Tales from the Courts – Mars(ton) and Pluto Were Inside the Closet Part XVIII

Justice Saunders opined that it was because Barbados judges were not scheduling their time properly.

Justice Saunders of the CCJ opined recently that  Barbados judges were not scheduling their time properly.

For some years now BU has been highlighting the issue of the almost terminal state of our justice system. We have been highlighting, among other things, the backlog of cases both before the High Court and the Court of Appeal, the complete inefficiency of the Registry with its loss of files and procrastination, the mess that is the Bar Association and the clear conflict between Bar Association enforced membership and the Constitution; but most importantly, we have been highlighting the quality of our judges, both at High Court and Appeal levels.

A very short while ago, attorneys-at-law from Barbados raised the issue of delays in both getting matters heard and in receiving the judgements on those matters with CCJ Justice Saunders at one open forum. Justice Saunders opined that it was because Barbados judges were not scheduling their time properly. Meanwhile, in another forum, CCJ President Sir Denis Byron advised that appeals to the CCJ from Barbados had risen by 350%.

Having read some of the CCJ decisions in right of Barbados, we have to say that Justice Saunders was being diplomatic, for these judgements do not censure delay alone, but the lack of quality of the judgements themselves, judgements that in any other jurisdiction would lead either to the judge being asked to resign or to his/her dismissal.

Sir Denis, we suggest, was also being kind, in that he attributed the 350% increase in appeals to the CCJ to the fact that such appeals are both easier to file and much less expensive than appeals to the Judicial Committee of the Privy Council. We have no doubt that Sir Denis is absolutely right. However, we suggest that this is only a part of the reason. The other part is the lack of quality of the decisions handed down by the Barbados courts.

The crusade by BU to sensitize relevant parties about our judicial system seemed to be finally penetrating the consciousness of the legislature, with some words on the subject coming from Prime Minister Freundel Stuart on his recent visit to Toronto. Of all people, the PM knows that the state of our judicial system, more than any other single factor, has all but decimated our overseas investment market and our offshore banking market and this must be a major concern to the Government. To many, the PM’s words may have sounded slight, given the magnitude of the problem. However, the PM is known (and has been criticised) for NOT often enough sharing his concerns publicly and his comments must be seen as a strong warning to the bench that judicial independence is not absolute and that the Prime Minister can act in the interests of the taxpayers who pay the wages and pensions of members of the Bench. With a different prime minister, it might be seen as empty rhetoric. With Freundel Stuart, it is more likely to be a statement of intent.

Meanwhile, in the Senate, Senator Wilfred Abrahams has jumped on the bandwagon created unapologetically by BU and made the reform of the judicial system his priority. BU tends to discount the words of Senator Abrahams, because a man who (as president of the BA) seeks legal opinions from the Chief Justice and Registrar as reported in a BU blog on April 07, 2013 would appear to be deficient in actually knowing what these reforms should be and how these reforms should be formulated and implemented. It has to be discounted as nothing but political rhetoric and an attempt to lead the now nationwide attack on the failings of the judicial system.

Meanwhile, Chief Justice Marston Gibson, his feet firmly planted in the cocktail circuit, talks of ADR and bail hearings by videoconference, which is akin to, “Take a couple of aspirin and call me in the morning,” to someone suffering from cardiac arrest. And our judicial system IS suffering from cardiac arrest and by this time the patient, like our judges, is brain-dead.

Even the Nation Newspaper has finally allowed Bajans to know that there are grave problems in the judiciary, problems spoken of a long time ago by people like Sir Roy Marshall and Sir Frederick Smith.

So, can we look for changes (and those changes need to be drastic)? The Prime Minister is the only person with the constitutional authority to make changes. So we watch and we wait.

Heretofore, the courts have been shrouded in mystique and mystery and, latterly, undeserved respect. We, most of us, will remember our parents and grandparents and teachers telling us that “Respect must be earned.” However, our judges do not seem to even want to earn the salaries, perquisites and pensions they are being paid by the taxpayer, far less the respect of the taxpayer. But, with the advent of the Worldwide Web where, at the click of a button, their failings can be exposed to all, they are living in the past and in a state of denial. And BU intends to do its best to drag them kicking and screaming, if necessary, into this time frame. Or assist in creating an atmosphere where they will be either asked to resign or suspended, pending the due process prescribed in the Constitution.

It is from England that we take our justice system. And therefore we look to England to see how the justice system there is coping with the demands of our time. In a recent Daily Mail offering, the Mail is patting itself on the back for having exposed a serious miscarriage of justice – read article. And the actions of the Mail in exposing this matter and bringing it to the public attention is PRAISED by one of England’s foremost lord justices. BU will now wait, without holding its breath, for someone on the Bench to praise it.

But the point is that the British Press (as in the British equivalent to the Nation) holds the justice system up to scrutiny, whereas, in Barbados, all the Nation is interested in, is scoring political points for its favoured party, while it watches arguably our most important institution float down the drain. The legislature and the press, like Nero, have been fiddling while Barbados’ justice system burns.

Also in the Mail, it has started another crusade, this time for the UK to withdraw from the European Court of Human Rights. There have recently been a spate of rulings handed down by the body that the Brits see as a threat to their sovereignty, their way of life and, most importantly, their national security and safety. However, we learn in the Mail all about the British judge at the ECHR, Paul Mahoney. A man who is paid £150,000 a year, had two years practice in law in the UK, before decamping to Brussels as a bureaucrat for the EU, has never held a judgeship and who advocates his right to make new law, exclusive of the legislature – read article.  Ring any bells? Let us help you, as if you need it.

A Chief Justice who is, like Mr Mahoney, an Oxford graduate, has never practiced law, has never held a judgeship, who has worked as a lecturer in law and a glorified researcher for judges in New York and is a devotee, not of CARICOM, but of the cocktail circuit and who is clearly completely out of his depth having, in 2 years, delivered not a single Court of Appeal judgement. AND a bench comprised of political hacks from places like the Solicitor General’s office and former registrars who have distinguished themselves by creating what today is the Registry who have little or NO practice experience and little or NO familiarity with the Rules or the Constitution.

Andrew Pilgrim has suggested the appointment of more judges, and he may be right. But, as we have abundant experience to know full well, the problem there is in the quality of the judges appointed. They must not be political hacks or party-faithful members of the bureaucracy. They need to be experienced jurists with an excellent record of practice. And there is no doubt that there are MANY such in Barbados who will not be considered, because they do not toe any political line.

Guyana has legislated as to the time in which judges MUST give decisions in cases. The Nation opposes similar legislation for Barbados. But at the end of the day, it may come to that. For, as Prime Minister Freundel Stuart pointed out in Toronto, it affects (negatively) litigants. Thus we interpret that to mean that it affects their families, their hopes and their aspirations, sometimes for as much as half the life-span that they can realistically expect, and even after death, to the extent of holding up people for years on probates of estates. It also affects all Bajans through our foreign investments and off-shore.

The truth is that Barbados and its peoples are being held to ransom by a deficient judicial system peopled by incompetents.

56 thoughts on “Tales from the Courts – Mars(ton) and Pluto Were Inside the Closet Part XVIII

  1. Oh dear…mostly the standard frothy round of general invective and mere assertion meant to brainwash – a “bandwagon” indeed.

    Amused – we can agree on the Registry nonsense and the scandalous inactivity of the CJ. We can agree too that there is an urgent need to retrench delays, something (delay) from which all legal systems suffer to a greater or lesser extent.

    BUT, eg,, since this is your latest little fad, please tell me who the political hacks are in the judiciary. Is, eg, Crane Scott a political hack or Reifer or Alleyne or Burgess? And if so, why? Come on Amused – who have you your sights on now? Given your wandering starry eyes now directed to Forde – should he be made a judge? Or is he a political hack too?

    Oh BTW, I guess most of us saw and heard Sir Denis Byron reading the CCJ judgment. It was my first time – and like so many first time things I thought him a disappointment. I didn’t find either his delivery or style terribly impressive – and well beloved Amused, if you ask again whether I could do better, I categorically state ‘Yes I could’. And that assertion has much the same directive force as most of what is written in this post of yours.

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  3. @Ross. I don’t know why your comments are directed at me. I have just read the blog and will allow it to digest before responding to the main points. However, on the superficial level of your comment, as I said in another blog, you are perfectly entitled to dislike Roger Forde, but I happen to like him both as a person and as counsel – and that is my right. I have read and studied in depth the judgement delivered on behalf of the CCJ by Sir Denis Byron and I happen to agree with it mostly. I did not attend the court to hear him actually read it so I cannot dispute that you are right, that he is no James Earl Jones. I have to be led by what the rest of the World will be led by in other jurisdictions that may adopt the judgement as a precedent – CONTENT!! And I can find no fault in that. Your comment on the delivery of this content by Sir Denis leads me to, most respectfully, suggest that you might like to consider following your true passion on Broadway or London’s West End, rather than at the Bar.

  4. @David. I have now digested the blog and the links.

    It seems to me that this blog focuses on the duty of the Press in any democratic jurisdiction, to identify areas that are falling short of the required and expected standards or flouting the rights (constitutional or otherwise) of the people. And to, as Shakespeare put it,”….take arms against a sea of troubles and, by opposing, end them.” We saw this practiced by the Press in connection with Watergate and many times since. The Mail article wherein a Lord Justice of England actually praised the Mail for its press campaign against “Secret Courts” attacks the denial of the very principal of courts and justice that justice must not only be done, but must be seen to be done. This is a laudable crusade by the Mail and, indeed, it is in the best and highest traditions of the press. Traditions that the Barbados press would do well to emulate as their duty. I note, thanks to BU’s reporting, that the UK press publicizes cases where judges are delinquent in providing timely justice, as required by Magna Carta (which will be 800 years old next year). This usually leads to those judges being roundly condemned by other more senior judges and almost always a little chat with the Lord Chief Justice in which the judge is asked to tender his resignation.

    But for the Lord Chief Justice to censor a judge and ask his resignation, it would, I would suppose, be hypocritical for the Lord Chief Justice to be himself guilty of the very act or omission for which he censors a subordinate. Maybe our own CJ is somewhat deterred by the fact that he himself is delinquent and it would be a case of the pot calling the kettle black. And doubtless the judges would highlight this fact to the CJ, as would many others.

    There is no doubt in my mind, or, I suspect, the minds of most Bajans, that the denial of access to timely justice in Barbados has resulted in our lamentable foreign investment market. Equally, a large portion of the fall in our tourism market can be laid, not only to the prevailing worldwide economic climate, but also to the UK press reports on the Diane Davies rape case. It was a lead story in all UK newspapers and TV and radio news reports. And it was a major blog here on BU, as I recall. The victim was, I have been able to discern, interviewed several times on TV and by the newspapers.

    So therefore a double-edged sword has been created. Foreign investors do due diligence BEFORE selecting a country in which to invest and this, as a matter of course, involves an investigation into the access to and standard of justice available in those countries and they will not be satisfied at all with time frames of 10 plus years, which is the case in Barbados. Moreover, they will not be satisfied with the standard of judgements FINALLY handed down. And the second edge of the sword involves the tourism market and the perception that tourists exposed to criminal acts when they report them to the authorities, are treated as if they themselves (the victims) are, in fact, the criminals. And the Myrie case has certainly sharpened the edge of that sword, when added to the Davies case. Both have received massive international publicity. A downside of reporting is always going to be focussed on unrequited victims, rather than on those victims who are well treated by the authorities – that is sad, but true. So, we have to avoid, not court, it.

    Focussing, therefore, on the dulling of just one edge of that sword, I have to say that it is all very well for those who deny that appointments to the bench are political plums. But it is highly irresponsible for them to deny that judges have not been doing their jobs, but instead merely enjoying the perquisites of those jobs (like the cocktail circuit where their positions accord them great deference). Maybe judges’ time would be better spent writing the many long-reserved judgements or, like many attorneys, burning the midnight oil or getting up in the early hours of the morning to make sure that they perfect work on which clients are relying, before they get to their offices and the constant interruptions they will encounter there. After all, litigants are relying on judges for their decisions so they can put the stressful litigations behind them and get on with their lives – and attorneys are relying on the court system so they can have their fees (read wages) paid. Win or lose. And it would be hallucination for anyone to believe that foreign investors do not take serious account of these extraordinary delays, before selecting a country in which to invest and, in the case of Barbados, rejecting it.

    Therefore, I can find no fault with the blog, which is both responsible and helpful and is a timely reminder of just where the current “bandwagon” on which press and others with political aspirations are now jumping onto, started. And I agree that there are many superior and organised and COMMITTED legal minds who have substantial practice experience in Barbados, the presence of whom on the Bench would be advantageous and would greatly assist the delivery of timely justice and the reversal of the international perception of Barbados’ justice.

    And yes, I admit a strong prejudice in favour of people like Roger and Pam Beckles. As for the CCJ decision in the Myrie case, it seems to me mighty peculiar that the blog is accused of being frivolous, when the same comment focuses on the thespian performance of Sir Denis Byron, rather than on the content of the judgement. I have no doubt that some lawyers can give superior thespian performances. We have all frequently witnessed these in court, especially when the substance is lacking.

    • @Amused

      Unfortunately there is a close the ranks culture which clokes how the judiciary/bank officers do business in Barbados. Against this background it explains why BU is highly skeptical of Senator Abraham’s recent attack on the Courts. In fairness to him we will give him some latitude to develop his case.

  5. ROSS comment is typical of most barbadians to distract just for sake or for fun” his comment about the style and delivery of THe CCJ reading is so ridiculous it should really have been ignored. at this point i am shaking my head …really! then one wonders why nothing is done here at every turn bajans ignore the substance and dwell on nonsense .

  6. @ac and David. I agree. Completely.

    @ac. You and I agree with Ross on equality under the law for gay people and I have found, as I am sure you have, his comments on that issue to be persuasive and insightful. I, like you, am therefore astonished that this equality is to be promoted on the one hand; but that the deeply flawed justice system that would, if that equality arrives, be required to protect those rights is, seemingly, to be business (and I use the word “business” in its loosest possible sense as “business” implies certain standards that are totally lacking in the justice system of Barbados) as usual. Surely our first priority is to establis (ressurect) the framework that delivers to the people the justice that they are entitled to under the Constitution, BEFORE extending the human rights which, if denied by anyone, can be enforced by that justice system. Otherwise, it is “cart before horse” time. But the scope is far wider than that for, as the PM stated and BU has always stated, it affects the lives of all Bajans AS INDIVIDUALS and collectively.

    • @Amused

      In fact the characteristic an orderly society whether perceived or real has been the one always recommended by those from the outside in the old days.

  7. Richard Byer also owes large sums of money for rent in Bridgetown I understand, perhaps he thinks he is above the law.

  8. David wrote “the state of our judicial system, more than any other single factor, has all but decimated our overseas investment market…….”

    Those of us including Bajans waiting 5 to 10 years or more for estates to be settled are also being deprived of the opportunity to invest our inheritances.

    Worst yet is that devaluation of the Barbados dollar is a possibility(no offence Bizzy).

    So what was worth a million would be worth a hundred thousand.

    Looks like I can expect some sufferation in muh ol age.

  9. David

    You see Bizzy pun TV the other night crying like a little girl or an old man with dementia? He and COW always got to have a scape goat when their businesses suffering, this time it is the GOB that ‘owes’ his companies millions of dollars. You got any idea how many millions, tens of millions Bizzy ‘Tek’ from the tax payers of this country in sweet heart deals like 3S and Ionics Freshwater Limited (Spring Garden Desalination Plant)?

  10. David

    Here is a small code to be decoded:
    3. Bizzy William(S)
    2. Cow William(S)
    1. Hallem Nichol(S)

    That company used to operate from by Bizzy and Hallem in Warrens and in 2008 after the DLP won the elections, Bizzy and Hallem tried their darnedest to distance themselves by look for unsuspecting landlords so 3S could rent in a different location. So I beg your pardon when you tell people Bizzy is ‘genuine’.

  11. Here is aman who used to stop at coral ridge cemetery all hours of the night to change into a fresh set of clothes before heading home to his then wife.

  12. is Andrew Pilgrim who wants more judges the saqme person who said that some judges come to work at 10.00 a.m. and leave about 2.00 p.m. to go and paly golf? Does he speak with one voice when wearing cotton and another when wearing silk????

  13. @Hants | October 6, 2013 at 4:56 PM | “Worst yet is that devaluation of the Barbados dollar is a possibility(no offence Bizzy).”

    Unlikely. We are index-linked to the US Dollar. Such an attempt would in fact constitute a back-door devaluation of the US Dollar.

  14. This government did everything legal and suspectly illegal to get the now C.J to office. He was to be the saviour of Barbados, yet to date matters have just gotten worst. I told you then and I’ll say it again, it would only be a matter of time when he joins the faternity and falls in line with the rest. This government needs to whell and come again.

  15. Amused

    The West End….interesting

    But otherwise, leaving aside our points of agreement, you are writing froth and obviously haven’t understood my Byron point which is this – it is a mere opinion which has no weight unless backed up by clear evidence. It is easy to assert something and if you say it over and over again – your ‘bandwagon’ – people end up believing it. In that sense my Byron comment is of no consequence at all – though it IS an opinion I hold. Of course, I say nothing of the substance of the judgment which – as I have made abundantly clear – I support fully with the ongoing consequences for the behaviour of this Government and the post judgment behaviour of your ‘shining knight’, Roger Forde (though not the A-G).

    Moreover you haven’t answered the question I put to you. Who are the “political hacks” on the Bench and why?


    To be candid – I hold very little brief for you too, neither your intellect nor your writing ability. Meanwhile………
    What IS your view on Gibson CJ?


    “Steve Gollop….is that the same Gollop who is the son of….?

    Do give over.

    • Does anyone want to believe that a sitting member of the CCJ would go public with an observation if it was not rooted in a credible position? A position which those who are close and not close are aware?

  16. @Ross. Thanks for clarifying. I was a bit startled as the clear conclusion to be drawn from your comments was that you disagreed with the CCJ judgement and I was wondering how any jurist could disagree.

    I will say that I am both startled and greatly encouraged that every Bajan, including non-lawyers, to whom I have spoken, agree with the decision.

    @David. I understand what you are saying and your point is taken and well made. Subtle, but subtle is good.

  17. Amused

    I am on record – see the Myrie post – as being VERY supportive of the judgment. You are guilty, I think, and to use a phrase with which you will be familiar, of premature adjudication.

    In the comment above I referred specifically to “delivery and style” in a BTW remark having seen the fellow on TV and, frankly, given your general level of competence I do not quite see how you could have mistaken that. There is even evidence that AC (poor soul) got it….well some of it. Of course, you might think his “delivery and style” was brilliant, as with Forde, but then that would be a mere opinion too. My version of SWMBO thought both were terrible….so there you go…and all “for what it’s worth”.

  18. @ Amused
    “Unlikely. We are index-linked to the US Dollar. Such an attempt would in fact constitute a back-door devaluation of the US Dollar.”

    I would really like you to explain exactly what you mean by that comment.

  19. David – was Roger Forde Qc able to tell listeners how much money the GOB paid the legal team? Was it:

    . Tens of thousands
    . Hundreds of thousands
    . Millions
    . Tens of millions

  20. Amused said:

    “Such an attempt would in fact constitute a back-door devaluation of the US Dollar.”

    I too would like to hear more from amused about his thoughts on that statement, seeing that the US does not rely one way or another on Barbados’ currency and the currency cannot in anyway impact the US currency negatively on the international market re devaluation, it would be interesting to hear what backdoor devaluation of the US currency constitutes.

  21. it reminds me of the B’dos/TnT marine dispute years ago. it’s all about fees. Sometimes the event has to be orchestrated to ensure fees for the abundance of lawyers in the region. Sad day and alll the while average Bajans believing the national bullshit.

  22. Bajans will forever be fodder to be taken for rides by con men….
    Is it any wonder that the lawyers are salivating all over themselves….?
    LOADS of money’s to be made over patent nonsense – when real life issues of national survival go a begging…

    Productivity down
    Imports up
    Every shiite failing
    Confidence down
    Savings being spent on food
    Can’t buy medicines for QEH
    Can’t pay UWI bills

    …..and brass bowls consumed with who can visit where…
    When Bushie was a damn boy this “issue” was a non issue….
    …now after YEARS of EXPENSIVE heads of Government meetings and MILLIONS in lawyers fees and changed laws! we now have some shiite law that says people can visit for six months unless they are deemed undesirable by some clear evidence….

    WELL hurray!!
    Fools and their damn money are SO easily parted!!!

  23. Bushie Boy you can now go to Trinidad and Tobago and stay for six months. You may learn a lot from the Trinis on survival from the land. Some good calaloo and crab gine put some lead in yuh pencil. You may even fall in love wid Tobago and might even want to remain and show dem how to bone flying fish. In fact tek de windjammer over to the Grenadines and eat some lambie and fig. They will give you a warm welcome. I can’t guarantee the same welcome when yuh coming back to Bim doah. So stop yuh foolish talk and embrace we Caribbean brudders and sisters. All ah we is one!

  24. Bushie says…..
    “Productivity down
    Imports up
    Every shiite failing
    Confidence down
    Savings being spent on food
    Can’t buy medicines for QEH
    Can’t pay UWI bills”

    Bushie what do you expect from Bajans? They are the most educated in the world, have the best civil service service in the world, the most beautiful island in the world, with the best school system in the world.
    The Guyanese gone, the foreigners got blamed for the high drug costs who are they going to blame now?

  25. @ Islandgal
    More like “embrace we Caribbean brudders and sisters. All ah we is Gone!”
    When we were selective about our leaders being intelligent and wise, Barbados was special, distinctive and successful.
    Once we followed the idiots who seek to bring everyone to a common level, (anti HC, anti 11+ etc) we will find that like water, THAT common level finds its Lowest Common Denominator.
    Instead of being a “light” to show how a poor small island can be successful by wise and intelligent use of resources -especially its people, – we are now on our way to joining the mass of losers who were destined for abject failure anyhow…..
    Brilliant logic….
    …are you sure it was you who hit your father in the head with the 2X4 or the other way around….? 🙂

  26. @ Islandgal
    The Guyanese gone, the foreigners got blamed for the high drug costs who are they going to blame now?
    We can’t excuse the brass bowls who can’t see past their noses….such are the limits of brass… But…
    We still have many (like you?) among us who seem to revel in our imminent demise. Even those who left their original place of birth and CHOSE to live among us, wish us ill…..

    Ours is death by accepting advice from haters….and national suicide.
    What CSME what?!?

  27. The case by Michael Jackson’s mother lasted lasted five months with thousands of documents. The jury gave a decision in one week. The Myrie case has thousands of documents and the Court took about five months to give a decision. Sometimes the Court in Barbados gives a decision after years. Why not let a jury give the decisions in Barbados? That would be quicker.

  28. Amused…………..it really is not…………are you trying to say, if the Barbados dollar is devalued, i can still pay 2 dollars for one US, i think that is what we are trying to ascertain……….

  29. Right now the US Dollar is devaluing against all major currencies, and as a result the Barbados Dollar is also devaluing against those same currencies. So why do we need a devaluation? We have no natural resources or mineral resources to sell, and devaluaing against the US Dollar when all of our imports are paid in that currency will skyrocket the cost of living, increase the input costs of manufacturing. Meanwhile, Barbados becomes cheaper as a tourist destination in our man source countries of Europe.

    • @Peltdownman

      Every recession we have this debate and the advantages and disadvantages of devaluation do not change. The key here is that imports for Barbados would become more expensive, oil, food etc. Yes it would be cheaper for tourists to travel here but would It be enough?

  30. @ Amused
    The right to ‘tag’ the Barbados dollar to any internationally accepted currency is contingent on our ability to defend that arrangement… …much like an individual being able to use a credit card BECAUSE he has a job, business or some kind of income to support it.

    Right now, Barbados is on layoff….tourism down, off-shore down, sugar dead, agriculture down….
    At the same time, fuel costs up, food prices up, imports up….

    …there is no magic to any 2 to 1 tag to the $US

    …just like there is no magical right to your credit card when you don’t have a job…..
    LOL….of course there is that strained period when the bank waits to decide exactly when to break the news to you about the credit card…. 🙂

  31. What is the matter with all you with this talk of devaluing the Barbados dollar? As I recall, the last time that was major topic, was during the Sandiford era. But yet it was the same Sandiford era that has been proved to have created the prosperity that followed. Indeed, it was the measures put in place during the Sandiford era that have protected Barbados from complete meltdown in this global recession. Credit where it is due, even if you don’t like it. I personally could not ever have voted for Sandiford, but fair is fair. Now, the talk of devaluation has started again and so I have to wonder if, like in the Sndiford era, this is more of the same old political scare-mongering.

    @Bushie. I stand by my comment above. You disagree and wish me to expand. I think it is obvious and, frankly, am too busy to dispute what I see as being obvious. You don’t agree. So, as David would say, “You may have the last word.”

  32. Amused…..your expanding will mean i learn something more that i obviously now do not know, so when you are not so busy, i would appreciate if you can explain.

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