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Press Release issued by the Leeward Islands Airline Pilots Association (LIALPA)
LIAT TO UPGRADE TO 11 ATRS over two years
LIAT TO UPGRADE TO 11 ATRS over two years

(St John’s, Antigua) The Leeward Islands Airline Pilots Association (LIALPA) is waiting to be informed of the measures LIAT will take in dealing with the passenger who caused the disruption and cancellation of one of its flights on December 13th 2016. The passenger who was on-board an aircraft in Barbados, destined for St Vincent, made a serious allegation that they had detected the smell of alcohol on one of the pilots.

Read full Press Release issued by the Leeward Islands Airline Pilots Association

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110 responses to “LIAT’s Pilot Association Calls for Disruptive Passenger to be Punished”

  1. Piece Uh De Rock Yeah Right - INRI Avatar
    Piece Uh De Rock Yeah Right – INRI

    down not doing**

  2. Gabriel Avatar
    Gabriel

    Speaking of inebriated pilots and the denial by the airline,saying initial tests of drug and alcohol were negative,this pilot was fired,subsequently,and 2 executives resigned over the incident.A pilot’s licence is his sword and buckler.Without It he is defenseless.How this guy got past scrutiny at security and got onto the aeroplane and into the cockpit is beyond belief.
    CCTV is absent in key areas at GAIA.Customs probably still objecting to CCTV in arrivals?

    https://www.the guardian.com/world/2016/dec/31/pilot-accused-of-being-drunk-after-video-shows-him-staggering-through-airport

  3. Gabriel Avatar
    Gabriel

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/dec/31/pilot-accused-of-being-drunk-after-video-shows-him-staggering-through-airport

  4. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    @ PitFlyng
    I think you are failing to understand what I am getting at. This passenger cost the company a sizeable amount.
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    This is the basis of your error…. but such propaganda does NOT fly on BU…
    This passenger expressed genuine, mature, (even if misguided) concerns about the safety of herself, fellow passengers, crew and the aircraft, …as well as other possible collateral damage on the ground….
    In mature organisations, such persons are appreciated.

    What cost LIAT a’ sizeable amount’ is the ATTITUDE of its pilots and staff …who obviously decided to cry righteous indignation, and exploit the situation to get a free day off with pay.
    After the second pilot reassured (successfully) the passenger, it is obvious (at least to Bushie) that others decided to abort the flight, get their full pay, and take absolutely NO risk by getting a blood test….

    As a pilot, you should be ashamed of the ATTITUDE displayed by your colleagues. You know full well that in a professional airline (almost any other one), that pilot would have walked out to the cabin, interacted briefly with passengers to reassure them of his sobriety; made a few good jokes about not even eating rum cake, …and gone on to do his job professionally – even if the complaining passenger was a miserable witch like ac…..

    Why not just apologise on your colleagues’ behalf and let us try to move forward….?
    And for God’s sake, leave the damn passenger alone…..

  5. David Avatar
    David

    There is enough blame to go around however the key issue must be the inability to apply the equivalent of a sobriety test in a reasonable time period with perhaps a minimum delay to passengers.

  6. PltFlyng Avatar
    PltFlyng

    @BushTea

    A reasonable attempt was made to diffuse the situation however that was not acceptable to the passenger in question.

    The accused in question made the right call.

    Continuing that flight without being cleared definitivly at that point posed a future potential personal liability to the accused and i would add to the company that could not be ignored. In his place I would have done the same and i can assure you he did not take that decision without consultation. Unfortunate maybe, but I would not put a career I have spent years and thousands of dollars building at risk. It’s not worth it.

    As to your comments about going into the cabin and making jokes. Why? A reasonable effort WAS made. Anything beyond that was as far as I am concerned not within the required purview. Pilots are there to transport you safely from A to B safely within the requirements set out within the employment contract and the company SOP’s. They are not there to humour you or indulge ridiculous behaviour. Pilots in general often get a lot of flak from passengers for the decisions made by others. We don’t make the big decisions, we do not build the schedule we do not decide when a flight is cancelled or rerouted. Outside of a very few circumstances relating to safety we don’t call those shots. We show up when told and go where we are told when we are told to go (as long as safety permits).

    That pilot did not cancel that flight that night. He did what he had to do. The rest was beyond his control. That is all you can ever do. Those passengers that got on so and demanded he take a brethlayser to prove his sobriety I can almost garuntee you would have got on the same way if he had removed him self because he was ill or too tired after having been on duty 10+ hours that day after having worked 12+ hours every day for the last 4 days (hypothetical scenario). People are throwing out the safety card here on behalf of the passengers to excuse obnoxious behaviour that would not be tolerated outside the airport at a regular buisness but because they were sitting onboard an aircraft it is suddenly ok. Yet those same people don’t want to hear about safety when you as a pilot make a decision not to go or have to remove your self from a flight.

  7. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    Your position is accepted PitFlyng, but it comes across as being a bit too judgmental, formal and aloof. A ‘reasonable effort’ from a pilot’s perspective is likely to be VERY biased from everyone else’s….
    Bushie always thought that pilots were there, not just to ‘transport you safely from A to B, but also to be responsible for all your concerns during the journey…. even irrational fears of flying and other safety concerns….

    This was a molehill, PitFlyng…. and a pilot should have been head and shoulders above being drawn into reacting so strongly to a simple question from a (probably scared and clueless) passenger.

    Admittedly, LIAT’s management, in failing to have CLEAR procedures in place – beyond simple-minded cancellations – also contributed greatly to the fiasco.

    Are you then telling Bushie that anytime that someone wants an excuse to stay another night in a Caribbean island (all expenses paid), with a solid excuse from LIAT, that person needs only get a passenger to question the sobriety of the pilot…?
    …even if that ‘person’ is a pilot or steward …with a girlfriend on the island…?

    No wonder LIAT means “Late, If At All…..”

  8. ac Avatar
    ac

    Look Plt i feel you .i feel you wanting all to understand the problems faced and having to deal with a irate passenger where emotionals were heigthened and tensions run high
    Yes your anology of the story bodes well for reccomendations and steps to be taken in case of another occurence.
    But not punishment of any kind towards the passengers being keenly aware that when situations of these type blow up with out prior warning emotions on both sides would run high and etiquette takes a back seat.

  9. Sargeant Avatar
    Sargeant

    “PLTflying” sounds like the real deal and I read his comments @2.57 am and all I can say is “lawd havest mercy” when I read this part of his submission

    <“Truth be told I am not surprised. Barbados has its own civil aviation authority yet in 17 years I have never once been spot checked (documents/aircraft etc) in BGI by the authorities. I have been ramp checked from time to time every where else by other authorities but never Barbados. Yet my government (yes I am a bajan) employees civil aviation inspectors who seem to be permanently missing in action”>.

    I think every traveler should shudder if they understand the import of those words, 17 years flying and not one spot check from the watchdogs at GAIA. If that individual hadn’t kicked up a fuss about an alleged drinking pilot that little titbit would never have seen the light of day. If Frick and Frack put on a pilot’s uniform or some facsimile they can just stroll through the airport onto the tarmac and board a plane and viola we have an incident waiting to happen.
    Sometimes when you think things are bad, they are actually worse “lawd haves mercy”

  10. David Avatar
    David

    @Bush Tea

    Based on PLTflying’s account the passenger did right to raise a concern then allowed their behaviour to deteriorate and became a jackass.

  11. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    How did the passenger ‘become a jackass’ David?
    Based on the response she got …to a genuine concern, she behaved like a normal person would…

    Boss…If that was Bushie… all like now you would be seeing the repercussions – cause, while Bushie is ALWAYS very nice and polite up front… when any shiite start, de whacker does do dixie yuh … 🙂

  12. David Avatar
    David

    If we take the insider account as gospel why was the irate passenger amenable to flying with said pilot when the decision to cancel the flight was made?

  13. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    duh!!
    …because she wanted to get home …and could not fathom the petit idiocy that resulted from her simple query…??!! …especially after her concerns were satisfactorily addressed by the first pilot she spoke with…
    Why would you ‘take the insider’s account as gospel?’ …sounds to Bushie like a LIAT ‘insider’/ employee …who saw an opportunity to take a paid casual day from work 🙂

    This reminds Bushie of the Ministry of Education’s policy of closing school when the water goes off; or there is a bush fire; or someone smells a tree fart….

    Boss,
    Shiite expands to fill all opportunities allowed for its existence…
    (c) Bushie 2016 🙂

  14. ac Avatar
    ac

    The only one who can give an answer to that question would be the passenger.
    But in apart the passenger might have changed her mind following a series of events including detailed or personnel decisions of her own

  15. David Avatar
    David

    Taking a position just like you Bushie.

    The safety concern would only have been addressed when the zero result of the test was returned. It is only then the worry or fear of the passenger would have been addressed.

    Fair is fair.

  16. Hal Austin Avatar
    Hal Austin

    Aircraft safety is the best in the world, even better than medical negligence. Read Matthew Syed’s book for a good history. The key reason is that people do not get disciplined for reporting incidents.

  17. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    @ Hal
    The highest safety record possible comes from not doing one shiite….
    Close shop at every possible threat ..and your safety record becomes perfect.

    Only when it is combined with excellent productivity AND customer service, does a good safety record mean anything.

    @ David
    So if you were that passenger, and the pilot came out and spoke with you calmly and coherently, ..walked around in full control of his balance …and displayed full control of his body and mental faculties ….you would need to wait on a ‘zero’ result?

    Suppose he was sober as a (almost said priest …but Bushie knows better) teetotaller, but was having a medical issue …like the mad-ass fellow who flew his plane into a mountain in Europe two years ago?

    Don’t lets make another mountain of of this molehill…. please.

  18. David Avatar
    David

    @Bush Tea

    Let us just say members of the BU household have a lot of respect for the LIAT pilots. They have to work under extreme stress often times.

    >

  19. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    @ David
    🙂

  20. Gabriel Avatar
    Gabriel

    Passengers are usually boarded after the pilots have boarded and seated in the cockpit doing pre flight checks etc.Passengers ascend the steps and turn right.How did this passenger come into such close contact with the pilot?Was there some pre- boarding hanky panky?Was the pilot seen drinking a coke or some colored drink and in a hurry to board “pitch it back”like a true boozer would?Lots of questions on this most unusual incident.That complainant is more than brave or brazen.

  21. Hants Avatar
    Hants

    only in Canada eh !!!!

    Pilot charged with being impaired by Calgary police after passing out in cockpit

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/impaired-pilot-sunwings-airlines-arrest-1.3917757

  22. islandgal Avatar
    islandgal

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/impaired-pilot-sunwings-airlines-arrest-1.3917757

  23. Artax Avatar
    Artax

    PltFlyng December 31, 2016 at 9:26 AM #

    “A reasonable attempt was made to diffuse the situation however that was not acceptable to the passenger in question.”

    @ PltFlyng

    Were you on the flight or are you repeating what happened during incident based on what your colleagues told you?

    If you were not on the flight, then it would be impossible for you to give an “eye-witness account” of the incident. And as such, your report of what occurred was based on “hear say” and will obviously be biased against the passenger, as you would want to be in solidarity with your colleagues.

    The “long and short” of the story is: as pilots, wunnuh feel dat wunnuh better dan evuhbody and no mere mortal has the right to accuse a “big boy pilot” of having smelled of alcohol. The accusation bruised the pilot’s ego.

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    David December 31, 2016 at 10:43 AM #

    “Based on PLTflying’s account the passenger did right to raise a concern then allowed their behaviour to deteriorate and became a jackass.”

    @ David

    PltFlyng conveniently or purposely refused to mention that, according a passenger who was interviewed by iWN, the co-pilot allegedly told the irate passenger re:

    “At this point, the guy (the other pilot) began SPEAKING RUDELY to the passenger telling her to stop being STUPID and if she is stupid and if it’s the first time she was travelling and all those things intended to make a person feel small.”

    The comments made by the co-pilot are enough to incite anyone who saw their legitimate concerns being downplayed and their intelligence questioned.

  24. Hal Austin Avatar
    Hal Austin

    China has a strong low-cost airline network. If LIAT does not improve the Chinese will move in on their parade.

  25. ac Avatar
    ac

    A high on celeb arrivals

    A Positive note to start the NEW Year ,,Nation News

    TOURISM OFFICIALS are over the moon this holiday season as the island is proving to be a calling card for the rich and famous like never before.
    The chief executive officer of the Barbados Tourism Marketing Inc. (BTMI), William “Billy” Griffith, told the SUNDAY SUN he was “delighted” that dozens of celebrities had chosen Barbados as their choice destination for Christmas and New Year, with their presence here being broadcast across the globe, and providing advertising that can’t be quantified in dollars alone.
    For the past three weeks, paparazzi have been in a frenzy on west coast beaches, and airport workers kept busy with the movement of private jets in and out of the Grantley Adams International Airport.

  26. David Avatar
    David

    Unfortunately a hike in tourism receipts alone will not do it for Barbados, and the hike has nothing to do with structual change in the economy. Based on the latest reports forex reserves are tanking and there is a wait to complete foreign exchange transactions at commercial banks.

  27. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    @ David
    Small things amuse small minds.
    Are most of these celebrities not staying at villas owned by rich people in England and other jurisdictions? Also, since these people already own properties in Barbados, where else will they, and their friends, holiday?
    Will they not have paid for their accommodation outside of our financial system?

    Perhaps ac and Mr Griffith can explain how this all redounds to the national bottom line in a significant way…. Ordinary potential tourists may well conclude that a destination that attracts the likes of Cowell will not give them the bang for their buck that they can afford…

  28. dPd Avatar
    dPd

    Any port – redardless of how specious – for a blog post.

    That’s the AC mantra.

  29. Hants Avatar
    Hants

    @ Bushie, there is some value to the “advertising” that celebrities generate.

  30. ac Avatar
    ac

    Say what you like it is a written fact . When tourist arrive on these shores it is a PLUS PLUS that should be recognized a plus that can bring revenue a plus that help to build and grow the economy a long term and sustainable plus rooted in the future as to many aspects going forward

  31. PltFlyng Avatar
    PltFlyng

    @artax

    “At this point, the guy (the other pilot) began SPEAKING RUDELY to the passenger telling her to stop being STUPID and if she is stupid and if it’s the first time she was travelling and all those things intended to make a person feel small.”

    The comments made by the co-pilot are enough to incite anyone who saw their legitimate concerns being downplayed and their intelligence questioned.
    ++++++++++++×

    Here is the thing, there is such a thing as a stupid question. The fallacy that there is no such thing as a stupid question is a myth perpetrated by a generation of social warriors out to appease everybody. The same types that hand out participation trophies and have brainwashed people into thinking every opinion is equally valid. It is always a good policy to engage your brain and assess the situation before engaging your mouth.

    Wet wipes smell of rubbing alcohol. The kind you use to clean a cut when you cut your self in the kitchen or scrape a knee. The kind they use to clean the area before you get an injection. Not the kind of alcohol you will be drinking.

    Yes the persons query was heard but it was dismissed by the other pilot for a good reason. The two pilots wold have been picked up together about 7 hours prior and would have spent the last 6 of those hours together crammed into that tiny atr cockpit where there is barely room to have a private thought much less anything else. The other pilot would also have been present there where after having consumed a meal at his workstation in the down time the other pilot opened a wet wipe (of which dozens are provided by the company) to clean his hands/face.

    If the accuser is not willing to hear out those facts and accept that as reasonable then yes they are being silly.

    Personally I am against pilots consuming meals forcibly In the cockpit for a variety of reasons. Among them hygiene and cleanliness being one as there is no running water in the cockpit to wash ones hands (hence the wet wipes). This person was most likely doing so in a personal attempt to get an already delayed flight back on time. There is a court of arbitration ruling In the 2010 case of LIALPA v LIAT which ruled among other things that after a certain amount of time on duty that pilots must be given time free of duty to eat. If that ruling is not followed and built into the schedule that is not the pilot (s) fault and they can hardly be blamed for the delays that result. Likewise no where in the ruling does it say that right is forfeited if there is a delay. Had the pilot in question taken the time he was entitled to and gone into the terminal to eat like a human being rather than trying to wolf down something in the cockpit so as to appease the same passengers who subsequently turned on him this likely would never have happened. The road to hell is paved with good intention.

    Ref the other comments I do not know what the misinformation they are feeding you all but GAIA is noticeably devoid of private jets this year. There is a noticable lack of them. Normally they are parked nose to tail as tight as they can get. This year and last year there are hardly any. Perhaps all the big wigs flew by airline.

  32. Artax Avatar
    Artax

    PltFlyng January 1, 2017 at 10:39 AM #

    “It is always a good policy to engage your brain and assess the situation before engaging your mouth.”

    @ PltFlyng

    Your above comments are very true and clearly DEFINITIVE of the BIASED approach you have chosen to take on this issue.

    Whereas I was able to analyze both stories, as well as take into consideration LIAT’s apparent refusal to pursue the matter any further, and came to a probable conclusion, you came to your conclusion based specifically on the pilot’s statements ONLY.

    Additionally, how do you know LIAT’s lawyers said there were not any “grounds” to pursue the matter further?

    I understand that being a pilot you would obviously prefer to believe your colleagues’ version of the events as they unfolded, as opposed to irate passengers.

    What you and LIALPA are essentially suggesting is that:

    1) It is presumptuous and for any passenger to raise concerns about their safety, by saying they smelled alcohol on a pilot.

    2) Because the tests confirmed the pilot did not consume an alcoholic beverage, this is proof the passenger was mischievous in her intentions, or made a PREMEDITATED attempt to sully the reputation of the pilot in question on that specific flight LI769, therefore, she should be blacklisted from travelling on LIAT operated flights.

    However, you must also consider that, although the tests may have confirmed the pilot was not drinking, there were no reports of any other tests being conducted to ascertain if the pilot used a substance containing alcohol at the time the passenger said she smelled it.

    Your comment re: “If the accuser is not willing to hear out those facts and accept that as reasonable then yes they are being silly,” is pure shiite………… and you know it.

    In my opinion, you and LIALPA are grabbing at straws because the pilot’s ego was bruised and the association wants it to appear to the public that it is actually representing its constituents.

    LIAT and LIALPA reminds me of the WICB and WIPA, where the EGOS of MEN are more important than any issue.

  33. David Avatar
    David

    Does the LIAT management see value in issuing a statement on the matter? We can’t blame the pilot association for articulating a position as it affects their members.

  34. Anonymouse - TheGazer Avatar
    Anonymouse – TheGazer

    A very harsh opinion. Coercion and intimidation seems to be one way of doing business. Hoping that this full court press does not deter other travelers from speaking up, should the need arise.

  35. PltFlyng Avatar
    PltFlyng

    Trust me i am in a position to be well informed on this issue.

    Do you think that after an incident costing the type of money that this cost that there was no internal investigation? Do you think a pilot having been sent to a clinic for this sort of testing was not put through an entire battery of tests? Of which the printed results are available for those who need to see them to see?

    Do you think something like this happens and the union would not seek guidance from the International Federation of Airline Pilots Associations.

    Unlike some people i do not speak unless i have facts supported by evidence and have the backing of established precedent.

    Before you lecture me on passengers rights perhaps you should be familiar with IATA AGM 69 and the passengers rights as laid out by their compliance document and MC99.

  36. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    Well one thing is clear now….
    There is no hope for LIAT …..not with this level of childish interactions on such a simple routine matter as customer concerns.
    Clearly, LIAT management is incompetent in the high quality field of the airline business, …but it is also clear that the pilots are no better in the attitude department either … even if they are competent fliers.
    One can only guess at the professionalism of the stewards, technical staff and clerical personnel. Bushie is surprised that they even manage to …..Leave Islands At Times

  37. de pedantic Dribbler Avatar
    de pedantic Dribbler

    @PltFlyng at 12:42 PM re “Trust me i am in a position to be well informed on this issue. Do you think that after an incident costing the type of money that this cost that there was no internal investigation?…”

    You speak with a certainty that is ‘refreshingly’ similar to a certain newly elected President.

    Taking you and your assoc. at your word that “…this cost that there was no internal investigation?…” and the reference to the ‘the International Federation of Airline Pilots Associations’ I would ask WHY are we even having this debate.

    By your OWN words the pilot contributed to an impractical, unprofessional, ‘dangerous’ and ultimately costly behaviour (Using food in such close quarters with all that electro-mechncal stuff, really!!!)

    I am confused therefore by your prosecution of this matter as you are.

    LIALPA are adopting a PR stance that gives them visibility on the backs of a very topical issue; a stance being used to drive other issues for them. Obviously, because this matter is incidental and you know that.

    Artax is fundamentally right in his stance. You also know that too because you are clearly an astute person…

    You and your fellow pilots along with difficult to understand LIAT practices are at fault here.

    It is NOT the passenger who made the claim… a claim that should have been handled as efficiently as you manage all the dials, switches and read-outs in those cramped ATR cockpits.

  38. Vincent Haynes Avatar
    Vincent Haynes

    LIAT is a political tool……it has no basis for its continued existence……it is funded by 4 of the 16 caricom states,its debt is worse than Bims,ad hocism is the order of the day and the list goes on………but it cannot be shut down.

  39. PltFlyng Avatar
    PltFlyng

    @de pedantic Dribbler

    Ask any airline pilot food is often consumed in the flight deck out of necessity. This happens in most airlines. Once again that shows how people who have no idea can make comments that seem informed to them but have no factual basis.

    My objections to such are mainly based on clenliness concerns and other human factors concerns for the pilot, not out of concern for the equipment. From the point of view of the aircraft it is not much different to sitting an eating in the front seat of a MTW truck parked at a job site.

  40. Artax Avatar
    Artax

    PltFlyng January 1, 2017 at 12:42 PM #

    “Trust me i am in a position to be well informed on this issue.”

    @ PltFlyng

    This will be my final response to you on this issue.

    Firstly, I cannot remember reading in any of the contributions to this topic, where a contributor attempted to “lecture you on passengers rights.”

    Secondly, unless you were you on that aircraft and WITNESSED the events as they unfolded, you cannot say for sure the “facts,” as relayed to you by your colleagues, are irrefutable.

    I bet none of you pilots would stand in solidarity for justice in a similar manner, if it were a luggage handler that was accused of having smelled of alcohol.

    Thirdly, you wrote about “the backing of established precedent.” Can you present any evidence to prove LIAT blacklisted any passenger for disruptive behaviour under specific or similar circumstances of that passenger claiming to have smelled alcohol on a pilot?

    Your reference to the cost LIAT incurred as a result of the flight’s cancellation, is irrelevant and seems to be your justification for the passenger to be blacklisted.

    Supposed LIAT had incurred a similar cost because the flight had to be cancelled for some other reason?

    You and LIALPA are grabbing at straws because A PILOT’S EGO was BRUISED.

  41. Artax Avatar
    Artax

    I am a regular traveler on LIAT and one of many passengers who have experienced the arrogance and the contempt shown for customers shown by the airline’s crew, especially the “glorified waitresses” known as “flight attendants.”

    I remember travelling to St. Vincent via St. Lucia. I sat by an emergency exit and before we departed for St. Lucia, the flight attendant asked if I was willing to assist in the case of an emergency, to which my response was “I have no problem in assisting.”

    When the flight was preparing to depart St. Lucia for St. Vincent, she went through the pre-flight procedures again and asked me a second time if I was willing to assist in case of an emergency. I smiled and replied that I told her previously I was willing to assist. She obviously took offence at my reply because she excluded me from the refreshments she served to the other passengers.

    As we were leaving the aircraft, she stood at the exit to thank passengers for travelling with LIAT, but turned her face from me as I approached the door. She was perhaps of the opinion she did me some great injustice by not serving me a “box juice” and not telling me “thank you for travelling with LIAT.”

    LIAT has a HISTORY of PROVIDING TERRIBLE CUSTOMER SERVICE, from the booking agents in Antigua who are very unmannerly, to the check-in agents, baggage handlers, pilots and waitresses.

    All this talk about blacklisting passengers and interpreting the rules to suit an agenda, if there was ANOTHER RELIABLE OPTION of inter-regional transport, INCLUDING a FERRY, given LIAT’s terrible customer service history, do you honestly believe people would travel on LIAT?

  42. David Avatar
    David

    @PltFlyng

    Regarding your observation about the low numbers of private jets on GAIA’s apron this weekend. Have you taken a look to the Eastern part of the airport where cruise ship passengers in-transit are handled?

  43. Gabriel Avatar
    Gabriel

    I have flown on Liat many,many times.I am yet to experience the service described by some on this thread.I have had a delay here and there but in a scale of 1-10 for customer service on the ground and in the air,I rate Liat 9.

  44. ac Avatar
    ac

    Plt giving the negative comments you have single handly been able to generate about Liat brought about by the Pilots ridiculous letter . The best advice would be for you and the pilots associations to take the high ground before your not so well intentions bury Liat underground in a sea of negative responses

  45. de pedantic Dribbler Avatar
    de pedantic Dribbler

    @PltFlyng January 1, 2017 at 2:12 PM… Now yah see how we does go and get we-self n trouble. If I had called you and your colleagues gloried truck drivers you would have gotten your undies in a real tizzy. Not so!

    Yet you say : “From the point of view of the aircraft it is not much different to sitting an eating in the front seat of a MTW truck parked at a job site.” (Actually a better analogy would be a ZR driver but still tho a broadside to your brothers, yah don’t think).

    Anyhow let me restate my position on pilots eating in the cockpit cause I am NOT trying to make any policy from some uninformed position. I am basing my remarks on YOUR comments.

    YOU said ” There is a court of arbitration ruling In the 2010 case of LIALPA v LIAT which ruled among other things that after a certain amount of time on duty that pilots must be given time free of duty to eat. If that ruling is not followed and built into the schedule that is not the pilot (s) fault and they can hardly be blamed for the delays that result.”

    So let’s be clear that I went to school. And if a PILOT tells me that a court has legislated that his work rules give him the right to enough time to have a lunch/dinner break and said PILOT tells me that “… Had the pilot in question taken the time he was entitled to and gone into the terminal to eat like a human being rather than trying to wolf down something in the cockpit”.

    Then YES that PILOT contributed by his OWN fault to this total mess…

    I hope that clarifies this point I made.

    Now I know that you went to school too, and likely much more than I did, so please settle and come again cause it is YOUR ” factual basis” upon which I relied.

    Are you saying you are a stranger to truth or “have no idea [but] make comments that seem informed …”!!

  46. Artax Avatar
    Artax

    I doubt there has not been any other contributors to this forum who has defended LIAT as much as I have.

    However, because one or two individuals may not have experienced LIAT’s poor service, it would be ludicrous of anyone to suggest such service does not exist.

    Rating LIAT’s service 9 out 10 is perhaps indicative of one who is not accustomed to proper customer service or has not travelled with the airline as regularly as they would have us believe.

  47. Gabriel Avatar
    Gabriel

    Artax
    I am not your average guy.i gave of my experience.Further I am well qualified to speak.

  48. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    @ Artax
    Boss, if Gabriel travelled by ZR …he would probably have a 9/10 experience….
    ….think he is a pleb like you and Bushie?
    .. 🙂

  49. PltFlyng Avatar
    PltFlyng

    Honestly the other side of the equation for pilots is that this is a learning lesson. The company will not stick up for you so do what you have to do to look out for your own personal interest.

    If accused do not try to explain or defuse the situation just go immediately and give blood to be tested and just go home. End of story. Breathalyzer testing has a high margin of error and especially if they equipment is not properly maintained blood testing is far more accurate and the civil aviation regulations and the contract only speak to blood testing anyway. So the person will be “offline” for a minimum of 24 hours while the results are pending.

    It is not worth the potential complications to fly under a cloud of suspicion. If it means like in this case the flight cancels so be it.

    If liat willing to eat the loss associated with the cancellation and not seek to recover it from the accuser if the tests come back negative that is their buisness.

  50. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    A simple breathalyser test for EVERY pilot clearing security …and passengers will feel 100% happy that their driver is not drunk. After a year of negative tests, the process can be randomly done.
    Most drunk drivers never feel that they are drunk….and a few of them then end up killing themselves, family and strangers every damn year on our roads.

    Our retarded justice system have followed logic similar to yours, to ignore the PREVENTIVE measure of breath testing. They are a pack of jackasses …and must bear responsibility for a number of traffic deaths and injuries every year that COULD have been prevented.

    Bushie thinks that you protests too much….
    Pilots should be seeking out ways and means of FACILITATING safe and efficient travel, ..taking into consideration the legitimate concerns of customers…. rather than focusing on their own selfish, albino-centric, EGOS.

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