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Hartley Henry – DLP Political Strategist

Congratulations on the passage of the Health Reform Bill. I am impressed and truly inspired by your vision, conviction and determination!

Many political observers in Barbados have come to compare and twin the politics of Washington to that of Barbados. They liken the Democrats in Washington to the governing Democratic Labour Party and the Republicans on Capitol Hill to the current leadership of the Barbados Labour Party.

Sir, in relation to your recent experience with the health care issue, we have an almost identical scenario existing here in Barbados, where absolutely nothing the government does is supported by the opposition.

I can well understand your frustration at having to fight so hard to effect positive and meaningful change. But that, I suppose, is the nature of politics in 2010. The Health Reform Bill, as I understand it, would bring both immediate as well as long term benefits to millions of Americans.

Straight off the bat, health insurers would be required to let young people stay on their parents’ policy up to their 27th birthday. Also, insurers would be barred from denying coverage to kids with pre-existing health conditions, and tax credits, to the tune of 35 percent of premiums, would start to flow to businesses with fewer than 50 employees to enable them to take out and maintain policies.

Mr. President, it is hard to consider how anyone, voted for by beneficiaries of these changes, could oppose them. Yet, we know that every single Republican, all 212 of those who voted, gave the thumbs down to this measure. This is almost as ridiculous, Mr. President, as our Leader of the Opposition here in Barbados persistently opposing free bus fares for school children. Can you imagine that two thirds of the Barbados Labour Party’s Parliamentary team represents rural constituencies, where many children take two buses to school, and these guys violently opposed the abolition of bus fares for school children?

I know how you must feel, Mr. President, because here in Barbados we also had a situation where the opposition opposed holiday camps for school children, constituency councils that would empower ordinary Barbadians and even more recent, the appointment of a Parliamentary Secretary to oversee the day to day operations of the Queen Elizabeth Hospital.

Imagine you have a situation in Barbados where over the last five years, it became commonplace for ordinary Barbadians to spend as much as 24 hours at the main, general hospital waiting to see a doctor. Also, where there were persistent reports of less than flattering experiences at the hospital by patients, staff and visitors alike.

Your counterpart, Prime Minister David Thompson, determined that in addition to having an energetic and competent minister of health that he would reinforce the oversight of government, by putting in a Parliamentary Secretary who has developed a reputation for getting things done. Do you know, Mr. President, the opposition in Barbados opposed that as well?

And it gets even worse! We have a serious water problem in Barbados. There are residential communities that have had to put expansion on hold, as a result of a shortage of or inaccessibility to water. Eighty per cent of callers on the call-in programmes complain of nightmares in respect of the Barbados Water Authority. The situation called for urgent and meaningful action. The Prime Minister acted. He appointed one of his then ministers to the position of Executive Chairman of the BWA in an effort to get ageless issues addressed and resolved. The number one problem at BWA is said to be human resource and industrial relations driven. Arni Walters is one of the foremost experts on HR and IR issues in Barbados. Do you know, Mr. President, that Mia Mottley and the opposition opposed that move as well?

So this opposing for the sake of opposing is not unique to Washington, my friend, we encounter the same nonsense in Barbados on a daily basis.

We have school children doing as they like both on and off the school compound. The Prime Minister and Minister of Education are at their wits end to find a solution to this problem. Do you think the Leader of the Opposition or the former Prime Minister has said a word in support of the government’s effort to check and stamp out incidents of antisocial behavior among school children? No! Not a word! Their obsession is with talking arithmetic.

Everything that flows from their mouths is GDP, deficit and foreign reserves related. No one is saying that these are not important, but, as the Prime Minister has said repeatedly, Barbados is more than an economy. It is a society. Yet, the Leader of the Opposition, and presumably Prime Minister-in-Waiting, cannot find a single social issue to associate with or to champion.

Indeed, she and her predecessor attended and spoke at their first party meeting in months (I am going to give you the joke about that another time) and when they discovered that the economic techno-babble was not resonating with even their supporters, do you know what they ended up talking about? Mr. President, you won’t believe it. Their time was spent calling for a member of the cabinet to be fired over some incident they say took place in the Members Room of Parliament.

I am waiting, Mr. President, to see where they and their mouthpiece newspaper are going to take this issue, because I recall hearing of a gun being fired among a gathering of BLP government ministers a few years ago. It was never denied or confirmed whether a then representative for a rural constituency received a gunshot wound, but I can tell you no one messed with the then representative for a very urban constituency thereafter. Interestingly, that incident was never reported in the newspaper.

Furthermore, Mr. President, have you ever heard of a pigtail bucket? Well legend has it that a senior Member of the current Barbados Parliament beat his father to a pulp with a pig tail bucket and when he was confronted with the tale of this in the Parliament of Barbados, a fight broke out with a now deceased former member, and an ex-cricketing great was struck by a flying chair thrown by that senior member. A former deputy Speaker also fractured a colleague minister’s nose with a cuff, right there in Parliament yard.

So I am waiting patiently to see how the Barbados Labour Party and its newspaper arm treat this issue of a recent fracas in Parliament, because, while I do not condone such; perpetrated by friend or foe, I will not sit silent and permit the impression to be given that such is unprecedented.

Mr. President, I agree with you. Such sanctimonious grandstanding is an abomination!

Hartley Henry is a Regional Political Strategist. He can be reached at hartleyhenry@gmail.com

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246 responses to “Dear President Obama”


  1. Yardbroom

    Your points are noted. However, I believe that many ask: what is so intrinsically different about marijuana as compared to alcohol that necessitates prohibition?

    I strongly agree that legalisation of marijuana and other drugs will not solve the associated problems of abuse and dangerous use of chemical substances. However, is it a view that by declaring a substance illegal, does solve the problem? Maybe if we move away from that position we can focus on health education, behaviour modification and social transformation strategies that may be very much more effective. For example, tobacco use has been reduced significantly through such efforts without the violence and corrosion of social order that is a consequence of the “war on drugs” as Bush Tea has alluded to in his earlier post.

    A peaceful and joyous Easter weekend to you and all other readers of BU.


  2. @ Sargeant

    The other point is;

    What if some people started to sniff glue, paint, or wet bovine excrement in order to get high? Will we extend the prohibition to these items? (…. oh wait people DO THAT??!!)

    What if some idiots tattoo themselves with gross looking marks which will haunt them for the rest of their lives and possibly damage the largest organ on their bodies….. should we pass a law against that too?

    Totally ridiculous and counterproductive.

    People are free to be wise, foolish, suicidal, constructive or whatever they wish to be….. EXCEPT where it infringes the rights of others to be wise, foolish, suicidal…….etc.


  3. Anonymous April 2, 2010 @ 1:47pm

    There is nothing I can intelligently add to what you have stated.

    May I reciprocate; a joyous Easter to you and your household and all readers of BU.


  4. Looka the genius that US got as Congresspeople..

    ‘WASHINGTON D.C. – One politician’s concerns over an island may have been misunderstood and now he’s the butt of countless jokes!
    U.S. Rep. Hank Johnson has become an internet sensation after comments he made during an Armed Services Committee meeting. Johnson never intended to gain such attention and has become the laughing stock of thousands.

    Is the island of Guam in danger of tipping over and capsizing? That more or less covers the basics of Johnson’s concerns. He addressed the matter to Adm. Robert Willard, the commander of the U.S. Pacific Fleet.

    “My fear is that the whole island will become so overly populated that it will tip over and capsize,” Johnson said in the meeting with a look of complete seriousness.

    The admiral seemed to take the concern seriously. “We don’t anticipate that,” he said”.

  5. Micro Mock Engineer Avatar
    Micro Mock Engineer

    Crusoe,

    The video of Congressman Johnson is here… I presume you raised it as testimony to the dangers of marijuana use?


  6. MME. I really do not know WHAT he is on…..but goodness!!! Lol

    Apparently he is now saying that he meant it metaphorically.

    Video says otherwise.


  7. @Anonymous, I know most folks, including Christians, believe that Jesus miraculously transformed water, into alcoholic wine, at the wedding feast, in John 2: 1-11.

    Because the Greek word ‘ionos’ is used in the text, it is claimed that therefore the wine was alcoholic and intoxicating. But, as ‘oinos’ is a generic word, and as such, includes all kinds of wine and all stages of the juice of the grape, and sometimes the clusters and even the vine, it is begging the whole question to assert that it was intoxicating. As the Biblical narrative is silent on this point, the character of the ‘wine’ can only be determined by the attendent circumstances , by the occasion, the material used, the Person (Jesus) making the wine, and the moral influence of the miracle.


  8. Here we go again trying to interpert the meaning of”wine”. Isn’t it ironic that Jesus used BREAD & WINE as part of his last SUPPER.


  9. The word ‘Wine’ in our modern Western culture, invariably is understood to mean ‘alcoholic’ wine.

    Whereas, in Biblical times, this is not so at all.

    Generic Words.

    “Professor M. Stuart, in his Letter to Rev. Dr. Nott., February 1, 1848, says, page 11: “There are in Scriptures (Hebrew) but two ‘generic words’ to designate such drinks as may be of an intoxicating nature when fermented and which are not before fermentation the word ‘yayin’ in its broadest meaning, designates ‘grape-juice’ or the liquid which the fruit of the vine yields. This may be new or old, sweet or sour, fermented or unfermented, intoxicating or unintoxicating. The simple idea of ‘grape-juice’ or vine-liquor is the basis and essence of the word, in whatever connection it may stand. The specific sense which we must often assign to the word arises not from the word itself, but from the connection in which it stands.”


  10. No intent to offend anyone’s religious sentiments. I am not suggesting that God encourages drunkenness or drug abuse. The only point I am making is that consumption of substances that have a psychoactive effect have been part and parcel of all civilizations throughout history. Some substances in small doses have a bad effect on people, others require large doses to cause harm. Anything is harmful (even water) if consumed in a large enough quantity. Any policy to reduce abuse and misuse of drugs should address the various classes of drug in accordance with their potency, effect and availability. Health education and social transformation strategies should be the primary response in all cases although some drugs are so potent and dangerous that prohibition probably would have to be enforced.


  11. The context of the miracle does not say “GRAPE JUICE ” as Zoe would prefer people to believe .It says WINE and wine is known to be of alcoholic content.


  12. Yes, Jesus used WINE and BREAD at the Last Supper!

    But, what kind of Bread and Wine did He use?

    Was the Bread leavened, or unleavened bread?

    Was the Wine He used, fermented, (alcoholic) or unfermented, grape juice, also called ‘Wine’!


  13. I have no problem with the Bread or the WINE that Jesus use at his Last SUPPER. MY inference was to the WINE in the Wedding. GRAPE JUICE is just what it is . THE fact that the context specifically differs the two speaks volumes.

  14. Georgie Porgie Avatar

    Zoe
    Why on earth dont you go and train to be a dentist/ You spend so much time “pulling teeth” on BU.

    For those who can understand here is a short note on the use of the word wine in Bible.

    The word “wine” is used 230 times.
    6 Hebrew words and 2 Greek words are translated “wine according to the following Strong’s numbers. 3196-7491-8492-2562-2561-6071- 1098G-3631G

    Six Hebrew words are used to translate wine; these are:
    chemer: pure red fermented wine
    chamer: wine
    yayin: to effervesce, fermented wine
    aciyc: fresh grape juice as just trodden out, juice, new sweet wine.
    raaph: distilate, to drip down
    tiyrosh: fresh grape juice as just squeezed out or expressed

    The Greek word used to translate wine are oinos, and gleukos.

    oinos:wine derived from grapes. The mention of the wine skins in Matthew 9: 17;Mark 2: 22; Luke 5: 37 implies fermentation. From the intoxicating effects of wine and the idolatrous use of it among the heathen, wine signifies communion in the intoxicating idolatries of mystic Babylon (Rev 14:8; cf Jer 51:7). The Jewish custom of giving a cup of medicated wine to condemned criminals just before their execution to dull the senses, figuratively denotes the dreadful judgements of God upon sinners.

    This word is used metaphorically
    (a) of the evils ministered to the nations by religious Babylon, 14:8; 17:2; 18:3;
    (b) of the contents of the cup of Divine wrath upon the nations and Babylon, Rev 14:10; 16:19: 19:15.

    gleukos: sweet, sweet wine, new or must wine, (Acts 2:13). Some believe it is what distils of its own accord in the grapes. The ancients has a way of preserving the sweetness and by consequence the strongly inebriating quality of the gleukos, for a long time.

    It is noteworthy that in instituting the Lords Supper, the Lord speaks of the contents of the cup as neither wine, oinos, nor gleukos, but as the gennema tes ampelou (fruit or offspring or produce of the vine) Matt 26:29; Mark 14:25; Luke 22:18.

    Both the Hebrew and Greek words used to translate wine imply juice that has been expressed from grapes and allowed to ferment, except for the Hebrew words aciyc and tiyrosh, which denote fresh grape juice as just squeezed out or expressed.

    It seems from examining the Greek words used to translate wine, that there are no such specific words to express the concept of fresh grape juice.

    As a result, in instituting the Lords Supper, the Lord had to describe the contents of the cup as the gennema tes ampelou (fruit or offspring or produce of the vine.

    This nuance clearly indicates how carefully, the Holy Spirit chose the words which forms God’s Word.

    Who are we then to change them or misinterpret them at will, when the Holy Spirit has been so particular in the specifics of His choice of words. ( e.g seed not seeds in Galatians 3:16 and many not any in 1 Cor 1:26.

    You can continue to pull teeth Zoe. Try injecting inferior dental branch of V5, although even that will not help with the folk with whom you are dealing. Just thought I would share that word study nuance with you.


  15. Man GP, I sent out an SOS for you ever since.
    I was reading some literature and I need some help, now that we are on this topic in translating a word.
    What is qaneh bosom?
    In what context (if any) is it used in the Bible?


  16. Sorry GP, it should be qaneh bosm.


  17. can’t resist stirring up the ant’s nest:

    so GP what Greek or Hebrew word translated as “wine” was used in John2:1 – 11?


  18. The Lord’s Supper.

    Matt 26: 26,27. Having finished the Passover, our Lord “took bread” unleavened, unfermented bread, and blessed it. This was done always at the Passover, and was by Christ transferred to the Supper. He gave it to His disciples as the symbol of his body. Then He took the cup, and gave thanks. This also was done on giving the third cup at the Passover. This He also transferred, and gave it to His disciples, as a symbol of His blood, “shed for the remission of sins.” The bread and the cup were used with no discrimination as to their character. To be in harmony with the bread, the cup should also have been unfermented. It was Passover bread and wine that Christ used. In Ex. 12: 15, 17-20, 34, 39 and other places, ALL leaven is forbidden at that feast and for seven days. The prohibition against the presence and use of all FERMENTED articles was under the penalty of being “cut off from Israel.” “The law forbade seor – yeast, ferment, whatever could excite fermentation, and ‘khahmatz’, whatever had undergone fermentation, or been subject to the action of seor.” (Bible Commentary, p. 280).

    Professor Moses Stuart, p. 16, says, “The Hebrew word Khahmatz means anything fermented,” p. 20: “All leaven, i.e., fermentation, was excluded from offerings to God. (Lev. 2: 3-14).

    “The great mass of the Jews have ever understood this prohibition as extending to ‘fermented’ wine, or to strong drink, as well as bread. The word is essentially the same which designates the fermentation of bread and that of liquors.”

    Dr. S. M. Isaacs, an eminent Jewish rabbi of this city, says: “In the Holy Land they do NOT commonly use fermented wines. The best wines are preserved sweet and unfermented.” In reference to their customs at their religious festivals, he repeatedly and emphatically said:

    “The Jews do NOT, in their feasts for sacred purposes, including marriage feast, ever use any kind of fermented drinks. In their oblations and libations, both private and public, they employ – the fruit of the vine – that is, fresh grapes – unfermented grape-juice, and raisins, as the symbol of benediction. Fermentation is to them always a symbol of corruption, as in nature and science, it is itself decay, rottonness.”

    The English word ‘Wine’ rendered from different Hebrew and Greek words in the Scriptures, does NOT mean the same thing for the ancients, as it does for us the modern Western thought. Sweet unfermented grape-juice, was also called “Wine” in Biblical times, as was fermented “Wine”,

    All admit that the bread at the Passover, was unleavened bread, had not passed the putrefaction or fermentation, and was, therefore, the proper emblem of the body of Christ, which “saw no corruption.” Likewise, for the same reason, there was a necessity that the wine should be UNFERMENTED, that it might be the fit emblem of the great Sacrifice which “saw no corruption.”

    Having finished the Supper, in parting with His disciples Jesus said: “I will not drink henceforth of this FRUIT of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in My Father’s kingdom.”

    The Saviour does NOT use ‘oinos’, the usual word for wine, BUT, adopts the phrase “genneematos tees ampelou,’ “this FRUIT of the vine.” Was it because ‘oinos’ was a generic word, used, including the juice of the grapes, also called WINE, in all its stages, that Jesus chose a more specific phrase? Was it because He had previously selected the vine as the illustration of Himself as the true vine and His disciples as the fruit-bearing branches, and the juice as “the pure blood of the grape.”? (Deut. 32: 14).


  19. Looking on:

    Tangent after tangent.

    Crusoe, you have a point (and recall my context is not B’dos but the volcano-hit island); but unfortunately the situation is complex, much moreso than I can describe publicly. I mentioned it to highlight how our own conflicts and agendas, mixed together can frustrate what on a calm look is fairly obvious common sense. Our region needs to rethink how we do things, and the neo-Luddites trying to lock in the status quo — in a lot of areas — are simply making us ever more vulnerable to what is coming.

    D

    PS: For those who are locked into the notion that Ganja is harmless, here is an excerpt:

    +++++++++++++++++

    >>American Council for Drug Education

    BASIC FACTS ABOUT DRUGS:
    MARIJUANA

    . . . . Call it pot, grass, weed, or any one of nearly 200 other names, marijuana is, by far, the world’s most commonly used illicit drug—and far more dangerous than most users realize. So, there is just cause for alarm when adolescent marijuana use increases, as it did in the mid-1990’s, and the age at which youngsters first experiment with pot starts to drops.

    Marijuana has been around for a long while. Its source, the hemp plant (cannabis sativa), was being cultivated for psychoactive properties more than 2,000 years ago. Although cannabis contains at least 400 different chemicals, its main mind-altering ingredient is THC (delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol).The amount of THC in marijuana determines the drug’s strength, and THC levels are affected by a great many factors, including plant type, weather, soil, and time of harvest. Sophisticated cannabis cultivation of today produces high levels of THC and marijuana that is far more potent than pot of the past. THC content of marijuana, which averaged less than 1 percent in 1974, rose to an average 4 percent by 1994.

    For the highly popular form of marijuana called Sinsemilla (from the Spanish “without seeds”), made from just the buds and flowering tops of female plants, THC content averages 7.5 percent and ranges as high as 24 percent. As for hashish, a resin made from flowers of the female plant, THC levels may be five to ten times higher than crude marijuana’s . . . .

    How Does it Affect You?

    A mild hallucinogen, marijuana has some of alcohol’s depressant and disinhibiting properties. User reaction, however, is heavily influenced by expectations and past experience, and many first-time users feel nothing at all . . . .

    Most of marijuana’s short-term effects wear off within two or three hours. The drug itself, however, tends to linger on. THC is a fat-soluble substance and will accumulate in fatty tissues in the liver, lungs, testes, and other organs. [Nervous tissue of course has a high fat content, especially the myelin “insulating” sheaths for the axons . . . the “wires” for our nerve cells] Two days after smoking marijuana, one-quarter of the THC content may still be retained. It will show up in urine tests three days after use, and traces may be picked up by sensitive blood tests two to four weeks later.

    The Impact on the Mind

    Marijuana use reduces learning ability. Research has been piling up of late demonstrating clearly that marijuana limits the capacity to absorb and retain information. A 1995 study of college students discovered that the inability of heavy marijuana users to focus, sustain attention, and organize data persists for as long as 24 hours after their last use of the drug. Earlier research, comparing cognitive abilities of adult marijuana users with non-using adults, found that users fall short on memory as well as math and verbal skills. Although it has yet to be proven conclusively that heavy marijuana use can cause irreversible loss of intellectual capacity, animal studies have shown marijuana-induced structural damage to portions of the brain essential to memory and learning.

    The Impact on the Body

    Chronic marijuana smokers are prey to chest colds, bronchitis, emphysema, and bronchial asthma. Persistent use will damage lungs and airways and raise the risk of cancer. There is just as much exposure to cancer-causing chemicals from smoking one marijuana joint as smoking five tobacco cigarettes. And there is evidence that marijuana may limit the ability of the immune system to fight infection and disease.

    Marijuana also affects hormones. Regular use can delay the onset of puberty in young men and reduce sperm production. For women, regular use may disrupt normal monthly menstrual cycles and inhibit ovulation. When pregnant women use marijuana, they run the risk of having smaller babies with lower birth weights, who are more likely than other babies to develop health problems. Some studies have also found indications of developmental delays in children exposed to marijuana before birth . . . .

    Teens and Marijuana

    Although dangers exist for marijuana users of all ages, risk is greatest for the young. For them, the impact of marijuana on learning is critical, and pot often proves pivotal in the failure to master vital interpersonal coping skills or make appropriate life-style choices. Thus, marijuana can inhibit maturity.

    Another concern is marijuana’s role as a “gateway drug,” which makes subsequent use of more potent and disabling substances more likely. The Center on Addiction and Substance Abuse at Columbia University found adolescents who smoke pot 85 times more likely to use cocaine than their non–pot smoking peers. And 60 percent of youngsters who use marijuana before they turn 15 later go on to use cocaine.

    But many teens encounter serious trouble well short of the “gateway.” Marijuana is, by itself, a high-risk substance for adolescents. More than adults, they are likely to be victims of automobile accidents caused by marijuana’s impact on judgment and perception. Casual sex, prompted by compromised judgment or marijuana’s disinhibiting effects, leaves them vulnerable not only to unwanted pregnancy but also to sexually transmitted diseases (STDs).

    Marijuana Dangers

    * Impaired perception
    * Diminished short-term memory
    * Loss of concentration and coordination
    * Impaired judgement
    * Increased risk of accidents
    * Loss of motivation
    * Diminished inhibitions
    * Increased heart rate
    * Anxiety, panic attacks, and paranoia
    * Hallucinations
    * Damage to the respiratory, reproductive, and immune systems
    * Increased risk of cancer
    * Psychological dependency>>
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++

    That should be enough to be a warning.

    The high is temporary while the damage is permanent, and insidious. (And, remember, I am also objecting tot he damage caused by alcohol and by tobacco, not to mention too many drugs we can get over the counter or for a prescription. Check out what even paracetamol does to the liver!)


  20. PPS: More on its impacts, here, from the American Association of Family Physicians.

    Excerpting just a tiny bit:

    ++++++++++++++++++++

    >>Long-term use of marijuana may lead to subtle cognitive deficits. In studies using animals, chronic exposure to marijuana changed the structure and function of the hippocampus in ways similar to the effects of the aging process.27 Acute exposure to marijuana leads to deficits in short-term memory, but long-term effects on cognition are not as well documented.

    An “amotivational syndrome” caused by marijuana use is still controversial but of concern. High school students who use marijuana often spend less time on homework, have lower grades and more delinquency.28 Also, college women who use marijuana report significantly higher rates of motor vehicle crashes, smoking, use of alcohol and tranquilizers, use of sex as a coping mechanism, violent dreams, sleeplessness and psychiatric problems than do nonusers.29 “Cause and effect” is still the area of uncertainty, as drug abuse and conduct problems are intimately intertwined, and temporal relationships are often uncertain.

    Marijuana use can lead to abuse, tolerance and dependence. The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, 4th ed. (DSM-IV) does not contain a diagnosis of “cannabis withdrawal”; however, some studies suggest that withdrawal symptoms can develop (Table 5).1,22,25 If present, these symptoms are generally mild, presumably because of the long half-life of marijuana.1 . . . .

    Identifying patients with a marijuana-related disorder can be difficult, because abuse and associated problems commonly develop slowly. Often, patients do not recognize that they have a problem or do not want to give up their drug use. In addition, they may try to hide their problem from parents, physicians and other authority figures.

    Unexplained deterioration in school or work performance may be a red flag for drug abuse. In addition, problems with or changes in social relationships (such as spending more time alone or with persons suspected of using drugs) and recreational activities (such as giving up activities that were once pleasurable) may indicate drug abuse. Information from concerned parents or spouses is often helpful in sorting out a differential diagnosis.

    Although marijuana abuse in adolescents and young adults is of particular concern, it should not be overlooked in other patient groups. For example, persons with certain psychiatric disorders (such as bipolar disorder and post-traumatic stress disorder), those who are under severe emotional distress and those who have chronic pain might be at increased risk. Ultimately, patients who need treatment will be identified through direct disclosure of marijuana-related problems by the patient, a positive urine drug screen, or identification by legal, school or employment authorities. >>

    ++++++++++++++++++++++

    See again the implications of cumulative, slowly advancing adverse impacts?

    Now, can we return to the serious matters at focus?


  21. Dictionary // April 3, 2010 at 3:32 AM. >>Long-term use of marijuana may lead to subtle cognitive deficits.

    And Dictionary says he has never used weed, so wonder what happened wid he. Mind you, he ones is not subtle, so you think he does use the one you put up you nose?


  22. PPPS: One last point, from Science Daily news, on the implications of brain scans of ganja users:

    ++++++++++++++

    >>ScienceDaily (Feb. 3, 2009) — Adolescents and young adults who are heavy users of marijuana are more likely than non-users to have disrupted brain development, according to a new study. Pediatric researchers found abnormalities in areas of the brain that interconnect brain regions involved in memory, attention, decision-making, language and executive functioning skills. The findings are of particular concern because adolescence is a crucial period for brain development and maturation.

    The researchers caution that the study is preliminary and does not demonstrate that marijuana use causes the brain abnormalities. However, “Studies of normal brain development reveal critical areas of the brain that develop during late adolescence, and our study shows that heavy cannabis use is associated with damage in those brain regions,” said study leader Manzar Ashtari, Ph.D., director of the Diffusion Image Analysis and Brain Morphometry Laboratory in the Radiology Department of The Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia. >>

    ++++++++++++++

    The precautionary motes are of course on the lines that correlation is not demonstration of cause, but on inference to best explanation of possible causes, it looks like the above is the best, most credible explanation so far, certainly a lot better than the ideas that : (a) it’s a miraculous coincidence, or (b) the main cause goes the other way — damaged people gravitate to drugs (though of course this may be an additional factor, triggering a vicious down-spiral as damage and psycho-dependence interact) .

    This is more or less a standard warranting method in science, and the point is that the researchers want enough further studies to strengthen the basic case.

    So, even on just the due diligence of a basic web search, no one should be advocating he Ganja is harmless line. (And in our region, if you open your eyes, you will see all too many cases in point on the damage caused by habitual use of said drug.)


  23. Onlookers:

    See the basic problem with the rhetoric of personal attack based on distractions and distortions?

    Amused and co have yet to be able to address the main points I have made, but because they do not like what I have to say, now I am falsely, slanderously accused of being a drug user.

    That is plainly meant to lead on to the inference that — without having to do the hard work of actually addressing matters responsibly on the merits [how cheap it is to be closed-minded and contemptuously dismissive!] — one may disregard and dismiss what I have had to say. In short, once the source has been poisoned in the minds of the onlooker, it is easy to take advantage of the negative attitude to distract from and dismiss what one could not otherwise fairly address on the merits. Shabby!]

    How sadly does this sort of rhetorical misbehaviour echo Paul’s warning in Eph 4:

    E[h 4: 14Then [as maturing Christians who have drawn on the sound ministry of the servants Christ has given the church as a gift and blessing] we will no longer be infants, tossed back and forth by the waves, and blown here and there by every wind of teaching and by the cunning and craftiness of men in their deceitful scheming. 15Instead, speaking the truth [which is tested by its accuracy to reality] in love [which shows itself in affirmation, respect and uplifting behaviour] , we will in all things grow up into him who is the Head, that is, Christ. 16From him the whole body, joined and held together by every supporting ligament, grows and builds itself up in love, as each part does its work.

    17So I tell you this, and insist on it in the Lord, that you must no longer live as the Gentiles do, in the futility of their thinking. 18They are darkened in their understanding [Rom 1 puts it this way: professing themselves wise, they have become fools out of resentful ingratitude to the One True Living God who is evident from creation without and from mind and conscience within] and separated from the life of God because of the ignorance that is in them due to the hardening of their hearts. 19Having lost all sensitivity, they have given themselves over to sensuality so as to indulge in every kind of impurity, with a continual lust for more. [In short, sinful behaviour is both en-darkened and addictive . .. and we see a principle of what to avoid: anything prone to mislead and hook you into habits of morally destructive dependence . . . ]

    20You, however, did not come to know Christ that way. 21Surely you heard of him and were taught in him in accordance with the truth that is in Jesus. 22You were taught, with regard to your former way of life, to put off your old self, which is being corrupted by its deceitful desires; 23to be made new in the attitude of your minds; 24and to put on the new self, created to be like God in true righteousness and holiness.

    So, onlookers, simply observe the contrasting patterns: who have consistently done their homework and have presented responsible information and reasoning on the merits?

    Who specialize in distraction, distortion, demonisation or denigration and dismissal?

    What does that tend to say about where the balance is on the merits, and about the agendas of those who refuse to face those merits squarely?

    G’day

    D


  24. F/N: have a read here too, for a Psychiatry prof’s summary.

    Money quote:

    . . . Marijuana use worsens, and in some cases precipitates, severe mental illnesses from schizophrenia and bipolar disorder to panic disorder.

    Why, given this abundance of evidence of the harmful effects of marijuana use, is this drug still so widely seen as harmless?

    Marijuana does not produce overdose deaths. It does not produce the prominent
    withdrawal symptoms seen with some other drugs, from nicotine and alcohol to heroin. These two facts led many Americans mistakenly to see marijuana as “non-addictive.”

    The damage done by marijuana is often more subtle than the damage done by other illegal drugs. Marijuana robs many of its users of their judgment. [Sounds familiar?] This insidious effect makes it harder for them, and people who care about them, to see pot’s adverse effects, obscuring the profundity of the damage it causes.

    This makes it harder for pot smokers to face their drug- caused problems than is the case for many users of cocaine, meth- amphetamines and heroin. These easily-overlooked adverse effects, and the pervasive pro-pot propaganda, are the reason that marijuana dominates the illegal drug scene in the U.S.

    ________________

    Robert L. DuPont, M.D. is a clinical professor of psychiatry at Georgetown Medical School and president of the Rockville-based Institute for Behavior and Health.


  25. Dictionary,

    You have provided good references, explaining well. Thank you.

    I did not know, that there was ‘worse’ than schizophrenia or bi-polar, that marijuana can be claimed to extend such diagnosis.

    I guess we average laymen see people as ‘loopy’ and ‘done wid dat’. But, maybe we should take the time to try to understand and be more sympathetic.

    Truly, I know a couple of people that I have serious quesitons about, everyday behaviour one thing, but when things do not go accrding to ‘their way’…..VERY strange behaviour. But that is another story.

    Moving on, despite providing the evidence above, what are the alternatives?

    Will, as some above claim, fighting the criminals and underground market work?

    It has not yet? Indeed, many countries are being held to ransom by the drug cartels i.e. Mexico, Columbia, Jamaica etc….

    Is it practically better to bring this under the Government control? i.e. to wit legalise?

    Then again, some above see this as the grand plan.

    But, so what. Will legalising at least destroy the excessive margins on a product that is still sought after?

    OR, do we do like Singapore and go as far as to execute drug runners i.e. those found with more than ‘x’ grams in their possession?

    But, that leads to exposure to ‘framing’ political opponents etc…not good.

    Personally, I am at a loss with the answer.

    Indeed, I am tempted to say that growing for personal use could be made legal, but anyone found selling or having more than ‘x’ quantity should face confiscation of all assets and jail?

    Is that a good compromise?

    Or, will we open the gates to all of the other drugs i.e. will someone need cocaine to counter ‘depression’??? Fortunately, cocaine is not as easy to produce, so is an argument against personal use is easily defended.

    Now, what about the latest drug in the Western world, hitting the scense among youngsters, apparently, to the average persons, seemingly destructive and ‘worse; than marijuana i.e. Mephedrone, which is sold as plant food, cheap and is apparently as addictive as cocaine? Or, the homemade drugs, distilled from freely available over the counter meds, Meths?

    Surely those are much more directly destructive, even if one argues the subtle danger of ganga?

    That said, can we then argue that some commenters above are right, that education and ‘drilling into the minds’ of youngsters of the dangers in ANY drug is the only way forward?

    Indeed, we hear every so often of a teen dropping dead at a ‘rave’….drug-induced.

    A difficult question, but will legalising ganga at least put one thing under authorities direct control?


  26. Well, there goes another good thread – the Dick is here.

    I got as far as
    “PS: For those who are locked into the notion that Ganja is harmless, here is an excerpt:……”

    Bush Tea don’t recall anyone seriously arguing that ganja was harmless. The argument has been that the response of trying to use law and force to protect people from themselves is counterproductive, costly and doomed to failure, and should be reviewed

    So what kind of intelligence goes on and on with thousands of words and links to establish a point that is not in contention?


  27. BT:

    Look above at Amused’s remarks.

    D

    PS: Crusoe: the real solution is reformation, but that is a spiritual matter. No ends of culturally and personally destructive trends are afoot, and addiction to drugs is just one of them. Right here, we are dealing with a trojan horse clause in a draft for a constitution, prepared by the UK and in revision and development here for years, that in effect defines a “right” to same sex marriage. I shudder to think of the precedents and implications of such a declaration of rights, in the hands of creative lawyers and judges: at most we have a freedom — i.e. no one may unduly hinder you — to marry, and the nature of marriage properly entails only marriage to the agreeable person of he opposite sex. A right is a claim that there are others who owe you a duty to the specific claim.The Caymanians, at least have managed to spot and blunt the problem effectively. i hope we can follow suit.

    The addiction to voting oneself largesse from the public treasury is in fact the underlying un-addressed problem on the OP. One that threatens bankruptcy of entire countries.

    And, without dipping my toe into local politics, I must observe on policy issues that, that Mr H Henry — a regional political consultant and strategist — did not see or understand (or worse, chose to distort) this, is deeply troubling.

    Deeply troubling indeed.


  28. PPS: I know of a current “triggering” case, and looking back over several decades, I think I can see a lot of the patterns being identified as exemplified in people I knew, including some very close to home.


  29. PPPS: On HH, I wish I did not have to make such a note. If he missed the largesse issue, that is serious. if he did not miss but chose to ignore or dismiss, it is worse. I hate that sort of fork, and would love to find that there is a third, more positive explanation.

    –> David, could we hear back from Mr HH to explain himself more adequately? (I want to be wrong on the dilemma I see above, but so far I cannot come up with a credible third alternative.)


  30. To echo BT’s point no one is arguing that using marijuana is safe but here is what the CDC says about a perfectly legal product:

    Prenatal alcohol exposure can lead to serious birth defects and developmental disabilities. A need exists to develop effective strategies for both children with fetal alcohol syndrome (FAS) or other prenatal alcohol-related effects and for women at high risk for having an alcohol-exposed pregnancy. Since the syndrome was identified approximately 30 years ago, advancements have been made in FAS diagnostics, surveillance, prevention, and intervention, but a substantial amount of work remains. Collaborations among partners in federal, state, and local agencies, academia, clinical professions, school systems, and families are critical to developing and implementing successful efforts related to FAS and fetal alcohol effect (FAE). In 1999, Congress directed the Secretary of the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services to convene the National Task Force on FAS and FAE (the Task Force). CDC’s National Center on Birth Defects and Developmental Disabilities, Fetal Alcohol Syndrome Prevention Team, coordinates the Task Force and manages its operation. Since the Task Force was chartered in 2000, Task Force members, with input from multiple partners, have convened to deliberate and determine the Task Force mission, goals, and priority concerns to be addressed. This report describes the structure, function, mission, and goals of the Task Force and provides their first recommendations. An explanation of how the Task Force recommendations were generated and the Task Force’s next steps are also reported

    And again CDC

    Prenatal alcohol use is one of the leading preventable causes of birth defects and developmental disabilities. According to the 1999 Behavioral Risk Factor Surveillance System, 12.8% of women reported drinking alcohol during pregnancy (1). Children exposed to alcohol during fetal development can suffer multiple disorders that range from subtle changes in I.Q. to profound mental retardation. They can also suffer growth retardation and be born with birth defects of major organ systems. One of the most severe outcomes is fetal alcohol syndrome (FAS), which includes central nervous system disorders, growth retardation, and facial malformations. CDC studies have documented FAS prevalence rates ranging from 0.2 to 1.5/1,000 live births (2–4).
    FAS was first described in scientific literature in the United States approximately 30 years ago (5). Since that time, advancements have been made in FAS diagnostics, surveillance, prevention, and interventions. Disorders related to prenatal alcohol exposure have generated substantial interest and activity among CDC’s partners (e.g., federal, state, and local agencies; school systems; academicians and clinicians; advocates; and families) and affected persons. However, additional work still needs to be done to prevent prenatal alcohol-related disorders and effectively intervene with children and families affected by them. Problems that still need to be addressed include 1) raising public awareness regarding the dangers of alcohol use during pregnancy and the adverse outcomes associated with prenatal alcohol exposure (i.e., FAS and other alcohol-related effects); 2) educating and training health and social service professionals concerning how to identify and intervene with women at risk for alcohol-exposed pregnancies; 3) developing effective intervention programs for children affected by prenatal alcohol exposure; 4) promoting and supporting basic research to identify the etiology and mechanisms involved in FAS; and 5) improving the quality of life of affected persons and families

    ***************
    Plus we could go on and on about the societal damage arising from using alcohol.


  31. Iif this is just a tangent, then why does Dictionary have to post so much for so long on a tangent…stupse.

    Quoting from the same people who demonised cannabis proves what??

    D quotes…’A mild hallucinogen, marijuana has some of alcohol’s depressant and disinhibiting properties. User reaction, however, is heavily influenced by expectations and past experience, and many first-time users feel nothing at all . . . .

    LOLOLOLOL…ROFLMAO….you really need to get your facts right on this one, next time try inhaling.


  32. Sargeant:

    First, you need to read above, so that your “no-one says” will accord more closely with the actual reality:

    Amused // April 2, 2010 at 4:00 AM

    I love weed. Most Bajans who were around in the 60s love weed and the popularity of weed has grown. It has the same effect on us over-stressed people as a few rums, but it causes far less damage, lasts a far lesser time and does not produce side effects – like vomit. For some of us who suffer from arthritis and asthma and cancer, it is far more effective than the usual drugs – and it is soocially friendly too. After all, you cannot share your traditional medication with people at a party. The fact that it is illegal has not stopped a single person from using it – irrespective of age.

    See what I am correcting?

    And, when it comes to old demon rum and the other weed that so many smoke, I have long since said above that if we could turn the clock back, they should have been banned at the outset. But, without a social consensus, that cannot be effective and would only criminalise a large cross section of the public. So, I have advocated education and regulation. (In some cases, the regs can then be tightened when a critical support threshold is passed, e.g. as is happening with tobacco.)

    I would appreciate it if strawman games were dropped.

    G’day

    D

    PS: Anyone able to provide a third alternative for Mr Henry on the implications of the OP in light of the voting largesse from the treasury problem, in his absence?


  33. PPS: T, I suspect that the research/ experience behind this minor point — & I must observe you are straining at a gnat [do all 1st timers get high] while swallowing a camel [weed does serious damage, including triggering major mental illnesses] — is sound. By comparison, in the old days, cocaine was used as an anaesthetic in the dentist’s chair. With few or no serious getting high effects. With low dosage marijuana and small doses — no inhaling — there probably will be low effect for many first time users. And of course the placebo drug effect amplifier is also at work, Don’t forget how often sugar or simple vitamin pills backed up by belief can work.


  34. @ D..

    I am not straining or swallowing.

    You now chose to compare cocaine in the dentists chair with cocaine on the streets and Cannabis in a controlled environment with the average user on the block, who is straining here?

    You suspect that the research is sound and I suspect it is flawed and biased.
    Agree to disagree is my position.


  35. @zOE

    In my bible translation Matt:26:26:27.Nothing is mentioned about unleavened bread or fermented or unfermented wine.


  36. Technician:

    I simply pointed out that there is a known parallel where a psychoactive drug’s impact is situationally sensitive. I also pointed out the placebo effect. That is, we are dealing with real complexity here. This stuff is not simple i-p-o software or hardware stuff; it may even point to the distinctions between mind and brain!.

    In addition, even on the tangent, this is a further degree of distraction from the main focus. And, there is a serious main topic issue on the table: the dilemma of voters calling for more and more largesse from the public purse so that democratic government is threatened from within. In the case in view, this is relevant to how Mr Henry has portrayed the recent health care insurance bill in the US, and it is not without relevance to our own tendencies as democratic polities.

    Maybe, I am more sensitive as a J’can who saw how fiscal irresponsibility in the name of caring for the poor and countering the rapacious rich wrecked J’cas economy by ruining our balance of payments and foreign exchange position through creating excessive, inflationary demand that led to the down-spiral that has us where we are today.

    When the Americans sneeze, we get pneumonia.

    So, can we please address a very serious issue, seriously?

    D


  37. To those who are critical of the Obama healthcare bill and say it will bankrupt America by adding to the burgeoning deficit, respond to the argument that high income earners who benefit from unearned income i.e. dividends and other gains on investment will now have to pay for healthcare.


  38. AC:

    That is why if you are to do serious exegesis, you need familiarity with original language tools and for preference the languages. (It is also why experts on such matters are very important and should be listened to carefully — as opposed to blindly followed.)

    I have often suggested eSword as a good first stop off. Get the interlinear Gk and Heb tools with Strong’s codes and some of the language/word studies dictionaries. Some top flight commentaries will also help.

    (I note that from my own Bible study base, there is not an absolute prohibition on the use of wine or the like — e.g. Paul’s counsel to Timothy on his stomach troubles; suggestive of problems with the often shockingly bad water of those days. But, there are very strong warnings against drunkenness and the way alcohol can enslave, deceive and destroy. And that is before distilled beverages so called were widely available! I believe Jews drank diluted wine at meals, and that the ancients often regarded the drinker of undiluted wine as foolish and uncivilised. But, that is rough recall from odd readings, not in depth study. But, again AC can we look at the main issue put on the table in light of HH’s remarks?)

    D


  39. PS: As it is topical this weekend, I note from Wiki on the four glasses of “wine” that are a traditional part of the ritual meal:

    There is an obligation to drink four cups of wine (or pure grape juice) during the Seder. The Mishnah says (Pes. 10:1) that even the poor are obliged to drink the four cups. Each cup is imbibed at a specific point in the Seder. The first is for Kiddush (קידוש), the second is for ‘Maggid’ (מגיד), the third is for Birkat Hamazon (ברכת המזון) and the fourth is for Hallel (הלל).

    The Four Cups represent the four expressions of deliverance promised by God Exodus 6:6-7: “I will bring out,” “I will deliver,” “I will redeem,” and “I will take.”

    The Vilna Gaon relates the Four Cups to four worlds: this world, the Messianic age, the world at the revival of the dead, and the world to come. The Maharal connects them to the four Matriarchs, Sarah, Rebeccah, Rachel, and Leah. (The three matzot, in turn, are connected to the three Patriarchs, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.) The Abarbanel relates the cups to the four historical redemptions of the Jewish people: the choosing of Abraham, the Exodus from Egypt, the survival of the Jewish people throughout the exile, and the fourth which will happen at the end of days. Therefore it is very important.

    That highlighted part suggests that the exegesis by GP and Zoe — both of whom have done theology at professional level — is on target that the Heb and Gk words are broader than our “wine.”


  40. David:

    As I long since repeatedly pointed out, America has long since been bankrupt off other fiscal irresponsibility, and has long since been unable to meet its long term explicit and implicit debt obligations on its economy, social welfare provisions/legal obligations and demographics.

    Recent policy actions are simply accelerating the day of reckoning, whether by hyperinflation, or repudiation of obligations, or draconian social controls that translate the debt into servitude.

    You are also dangerously wrong to describe returns to investment as unearned income.

    Investment is a productive economic factor, indeed a critical one that stands on its own as a factor of production and wealth creation that requires skilled and knowledgeable input. So, kindly refrain from Marxist-tinged, loaded language that suggests that confiscation of the resources owned by investors is a legitimate act of the state; and/or that those who own or manage such assets are essentially parasites on the “real” producers. For corrective instance, without astute venture capitalists we would have had no high tech economic revolution in recent decades; starting with Microsoft.

    Indeed, loss of confidence in the security of investments is a key factor in precipitating economic crisis, and a key explaining factor in the business cycles.

    As Hicks put it: “investment is a flighty bird.”

    Moreover, such is one of the mechanisms by which voting largesse from the public purse breaks a country financially and economically.

    (David, on the assumption that your remarks reflect Mr H’s thought, that gets me even more concerned. Let’s just say that the labour theory of value is mathematically unsound, creating an overdetermined equation set that tends to fall into mathematical contradictions, which can only be avoided by becoming very unrealistic. A marginal approach to prices, in which we see the incremental effect of one more unit of inputs, is sounder. Worse, von Mises was fundamentally correct to point out in the 1920s that the price and glut/scarcity mechanism is a complex balanced information based feedback system that allows simple planners distributed across an economy and now the world, to outperform in aggregate any practically conceivable central planning system. The ideal equations are misleading: you cannot move the information — much of which is intuitive and non-verbal, stored in the neural networks and hunches of experienced operators in markets — fast enough and of a good enough quality to effectively centrally manage the economy. Just ask the former managers of Gosplan, the USSR;s attempted central planning solution. And ask the Chinese why they have opted for the market, even as communists.)

    Further, kindly note that the tax burden of the US is actually highly weighted on relatively high income earners. As a part of that, the US has one of the highest tax rates on capital gains, certainly for the industrial world. You must also reckon with the double taxation impact of corporate tax law: profits are taxed, and dividends are again taxed when paid. (That is part of why there is so much complexity in tax law and in accounting for taxation. “Loopholes” are not all a matter of trickery and gimmicks, given the implications of confiscatory taxes — which BTW can include excessive estate taxes.)

    But all of this is secondary.

    The primary concern is the fraction of GDP that is absorbed by Government, which is a good index of the in the end tax rate on the economy. Once that heads for and passes about 25%, as a crude rule of thumb, the crowding out of the private sector and the tax burden on the public begin to be demotivating and stagnating.

    The US has long passed that threshold [in aggregate: federal, state and local, including the Social Security de facto tax], and it is getting steadily worse. The recent de facto takeover of the health sector, in addition to all the above, puts pretty direct govt control on 1/6 the US economy.

    So, David, on fair comment: you need to look very seriously at the economic soundness of the premises in your remarks above, and those in the original post.

    D


  41. @DICTIONARY
    Since you are a believer in the truth let ‘s be truthful on this point most and not play wink wink . The word wine in the bible is used and nothing before or after the word would make one believe it has a double or another interpretation. I have been on several Jewish holidays given several bottles of the Kareem wine which in used during the Passover it is very sweet and also has about 18% alcoholic content. Since the sacrament is only symbolic it shouldn’t really matter but to try to cast doubt in the minds of people about whether it was Wine or Grape Juice is troubling to say the least.Let’s call a spade a spade.


  42. @Dictionary

    Why have you attributed a comment from BU to that of Hartley Henry?

    The term unearned income was made as a distinction to PAYE. In fact the example of Warren Buffet has been used by Obama to sell this point i.e. Buffet’s income is earned from dividends and consequently does not currently have to pay for healthcare. This is not fair but more importantly this will create additional revenue opportunity for the government.


  43. So am I to believe that Jesus turned water into grape juice for the wedding feast?

  44. Georgie Porgie Avatar
    Georgie Porgie

    Dictionary

    I see that you too are pulling teeth.

    Your comments on cannibis and cocaine are both in order. Your pharmacology on these matters is very sound. Dont be deterred by illiterate detractors on the matter.

    It is well known that the concentration of stimulants or depressant drugs as well as thier abillity to cross the blood brain barrier is important in the variable effects that they produce.

    It is also well known that induction of enzymes also play a part, along with the several variants (such as age sex ethnicity inter alia) that effect the metabolism of a drug or xenobiotic.

    It is also well known that the effect of depresants and stimulants also vary with the environment in which they are taken.

    Unfortunately the making of supid comments on BU is called “challenging”. However, only the learned or knowlegeable about the topic are challenged. It is most ironical. But after a while the comedy of it all tends to wear off.

    It is well known that most languages incliding Greek Hebrew Latin are more specific than English. It is also known that much more scholarship has gone into ‘Word studies ” on the cannon of Scripture than was done by the men who translated the Latin vulgate into what is called the KJV.

    What is most interesting too, is that translation into German by Martin Luther is still the only German translation as far as I have been able to determine.

    Paul’s counsel to Timothy on drinking some wine for his stomach troubles; suggests that he might have had some gastric malady caused by a microbe due to “problems with the often shockingly bad water of those days” as you opined. It was then wise to drink wine rather than water.

    The Bible gives no prohibition on the use of wine, but as you say there is a large number of “warnings against drunkenness and the way alcohol can enslave, deceive and destroy.”

    Your comments to the effect that “Jews drank diluted wine at meals, and that the ancients often regarded the drinker of undiluted wine as foolish and uncivilised” is also well supported in the literature.


  45. @HANTS

    In the bible it is said nothing should be added or taking away .However man’s quest to challenge God is an on ending feat. Have you noticed how many Bible theologist out there telling the world what the bible meant. For example the word “WINE” have another meaning according to the Greeks or whoever they agree with.


  46. David:

    I went looking for a start point reference on the issues, and in the end, Wiki is about as good as we will get elsewhere. (But note some of my own points are not simply summaries.)

    As to the HH connexion, I have more or less asked, given that you sponsored the article above and asked questions in response to the comment I made earlier relating to the author. If in fact you do not speak for HH, pardon any inference that you do.

    Also, I note you are speaking of “unearned income was made as a distinction to PAYE.”

    But, that is precisely my point of concern.

    Returns to investment are not unearned income, but a different class of risky income, on a class of highly skilled and extremely productive labour indeed. As risky income, it properly commands higher rates of return on initial investment than effectively risk free actions.

    If you think Mr Buffet in particular has not earned his income [or that his health care provision does not come from moneys he has by and large legitimately earned and accumulated across his lifespan], you are setting up the conditions for the feeling that he is to be branded a parasite and thief whose assets and earnings can be taken away at will, as voters demand largesse and as politicians pander to the desire for such largesse.

    Maybe, wiki’s quick bio can help dispel that notion:

    Even as a child Buffett displayed an interest in making and saving money. He went door to door selling chewing gum, Coca-Cola, or weekly magazines. For a while he worked in his grandfather’s grocery store. While still in high school, he carried out several successful money-making ideas: delivering newspapers, selling golfballs and stamps, and detailing cars among them. Filing his first income tax return in 1944, Buffett took a $35 deduction for the use of his bicycle and watch on his paper route.[12] In 1945, in his sophomore year of high school, Buffett and a friend spent $25 to purchase a used pinball machine, which they placed in the local barber shop. Within months, they owned several machines in different barber shops.

    Buffett’s interest in the stock market and investing also dated to his childhood, to the days he spent in the customers’ lounge of a regional stock brokerage near the office of his father’s own brokerage company. On a trip to New York at the age of ten he made a point to visit the New York Stock Exchange. And about this same time he purchased shares of Cities Service for himself and his sister. While in high school he invested in a business owned by his father and bought a farm worked by a tenant farmer. By the time he finished college, Buffett had accumulated more than $90,000 in savings measured in 2009 dollars . . .

    See what I mean?

    D

    PS: AC and Hants, it is plain that the original language words and their various contexts will have to be respected above any translation and one would be unwise to insist on an English word as you see it in the teeth of the weight of Gk and Heb.. I have no problem with the wine in question being alcohol containing, especially in a day when that had a health function, but I too must reckon with the fact that the terms in use were/are — note how the beverage at seder can be fermented or unfermented — broader than ours today. And that is not wink wink etc; it is a warning against ignorant and unstable wrenching of the scriptures as 2 Pet 3:15 – 17 warns us against.

  47. Georgie Porgie Avatar
    Georgie Porgie

    Hi Hants

    What do you think?

    It was just as easy for him to have turned the water into grape juice for the wedding feast, as for him to turn it into any of the forms between pure grape juice and fermented wine according to the definitions of the 6 Hebrew words I cited or the 2 Greek words.

    It is easy to check Strong’s to see the word used in John’s account in John chapter 2. That will give you the answer to your question. I left my Strongs at home.

    What is clear is that gemmema tes ampelou is the phrase used in the setting forth of what has become one of the two ordinances of the church- The Lord’s Supper.

    Bible scholars and serious Bible students do Word Studies in an attempt to understand what the Bible teaches. They dont just talk from the top of thier heads.

    If you read a piece of litterature that is Bajan and you were not Bajan you would need to ascertaing the meaning of unique words that we use, as well as the unique use of certain words and phrases. Sane sound solid students of the sacred scriptures should do similarly.

    What does “pushing bread cart mean”? or going through the eddoes? What is the significance of Drax Hall and Kendall?

    When these words are used in common Bajan parlance, there is nothing before or after the word that would make one believe it has a double or another interpretation. Does it?

    Strong and Vine and Vincent and Wuest and Zodiates and Barclay and others of that level of scholarship labored in this area, so that when Bible scholars read and understand these things and try to explain such they can be scoffed at and “challenged” on BU by obvious illiterates and those who wasted the opportunity provided them of obtaining free education since 1962.

    It is hilarious! I better l keep quiet now before the thread gets closed, or you know what?.

  48. Georgie Porgie Avatar
    Georgie Porgie

    Oh by the way Hants, you might have noticed that the Jews called several products WINE. These included grape juice and products derived from grapes of varying states of fermentation and ethanolic content.

    Note from the words I cited in the Word studies I did ten years ago, and from which I copied, that ALL of these products are called WINE.

    Hants as an entrant to HC in 1963 I think you must have known Tony Kinch formerly of Britton Hill. I understand via my cousin who was his class mate , and fellow traveller on the ” Deighton” bus that he succumbed to a cerebral tumor and was planted this week or last week.


  49. PPS: David, here is von Mises himself.

    P4S: Buffet in a nutshell, in his own words:

    The basic ideas of investing are to look at stocks as business, use the market’s fluctuations to your advantage, and seek a margin of safety. That’s what Ben Graham taught us. A hundred years from now they will still be the cornerstones of investing.

    That “margin of safety” is about knowing enough specifically on a company and market to spot — note, not simply analyse! — that the herd undervalues the equity relative to the implications of its productive assets and performance. That gives you an advantage based on knowledge and hard to discern information; e.g. who would have bet on a college dropout vs IBM circa 1980? But, success soon enough will tell others which way the wind is blowing, and you have to keep one step or two ahead of the onrushing herd. And, feeding investments into such businesses is one of the most important aspects of a functional financial market!


  50. GP:

    Thanks.

    Condolences.

    And, eSWORD makes these tools instantly accessible for the price of a short download and installation.

    D

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