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CL Financial Bailout – False Equivalence?

In today’s world of ‘Alternative Facts’ we have to be alert to the special dangers posed by ‘False Equivalence’. False Equivalence arises when two arguments are presented as being of equal relevance, but in fact one is solidly fact-based and the other is mere speculation or invention. Those dangers are especially present in matters of…

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In today’s world of ‘Alternative Facts’ we have to be alert to the special dangers posed by ‘False Equivalence’. False Equivalence arises when two arguments are presented as being of equal relevance, but in fact one is solidly fact-based and the other is mere speculation or invention. Those dangers are especially present in matters of public importance, as recent events have shown.

Tony Rakhal-Fraser’s Sunday Guardian column on 25 June 2017, titled Appointing ‘Fit and Proper’ People, made me wince, despite his usual high standard of writing. My reaction arose from what appeared to be an attempt by the Central Bank Governor to promote a new discussion on the fit and proper rules.

Read full text on Afra Raymond’s website – CL Financial bailout – False Equivalence?

72 responses to “CL Financial Bailout – False Equivalence?”

  1. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ David July 14, 2017 at 4:44 PM
    “Is the able right hand man Terrence Thornhill still chairman of the EGF?”

    Now you can appreciate the depth of rot which has infiltrated the current administration to make it ineffective in moving in any direction to resolve the CLICO fiasco to the minimum satisfaction of the CLICO policyholders especially those holding pension and life insurance annuities.

    Why should a man so morally tarnished, both professionally and personally, be the head of such a financially-focused organization with the mission of facilitating the economic development of Barbados. Out of sheer self-respect he ought to have relinquished such a position.

    The DLP is unable to bite the hand of the elections benefactor which financed its rise to power in 2008.

    What we should be querying also is if the Parris $5 million leprous deposit is still at the C B now that his protector and laundry guard has been unceremoniously dismissed for disobeying the order to print more Mickey mouse dollars to prop up a crumbling regime.

    Now you see why the miller has been at Dr. Deliar’s throat since 2013 for failing to give a satisfactory account of that miraculously missing $300 million in foreign exchange reserves?

    One wonders what William the Billy Skinner now has to say about his good friend who like Saul has now seen the Light of being professionally honest with himself?

  2. Gabriel Avatar
    Gabriel

    The Clico saga continues in TnT…

    http://www.trinidadexpress.com/20170715/news/meet-with-us-let8217s-negotiate

  3. Well Well & Consequences Observing Blogger Avatar
    Well Well & Consequences Observing Blogger

    They are all sitting on their fat asses looking for more bribes…if the government can find a buyer for the 15 billion dollar debt, sell the damn blighted, corruption filled company,……

    ……there are more than enough conglomerates inside and outside of TT with the money to purchase the entity.

  4. David Avatar
    David

     

    From: Clico Policyholders Group <clico.policyholders@gmail.com>

    To:

    Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2017, 6:19:44 AM AST

    Subject: CL Financial ready to repay $$ | T&T Newsday

    CL Financial ready to repay $$

    MIRANDA LA ROSE Saturday, July 15 2017

    SHAREHOLDERS of CL Financial and Clico are ready to pay taxpayers the $15 billion financial bailout of 2009 that Government claims the conglomerate owes them, shareholders representative Carlton Reis says.

    “Are you going to liquidate a company worth $40 billion to get $15 billion,” he asked in relation to a petition Government has lodged in the High Court to wind up CL Financial. 
    The petition, Finance Minister Colm Imbert said, is to obtain from CLF, all funds owed to taxpayers. 
    “The funds owed by Clico to the Government, and by extension taxpayers,” Imbert said, “are already the subject of a court-approved resolution plan.” He said the taxpayers bailout of CLF was over $23 billion, not including legal costs or consultancy fees or all contingent liabilities. 
    About $7.5 billion has already been recovered, Imbert said, and the remaining debt is in excess of $15 billion. 
    Prime Minister Dr Keith Rowley’s estimate of $27 billion given in another forum, Imbert said, “takes into account all of the costs incurred and all estimated contingent liabilities and would be over $23 billion. 
    Speaking on behalf of DALCO, CLF largest shareholder, and the United Shareholders Limited representing CLF shareholders, yesterday at a joint press conference with the Clico Policyholders Group at One Woodbrook Place, Reis said, he understood that the petition was served but shareholders have not gotten a copy. “All we know is what we saw in the newspaper. At this time we are seeking legal advice. We have requested a copy of the petition,” he said. 
    Expressing gratitude for Government’s move in bailing out CL Financial and Clico, Reis said, “We believe we are in a position right now to repay the debt. We want to pay.” Clico Policyholders’ Group chairman Peter Purmell said the shareholders have joined forces with them to oppose Government’s plan “to liquidate CL Financial and ultimately Clico.” Reis said that shareholders has tried to negotiate with Government, made “numerous attempts” since 2013 to now, but was never acknowledged. “We have been oppressed by the government,” he said. 
    “I don’t think these guys intend to hand back the company,” he added. 
    Wanting to get back the company, he said, “We want to get in the driver’s seat. We have plans on how to stimulate the company, and we could create jobs and help to develop Trinidad and Tobago’s economy in this depressed state.” 
    GOVT LIKE A CANCER 
    Claiming that the shareholders have been ignored by Government, he said, over the last eight years Government has converted CL Financial and Clico into a State enterprise. 
    They have been running “their affairs and doing what they want inside of there” and at this stage they do not want to let go of CLF and Clico. 
    “They are like a cancer in it. We want them out,” he said. Calling on Government directors to resign with immediate effect, he said, shareholders want to negotiate with Government and to share its rebirth plan. A lot of people want to invest in Trinidad and Tobago, he said, but with Govermment making a move like a “gangster” to take control of a financial conglomerate would not be encouraging. 
    The manner of the removal of CLF shareholders director and managing director, he said, was illegal. 
    “The government did not build this empire so they can shake it down,” he said. “We made a commitment to policy holders that when we get back there everyone is going to be paid.” He said that the payment of policy holders was not so much a problem. 
    “It is only when the Government came in, that problem started,” he said. Asked about the role Lawrence Duprey, the single largest shareholder would play in the company if it goes back to shareholders, Reis said, Duprey has apologised for what occurred and looks forward to advising a new management team. 
    Duprey, now in his 80s, he said, will not be in the forefront. “Nobody understands the group as he does. He built the empire,” he said. 
    NO NEED TO LIQUIDATE 
    Meanwhile, Peter Permell, Chairman of the Clico Policyholders Group questioned why Government would want to trigger a liquidation when shareholders want to pay. Policyholders views the move to liquidatation, he said, “as an unfortunate and unnecessary act of desperation, which comes as no surprise to our group, and more importantly is not in the best interest of taxpayers, policy holders, employees, and shareholders of CL Financial and Clico.” As any such move would only benefit the liquidator, lawyers, and big businesses who are already “salivating” at the thought of getting their hands on CLF assets, he said. 
    A subset of this group, he said, are party financiers who would have financed the campaign of the current administration. 
    He said the petition will fail because Government is not a direct creditor of CL Financial, the company was not insolvent, and it has sufficient assets to settle all outstanding debts among other reasons. 
    Claiming that CLF has been solvent since 2013, yet, he said, there was no audited financial statements for the company. “So CL Financial has been shrouded in secrecy all these years.” The petition, he said, “is a scare tactic to precipitate certain actions on the part of CL Financial stakeholders.” Any liquidation, he said, can be equated to a fire sale in which goods are sold for significant discounts. 
    Questioning whether there is a hidden agenda for the liquidation of a solvent company, Purmell said, “Even Mrs Kamla Persad Bissessar (former prime minister) in the Parliament had said “No fire sale! We are not going the route of liquidation because that would mean a fire sale.”

    http://www.newsday.co.tt/news/0,246379.html

  5. David Avatar
    David

    Extracted from a Trinidad chat group.

    The govt has to come good here, to throw all the resources of the nation in this battle to ensure the people get back their tens of billions, and justice. Do not go after the foot soldiers, the poor and vulnerable, the shrinking middle-class, yet give back the companies without repayment. You preach all manner of action against white-collar criminals yet now you want the maha white collar criminals to get back the loot without repaying the people?

    As the govt of the day, you MUST ensure the people’s money is returned or else you will be accused of recklessness, shirking your responsibility, and in cahoots with those who want to stage a CLF coup.

    There is only one issue the people care about: we want our money, more than 40 years; worth of property tax.

    Caught between the devil and the deep blue sea, the people will have to trust the elected government of the day more than those who care more about themselves. Ask the Carpenter guy or Permell what plan they have now to repay…. no answer, no details… so how can the people trust you? Come up with details, a definite schedule with deadlines etc.
    Provide data & info to back up your claims and solutions.

    The media has a critical role to play: demand details, info, schedules, deadlines, etc from those who do not want to repay the people. How can the people trust them? Who are they? and, they want duprey to play a background role? Who the F fooling who?

  6. Well Well @ Consequences Observing Blogger Avatar
    Well Well @ Consequences Observing Blogger

    if the shareholders have 15 billion to repurchase CLICO, then they have the 23 billion of taxpayers money to pay back the treasury…what took them so long, the court case lit a fire under them.

    they are playing games.

    got some nerve, sat down and watched government use up billions of tax dollars and remained silent.

  7. Gabriel Avatar
    Gabriel

    As Trinidad say it Permell have de gall to quote Kamla..eh eh.All ‘o dem is one set a UNC backers.One set ‘o crook and teef.

  8. David Avatar
    David

    From the T&T chat group.

     

    Yeah, we rel fcking stupid! All yuh now come out to defend we! We out of pocket by more than $20 billion and counting but all yuh think all yuh could fool us, again!

    "…we must all now support any action that parties take to truly defend the interests of taxpayers…"

    Yeah, right! CLF cannot pay off $15 billion, but all yuh promising and want a coup to take over the companies.  All yuh have no plan, no details, no money, but all want to fool we, again! All yuh arse all lucky all yuh not in jail and assets seized like Madoff, Stanford et al

    Hear this: put out a down payment of 10 billion and we could start talking….money talks, bullshit walks.

    Did you say all yuh want another loan from us to make that down payment to us?

    CLF records show company unable to pay off $15b debt *

    CLF records show company unable to pay off $15b debt *

    Asha Javeed—CL Financial’s management records show that it is unable to pay its $15 billion debt.

    SPITEFUL ACT *

    SPITEFUL ACT *

    Asha Javeed—SPITEFUL.

    Govt seeks to appoint provisional liquidators *

    Govt seeks to appoint provisional liquidators *

    Asha Javeed—GOVERNMENT has applied to the High Court to appoint joint liquidators for CL Financial (CLF).

  9. Well Well @ Consequences Observing Blogger Avatar
    Well Well @ Consequences Observing Blogger

    lol….these shareholders have short memories, they forgot what befell some CLF/CLICO execs on a monthly basis some years ago.

  10. Hal Austin Avatar
    Hal Austin

    Well Well & Consequences Observing Blogger – you are a sad bitter moron allowing your miserable life to be poisoned by hatred of generations long dead. My guess is that you have been a failure all your life, and spend your worthless hours seeking excuses for your own irrelevance.

  11. Well Well @ Consequences Observing Blogger Avatar
    Well Well @ Consequences Observing Blogger

    Hal…is that you plagarizing a 45trumptard`s words, just because you dont understand what is really happening.

    if you only knew how successful i was you would shoot yourself for wasting all those decades in UK being mistreated by, discriminated against and shat on by racist whites. your existence and experience was pure hell, hence your inability to understand the most simple things or have the power of analysis or deduction.

    that is a sad existence…..mine rocks.

  12. Well Well @ Consequences Observing Blogger Avatar
    Well Well @ Consequences Observing Blogger

    …and you got a nerve to call yaself a journalist…plagarizing comments from racists…lol

    Hal…get a life…you will always be 100 steps behind.

  13. Well Well @ Consequences Observing Blogger Avatar
    Well Well @ Consequences Observing Blogger

    …a bet ya wish ya had not been so impulsive to plagarize that comment…lol, lol

    let it stay as a reminder, i will save it Hal……lol

    you are plagued with deficiencies and have no self control.

  14. Gabriel Avatar
    Gabriel

    When the COI was in full swing,nobody could get Duprey the prayer mantis to appear before the commission.Now its all over bar the liquidation, Duprey the prayer mantis turned up in Trinidad,in Guyana ,maybe in Bdos too unknown to the local press, making all kinds of noise and promises,still no money to show.Effing school boy,bullying trix just like trump.Based on what’s going on in TnT,and not enough money to bail the CLFinancial,it’s reasonable to conclude that Barbados will be a failure too.

  15. Well Well @ Consequences Observing Blogger Avatar
    Well Well @ Consequences Observing Blogger

    Duprey claimed he was in fear for his life to ever return to TT, obviously now taxpayers 23 billion dollars has been used up to save CLF, he has no more fear.

    …but it`s now he should be very, very afraid…lol

    when Trinis start every sentence with all yuh…ya know it`s time to run.

  16. Gabriel Avatar
    Gabriel

    Praying

  17. Vincent Haynes Avatar
    Vincent Haynes

    Headline >> Clico transfers interest in No Man’s Land to Govt

    Source >> The Trinidad Guardian Newspaper

    At the very end of the notes to the 2016 year-end audited financial accounts of beleaguered insurance giant Clico lies note 37. It reads: “To facilitate the implementation of the Resolution Plan, in January 2017, the Company was directed by the Central Bank of Trinidad and Tobago to take the necessary steps to effect the transfer of its 100% shareholdings in Occidental Investments Limited and Oceanic Properties Limited to the state enterprise Buccoo Limited. This transfer agreement was completed on March 2017.”
    In effect, this note says that Clico’s 100 per cent interest in Occidental Investments Ltd and Oceanic Properties Ltd, more commonly known as the No Man’s Land ocean property in Tobago, and carried on Clico’s balance sheet at a value of roughly $187 million, is now owned by the Government of T&T.
    One of the concerns arising out of this transfer, according to chairman of the Clico Policyholders Group Peter Permell, is the fact that the Minister of Finance by virtue of the powers under Section 44D of the Central Bank Act can give general or specific instructions to the Central Bank in this particular transaction.
    https://www.cahfindit.com/node/166214

  18. Gabriel Avatar
    Gabriel

    Some further data on CL Financial and Clico

    http://www.trinidadexpress.com/20170716/news/what8217s-at-stake-in-liquidation

  19. Vincent Haynes Avatar
    Vincent Haynes

    The State’s application to have the High Court appoint joint provisional liquidators for CL Financial (CLF) has been postponed until tomorrow.

    Read more : http://bit.ly/2u39GP3
    State’s bid for CLF liquidation on hold
    trinidadexpress.com
    http://bit.ly/2u39GP3

  20. David Avatar
    David

    AUDIO: Interview with Tony Fraser on CL Financial and the return of Lawrence Duprey

    by AfraRaymond

    This is an interview on Hard Talk with Tony Rackhal-Fraser to discuss the CL Financial bailout with myself and Peter Permell of the Clico Policyholders Group. Audio courtesy Power 102.1 FM. Programme Date: 12 July 2017 Programme Length: 00:58:34

    Read more of this post

  21. David Avatar
    David

    VIDEO: Morning Brew interview on fight for control of CL Financial

    by AfraRaymond

    This is my 17 July 2017 ‘Morning Brew’ interview with CNC3’s Hema Ramkissoon on the continuing drama that is the CL Financial bailout. The "chess game" for control is active at this moment, but the propriety of a wholesale return of the group to those chiefs who brought the company to its knees in the […]

    Read more of this post

  22. David Avatar
    David

    Recent development is that a TT High Court has blocked government’s application to appoint a liquidator for CL Financial. This continues to be a complex transaction.

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