Submitted by Crusoe (as a comment on the Haiti We Are Sorry blog
You list some good ideas for the structural retransformation of Haiti [Responding to Commenter Dictionary on the Haiti We Are Sorry blog]. Each in of themselves they do not depend on improved education but do depend on improved technical training (farming etc). However, for all, the long-term success of those initiatives individually and collectively leading to a successful Haiti will certainly also depend on improved education, if as we have been informed, the literacy level is so low.
This has two implications.
Firstly, immediately after initial search, rescue, medical, temporary (short and medium term) and security issues have been addressed as priority, the early reformation must include an immediate education programme, for adult and youth, such that the transformation of Haiti can begin with the active participation of her people, not as ‘serfs’ but as active individuals and communities with an understanding of the reasoning behind the methods and the aim of the methods.
I must add, that ‘transformation’ in this context is not meant to refer to bringing Haiti to the same philosophical outlook as anyone other specific group. In this context it is meant to refer to bringing Haiti to a level of self-capability and self-determination. Now, to expect say a three or four year ‘crash course’ in education and technical skills may seem either impossible or unrealistic, but unfortunately, if this is not done as one of the foundations of the rebuilding (in the context of not only structural, but as a nation of people), than all else may eventually prove futile.
This is obviously along the lines of the old phrase of teaching a man to fish instead of giving him the fish. Merely putting up structures, farms etc may certainly alleviate some misery, but while in the short term foreign contractors etc may gain much from the aid given for this purpose, the long-term goal should be to have Haitians and not only elite, but the everyday Haitian, benefit from money flows and thus create an independent people and a vibrant economy.
It is my view therefore Caricom leaders, should address the education of Haiti, as a priority, as much a priority as any other redevelopment effort.
To reinforce a point, the initial effort must not only be to set up an improved schooling system, but implement as an interim measure, an ’emergency education programme’, with the help of international authorities and the Haitian authorities. If one wants a long-term Haiti, this is essential.
We must give thanks yet again, that Errol Barrow saw the necessity of education as a developmental tool. And, we must forever resist ANY attempts to take free education from Barbadians. Indeed, those of us who wish for an improved world, must seek the furtherance of a sound even if basic education, for all peoples, as a necessity for development.
1,421 responses to “The Reconstruction And Transformation Of Haiti: A Global-Moral Imperative”
p.s. please disregard duplicate postages
or hum along if you already recognise it?
kiki
I don’t think you need to worry about duplicate “postages”.
Surely everyone already ignores even your initial “postages”, they being pointless and dull beyond belief.
All best wishes to you.
Oh no
Jack Bowman the criticizer from the BFB has got the hump now
A to Z
Duplicate comment detected; it looks as though you’ve already said that!
@Zoe,
I love you like a brother, like a son, but you have fallen into ERROR.
Listen to me, brother, my son. For is it not said that the Word IS God? And is the question not asked in Genesis 4:9 “Am I my brother’s keeper?”
And is this NOT the finest question in the world? For surely we ARE our brothers’ keepers. And whence, answer this, brother Zoe, hath it been made known that when the Lord Your GOD shall decideth to slaughter yea unto a hundred thousand of your bretheren in the Carib land, and when the Lord Your GOD shall decide to slaughter yea unto two hundred and fifty-thousand of your brothers in Asia by water and pestlilence, WHENCE shall you comment or remark or otherwise make known by deed or thought your OPINION of the Lord’s decision? Have you fallen into the Sin of Pride?
Have you learned nothing from Daniel (7:14)? Must you remain in igorance of Job (2: 1)? Doubtless your “busy” life keeps you from Revelations 7:12. But does not even Ezekial teach us that “there will come a man, a ranting man with no moral imagination, who will bleat as the sow [an echo, surely, of both Ecclesiates 2:2 and Derek 79:24] and be as useless as the cat’s need for a banjo”?
Brother Zoe: know now that the Lord your GOD has decided to slaughter one hundred thousand of your brothers. Are you your brother’s keeper? Have you divided the word and squared the word? Have you triangulated the word? Know now, Brother Zoe, that the word can be circled, yea as the mass tombs in Port-au-Prince can and, indeed, shall be circled.
Here endeth, for now, the lesson.
@ Zoe,
I love you like a brother, my son. Knoweth that the Lord had not yet revealed to me further support to substantiate my argument. Now, I haveth it.
It is-eth: The Book of Errol Flynn (69:69) and, most importantly, the Letter of Woody the Allenite to the Leprachauns and Pixies (see, especially, Chapter 7, verses 9B, 9C, and appendix 14).
Commenters please note :-
Zoe has DONE exactly what the Apostle Paul, whom Almighty God, through the anointing of the Holy Spirit, WARNED the early Apostolic Church, in Galatians, to be on guard against, AND the Biblical imperative, injuction from God’s Word, the Bible, IS that ALL men/women, WHO would pervert the Only True Gospel of Christ, as SEALED in the Canon of New Testament Scripture, as the LDS and others have DONE, “…let him BE ACCURSED.” (Gal. 1: 9b).
You are in a terrible, deceived, state, with this ZOE FALSE, erroneous gospel, wrapped around you mind!
Mr. Zoe you see all these “hermeneutics” and all your
“Exegesis”, these same things will come back to haunt you and whip your ass!
Listen, hoe, cause I’m the Lyte one
And if you’re lookin for a fight, you found the right one
(They call me Lyte)
(And I’m a slave to the rhythm)
(Funky fresh, dressed to impress, ready to party)
Slave 2 The Rhythm
[ VERSE 1 ]
I’m not a procrastinator, or a instigator
But when it comes to dope rhymes on the mic, I’m the creator
I never look for trouble, but somehow it finds me
But yo, I just conquer it, and leave it all behind me
The L-y-t-e, very outspoken
And when I rock a rhyme, sometimes I leave you chokin
I’m MC Lyte, comin live and direct
I never lose a battle, cause I always come correct
In any case I win, again and again
You see Lyte is at the top till the very end
@The Hood
For surely you ARE right for was it not SAID by Groucho to Mrs. Dumont in DUCK Soup: “I drank champagne from your slipper. Would have been more, but you were wearing inner soles”.
The Lord Your GOD has spoken, Brother Hood, and he has SAID that you are among the saved. You are SAVED, Brother Hood. For surely as Brother Zoe has offended me with his Pride and his Presumptious Presumption, so surely you, too, Brother Hood, will be an angel in Heaven, with wings and everything.
We are STILL working on the personal cloud-with-the-harp situation but you SHOULD know that you will be getting a personal cloud just as soon as you clean up that English grammar. We gave you a pass on your miserable grasp of Aramaic and your pitiful Hebrew, but from now on we’d like you to get a grip, okay?
Don’t always agree, Jack.
But keep on posting.
@ Jack Bowman // February 8, 2010 at 3:54 PM
My humble apologies to you and all BU for that indescretion and slip of the “fingers”. If we had been conversing it would have been “slip of the tongue”!
However, I am well aware that I am very far from being “saved” as you put it. I know that I have a long hard struggle ahead of me especially when I have such as Zoe et al around!
zoe is alright for a 10 year old
here is the asiatic The B-I-G D-A-double D-Y
K-A-N-E
It’s quite confusing for you to remember
The originator, and boy do I hate a
Perpetrator, but I’m much greater
The best oh yes I guess suggest the rest should fess
Don’t mess or test your highness
Unless you just address with best finesse
And bless the paragraph I manifest
Rap prime minister, some say sinister
Non-stopping the groove, until when it’s the
Climax, and I max, relax and chill
Ain’t No Half-Steppin’
‘ll just break him and bake him and rake him
and take him and mold him and make him
Hold up the peace sign…
Assalam Walaikum!
kiki!
You’re always as mind-bendingly pointless and thought-short as I recall.
Everyone: Let’s get a big “Thank You” for the quote-ridden dunce, kiki.
Thanks.
Jack
you are so insincere
typical for a big-shot
phony like you
Ahhhhhhhhhh, Jack, I have missed you something fierce. Strange that you and Halsall would have some common ground re The kiki 🙂
Jack sorry should be
you are so insincere
typical for a big-shot
phony like your self
Mind Blowing Decisions
Dear kiki, Jack may be a lot of things but a phony is not one of them. The vast majority of your posts are 1) mindless 2) pointless 3) self serving and finally, rarely, if ever, have anything to do with the subject at hand.
Ok chris
phark off
sorry cant say F properly Bch
Sir jack Blowman is right on point
lets all suck him off anon(2) too
must be genuine
if he ain’t phoney
@Jack Bowman, Sir, your linguistic eloquence, and rhetorical diatribe, IS exceeded only by your inept, malpropos, incompetent, attempt to ‘rightly divide’ the Word of Truth!
For, your blear-eyed, blear-witted, doltish, taking of verses from God’s Word, the Bible, entirely out of context, and juxtaposing them, in order to justify your ignorance, confirms that, you ARE a *natural* man, (pseuchikos de anthropos), the unspiritual man, does not receive, (does not accept, rejects, refuses to accept) the things of the Spirit of God (Why not?) because they are spiritually discerned ( I Cor. 2:14).
On this discourse, Professor A.T. Robertson, A.M., D.D., LL.D., Litt.D., offers the following comments, which, Sir, you would be wise to take heed:
“Today one notes certain of the intellgentsia who sneer at Christ and Christianity in their own blinded ignorance. ‘He cannot know them’ (ou dunatai gnonai). He is not able to get knowledge. His helpless condition calls for pity in place of impatience on our part, though such a one usually poses as a paragon of wisdom and commiserates the deluded followers of Christ; men of intellectual gifts who are IGNORANT of the things of Christ, talk learnedly and patronisingly about the things of which they are grossly ignorant. The spiritual man (pneumatikos de anthropos) is superior to all of this false knowledge.” (Word Pictures in The New Testament, Vol. IV, pp. 89, 90) emphasis added.
Here endeth, for now, the lesson, Sir!!!
“But Jesus said unto him. Follow Me; and let the DEAD bury their DEAD” (Matt. 8: 22).
Billions of DEAD people are walking around the earth, and right here on BU, the evidence of this reality, is DEADLY TRUE!!!
Technician @ February 8, 2010 at 10:46 AM wrote
@ Dictionary…..
I try not to respond to your posts but I must this time!
You can kiss Technician’s black arse!!
DO YOU REALLY THINK THAT YOU NEEDED TO DESCEND TO THIS LEVEL FRIEND? SURELY THIS IS NOT THE WAY HOW YOUR MOMMA BROUGHT YOU UP SIR.
Re To hell with you Gordon Mullings !!
I notice that you like Rok and Zoe are now consigning others to hell. Interesting.
How did Anon hijack the thread Techie? Did not Anon converse peacefully with Mr Hood in a simple logical way?
Techie would you say that Kiki hijacks all “religious threads?” Would you say that a few persons regularly hijack religious threads e.g the thread on the Second Coming of Christ.
Who is to say that Mr Mullins should not hold himself in high esteem?
And how do we decide how high one should esteem himself?
Don’t you think that certain obvious morons (far less brilliant and competent and knowledgeable than Mr Mullin) who post on BU don’t think that they are special too? .” LOL ROTFLMAO I aint calling no names. But you must know who I mean. .” LOL ROTFLMAO
Was his info on bamboo construction for Haiti not relevant to the post?
I am sure that you might agree with Dictionary that the facts that Zoe posted are well established. You might recall that before Zoe came to BU, that I my self referred you to the Kingdom of the Cults in response to a question that you posed to me.
Do you type and reread everything you post before posting? I certainly don’t as can be seen by some spelling errors resulting from my faulty keyboard.
Whereas 2 Tim 2:23 – 26 can be taken into consideration (and you might recall that I cited that last year as one of my reasons for avoiding lowering my self to deal with you know whom) but Zoe can argue that he IS EARNESTLY CONTENDING FOR THE FAITH as cited in Jude 3:3. Ah lie? LOL ROTFLMAO .
You say that as a Christian, he leaves a lot to be desired as well. Have you met a perfect Christian anywhere? I have not. According to Ephesians 2:10 believers are God’s workmanship or masterpieces in progress— THEY ARE NOT COMPLETE! Christians are still working out their salvation. God is still chipping away at each believer, as he seeks to mold them into his image! Ah lie? LOL ROTFLMAO
How can you be goaded to anger on a blog?…very very easy. Seems you did it today man. LOL ROTFLMAO
Re What has Zoe posted with any value to the reconstruction ? Good question. May I ask what did a certain group add to the several threads on Bible topics over the last year? Lets be reasonable here friend?
By the way I agree with Dictionary that Anon brought a breath of fresh air dose of common sense, and that it stood out “sharp contrast with far too much of what is going on in the thread” and generally the standard of logic exhibited on BU.
Techie my friend you accuse Zoe for “in his fanatical and overzealous style turned a thread about Haiti’s reconstruction into a crusade against the beliefs of Mormons, ” but was not Hood fanatical and overzealous in his style in his attempt at a defense? Hood as not yet rebutted or debunked anything that Zoe posited about the Mormons. Ah lie? LOL ROTFLMAO Where is the balance Techie?
I gone back to playing with my review of Amino Acid Biosynthesis. Be good ma boy!
the hood // in your post of February 7, 2010 at 8:23 PM
you posited inter alia……….. I have been taught that contention is of the Devil and I do not wish to be so influenced as you seem so inclined to be, as portrayed by your most recent post on the topic.
Might Zoe not be earnestly (or too earnestly) contending for the faith as taught in Jude 3:3? Do you know anything about the etymoplogy of the word translated “contend” in that verse?
You like to quotes Scriptures, and in this case you quoted Matt. 5:22 in response to Zoe calling you a fool.
Do you have a Strong’s or similarly good Concordance to research the several uses of the word FOOL in both the OT the NT?
Do you know what “hermeneutics” and “Exegesis” is?
Do you read koine or any Greek at all?
Can you explain your paragraph at February 8, 2010 at 4:29 PM re
“However, I am well aware that I am very far from being “saved” as you put it. I know that I have a long hard struggle ahead of me especially when I have such as Zoe et al around!”
Jack Bowman
I curse you for your wicked conception.
May you wake up this morning and find
your dick has fallen off.
Good wonder. I must say, the civility in here positively overheats.
Imagine all the players here in a room or bar, saying exactly what they do here.
Wonderful entertainment. Hatters and some not. At least it would be honest, showing what each thinks, rather than the usual skinteeth.
I wonder who will,bring a bullhorn, who will bring a bear, who will bring comp’ny, who will bring nothing to wear. Lol.
This thread is a wonderful example of the diversity of humankind, of the egos therein, of the irrelevance that is much often spouted as ‘knowledge’, all to the cause of massaging one’s ego.
Could not make better fruitcakes with a room full of ingredients.
Have a constructive day all.
Kiki, leave Bowman alone, even if he does come across as an obnoxious prick.
At least give him the credit to type with one hand.
Mr Dick
Tell Mr Bowman to get off my dick
I’m the opposite of what you say a slob is
Dumpin suckers off is exactly what my job is
I’m feared like Napoleon and blessed like Buddah
You couldn’t face me solo, you’d have to bring your crew to
Dump me off, I don’t recollect the mumble
I ain’t soft, homeboy, and picture me crumble
And forget all of those that don’t like my rap
I don’t be kickin that old shooby-dooby-doo-wop crap
Droppin’ Science
@Zoe
“Billions of DEAD people are walking around the earth, and right here on BU, the evidence of this reality, is DEADLY TRUE!!!”
AGREED! So all you need to do is lie down and there will be one less dead walking around doing evil; for they know not what they do.
Very disappointing and to think we claim to be intelligent. The more we read many of the comments above it makes the BU household wonder why we bother.
More reasons for USA occupation. When will it end? See:
http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/02/08/20100208haitidrugs0208.html
@Zoe // February 8, 2010 at 10:27 PM
Quoting “Mr” Zoe, His Greatness :- …….”His helpless condition calls for pity in place of impatience on our part,…….”
……………………………………………………
My, my,my, how true of you my friend you read my thoughts exactly how I am thinking about you! You have to be a mind reader!
……………………………………………………
“Mr.” Zoe when I read scripture like Matt: 16-20 :-
16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a ccorrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
and then compare them with how you rave and rant here and with the LDS people that I interact with every day as they (LDS) portray true Gospel Principles in their every day lives, I cannot but be more convinced how much these scriptures help me in revealing your true nature!
It is people like you, “Mr” Zoe who has the world the way in which it is today. People like you who down through the ages have been resposible for things like the Spanish Inquistion for the suffering of innumerable folks needlessly. People like you who try to force your ideas on other people and when they resist then the “strong-arm” tactics are brought into play (in bygone eras it was things like the Inquisition, today it is persecution as per people like you). Reminds me a lot of the modus operandi of one called SATAN!
You little realise that you are helping to confirm how true a prophet a man like Brigham Young was. He testified some 15o years ago that what you are doing now is exactly what would happen. He further testified that if the day ever came that “Mormons” (nickname used for LDS church in a derogatory way) were not being persecuted for their beliefs then it would mean that they had gone so far over to the worldly thinking and forsaken the things of God and were no longer living according to Gospel Principles!
So go right ahead continue with the raving and ranting, we love to hear it, for then it means that we ARE on the right track!
David (and onlookers):
I again came by, this time to notify you that I have passed on the petition you copied Feb 4th to some folks who may be able to act on it, using a blog post in which my earlier suggestions were highlighted as a way to respond to the issues raised by the Haitian youth.
Cf here.
Beyond that, I see that some of your more out of control anti-Christian commenters have been unable to resist the temptation to abundantly underscore the force of my corrective that there is a serious question of needing to act with civlity.
Indeed, they have manged to show a capital illustration of the community-destructive implications of the Saul Alinsky and trifecta fallacy rhetorical and propaganda strategies that I spoke to above. This brings to mind a pithily apt bit of Jamican peasant wisdom:
Given the vulgar and slanderous nature of what has again happened, I think you will not begrudge me a few remarks in response, for the record:
1 –> There is never an excuse for vulgar personalities, and those who resort to them have thereby shown that they have nothing of substance to say on the merits.
2 –> Technician has again chosen to violate my request that my privacy be respected. I trust my spam filtering will work well enough that it will have little adverse impact.
3 –> I see that he has arrogated to himself both the rhetorical demand to do a degrading unnatural act, and to consign me to the nether world. That is a sad testimony to want of character and broughtupcy, which needs to be corrected forthwith. (Were he under my jurisdiction in a classroom, he would have some serious detention time, and any child of mine resorting to such speech will have an appointment with soap to wash out its mouth from foulness of speech. Sis Virginia Claire of fragrant memory would have used Jeyes cleaning solution — suitably diluted.)
[ . . . ]
@ GP….
First I am not being goaded to anger her but true to form, you would run to Zoe’s and Dick”s defense.
What is the topic of the thread?
Whether or not what Zoe posted is true or relevant is not the issue but from reading above any dumb dog can see what I mean.
We may be sinners and in the dark to Christians but we are not as stupid as you may think, all the intellect and posturing does not fool me. As brilliant as Dick is, he is just as arrogant, as brilliant as Zoe is, he is just as insulting albeit in the name of God.Threads have been hijacked before and posters were admonished for it. one would hope some would learn from their lesson, some do, some dont.
You always harping about non perfect Christians, really, are they ?..because if one had to listen to Zoe and Dick, you would never guess!!
You asked for balance GP?
Where is yours when Zoe berates others?…….oh…..I forgot…..”but Zoe can argue that he IS EARNESTLY CONTENDING FOR THE FAITH as cited in Jude 3:3. I guess as long as it is done in God’s name it is ok.
4 –> Turning to ROK, though he avoids outright vulgarities, we can all see that he has sadly not bothered to listen to the cogent corrections made by Zoe, GP and the undersigned in an earlier thread — and indeed, let us recall that he boasted in that thread of how he padlocked his mind beyond all correction by mere inconvenient facts, thirty years ago.
5 –> I do not know which churches he went to or has inspected Sunday School materials for or has spoken tot he Pastors of, but in the Sunday School classes I attended on East Street Kgn [where one of my best teachers was a tailor], we children were very carefully and repeatedly told that no-one knew what the characters in the Bible looked like, and so the artistic representations were not to be regarded as actual pictures, whether of Abraham, or David or Jesus or Paul. (We still loved and eagerly collected them as examples of drawings we would like to be able to do. Now, my son is approaching that level of drawing skill, before he has met his first formal art teacher . . . )
6 –> Those who paid attention will recall that I noted that when ROK challenged me when I spoke of meeting God in the face of the risen Jesus . . . .
. . . I stressed that Jesus’ face would have been “very Middle Eastern,” actually providing a link to a modern reconstruction on the Shroud of Turin undistorted through applying the Marquardt Golden ratio facial mask as there is a bit of a chance that his might just be about right. (And in fact, iconography of Christ for 1500 years has been dominated by points from the Shroud image.)
7 –> Instead, he insisted on a demonstrated falsehood, meant to poison Afro-Caribbean minds by assigning an improper racial identity to Jesus of Nazareth; multiplied by a long list of equally ill-founded assertions on the alleged “copycat” roots of the Biblical teachings and life story of Jesus in the Osiris legend cycle and other myths and teachings of Egyptian paganism. [He paid utterly no attention when these were corrected point by point over about 500 pp of comments in the same remembering the second coming at Christmas previous thread. (Note to ROK: you have volunteered yourself for an example of how not to reason on Bible related matters, for the use of training Christian believers.)]
8 –> This reached its culmination in another thread, where Hopi used the same blondy blue-eyed slander to call for arson against Christian churches.
9 –> But not event that shocking development has sufficed to move ROK to correct his poisonous falsehood.
10 –> So, sadly, this too now plainly goes to character.
________
I trust that at length, there will be a determination to do better in a thread that started out to do something positive and that is still needed badly.
G’day
Dictionary
David:
A note is in the mod pile. the completion of my remark above.
I see as well that T — sadly — continues to substantiate my point on vulgarity.
Good day
Dictionary
2 –> Technician has again chosen to violate my request that my privacy be respected. I trust my spam filtering will work well enough that it will have little adverse impact.
When you continue to ridicule ROK and question his ability to function in BANGO, are you here respecting his privacy?
It goes both ways Dick and it is earned not demanded!
I see that he has arrogated to himself both the rhetorical demand to do a degrading unnatural act, and to consign me to the nether world.
…and aren’t we non believers consigned by Christians to the nether world also, didn’t realize Christians had the monopoly on consignment!
“and any child of mine resorting to such speech will have an appointment with soap to wash out its mouth from foulness of speech.
I am sure you will eat those words, if you haven’t already.
…and GP would want to tell me that Christians are not perfect……..stupse….wunnah sure think so!!
@ Georgie Porgie // February 9, 2010 at 12:40 AM
Your quote :- “Might Zoe not be earnestly (or too earnestly) contending for the faith as taught in Jude 3:3? Do you know anything about the etymoplogy of the word translated “contend” in that verse?”
“Contending for the faith”, REALLY? Is that what all that raving and ranting is all about? But then again what “faith” is he “contending” about? Is he really “contending” about TRUE faith, HOLY faith or “Mr” Zoe”s FAITH!!!
So Peter, James, John et al had Strong’s, koine, “hermeneutics” and “Exegesis” as well!!?? Or they had the Lord himself as then afterwards the HOLY SPIRIT?? That is something I see missing greatly from all your “hermeneutics” and “Exegesis” , ie the influence of the HOLY SPIRIT! Go figure and while yuh tryin’ to figure, how about some real sincere, heart-searching PRAYER to God Almighty that he would remove the scales from your spiritual eyes!!
@Technician,
Would you believe that all this raving and ranting at me by “Mr” Zoe started because of a link I posted to ROK about members of the LDS church on the ground helping the people in Haiti before and after the earthquake? From there on “Mr” Zoe chose to fling his MUD at me! I wonder what tickle his fanny so!!
Check it out for yourself it was posted
@// February 2, 2010 at 3:48 PM about the half way mark of this thread.
He then started his tirade at me here :-
Zoe // February 2, 2010 at 7:48 PM
My point exactly Hood.
When others hijack threads, it is wrong, when a Christian does it, it is…”he IS EARNESTLY CONTENDING FOR THE FAITH as cited in Jude 3:3.
Hood
You write “ and then compare them with how you rave and rant here and with the LDS people that I interact with every day as they (LDS) portray true Gospel Principles in their every day lives, I cannot but be more convinced how much these scriptures help me in revealing your true nature!”
I can say the same about the believers with whom I have related for over 42 years.
You have not answered my question
Do you know anything about the etymology of the word translated “contend” in Jude 3:3?” What does the word CONTEND mean, according to the usage of the word in the Greek?
Here you are yourself ranting and raving. Are you not?
Define TRUE faith, HOLY faith according to you?
Is “faith” not PISTIS? Does it not refer to THE APOSTLES DOCTRINE THAT WAS ONCE DELIVERED TO THE SAINTS, as has been the interpretation of the Word.
Mr Hood when you ask questions like this, it boggles the mind?
“So Peter, James, John et al had Strong’s, koine, “hermeneutics” and “Exegesis” as well!!?? Or they had the Lord himself as then afterwards the HOLY SPIRIT??”
FYI Peter, James, John and the Lord all used the koine greek. It was THE UNIVERSAL LANGUAGE OF THE DAY JUST AS ENGLISH IS TODAY (English was not yet known). Didn’t you know that?
Didn’t you know that Peter, James, John, Paul, Luke, Jude, Mark and Mathew wrote the NT in koine greek?
Do you know what the words “hermeneutics” and “Exegesis” mean Sir.
Do you know that all of the above writers exegeted the OT as they quoted and explained it in the NT as they wrote.
Strong’s Exhaustive Concordance Sir is a very good dictionary of all the words used in the Bible. It lists every time a word is listed and gives the verse along with a number to differentiate the different Greek or Hebrew words translated by that word.
All serious Bible students and scholars and many many laymen own and use that book all throughout the World under the agency of the Holy Spirit.
Do you think that Strong could have completed that work without the Holy Spirit Sir?
You castigate Zoe who has time and time explained what texts say using the ORIGINAL GREEK. I have never seen you done that. You quote verses out of context only.
You ask me to remove scales from my spiritual eyes. But tell me ARE YOU SAYING THAT ALL THE STUDIES IN THE SCRIPTURE DONE FOR CENTURIES PRIOR TO 180 YEARS AGO WHEN THE MORMONS CAME ON THE SCENE MEAN NOTHING?
Are you saying that the Wesleys, Whitfield, Luther, Swingli, Calvin, Spurgeon, Moody Mathew Henry, et al ALL interpreted Scripture incorrectly? AND ON:LY THE MORMONS INTERPRET CORRCTLY?
What about Darby, Stevenson, Mc Gee, Deffinbaugh, Narnhouse, Campbell Morgan, Jensen, Stedman , Adrian Rogers, Billy Graham, Billy Sunday, JR Rice, etc etc WERE ALL WRONG and only the Mormons are right.
You see all that junk that you say that Brigham Young predicted about the Mormons 150 years ago? Read 2 Peter 3 and see that Peter predicted that the same would be said about those who rightly divide the Word.
Zoe reported on BU what is common knowledge about the Mormons as obtained from Mormons themselves, both practicing and those who formerly practiced Mormonism. Zoe reported on BU this information.
Anon pointed out that Mormons are essentially Protestants like most of us.
He pointed out that Protestants “protest” on the plank of BIBLE ONLY.
He reasonably concludes that groups that deviate from this plank are suspect.
Some call such groups cults.
Anon logically tried to explain what Zoe was saying in another way.
Anon erred only I that he is saying what Zoe is saying.
If Zoe is ranting and raving in his apologetic, what are you doing in yours?
Oh yes:
Passed by to see if he mod piled went through as yet.
Nope.
I should note too that so far as I have seen over several threads at BU, ROK’s affiliation and public acts are not a secret. In fact, ROK’s actions have made him a public figure.
Such a public figure is properly subject to a sharper degree of scrutiny under fair comment than a private individual.
Note also please: at no point have I ever ridiculed ROK.
I have corrected him, and when necessary rebuked or reproved him, but I have never disrespected his status as a human being made in God’s image and due a certain measure of respect for that.
I would therefore appreciate it if you, Technician, would refrain from slanderous misrepresentation of what I have said, and how I have said it.
And, there is no parallel with my own case, not only because I am not exactly a public figure holding a National Office, but also because I have not used his NAME, which as T knows is a key point of contact for data scrapers. [No prizes for guessing one reason why I so quickly go to abbreviations or names, especially if they are personal ones and fairly easily identifiable.]
But then the turnabout one-sided, usually false or at least misleading and distracting accusation is also one of the key tactics in use by antichristian agitators in our day.
G’day.
Dictionary.
PS: Hood, before jumping all over Zoe for his using some fairly strong language to speak of certain commentators [who in at least one case are unrepentant slanderers, which slander that has been used as a premise for a call to arson against churches in a previous thread, within a few weeks; which slander I note you have not set out to correct . .. ] — and note I have asked him to refrain himself on this — I would have you note Jesus’ language of a certain Herod: “Go tell that fox . . . ,” I would note Paul’s angry retort when he was struck in court at he order of the high priest [which earned him the further accusation of lese majeste], as well as his very strong language in Gal 5:12 — so we can have valid men of God who struggle with their tempers, and of course we have the extensive discussion of the fool in the Proverbs. One of the marks of a biblical fool is that he refuses appropriate correction and counsel, defiantly spouting off falsehood as though it were the truth.
I think Zoe should not have allowed himself to be goaded into sharp remarks, but must observe that I who have refrained from such have been repeatedly subjected to very nasty vulgarities plainly meant to hurt, denigrate and with onward intent to poison the atmosphere and drive out decent people. This, you have not objected to even as it happened before your eyes, so you have no legitimate standing to try now to turn the moral tables on Zoe, by using a few proof texts.
Techie
I am not saying that Zoe didnt hijack the thread, but you must be honest and state that all Bible threads have been hijacked by certain folk. Most especially the one on the Second Coming of Christ.
Read that one through and see if I complained once!
It seem that folk here find it very difficult to avoid topics that they know little about and just observe and learn.
Also it seems that folk on BU respond to posters rather than the content of their posts.
Re and GP would want to tell me that Christians are not perfect……..stupse….wunnah sure think so!!
I have not read where any believer on BU has said or implied that he was perfect. To do so would be to contradict 1 John 1:5-10
Techie
You wrote
“How can you be goaded to anger on a blog?…You have lots of time to count to 10, just shows that Zoe is no different even though he tries hard to prove otherwise…..damn hypocrites!!”
You wrote
Then you turn around and wrote
You can kiss Technician’s black arse!!
To hell with you Gordon Mullings !!
Thus indicating that you are no different to these guys.
As another would say are you not a persecutor and terrorist man? LOL ROTFLMAO!
Are you a hypocrite too? LOL ROTFLMAO!
Don’t cuss me OK cause I wont be approximating my labiae orae to the adipose or other tissues overlaying your glutei! LOL ROTFLMAO
Techie
I am not saying that Zoe didnt hijack the thread, but you must be honest and state that all Bible threads have been hijacked by certain folk. Most especially the one on the Second Coming of Christ.
I thought I was GP, when I said…”Threads have been hijacked before and posters were admonished for it. one would hope some would learn from their lesson, some do, some dont.”
Also it seems that folk on BU respond to posters rather than the content of their posts.
……I can say this goes both ways !
I have not read where any believer on BU has said or implied that he was perfect. To do so would be to contradict 1 John 1:5-10
No ..they dont come out and say they are perfect on BU…just treat everyone else on BU as though we are the scourge of the earth…six is half dozen!
Come on Techie
No believer that I know believes that they are perfect man.
IF YE SAY THAT YE HAVE NO SIN (ie the inherited sin nature) YE LIE AND THE TRUTH DOES NOT HABITUALLY RESIDE WITHIN YOU
IF YE SAY THAT YE HAVE NOT SINNED (i,e committed acts of sin)
The worst you can say about the “Bat men” is that we know that we have a good grasp of the Word and that we interpret it correctly—– or according to most of the scholars from all over the world!
Now I am sure some of you will pick that statement to pieces.
Zoe for example is in the top drawer with his greek exegesis. I think folk should learn from that and forget the rest. Thats what I do, man. LOL
I respect men that excel in what they do or like or in the things in which they are interested. And I will defend such. I dont have to agree with them or even like them or attack them all the time.
Such attacks them dont make them better or worse……..nor do such attacks make me a better person.
Here is a Word Study from the Hebrew and Greek, dealing specifically with *foolish* *folly* *foolishness* and *ignorance*
Hebrew Word Study from the Old Testament:
1. (‘ewil) foolish.
‘ewil. “Fool, foolish, foolish man, although the word is rendered “FOOL” in twenty of twenty six usages (ASV same, RSV similar).”
“Some derive (‘ewil) from (ya’ al) “be foolish,” while another possibility is from the Arabic word meaning “BE THICK,” and therefore “thick-brained” or “stupid.”
“The NIV renders “fool” in Prov 1:7 with a footnote” “The Hebrew word rendered ‘fool’ in Proverbs, and often elsewhere in the OT denote one who is morally deficient.” Such a person is lacking in sense and generally corrupt. If one can posit a gradation in the words for FOOL, ‘ewil’ would be one step below ‘k’sil’ and only one step above ‘nabal’ (q.v.). And even stronger word in Prov is ‘les’ often translater “SCOFFER.” The ‘ewil’ is not only a ‘k’sil’ because of his choices, BUT he IS also insolent.”
The ‘ewil’ identifies himself as soon as he OPENS his mouth. He would be wise to conceal his FOLLY by keeping his mouth quiet (Prov. 17:28). When he starts talking without thinking, ruin is at hand (Prov 10:14). While a wise man avoids strife, the FOOL quarrels at any time (Prov 20: 3). He cannot restrain himself and will “desplay his annoynance at once.” A FOOL has no balance in his relations with others. The wisdom instructor indicates that while stones and sand are most burdersome, a FOOL’S anger is even more intolerable.”
“As indicated, ‘ewil’ primarily refers to moral perversion or insolance, to what is sinful rather than to mental stupidity. This kind of FOOL dispises wisdom and is impatient with discipline. He who does not fear God IS a FOOL and will be UNABLE to grasp wisdom or benefit from Godly discipline (Prov 1:7). While the wise accept Godly instruction, the boastful or BABBLING fool who rejects it will fall down by the predicaments he makes for himself (Prov 10:8). Because a FOOL feels that his own way is without ERROR, he does NOT seek or listen to counsel as the wise one does. The FOOL is overbearing in his attitudes since he has ALL the answers (Prov 12:15) A fool despises his father’s intructions, in contrast to the one who shows good sense in regarding reproof (Prov 15:5). This kind of FOOL is also lincentious, taking sinful enjoyment with a wayward woman (Prov 7:22).
“Even if a FOOL were pounded with a pestle in a mortar along with the grain, no desirable results would follow” (prov 27:22).
‘Iwwelet.’ “Folly, foolishness, each twelve times, is asociated with a ‘k’sil’ and overlaps in meaning. Thus a FOOL displays his FOLLY, i.e., his ‘iwwelet’ (Prov 13:16). One is regarded a FOOL because of his FOLLY (‘iwwelet), since FOLLY seems a special product of FOOLS (k’silim).”
“…the senseless find joy in FOLLY, while by contrast the one who walks straight is a man of understanding.” (Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament, Vol. I, pp. 19,20) emphasis added.
Ignorant, to be ignorant, as taken from New Testament Word Study:
‘agnoeo, contracted ‘agnoo’ fut. ‘agnoeso’ from the priv. a (1), not, and ‘neo’ (3539) to perceive, understand. Not to recognize or know.”
(1) “To be IGNORANT of, unacquainted with, followed by the acc. (Acts 17:23; Rom. 10:3; 11:25; 2 Cor. 2:11); with the perp. ‘peri’ (4012), concerning, meaning to be IGNORANT concerning anything ( 1 Cor. 12: 1; 1 Thess. 4:13); followed by ‘hoti’ (3754), that (rom 1:13 “I would not have you ignorant,” 1 Cor. 10: 1; 2 Cor. 1:8). In the pass., to be unknown, unrecognized, rejected (2 Cor. 6:9). It came to mean to be IGNORANT, to have NO discernment of, NOT to UNDERSTAND (Mark 9:32; Luke 9:45; Rom. 10:3; Acts 13: 27 [cf. Acts 17:23; 1 Cor. 2: 8; 14: 38 “let him be IGNORANT [voluntarily],” of FOOLISH action; 1 Tim. 1:11).
(11) ‘To err, to commit a fault or faults arising from want of DISCERNMENT, knowledge, or insight, denoting conduct of which the result and importance is unperceived by the agent (heb. 5:2; 2 Pet. 2:12; Sept,; Lev. 4:13; 5:18). The idea that SIN can be done ignorantly and involuntarily is NOT found in the NT.”
‘Agnoia’: gen. ‘agnoias, fem noun from ‘agnoeo’ (50), not to know. want of knowledge, IGNORANCE which leads to mistaken conduct and forbids unconditional imputation of the guilt of the acts performed (Acts. 3:17; 1 Pet. 1: 14 [cf. Luke 23:34; 1 Cor. 2:8]). Accordingly to Paul this ‘agnoia’ or IGNORANCE is the characteristic of heathendom (Acts. 17: 30; Eph, 4:18 [cf. Eph. 4:17]) and is a state which renders repentance necessary (Acts 17:30). Thus it eventually furnishes ground for blame (Eph. 4:18), or otherwise for forebearance.” (The Complete Word Study Dictionary, New Testament, Spiros Zodhiates, Th.D., p. 53) emphasis added.
Interesting, isn’t it? We see clearly, all of the various shades of meaning, demonstrated in blatant FOLLY and downright FOOLISHNESS, IGNORANCE, right here on BU, by those who think they know on certain subject matters, that they don’t!!!
This is Zoe’s attempt at an apology?
Shame!!
@ Mr. Straight talk,
And you, too, Mr talk, are among the SAVED.
For is it not written in Mathew (3:3) and Luke (2:2) and Walt-Disney (273:1) and Hewlett-Packard (Appendix 4) that “blessed are the peacemakers, and I’d like fries with that. To go. What? Yeah, extra-crispy-eth. Thanks. And the dull of mind are blessed, too. Can I have a napkin?”
For surely this IS proof. And you WILL get a personal cloud with wings and so forth.
Do you want a little harp to go with that cloud?