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Regulate Lawyers’ Clients Accounts

The Speaker of the House Michael Carrington has been reported to have significantly repaid monies withheld from a septenarian wheelchair bound client demanded by Madam Justice Jacqueline Cornelius’ court order. The issue of the indiscipline approach to how Barbadian lawyers appear to manage client’s monies must become part of a national discussion and lobby to…

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The Speaker of the House Michael Carrington has been reported to have significantly repaid monies withheld from a septenarian wheelchair bound client demanded by Madam Justice Jacqueline Cornelius’ court order. The issue of the indiscipline approach to how Barbadian lawyers appear to manage client’s monies must become part of a national discussion and lobby to make better.

While it serves the purpose of the legal profession, including the large cadre who makeup the members of parliament, managing client’s accounts (monies) does not require a rocket science approach. President of the Barbados Bar Association (BBA) Tariq Khan can deny it all he wants, we know lawyers hold client’s monies handed to them for simple to complicated transaction for unacceptably long periods and complaining to the BBA is a joke.

Have a look at the Solicitors Regulation Authority handbook. We claim t be an educated people, we pay hundreds of thousands of dollars to educate lawyers so where is our return in value to making our society a better place.

89 responses to “Regulate Lawyers’ Clients Accounts”

  1. pieceuhderockyeahright Avatar
    pieceuhderockyeahright

    @ Crusoe

    Indeed a gem

    “You think people on this forum vexated?? Should go listen on the street..”

    The thing is Crusoe that when these fellows get in the house neither they nor their Parliamentary Assistants venture into the gazas nor slums that they have either created or, in absentia, continue to nourish

    They think that Michael Lashes getting beat to donkey up is just a single instance.

    Let any one of them venture into their communities after the sun gone down, BY THEMSELVES, its their BMWs, and see if we doan read bout them and the lashes that them get in them communities!!

    I beleive that only Owen and Mia wont get licks

    Owen, because people would tek compassion on he as he moving around and Mia becausing she got she Glock on her him just in case

  2. David Avatar
    David

    It will be interesting to hear the reaction to Mara Thompson named in the Affidavit by the JM. Up to now she has been given a pass. She was the Office Manger at Thompson & Associates, time up!

  3. Enuff Avatar
    Enuff

    Amen David. Do you think the cheque will be evidence?

  4. David Avatar
    David

    @enuff

    The cheque has to be evidence. It can easily be requested by the Court from the bank.

  5. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ David February 1, 2015 at 6:55 PM

    Be careful here. That ‘request’ can be made only if it is the timeframe allowed by the law for the keeping of financial records.

    Let us hope the JM and forensic auditors took a photocopy of the cheque(s) in preparing their reports.

  6. Enuff Avatar
    Enuff

    Agreed.

  7. David Avatar
    David

    @Miller

    In the first forensic audit when the natter was mentioned one suspects the JMs had sight of the cheque.

  8. Gabriel Avatar
    Gabriel

    I don’t know if this is window dressing but it’s a start.Maybe the PM will now advise Mara to go get a lawyer.First the Speaker involved in a court case which calls into question his bona fides.Now the Deputy Speaker is in a court case too and in both instances applying parties seek redress for monies chequed and passed through the banking system.

  9. islandgal246 Avatar
    islandgal246

    The dead coming back to haunt ………Barbados politics and lawyers are now being shown up for exactly what they are.

  10. Redman Avatar
    Redman

    All of the tiefing political class should be exposed, looks like there is lots more to come. Man dem shameless cleptocrats dat skinning their teeth need some time in Dodds. What part of thou shall not steal is it that they don’t understand.
    A former PM allegedly created a false invoice for over 3 million dollars. Nothing to see here move along. This apparently is standard practice for the political class.

  11. Colonel Buggy Avatar
    Colonel Buggy

    Baroness Brenda Browne February 1, 2015 at 5:49 PM #

    Members of Parliament especially feel that they are Hollywood stars -Celebrities ..............

    ………………………………………………………………………………………
    And GOD , since they are worshiped by many, and given preference by the clergy, over Christ when they attend some churches, and also over the Deceased when attending a funeral.

  12. robert ross Avatar
    robert ross

    Crusoe

    I see you’re still deeply in love with yourself. Go for it. Two things though.

    It’s res ipsa loguitUr…you see the problem when idiot no-all’s try to talk law?
    The issue of interest on clients’ accounts is critical for clients. But you’re not really interested in clients are you….just political fodder and love of self.

  13. robert ross Avatar
    robert ross

    One of the things which needs to be made clear is this…..

    It is right and proper that the legal profession be scrutinized. There are bad apples in every walk of life…and that goes for BU too. When I read some of the things people write I wonder how any of this will ever change the world, or could.

    For example, many commentators on here accused Carrington of stealing/theft. Well for a lay person that may be how it seems. But in law there’s only slender evidence of it. But, yes, that’s the mob at work, the market place. Not that there’s anything wrong with a market place. It’s right too that people should sound off, get it off their chests and YES at times there is good reason to do so.

    A moment ago I referred to Crusoe as a ‘No-all’….and the point was that he has the arrogance to dismiss, in his interminable ravings, every contribution other than those which agree with him. Like David, he says ‘NO’ to everything….like a spoiled kid.

    If the public wrath at what has happened, which I quite agree is real enough, leads to real change in the system, in this instance a more stark understanding of the concept of ‘trust’, then all to the good. But it must also be understood that there are envious and malignant dispositions who will ever try to make capital from whatever rears its head in the public domain and much of it stems from the political barnyard. In short, there are agendas.

    For myself, I have no special brief for this Government. Indeed, I have written on a number of occasions about its “mean spiritedness”. I admire Owen tremendously. But none of that means that by my own lights I cannot say “I don’t agree with you” to people like David and Crusoe (who’s now a star to himself), who wish to ride roughshod over elementary principles of natural justice – one of which is ‘you don’t condemn a man without hearing the full story’. The problem here is that from the first BU – because of course it detests lawyers on the screen because that panders to its followers, though many of its protagonists are in fact drawn from its ranks – has acted as advocate, judge, jury and executioner. For me, that cannot be right. Carrington, as any other accused person, is entitled to consideration, if not respect.

    If THAT position is unacceptable to people like David and Crusoe, I really couldn’t give a monkey’s nuts. The world is big enough for dissent. It’s what the democratic process is about. And it’s the failure to understand that, with tolerance, which makes me say ‘It is very doubtful whether any of you will ever change the world for good not least because at root many of you are as rotten as those you condemn’.

  14. David Avatar
    David

    Yes it is tantamount to theft in the real world if you factor the opportunity cost of the Griffiths not being able to utilize his money. Everything is not defined y law.

    On Monday, 2 February 2015, Barbados Underground wrote:

    >

  15. DeeWord Avatar
    DeeWord

    @robert ross February 2, 2015 at 10:13 AM…For example, many commentators on here accused Carrington of stealing/theft…that may be how it seems. But in law there’s only slender evidence of it. ===============

    Ross, please clarify your remarks that there is only slender evidence.

    I appreciate your statement that we did not have all the evidence but based on that which we did have: legal matter between client & lawyer initiated some 14 years ago; dispute developed where client claimed money was due to him; attorney refused to make any payment; matter taken to civil court; lawyer does NOT contest matter; judge adjudicates for client.

    Based on that and this legal definition below I searched please clarify why it was so wrong to label Carrington’s actions as theft and the so slender connection to being a thief.

    –A person is guilty of theft if he dishonestly appropriates property belonging to another with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it; and “thief” and “steal” shall be construed accordingly.

    –It is immaterial whether the appropriation is made with a view to gain, or is made for the thief’s own benefit. —– source: legislation.gov.uk

    It’s likely the Barbados statute is different but you can clarify surely.

  16. old onion bags Avatar
    old onion bags

    @ David

    Yes it is tantamount to theft in the real world if you factor the opportunity cost of the Griffiths not being able to utilize his money.

    Opportunity Cost: The loss\cost foregone to a recipitent by not having use of his monies as a result of the holder’s deliquency…..where Artaxex when needed nuh?

    Yes David ya on the ball….apply this now to the CLICO senario…loss here includes deaths of individuals….how do we place a price on a life? Nasty business indeed….Carrington should be glad for the voices in social media…. As for the persons involved in the covering up \ shelving whatever you care to call it..illgotten sums of that CLICO money for self and family….RELEASE THOSE FUNDS NOW! Before further sins lie on your hands .

  17. Crusoe Avatar
    Crusoe

    Robert Ross said.. ”robert ross February 2, 2015 at 9:25 AM # Crusoe

    1 ) I see you’re still deeply in love with yourself. Go for it. Two things though.

    2) It’s res ipsa loguitUr…you see the problem when idiot no-all’s try to talk law?
    The issue of interest on clients’ accounts is critical for clients. 3) But you’re not really interested in clients are you….just political fodder and love of self.

    1) Heck yes. Of course I love myself, heck if by now as a grown adult, you do not love yourself, you have more problems than seeing what is immoral and right than what is not.

    2) Yes, I get it. What you are saying is that by the one letter incorrect, my intended meaning is unkown, as we idiot no-alls, should understand, that one letter incorrect means that allegedly educated folk, cant decipher the meaning of a phrase, or its intent.

    Sorry, it is indeed Res Ipsa Loquitur, you understand now?

    3) Where the heck did you pull that one from. Show me the evidence on this site that demonstrates that I am just after political fodder? And not yourself the same?

    Interesting that both yourself and ‘ac’ (oh, that was precious, ac’s Angel of Wickedness, I cracked up) rush to get personal when one’s arguments are falling apart and even throwing everything and the kitchen sink and three gallons of paint fails to cloud the issue.

    Are you one and the same?

    Res Ipsa …whatever…. 😉

  18. Crusoe Avatar
    Crusoe

    Robert Ross ”people like David and Crusoe (who’s now a star to himself), who wish to ride roughshod over elementary principles of natural justice – one of which is ‘you don’t condemn a man without hearing the full story’. ”

    Hey Mr. Full Story, show me where on this site I demonstrated to ‘run roughshod’ over natural justice?

    And yes, of course, my belief that to keep a clients monies 14 years, only to be delivered after ordered to do so by a judge, is indeed immoral.

    And if you don’t think so, well, I am not surprised based on your ramblings. As I said before, I know one to avoid for sure.

    😉

  19. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    @ Ross
    steupsss…the man is a damn thief.
    what slender evidence what?!?

    Damn man’s client had to get another lawyer and go to court to get a HIGH COURT judge to get his rightful money……what the hell do you call that…?

    The problem with wunna lawyers is that MOST of wunna do this shiite ROUTINELY and refuse to accept that IT IS THEFT….

    This matter seem to have you in jitters… you are not you usual calm self…. Bushie certainly hope that YOUR client fees are intact…..
    ….and the Bushman don’t mean “intact” in your home loan….. 🙂

  20. robert ross Avatar
    robert ross

    DeeWord

    Our Theft Act is, as you suggest, borrowed from the Theft Act in England. There are various concepts at work. One is the concept of ‘appropriation’. Another is ‘dishonesty’ and the third ‘intention to deprive permanently’. All three would have to be satisfied. The second, ‘dishonesty’ is the one that best suits your argument since the yardstick is objective and geared to what most people would account as dishonesty. The third is evidential. The first in essence entails a consideration of whether there is a usurpation of the rights of the owner (the client).

    A civil action was brought which, as we all know, was not contested – for whatever reason. And it’s that – the unarticulated reason – which for me is the critical point. There are all sorts of reasons why client’s funds might be withheld and these are recognized in the Code of Ethics I mentioned in an earlier post. At what point, if at all, was there a usurpation of the rights of the client? The short answer would be if Carrington had withheld the money, or absconded, following the Court Order. Had this not been so, the assumption must be that the client would have complained to the police at an earlier date or to the BA if he thought his proprietary interests were being usurped. That he did not do so suggests, as I say, that there was no usurpation, or no perceived usurpation, and, since BU says the bulk of the money has been returned, there is clearly no intention to deprive the owner permanently IF the critical date is indeed the date of the Order. I assume also that the client had the benefit of independent legal advice on this which is why he sought recovery in a civil suit.

    Bush Tea

    I do assure you I am totally calm; perhaps a little sad at the things I’ve been reading. I can’t pretend it doesn’t sadden me when I read – and so often on here – attempts to destroy people who can’t give evidence before David’s court.

    Crusoe

    To suggest that I might be ac qualifies you to join me in David’s ‘Hall of Fame’. But yes, do avoid me. You sound like one of those people who wouldn’t pay for services after the ‘no charge’ first interview.

  21. David Avatar
    David

    When the original story concerning this matter broke it was reported that John Griffiths revealed he had reported the matter to the Barbados Bar Association.

  22. David Avatar
    David

    Good to hear David Ellis, VOB’s Director of News, plans to keep the issue of lawyers and related matters front and centre on the airwaves. Very good David Ellis, block by block.

  23. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    @ Ross
    I do assure you I am totally calm; perhaps a little sad at the things I’ve been reading. I can’t pretend it doesn’t sadden me when I read – and so often on here – attempts to destroy people who can’t give evidence before David’s court.
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    …But why are you sad that a citizen was able to recover his RIGHTFUL money?

    …Why are you sad that someone who attempted to deprive a citizen of his RIGHTFUL assets has been exposed and forced to do the right thing?

    …Why are you confusing the issue when A LAWYER fails to defend himself in court? …are you saying he was unaware of his right to do so…?

    …Why the hell can he not give his side of the story? CAT GOT HIS TONGUE?

    …don’t you think he OWES an explanation to Parliament?

    Don’t you think that, failing such a satisfactory explanation, Parliament OWES us to dump his ass from that institution?

    Tell us what you think Mr Ross….

    ….or do you think that lawyers have a RIGHT to use client’s funds as they see fit…?

  24. David Avatar
    David

    How does the Carrington matter compare to Neville Nicholls son Lumpy?

  25. robert ross Avatar
    robert ross

    Bush Tea

    Your views on lawyers generally are well documented and there is little point in arguing the toss with you. Your last question is simply stupid – a quality for which you are renowned. And no, I don’t think he owes an explanation to Parliament. I take Owen’s line on that one.

    Now: how are you on nepotism and political creeping in the Anglican Church?

  26. Donna Avatar
    Donna

    The first telling fact is that the Speaker did not contest the case. That usually means that one has no defence for one’s actions – not one that would fool a judge anyway. The next telling fact is that the Speaker ignored his leader’s advice. He did not hire a lawyer but complied with the court’s order. The final telling fact is that it took so long for settlement to occur – past the deadline given by the court. How long does it take to transfer funds and give a simple account of them? Hmmmmmm……what else do we need to know? Some people seem to be taking their law degrees too seriously. We non- lawyers are capable of rational thought, you know. Please do not insult our intelligence any further!

  27. millertheanunnaki Avatar
    millertheanunnaki

    @ robert ross February 3, 2015 at 9:07 AM

    Robert R, I think you have lost the Carrington case.
    The man by his subsequent act of restitution confirms he had wronged Mr. Griffiths all along.
    It’s a pity you are not in receipt of fees for defending the actions of Mr. C. You certainly would have been in line for a massive windfall of financial luck due 14 years down the road.

    Now let us see how you can put up a similar spirited defence of a client of similar moral hue. Leper Parris is in dire need of your services, even though he has the protection of the highest court of the Land and hoping the Statute of Limitations kicks in.

  28. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    LOL @ ROSS
    ….stupid questions are often the ones with the most insightful answers.

    Here it is again….
    Do YOU think that lawyers have a right to the use of their accumulated client account – which may total in the millions, and which can be arranged to sit in an account 100% CONTROLLED BY THAT LAWYER for as long as the client is forced to tolerate?

    Yes or no?

    If ‘yes’, then you will have explained the genesis of your warped position on the subject case.

    If ‘no’, then pray tell us why the funds cannot be deposited in an independently administered account (say held by the BAR assoc) for transparency and safety.

    If you wish to abstain, and remain silent, we will (based on recent law) come to obvious conclusions about your concerns about incriminating yourself with respect of YOUR own circumstances…

    LOL ha ha ha ….Shiirt!!

  29. DeeWord Avatar
    DeeWord

    Ross, your response certainly validates your profession. But allow the non-lawyer to walk through your remarks.

    “And it’s that – the unarticulated reason – which for me is the critical point…they are all sorts of reasons why client’s funds might be withheld”

    In the absence of a why according to Carrington, the simple and uncomplicated fact is that he determined that there was no valid ground for him to waste the court’s time and prolong the proceeding by contesting.

    Don’t let us make esoteric suppositions on why he remained silent. If he had VALID grounds he would have raised them. After all, he is as seasoned a lawyer as you are.

    “At what point, if at all, was there a usurpation of the rights of the client?”. Ross, if you are my lawyer and I advise you at 11:00 that I no longer want you as my counsel then I suspect that if we are both standing before a judge and she accepts that I am fully capable of making that determination then you and I are done at 11 am.

    And yes you gotta file with the court or others accordingly to severe all ties, properly. And eventually, my new lawyer will advise any related parties that he is now my legal guide.

    The point sir, is that at 11:01 before that Judge you are just another person that has no special relationship with me, thus you start to usurp my rights the moment you do not honor my requests and those of my new lawyer. Simple, I think.

    “… if Carrington had withheld the money, or absconded, following the Court Order.”

    So, is it understood from this statement that an officer of the court who is supposedly bound by a regulation that stipulates in essence that he should not hold on to the client’s money any longer than legally or contractually required is in fact, according to you, excused and should only be accountable if he breaches a court judgment to repay that client? That is interesting to say the least.

    “… the assumption must be that the client would have complained to the police at an earlier date or to the BA if he thought his proprietary interests were being usurped.”

    And the interpretation of this one is that you do not see “his …interests … being usurped” although he hired another attorney. Although that action clearly showed the GRAVITY of his conviction re his monies due .

    “…the bulk of the money has been returned, there is clearly no intention to deprive the owner permanently …”.

    That is as eloquent as I have heard in a while; straight up bold faced lawyer obfuscation.

    Mr. Griffith asked for his money and it was not given to him. Finally after many years the money was finally returned due to a court ruling yet, according to you, nothing can be construed as an intent to deny Mr. Griffith his money permanently.

    In short, Carrington simply borrowed these funds indefinitely and the court was needed to stipulate the duration of the borrowing period.

    I believe your remarks clearly explain why there is such a major problem with attorney’s and client’s money. Bushie said it well: “The problem with wunna lawyers is that MOST of wunna do this shiite ROUTINELY and refuse to accept that IT IS THEFT…. “

  30. Crusoe Avatar
    Crusoe

    robert ross February 3, 2015 at 9:07 AM # Bush Tea Your views on lawyers generally are well documented and there is little point in arguing the toss with you. Your last question is simply stupid – a quality for which you are renowned. And no, I don’t think he owes an explanation to Parliament. I take Owen’s line on that one

    No, of course not. Morality and ethics have no place in Parliament according to the ‘modern types’ we have in authority. Morality what, ethics what.

    It is ALL about what they can and cannot slither under, over and around.

    Yeah, Rossie boy, we are on opposite sides of the cliff and I am glad to be on this side.

    We both may fall in, but I am comfortable with being on this side, just like you are being on that side far over there….as many others today.

    And at least I have Bushie on this side to provide entertainment….

  31. Bush Tea Avatar
    Bush Tea

    @ Crusoe
    …And at least I have Bushie on this side to provide entertainment….
    +++++++++++++++++++++
    LOL …not to worry, the whacker can reach over by Ross on the wicked side 🙂

  32. Donna Avatar
    Donna

    Deeword,

    Well done! I didn’t have the patience to deal with that load of crap as you did.

  33. Togetherness Avatar
    Togetherness

    Lawyers searching for distractions today there is another in the news for stealing not only that Avonda Pile is still practicing while on bail. How is that allowed Tariq Khan. Is he a Barbadian? Now he complains that the new judicial Center making lawyers sick. News flash Khan lawyers and before them solicitors have sickened and robbed our people for decades. Your job is to stop the rot. The Bar Association needs to stop casting around for scapegoats for the scandalous crookery that is endemic in the profession. Time to get the finger out and self police your thousand comrade of lawyers out there many prone to misusing client funds. We are not buying this nonsense that its government’s fault. The doctors engineers even police handle people’s money and trust and their rates of deviance pale next to lawyers persistent shenanigans.

  34. John Jickum Avatar
    John Jickum

    And to say that only three lawyers out of a thousand have been disbarred serves only to confirm the ineffectiveness,ineptitude and uselessness of the Bar Association. It is like putting Al Capone and his henchmen in control of the Mafia ! Let us hope that other judges will follow Judge Cornelius’ lead and render justice in a fair and timely manner!

  35. Hants Avatar
    Hants

    You may want to read

    BarbadosToday page 3 and page 5 (bottom right)

  36. David Avatar
    David

    @Hants

    So BU is serving a purpose?

  37. Georgie Porgie Avatar
    Georgie Porgie

    One afternoon a lawyer was riding in his limousine when he saw two men along the road-side eating grass.

    Disturbed, he ordered his driver to stop and got out to investigate.

    He asked one man, “Why are you eating grass?”

    “We don’t have any money for food,” the poor man replied.
    “We have to eat grass.”

    “Well, then, you can come with me to my house and I’ll feed you,” the lawyer said.

    “But sir, I have a wife and two children with me. They are over there, under that tree.”

    “Bring them along,” the lawyer replied.

    Turning to the other poor man he stated, “You may come with us, also.”

    The second man, in a pitiful voice, then said, “But sir, I also have a wife and SIX children with me!”

    “Bring them all as well,” the lawyer answered.

    They all entered the car, which was no easy task, even for a car as large as the limousine was.

    Once under way, one of the poor fellows turned to the lawyer and said, “Sir, you are too kind.”

    “Thank you for taking all of us with you.”

    The lawyer replied, “Glad to do it.
    You’ll really love my place.
    The grass is almost a foot high.”

  38. curtis Avatar
    curtis

    here in america, a broker’s account may not earn interest, i think that’s why the lawyers
    there in barbados hold on to clients funds so long.

  39. Hal Austin Avatar
    Hal Austin

    Of course client money should be held in separate client accounts from the practice money. All attorneys should also be compelled to have indemnity insurance if not they should not be allowed to practice.
    We do this with motor vehicles, so why not with professionals. Also, a new disciplinary authority should be established to discipline lawyers.
    The myth that only lawyers will understand the so-called technical side of the cases is hogwash. Any disciplinary authority will have a legal adviser who will advise the authority. Ordinary people, non-lawyers, will bring common sense and fairness to the table.
    But do yo expect a parliament overloaded with lawyers to bring in such change?

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