about their own country and its situation
**************************************
1984 Here we come Big Brother is watching

I do hope that you use your matrix to produce accurate accounts and not the literary license to say “You get a lot of supposedly substantive arguments against this group for being ‘smelly’, ‘musty’, ‘clannish’, ‘not like us’, ‘scheming’, ‘wanting to take over’, etc”.

We have had this discussion about literary license before; when you substitute one or two commentators with the words “a lot”; someone who may not be current with the discussion will take your word at face value without any idea what “a lot” represents.

Also, your characterisation of what some people say about Jamaicans on the blog is misleading. People tend to generalise, pop off and disappear and their views don’t necessarily represent the position of the majority. The Jamaicans I know would be the first to tell you that their country has a great deal of problems, but they are fiercely patriotic and if Ramphal made the same statement about Jamaica he would be made to feel unwelcome. These Jamaicans tell me that Bajans are very docile (and these are only the females).

Parsing;Parsing;Parsing!

@Sargeant
“1984 Here we come Big Brother is watching” [A tad paranoic? Is there some sense that you all believe that no one is taking note of what is written here? A bevvy of observations gathered from hither and yon, like squirrels chasing nuts. Look! Starbroek said this. Hear this! Man speaking on VOB…I am not the government, or police, or a particularly intersted observer of much that is written here, but who knows who amongst your own nation may be out there ‘watching’ and ‘tracking’? We know that the moderator is, as he can identify those who flip identities and try to generate what could be mistaken for dialogue but is in fact just one source.]

I said that my focus was on “those who are deemed to be revered and patriotic”. Faceless and nameless individuals commenting on a blog thread do not fit those criteria.

@AH
My visit to Boston will give me time to reflect on how things in Barbados look from afar, as my travel usually does. I will use it to ask some questions of two friends who know ethnic strife well (a Peruvian Jew, who has just returned to the US after spending time in Rwanda abd Burundi) and a Guinean (my former junior economist, whom I sponsored to do a masters), whose country has 3 near equal-sized ethnic groups, who have not been in strife, but have watched how such strife has torn apart their neigbouring countries (Sierra Leone, Cote d’Ivoire and Liberia). It’ll be useful perspective also to talk about their histories, which they can trace back over at least 1000 years, and see how that has shaped what they call nationhood.

Maybe I will get to Fenway Park, for the first time, and see how the American national spirit is doing.

Pretty boring stuff, really.

Where so ever you all are with your thoughts, I’m going to have fun in a Crop Over tent.

You people realise, of course, that Ramphal was merely reporting what he had heard and read (“intimations of ethnic cleansing”) He was not at all saying that there was ethnic cleansing in Barbados as many, a few of whom should know better, seem to think!

@AH
“It seems like I will miss a great intellectual meeting of like minds,”
We are anything but of ‘like minds’, even in the area of the economics that we practised together. This is where assessment of people can be important.

An exercise that would be worth going through in the immigration discussion, but more broadly, is thinking about what it is that makes people seem different or similar. Look at the three disparate individuals, of which I am one.

1. A middle-aged Peruvian-born Jew, who spent time growing up in Peru (as part of a religious minority that has known centuries of persecution) and Israel (as part of a religious majority that was built to avoid persecution), studied and worked in the US (where he was part of the religious minority but in the racical majority), worked and lived in Ghana, Rwanda and Burundi (where he was the minority in so many senses–and in two of those countries elimination of ethnic minorities is a well know part of recent history). Has his family living in Israel while he goes off to do Hebrew studies.
2. A late 20s Guinean born and bred Muslim, who studied in his country (where political opponents of the presidents have been brutally eliminated over decades) and Morocco, then worked with a group of expatriates (none of whom shared his religion), then studies in Tunisia and now the US. Whose family now lives without him, though in their home land.
3. A Jamaican-born Christian (who has never known religious persecution), who spent 30 formative years in England, as a not much liked racial minority (though never really persecuted, personally), who then lived about 20 years in the US, again as a not much liked racial minority (where racial persecution of this group is still part of living memory). Who also lived and worked in west Africa as part of a racial majority but part of a religious minority. Who returns to the Caribbean, but as part of a racial majority, but also a distinctive foreigner.

How could or would we become of ‘like mind’?

@AH
“Report back on all views with respect to “Nationhood” and all that it entails.”

I do have that very much in my sights, with the modest caveat that ‘all that it entails’ may be beyond me.

As an aside, I am always amused how I have to explain to many people that my English accent or time in England DOES NOT MAKE me English in my mind, one little bit. Yet there are some who will see me as nothing as pure Jamaican.

Our Caribbean lives are complex enough for a region so small. My generation was born British (by administrative fiat), then became something else (by adminsitrative fiat) when our countries became independent as their different times. Some like me could reclaim British nationality (by another administrative fiat) and yet also retain our new national identities by administrative convenience. But throughout all of that, I was/am, and I am sure many like me, were/are only ever ‘nationals’ in our own eyes.

Enough for the moment.

I was/am, and I am sure many like me, were/are only ever ‘nationals’ in our own eyes.

Is that Jamaican Nationals or Caribbean Nationals?….yuh know, of the Caribbean Nation?

I am surprise that could be so confuse by your accent. 🙂 Now that I know you see yourself as Jamaican, I shall refer to you as British. lol!

@AH
“Is that Jamaican Nationals or Caribbean Nationals?….yuh know, of the Caribbean Nation?” [To me, there are nations (and territories) in the Caribbean region, and we can confuse things by referring to ‘Caribbean nationals’ because there are many who are ignorant of our location and status and confuse themselves. Even if we had a common passport we would still be nationals of the individual countries, unless they have disappeared as states in the process.]

“I am surprise that could be so confuse by your accent. 🙂 Now that I know you see yourself as Jamaican, I shall refer to you as British. lol!” [There you go. I am more likely to be truly offended by being called British or English–not least for the insult to my ancestors and compatriots and those with whom I align myself in the Caribbean.]

David did not think the British ‘invasion’ was worth being concerned about now/yet. But though my initial intention had some facetiousness about it, it’s worth focusing on. One of the good Calypsos from last night touched on this issue, and who is buying up the land. Food for thought.

How should I accept the following:

and we can confuse things by referring to ‘Caribbean nationals’
—————————————-

Were you deliberately attempting to confuse when you referred to your wife as a Caribbean national?

So the Brits failed to assimilate you. After 30 years of living there you still do not see your self as British. So much for the their defence of Multiculturalism. Would you still advocate for a deepening of a multicultured Barbados?

I am with you on the new British Invasion. It is sad that they are leaving the multicultured society they created, and still defend.

LIB, AH, as a person who has not lived in Barbados for more than 15 years and rarely visits, can only comment and opine from the perspective of one who has no realistic view of current life in Barbados or the Caribbean.

No Adrian, You’re not wrong but some things have been added. All over Barbados you will find Chinese restuarants and lots of them walking around , most of the large government projects are now done by chinese and some private ones too. Then their is the large influx of guyanese who are competing against the chinese for jobs. It is not unusual for an unemployed bajan artisan when he applies for a job on the worksite, that they don’t employ bajans. Yes, this is Barbados I’m talking about, a Barbados that many bajans are beginning to lose faith in. Progress is great but bajans are not benefiting. Even the NHC seems to be favoring guyanese for their houses over the bajans. Something will explode soon.

Ha ha Scout let me “INTERSEED” on yours and my behalf. Your statement though grammatically incorrect did not result in any miscommunication thus. We ALL understood your point. Do understand the Jamaican LIB propenSCity to correct the obvious. Indeed by the statistics Jamaica is not the murder CAPITAL of the world, nor is it a Capital, but is a Country. How the Jamaican LIB now Language maven missed this one???? To be more pointed in my response,….15 years later what has change in respect to Jamaica and murders committed there, for 1993 the year I left Barbados, Jamaica murder rate was 26.8 per 100k with 600+ murders recorded. By 2004 Jamaica was ranked as a country with one of the highest murder rate in the Caribbean. By 2005 its murder rate was reported to be one of the highest in the world.

Caribbean Islands‎ – Page 254
by Lonely Planet Publications Staff, Ryan Ver Berkmoes, Amy C. Balfour, Paul Clammer, Michael Grosberg – Travel – 2008 – 880 pages
Jamaica has the highest murder rate for any country not in the throes of war (
the nation had a record 1574 murders in 2007, a 17% rise on the previous year)

LIB said:
You’ve lived amongst the British quite some time. Do you want them to turn Barbados into a more than “Little England” in name?
————————————————-
Any Ideas on why only two or three islands have signed onto the CCJ?

Any Idea on why there MAY be a significant number of persons who do not want to change our constitutional monarchy for a republic?

Could it be that there isn’t much trust of the West Indian politician?

Thanks Sargeant. I must admit I almost fell for it, although in the back my mind I sense a change in his position re. I am Jamaican not British, and his play up of his past 30 years in Britain as a minority who was constantly reminded that he is. Yet he his Englishness is laid out for all to see on his blog.

@Sargeant: No evil plot. Briefly, we open our hearts it seems to children of those who enslaved our ancestors and brought them here. We close our hearts and minds to those who were sort of in the same boat. Will expand once feet settle in the state of the tea party. Doing this by mobile phone is hard.

LIB

We close our hearts and minds to those who were sort of in the same boat.
***********************************
Man you singing from the same song sheet as the honourable Knight Ramphal, he with his “All a we is one” and you with “in the same boat”. I can see why you were loathe to crticise Ramphal, the two of you think alike there must be some school or organisation for folks who can flit from country to country at will to impart “knowledge” to “the great unwashed”; you as a Technocrat and he as a Mandarin. What boat was this? The one that transported us across the ocean below deck, in chains and unable to see the sunlight? Or the one that brought some with their culture and religious beliefs intact. I don’t know if my ancestors worshipped the birds and the bees or the Sun and the Stars, however you described yourself as Christian and I fit that description. Some can point to a culture and religion that goes back thousands of years while I don’t know if I was descended from Ghanaian peasantry, Royalty or even the Kabaka of Buganda.

BTW sometime ago during a casual conversation with a Guyanese colleague I asked what caste she belonged to and she told me she was “Brahmin” ,no “Dalit” for her 

If you come on this blog with that foolishness about the same boat we will have to take you to the Bajan equivalent of a woodshed

Enjoy your stay in Beantown. I hope the Bosox go on a losing run (sorry AH)